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Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1

Why oh why so many updates? Why I "like" Ubuntu

I turned on my Ubuntu box this morning, and saw a few updates. I had a thought pop into my head that Ubuntu seems to get updated more often then my windows box.
But also, despite the numerous updates, the Ubuntu box seems to be running at the same performance level as the first day of install.

Where as my windows box is slowing down after each update. It's at the point now where the drive is busy indicator is flashing every minute or so.
I guess I should formate and reinstall windows and deal with at least a day or two of updates and reinstalling programs.

As for the amount of updates, it's not an issue. As I understand they are typically security fixes or software that needs updating.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.


kleeman
Australian Expat

join:2000-07-29
Nyack, NY
kudos:3

Re: Why oh why so many updates? Why I "like" Ubuntu

Yeah I have a thinkpad with both Mint and Windows Vista and have had it 3 years or so. Not only does the Windows partition run hot and slow with continual massive and annoying updates it is chewing up 25G for a minimal install. I only keep it for when I have to use the laptop for a presentation because the video drivers are better. The Mint partition updates a lot but rather quickly and unobtrusively. It runs much cooler and much faster and only chews up about 5G.

Windows is slowly dying.
--
Aesthetics should be an inspiration not a pair of handcuffs


Bill_MI
Bill In Michigan
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join:2001-01-03
Royal Oak, MI
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Reviews:
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1 edit

1 recommendation

reply to Snakeoil
There's a few things different about Ubuntu updates. 1) They're not on a monthly cycle like Microsoft does for IT professionals. They come whenever they are ready. This, by itself, can make it appear to be more often. 2) They're for the whole software repository, not just the operating system and/or MS products.

Just my 2 cents.

EDIT: Forgot about the last one with a recent example. We just had a BIND update that included 1/2 dozen packages - but all for the same "fix". Microsoft would have treated that as 1 update but Ubuntu looked like 6 updates.


lugnut

@look.ca
Yes and no. There's such a thing as TOO many updates. I have Kubuntu 12.04 installed on my main desktop with the KXStudio Addon Multimedia Environment.

In the past two weeks I have had to deal with TWICE DAILY updates of JACK Audio about a dozen times.

I'm all for bug fixes but TRY and get it right the first time fellahs...


shrtckt

join:2007-08-09
Winder, GA

1 edit
reply to Snakeoil
Gentoo.. Well - you know. The reason we do this is to insure that our users have the best, latest, stable, and bug-free software possible. I know updates are sometimes a pain, but this just shows that techs are working hard for YOU!


nwrickert
sand groper
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reply to Snakeoil

Re: Why oh why so many updates? Why I "like" Ubuntu

The worst I have ever had with opensuse updates, is an occasional error message (aka "dependency hell"). This is usually fixed within a few days.

Yes, I do remember an update to Icetea that broke java until they fixed it.

Updating in linux is a lot smoother than in Windows. Those annoying "restart your system to complete the update" messages are a great annoyance.
--
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XCOM
digitalnUll
Premium
join:2002-06-10
Spring, TX

1 recommendation

reply to Snakeoil

Re: Why oh why so many updates? Why I "like" Ubuntu

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1

1 recommendation

For those of us, whose linus foo is weak, Ubuntu is a good way to get exposed.

Many years ago, back when I owned a 486 PC, I tried Mandrake linux. It changed it's name a few years later. Anyhow, I was in over my head, and got frustrated with it.

Ubuntu on the other hand, as it matures/ages, seems to get easier to use.

I would like to learn how to do things the way the uber linux gurus do things, through the terminal. But, I find programming rather boring, and at times headache causing.

And I find it nothing like, or close to Microsoft.
--
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XCOM
digitalnUll
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said by Snakeoil:

And I find it nothing like, or close to Microsoft.

Click and go... click and go...
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
join:2000-08-05
Mentor, OH
kudos:1
So?
If you such a linux uber, then why not host a skype chat and teach me how to use the linux terminal. I have found people willing to teach, but they charge monwy. And I don't have money.

I fail to understand why you find it necessary to troll the thread.
--
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XCOM
digitalnUll
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I am not trolling... just expressing how I feel about your thread "Linux and Microsoft". If people is charging you to teach you linux than you have bigger problems...
I have help several users here in DSLR over remote sessions. I do not mind helping/teaching. But if you want me to help you... switch to a real Linux OS.

IMOHO Ubuntu does nothing to help you learn Linux and that's my problem with Ubuntu. I know quite a few people who get stuck in this ubuntu limbo and have a hard time merging to other OS because of the complications "outside" the box...

I just helped a friend install his nvidia card on his mint install... My recommendations to him after a few findings... Move away from this OS. When an OS is telling you that you don't need runlevels you are in a straight path to hell....

--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


jimkyle
Btrieve Guy
Premium
join:2002-10-20
Oklahoma City, OK
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Reviews:
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1 recommendation

said by XCOM:

When an OS is telling you that you don't need runlevels you are in a straight path to hell....

So does this mean that you dislike Debian just as much? While they do handle runlevels during the boot process (as do all flavors of Ubuntu and Mint) they make no distinction between 2, 3, 4, and 5. All four of those do exactly the same thing.

I agree that out of the box, Ubuntu itself is a bit TOO simplified and seems to be getting moreso at each 6-month upgrade. However under the hood it's simply Debian with a minimal amount of tweaking, and anyone who wants to actually learn POSIX-compliant systems be they BSD, Linux, or Unix itself, can do so on any distribution that complies with the standard. When you replace the current default GUI with one that's much less of a nanny (such as XFCE), you have a system that can do serious work easily.

Of course, one could always go to LFS (Linux From Scratch) and build one's very own distribution. The author of LFS helped me greatly when I was stumbling through the help that Mandrake tried to give -- but I'd certainly hate to try to guide a newcomer through the agony of debugging one's own compiled-from-scratch kernel!
--
Jim Kyle


lugnut

@look.ca

1 edit
reply to XCOM
said by XCOM:

said by Snakeoil:

And I find it nothing like, or close to Microsoft.

Click and go... click and go...

If you prefer to run your desktop from a CLI might I suggest a C64 or an Apple IIE or even DOS 5.1? If you need to muiltitask, you could even run Desqview

I'm old enough to remember when Linux was simply Linux and ran from a couple of floppies. And a heartless, kludgy, unforgiving bitch of an OS it was too.

I make no apologies for using a *buntu. It's NOT M$ and it gets the job done as easily as possible. That's WHY computers were invented in the first place. To make difficult jobs easier


XCOM
digitalnUll
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Spring, TX
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said by lugnut :

said by XCOM:

said by Snakeoil:

And I find it nothing like, or close to Microsoft.

Click and go... click and go...

If you prefer to run your desktop from a CLI might I suggest a C64 or an Apple IIE or even DOS 5.1? If you need to muiltitask, you could even run Desqview

I'm old enough to remember when Linux was simply Linux and ran from a couple of floppies. And a heartless, kludgy, unforgiving bitch of an OS it was too.

I make no apologies for using a *buntu. It's NOT M$ and it gets the job done as easily as possible. That's WHY computers were invented in the first place. To make difficult jobs easier

Linux is not about running a terminal. You only assumed that.
When I say click and go I mean they give you the power to work the terminal. Learn how to grow from a user to your own administrator.
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


XCOM
digitalnUll
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Spring, TX
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reply to jimkyle
said by jimkyle:

said by XCOM:

When an OS is telling you that you don't need runlevels you are in a straight path to hell....

So does this mean that you dislike Debian just as much? While they do handle runlevels during the boot process (as do all flavors of Ubuntu and Mint) they make no distinction between 2, 3, 4, and 5. All four of those do exactly the same thing.

I agree that out of the box, Ubuntu itself is a bit TOO simplified and seems to be getting moreso at each 6-month upgrade. However under the hood it's simply Debian with a minimal amount of tweaking, and anyone who wants to actually learn POSIX-compliant systems be they BSD, Linux, or Unix itself, can do so on any distribution that complies with the standard. When you replace the current default GUI with one that's much less of a nanny (such as XFCE), you have a system that can do serious work easily.

Of course, one could always go to LFS (Linux From Scratch) and build one's very own distribution. The author of LFS helped me greatly when I was stumbling through the help that Mandrake tried to give -- but I'd certainly hate to try to guide a newcomer through the agony of debugging one's own compiled-from-scratch kernel!

Funny you say that. I actually dont hate Debian. I like Debian I used Debian up too 4.0.... And I know that the underneath OS is Debian. Back when I used Debian dropping X was not an issue. Dropping to runlevel 3 (no X running) was a simple task. Now this new OS make you go through Hell to try and get a simple shell. O wait hold on X died we need to respawn!. su - worked as it should sudo was an option and was not mandatory. I was not forced to be a user.... To me any OS that dictates what you should do or be is out for me.
That's just the way I feel. I have the control and I tell it what I need. The system works for me... I don't for work for it. I don't need automation of package's. I want to understand what library I need and why. I want to run ./configure, make, make install and see it compiled and work how it should. At the end that's what make Linux beautiful
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


scrummie02
Bentley
Premium
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

1 recommendation

reply to XCOM
said by XCOM:

I am not trolling... just expressing how I feel about your thread "Linux and Microsoft". If people is charging you to teach you linux than you have bigger problems...
I have help several users here in DSLR over remote sessions. I do not mind helping/teaching. But if you want me to help you... switch to a real Linux OS.

IMOHO Ubuntu does nothing to help you learn Linux and that's my problem with Ubuntu. I know quite a few people who get stuck in this ubuntu limbo and have a hard time merging to other OS because of the complications "outside" the box...

I just helped a friend install his nvidia card on his mint install... My recommendations to him after a few findings... Move away from this OS. When an OS is telling you that you don't need runlevels you are in a straight path to hell....

What is a "real" Linux OS? CentOS? Redhat? Slackware? LFS? Why not drop that and get a "real OS" like FreeBSD or HP/UX or AIX - hell screw them even, go Plan9.

That's a rather arrogant comment to make
--
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XCOM
digitalnUll
Premium
join:2002-06-10
Spring, TX
Mhhhh I guess it is.
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
said by XCOM:

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.

said by XCOM:

I am not trolling

Posting an off topic criticism which can only lead to the degradation of the thread away from the help the user sought is trolling.


XCOM
digitalnUll
Premium
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Spring, TX
Reviews:
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said by Maxo:

said by XCOM:

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.

said by XCOM:

I am not trolling

Posting an off topic criticism which can only lead to the degradation of the thread away from the help the user sought is trolling.

I am sorry but I fail to see how. It all started with this Ubuntu is better than Microsoft.
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$

grunze510

join:2009-02-14
Cote Saint-Luc, QC
kudos:1
said by XCOM:

said by Maxo:

said by XCOM:

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.

said by XCOM:

I am not trolling

Posting an off topic criticism which can only lead to the degradation of the thread away from the help the user sought is trolling.

I am sorry but I fail to see how. It all started with this Ubuntu is better than Microsoft.

The correct answer is, the best OS is the one that's right for you. For lots of people, it's Windows, for many, it's Ubuntu, for others, it may be Slackware. And the OP was giving his opinion on why he finds Ubuntu is right for him.


signmeuptoo
Bless you Howie
Premium
join:2001-11-22
NanoParticle
kudos:5
This!

Not everyone is smart in the same things. And while I understand xcom's comments, and appreciate how he/she feels, it does seem afield of the OP's focus.

Look at cars. Some will say a car with an automatic tranny is not a real car. Whatev. The world is full of variety and any OS pluralistic enough to come in various distros to suite various types of people is a OS for me.
--
Join Teams Helix and Discovery. Rest in Peace, Leonard David Smith, my best friend, you are missed badly! Rest in peace, Pop, glad our last years were good. Please pray for Colin, he has ependymoma, a brain cancer, donate to a children's Hospital.


Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
reply to XCOM
said by XCOM:

said by Maxo:

said by XCOM:

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.

said by XCOM:

I am not trolling

Posting an off topic criticism which can only lead to the degradation of the thread away from the help the user sought is trolling.

I am sorry but I fail to see how. It all started with this Ubuntu is better than Microsoft.

Perhaps in the light of comparing OSes then I may have mispoke. I think the benefits that Snakeoil See Profile was toting really aren't benefits of Ubuntu necessarily, but are common among Linux distributions with a proper package management system.
It would certainly be more constructive to note that the same benefits exist for a wide variety of Linux distributions, then to engage in the hyperbole innate in comparing a popular open-source Linux flavor that is developed in an open environment, to a company that produces proprietary software developed in a traditional closed environment.
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howardfine

join:2002-08-09
Saint Louis, MO
Reviews:
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reply to Maxo
said by Maxo:

said by XCOM:

Ubuntu is a bastardized linux version of Microsoft.

said by XCOM:

I am not trolling

Posting an off topic criticism which can only lead to the degradation of the thread away from the help the user sought is trolling.

If anyone replied in kind on the Microsoft forum the post would be deleted immediately.


XCOM
digitalnUll
Premium
join:2002-06-10
Spring, TX
Well this the Unix forum

singmeuptoo & Maxo..

Got it.... Ill just stand down before I get burned.
--
[nUll@dcypher ~]$


El Quintron
Resident Mouth Breather
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Reviews:
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reply to howardfine
said by howardfine:

If anyone replied in kind on the Microsoft forum the post would be deleted immediately.

Even though comments towards the OP were trollish, I think most people here are friendly enough and smart enough to "sort it out" without a lot of mod intervention.

The Microsoft forum probably has 10 if not 100 times the posters that this forum does, making a hard stance practically required.
--
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El Quintron
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reply to XCOM
said by XCOM:

Well this the Unix forum

singmeuptoo & Maxo..

Got it.... Ill just stand down before I get burned.

No worries.

I don't think your comments were malicious and I don't think anyone else here included the OP took much offense. I'm not a veteran of this forum so I can't speak for way back, but I've seen much worse flame wars than what just happened here.
--
Support Bacteria -- It's the Only Culture Some People Have


XCOM
digitalnUll
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said by El Quintron:

said by XCOM:

Well this the Unix forum

singmeuptoo & Maxo..

Got it.... Ill just stand down before I get burned.

No worries.

I don't think your comments were malicious and I don't think anyone else here included the OP took much offense. I'm not a veteran of this forum so I can't speak for way back, but I've seen much worse flame wars than what just happened here.

Truly I was not.. I was just expressing how I felt and my point of view on the matter... I guess some did take it a bit personal and I am standing down

Take care!
--
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Snakeoil
Ignore Button. The coward's feature.
Premium
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Mentor, OH
kudos:1
It's all good, no worries. Opinions appreciated. One day, when I get a spare PC, I'll be willing to try a different Distro, and try learning more about the terminal.
--
Is a person a failure for doing nothing? Or is he a failure for trying, and not succeeding at what he is attempting to do? What did you fail at today?.


scrummie02
Bentley
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Arlington, VA
Reviews:
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You don't need a spare PC, run KVM or virtualbox on your machine now and you can deploy an instance of another distro or even a different OS such as FreeBSD or OpenBSD or a Solaris based OS.

Ubuntu/Debian are fine to learn CLI if you want. CentOS might help more since a lot of companies use Redhat and CentOS is pretty darn close.

That being said, if you feel the need to download and compile software from source you can do that with Ubuntu just as much as the other Linux distros if you want.

Also "Linux in a nutshell" and some O'rielly shell scripting books are also good.

Your local community college no doubt has an intro to UNIX type class to help as well.
--
"He's a politician. It's like being a hooker. You can't be one unless you can pretend to like people while you're f*cking them."
General Welfare


Maxo
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join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
reply to Snakeoil
said by Snakeoil:

I'll be willing to try a different Distro, and try learning more about the terminal.

While I would strongly encourage trying out various distros, you don't need to leave Ubuntu to learn Linux. Despite what some will tell you, unlike Windows everything under Ubuntu's hood is available for poking, prodding, and modding.
The easiest way, IMHO, is to setup a server and get it doing things like file and print sharing, data backups, etc. Practical things help give learning a reason.
--
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