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| reply to Crookshanks
Re: 9; said by Crookshanks:
If passenger trains are so great why can't they successfully compete without support from the government?
Railroads that moved freight AND people ie: passenger service built some of the largest corporations and wealthiest persons in the US at one time. Combine the runs! If you have cars to take from area a to the yard in b to be transferred out to other trains put them in the consist for the passenger run, at least on the local/regional feeders to the high speed line.
Now a days the RR's reroute traffic around passenger service lines like they have the plague or something... gee they managed to share the same lines for hundreds of years before no reason they can't now, other than lawyers.
cars are a big part of the demise of train travel, and even air travel.
said by Crookshanks:
Do you really think that high speed rail offers benefits compelling enough to justify the use of eminent domain against countless property owners?
Had the RR not been allowed to abandon and let rot or allowed to remove lines, or abandon/remove/turn to trails a good bit of infrastructure would not have to be REBUILT but upgraded.
And YES 10000000% I approve of taking back the land to provide for a high speed rail feeder system to feed local service to every hick 1 cow town in the US!
said by Crookshanks:
What of the environmental impact of thousands of miles of new track?
I do not care one bit about environmental impacts.
said by Crookshanks:
How does it ever compete financially against air travel, which requires no new infrastructure, no use of eminent domain, and has no NIMBY pushback from the communities between point a and b?
Thats why the government will have to be the one to take the land and then turn it over to some one else OTHER THAN AMTRAK!
So how's that air travel working out????
Delta is killing its regional service, all those great regional jets are going to sit in the AZ desert now till the next revival... All the others are doing the same the regional airlines are going to be gone... Rail offers a good way to do local transit to feed to stations for regional rail travel and then on to the high speed line.
Cities are going to loose the only air travel they have! Some would required hours long drives. Rail service could pick this up.
I am all for regional airlines too... fuel cost is the problem.. it should not be... since the US occupies a country with the 3-4th largest oil supply... it should be running down the streets of the US like water. And similar cost... Put it in a tanker and ship it to the US.. Thats why we were/are there, period. The next problem is refining, the greenie weenie tree huggers kill every project for refineries or nuclear power plants. Arrested and deported for economic terrorism. bye bye enjoy Gitmo!
Plain and simple we need to get alternatives to oil for jet fuel, to electric generation to vehicle (cars/trucks) fuel.. If some South American country, brazil, can convert to ethanol than this country can too! Plenty of sources for it in non corn or other non food stocks.
1) Every oil burning electric plant in the US is REQUIRED to convert to nuclear or sustainable source (NOT COAL or Natural gas! has nothing to do with the environment! it needs to be a one time switch nuclear or some sort of other fuel, like garbage... that can be renewed.
2) gasoline vehicles are phased out for ethanol vehicles.
Ethanol is produced from what ever sustainable sources.. sugar cane, switch grass, garbage, grass clippings, wood processing remainders what ever.. there was a whole slew of development on these things...
said by Crookshanks:
I'm sorry, but I've never understood the fascination that people have with rail. It's great for moving freight, getting around the city, and for regional trips. Cross country trips? Not so much.
Because you have never ridden a train... Not ever trip is about being there instantly. If I have a time frame to meet then air travel is probably the only choice for some situations. Rail travel across the UK, france, Germnay etc. exists and is used by large.... Some time its not about getting there NOW NOW NOW.. its about getting there in peace and quiet.
I'll take trains when its possible and air when I need to... but trains is not an option for 98% of the US... At one time is was as ubiquitous as water. Thats a sad testament to this country.
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| said by TuxRaiderPen:Because you have never ridden a train... Not ever trip is about being there instantly. If I have a time frame to meet then air travel is probably the only choice for some situations.
Actually, I have ridden on a train. Multiple times. I live in the Northeast, the only part of the country where rail travel is self-sustaining.
The "it's not about being there instantly" mentality is why trains will never be profitable, because with few exceptions that's exactly what it's about. Ocean liners died out precisely because air travel got you there in hours, not days. Cruise ships are still around but that's an entirely different market than ocean liners, they are catering to people who view the trip itself as the vacation, with all of the assorted luxuries that a cruise ship can provide.
Could you take that business model to trains and make it profitable? Possibly. I've always wanted to take the trans-Siberian railway across Russia and would consider making a similar trip across the United States. I don't think it would be nearly as successful as the cruise industry but you could probably make it self sustaining. Note that is an idea for a novelty/luxury service like cruise ships, not as a means of travel, and I would not condone my Government spending tax dollars on such a venture when we need them elsewhere.
said by TuxRaiderPen:Rail travel across the UK, france, Germnay etc. exists and is used by large.... Those countries are a lot smaller than the United States. Why don't you look at the whole of Europe and ask yourself how many people really take a train from Madrid to Moscow, or from Helsinki to Rome? The numbers are small to non-existent, air travel is the clear winner at those distances. | |
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