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howardfine

join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO
Reviews:
·AT&T Southwest

4 edits
reply to BronsCon

Re: SOPA Protest/Awareness Event

So I'm having trouble following along with that bill though I'm rushing through it. It seems to me, according to Section 103, they want to act against sites that are:
quote:
offering goods or services in a manner that engages in, enables, or facilitates --

1) selling or distributing copyrighted computer software and other technology

2) circumventing copyright laws

3) the sale, distribution, or promotion of goods, services, or materials bearing a counterfeit mark.

Why is this a bad thing?

EDIT: So far, I've seen nothing to indicate linking to copyrighted material is forbidden.

OZO
Premium
join:2003-01-17
kudos:2
You may want to look at current discussion about SOPA in our own forum first:
Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA) Vote Delayed.
There you may find examples how the act will affect common people.

Read particularly about the potential of blocking US users from buying drugs from Canada. Why do they buy needed drugs from Canada now? They can not afford over-inflated prices offered here, in the US, by drug and insurance companies. In Canada people can buy those drugs for far more affordable prices. The act will require to block the access to those stores. And it's not only blocking DNS records, censoring results provided by search engines, removing links from any forums, etc. It's also by blocking credit card transactions when one wants to pay for those drugs. It's a typical protectionism, making local drug prices extremely high (over-inflated). The act will facilitate that money extortion practice by local drug cartel even more... (if it sounds not convincing yet - such protectionism is simply against market) And it's just one example of why some big businesses want that bill so badly.

SOPA bill is not about an online piracy (as "Patriot Act" is not about patriotism in any way, while it just sounds like), it's about introducing new Internet censorship and creating environment for special interests, who lobby (pay legislators for) the bill.
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...


howardfine

join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO
I don't read any of that in the bill. Drugs in Canada, if they are the same thing, would not come under this. If they are copies of the same drug, meaning they are illegally manufactured, that's a different story.


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·Comcast Business..
·SONIC.NET
said by howardfine:

I don't read any of that in the bill. Drugs in Canada, if they are the same thing, would not come under this. If they are copies of the same drug, meaning they are illegally manufactured, that's a different story.

Most drugs are patented in the US. Buying from a Canadian company that is not restricted by US patents circumvents those patents; not that the US drug companies can claim a lost sale when the buyer is buying from Canada because they can't afford to buy from the US source. At any rate, the sale of a patented drug, in the US, manufactured by someone other than the patent holder or their licensee, is considered sale and distribution of goods bearing a counterfeit mark. The promotional materials on a website selling such drugs would be considered to be promoting goods bearing a counterfeit mark.

Oops.


howardfine

join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO
Reviews:
·AT&T Southwest
said by BronsCon:

Most drugs are patented in the US. Buying from a Canadian company that is not restricted by US patents circumvents those patents


You think the US patents don't have any force of effect in Canada? You think those "legal online pharmacies" in Canada are not selling the same drugs by the same manufacturers? SOPA does not affect vendors selling Bayer aspirin cheaper in Canada vs Bayer aspirin in the US.

quote:
not that the US drug companies can claim a lost sale when the buyer is buying from Canada because they can't afford to buy from the US source.
That's the point.
quote:
At any rate, the sale of a patented drug, in the US, manufactured by someone other than the patent holder or their licensee, is considered sale and distribution of goods bearing a counterfeit mark. The promotional materials on a website selling such drugs would be considered to be promoting goods bearing a counterfeit mark.

Oops.

Exactly! That's what SOPA's for!


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·Comcast Business..
·SONIC.NET
said by howardfine:

Exactly! That's what SOPA's for!

How does SOPA protect anyone in that instance?

If I can't afford to buy from the US manufacturer, but I can afford to buy from the Canadial company, why should I have to go without a drug that I might need to save my life?

SOPA would be hurting me, in that instance, and not helping the US drug company, since I wouldn't be able to buy from them anyway.

Get your head out of your ass and realize what this is about. It's censorship, plain and simple.

With no appeal process and no means by which the public can review a site's content after it has been blocked or taken down, what's to stop the government from taking down any and all sites they disagree with, under the guise of copyright violation?

That's beside the point, though. If, as you said earlier, it is possible to sue an international entity based on the laws of your own country (e.g. you said a french company could sue me if i violated their copyright on the web), then we have all we need to be able to enforce copyright internationally, as it is. Why do we need SOPA, which gives the government way too much control, including the power of censorship?

Wake up and smell the roses, they've started to rot and it smells like shit in here.


howardfine

join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO
Reviews:
·AT&T Southwest
said by BronsCon:

said by howardfine:

Exactly! That's what SOPA's for!

How does SOPA protect anyone in that instance?

If I can't afford to buy from the US manufacturer, but I can afford to buy from the Canadial company, why should I have to go without a drug that I might need to save my life?
What is preventing you from buying legal drugs from Canada?
quote:
SOPA would be hurting me, in that instance, and not helping the US drug company, since I wouldn't be able to buy from them anyway.

What is preventing you from buying the same drug by the same manufacturer from a Canadian pharmacy?
quote:
Get your head out of your ass and realize what this is about. It's censorship, plain and simple.
Oh, now it comes out. It's boiled down to name calling and that's where I draw the line. If you can't follow along and want to continue to make things up on your own, and you have to stoop to name calling, then I'm done with you. I thought this would be an intelligent argument but apparently you're not up to it.


BronsCon

join:2003-10-24
Walnut Creek, CA
Reviews:
·Comcast Business..
·SONIC.NET
What's stopping me from buying the drug the original manufacturer charges more for than I can afford from a different supplier who also gets if from the original manufacturer? Probably that the price would still be high, as it was originally high due to what the original manufacturer charges the supplier. Plain and simple.

I didn't call names. My understanding of SOPA comes from speaking with friends of mine who happen to deal with copyright laws on a daily basis. They surely understand it better than either you or I. You've made numerous strawman arguments that I simply didn't see a point in calling you out on. You also claim to have quoted the bill directly in your posts, but I did not see this; all I ever saw was a reference to the first two lines of the bill. That, sir, is the very definition of having one's head up one's ass. I'm only sorry I had to be so blunt about it to get you out of my thread. There was no intelligent argument here, just one person talking about SOPA and another person building strawmen.