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ihatebell21

join:2012-04-04

1 edit
reply to jfmezei

Re: CNOC R&V of CRTC 2011-703 and CRTC 2011-704

In the AGI report, they state:

34. As is, the capacity-based rates struck for Bell Aliant/Bell Canada, Cogeco, Rogers and Videotron clearly deter independent ISPs from investing in increased capacity and growing their consumer base, particularly because annual increases in per-user peak demand are expected to exceed 20%. It is therefore unlikely that the independent ISPs will increase their market share in Internet services provision beyond the current level of 6%.56 It is more likely that independent ISPs will continue to lose share to the incumbents under the current rate structure. Accordingly, Canadian consumers will lose out on different competitive market options in terms of price, connectivity, and choice. [emphasis added]
What they should have added is the following:
It will be the erosion of the independent ISP marketshare which will force the CRTC, the Competition Bureau, and the Government - reluctantly - into legislating functional separation of the incumbents for all aspects of their businesses, including the spinning off of content divisions the incumbents have recently acquired.

InvalidError

join:2008-02-03
kudos:5
said by ihatebell21:

In the AGI report, they state:

It is more likely that independent ISPs will continue to lose share to the incumbents under the current rate structure. Accordingly, Canadian consumers will lose out on different competitive market options in terms of price, connectivity, and choice. [emphasis added]

The funny thing is that real-world results thus far since the new rates were introduced seem to indicate that aside from people being initially upset by rate changes, wholesale DSL and cable internet are currently doing better than ever... perhaps more cable than DSL due to many people switching to cable to avoid dry-loop fees.

I wouldn't be surprised if the CRTC's next retail vs wholesale accesses compilation showed that wholesale grew to 7% instead of losing share, though the share distribution between 3rd-party ISPs and access technologies themselves may have changed considerably. (ex.: unhappy TSI-DSL subscribers going to eBox cable in Quebec.)

ihatebell21

join:2012-04-04
said by InvalidError:

said by ihatebell21:

In the AGI report, they state:

It is more likely that independent ISPs will continue to lose share to the incumbents under the current rate structure. Accordingly, Canadian consumers will lose out on different competitive market options in terms of price, connectivity, and choice. [emphasis added]

The funny thing is that real-world results thus far since the new rates were introduced seem to indicate that aside from people being initially upset by rate changes, wholesale DSL and cable internet are currently doing better than ever... perhaps more cable than DSL due to many people switching to cable to avoid dry-loop fees.

I wouldn't be surprised if the CRTC's next retail vs wholesale accesses compilation showed that wholesale grew to 7% instead of losing share, though the share distribution between 3rd-party ISPs and access technologies themselves may have changed considerably. (ex.: unhappy TSI-DSL subscribers going to eBox cable in Quebec.)

So I'll correct my wording to read, "erosion or effective stagnation of the independent ISP marketshare".

How's that?

Indies should be owning about 20-35% of the total market in order for the marketplace to be considered competitive. That would generally mean that the telco/cableco regional monopolies would each have about 30-45% market share in each of their service areas (depending on the day), with a multitude of indies fighting over the scraps.

InvalidError

join:2008-02-03
kudos:5
said by ihatebell21:

Indies should be owning about 20-35% of the total market in order for the marketplace to be considered competitive. That would generally mean that the telco/cableco regional monopolies would each have about 30-45% market share in each of their service areas (depending on the day), with a multitude of indies fighting over the scraps.

With incumbents offering triple-play plans at ~$80/month, many people aren't interested in switching. I have told many friends/acquaintances about Teksavvy and eBox, showed them they could get better prices or at least not have to worry about caps but so far, only one has switched, most of the others negotiated a discount with their respective incumbents.

The reason 3rd-party ISPs have a hard time growing their market share is that lower prices on a single service alone are insufficient to convince the average incumbent subscribers to switch... people like sticking to the devil they know.


The User

@videotron.ca
said by InvalidError:

The reason 3rd-party ISPs have a hard time growing their market share is that lower prices on a single service alone are insufficient to convince the average incumbent subscribers to switch... people like sticking to the devil they know.

I'll agree with this (as it relates to the cable world, and in Quebec only).

Eventually the kids will use up the allocated usage. When that time arrives they will either toss in free usage, offer a different plan w/ more usage at the same price or better so I don't leave, Or I would leave if the cost savings justifies it.

Also, I make a call and they are here fixing stuff or moving wires at no cost. With the likes of teksavvy or Ebox, it's a minimum of 48-hrs to even get a reply. Or like Teksavvy was doing, if you think you have a cable problem they tell you to go buy another 100$ modem to make sure. Then they try to push a 100$ maintenance fee on you and whatever other bullshit that never ends. You just aren't going to get the quality of service from a 3rd party. Ever (Bell aside).

Everything listed here, »/forum/teksavdirect,or here »Bell Canada Direct just doesn't exist in videotron land.

There is no justification in moving to a 3rd party for many. It will actually increase costs. 3rd party ISP's can't compete to this.

The 3rd party's main customers are those who:
Have no other choice,
Live in Ontario where Rogers is just as bad as Bell,
Have kids using hundreds of gigs of B/W,
Kids download their movies,
The poor (or those having troubles making ends meet) who can't afford TV and/or phone services and use the net instead.

I will even go further and say: if stats were compiled, I bet we would see the 3rd party crowd being in the range of 20's to mid 30's.

Even Teksavvy's targeted advertising is aimed at this specific targeted age group of people: »Re: Delivered Teksavvy flyers today + TSI Billboard seen in KW

If and when these 3rd parties start offering more maybe we will see a different target group jumping. But I don't think just reselling Bell-IPTV, like TSI planned on, is really differentiating themselves. They just come across as mini-Bells. Like Bell's lower cost Virgin brand and nothing more. A sort of mini-Bell retention department.