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simon726

join:2006-12-21
Ajax, ON

[Rant] Ontario Photo ID card now available at more locations

It's been almost a year and half since the Ontario government has become a "latecomer" on offering a non-drivers photo ID card after it joined the many other provinces that offer such a service.

Quebec is now the only province that does not offer a non-drivers photo ID card and the Government of Canada has stopped issuing the the so-called Certificates of Canadian Citizenship - in the form of photo ID cards. Instead, they are now issued in a letter-sized document, which is NOT considered a valid travel document.

I have no idea why, but the government is relentless on upgrading the certificate of Canadian citizenship photo ID cards - to modern security standards.

Anyways, back to my topic now and while the Ontario Photo ID card service initially offered at a handful of participating ServiceOntario centres, it has recently been expanded to many other ServiceOntario locations - the bulk of that in the Toronto area. You can review the information (dated May 2012) at these links:
»news.ontario.ca/mgs/en/2012/05/o···res.html
»news.ontario.ca/mgs/en/2012/05/o···res.html

This prompted me on writing a letter to the editor of my local community newspaper. This letter can be founded here: »www.durhamregion.com/opinion/let···resolved

What really bothers me is that not many people aren't getting the message on what the Ontario Photo Card (for non-drivers) is all about. They believe it's just a cookie-cutter version of a drivers licence (but the fact is that it's a government-issued photo ID card for Ontario residents aged 16 who do not have an Ontario Driver's license - in fact the words "NOT A DRIVERS LICENCE" is explicitly printed at the back).

They would consider this non-drivers photo ID card a fake, even though it's government-issued. I find that unacceptable. If you ever been to a club or bar and there is someone with a handheld card scanner verifying to sure if your card is genuine, rather than a fake. I would wish if the manufacturers who build these devices provide a "software/firmware" update to support the Ontario Photo Card for non-drivers.

Then again, it'll be a matter of time until everyone know what the Ontario Photo Card is. It's just like trying to learn a new language. In addition, you cannot (under any circumstances) have a drivers licence and an Ontario Photo Card at the same time. This is due to fraud prevention reasons. If you decide to drive later in life, you have to surrender your Ontario Photo Card when applying a drivers licence (G1/M1, etc.). If you want to stop driving - whether temporarily or for good - then you must surrender your drivers licence.

I really wish there was a system in place telling the customer if they hold a driver's licence when applying for the Ontario Photo Card. The same is true at DriveTest. When you apply for the G1 or M1, then there should be a way on notifying the applicant that they must surrender the Ontario Photo Card when applying for your G1 or M1.

I've been bashed, criticized and in some words - name called because I was lobbying for the Ontario Photo Card. I was not the only person who lobbied for it. Many people with disabilities and in fact - seniors lobbied for it too.

So my question is, what do you have to say about the Ontario Photo Card service being expanded to many locations and how would one person know on what the Ontario Photo Card is all about? I tend to explain on what the Ontario Photo Card is whenever I claim a parcel at the post office, buying booze at the LCBO/Beer Store and so forth. What's more, this particuilar photo card cannot be used to cross the United States border by land or water - a passport must be used. I'm wishing that an enhanced version of the card should be offered - although it won't be in the horizon.


Guspaz
Guspaz
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
kudos:20

Quebec has had government-issued photo ID for many years, our medicare cards. Ontario doesn't allow OHIP cards to be used as ID, but the opposite is true in Quebec; medicare cards are the normal card used by people without drivers licenses both as photo ID and to prove age.

I do realize, though, that what you really mean is photo ID with an address on it, which the medicare does not have. It should be noted, however, that the Ontario photo ID card is not a "travel document", and is only intended to serve as photo ID. I'm not sure it would have a huge value in Quebec, since most places accept medicare cards in concert with a mailed bill or lease.
--
Developer: Tomato/MLPPP, Linux/MLPPP, etc »fixppp.org



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

said by Guspaz:

Ontario doesn't allow OHIP cards to be used as ID, but the opposite is true in Quebec

Not true. It is perfectly acceptable to accept an Ontario health card as photo ID. The issue is that it is illegal for the OHIP number to be copied down by anyone other than the Ministry of Health or a health care provider, meaning anyone that keeps copies of identification or the numbers (e.g. banks) can't use a health card.

I'm surprised that Quebec has no similar provision, being that one's health records are... well... about as private as anything the government keeps track of can be. Those numbers are not exactly something I would want anyone to have a copy of.

As for the Ontario Photo ID being a travel document, it's in the works. It'll eventually work the same way as an EDL once the program is up and running for those who want the option added. It was their intention to offer this all along, but apparently there were cost issues or so they say.


elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand

reply to simon726
Show me your papers.. another step towards everyone carrying identify cards.


simon726

join:2006-12-21
Ajax, ON

reply to simon726
In fact, you can use your Ontario photo ID Card - to board a domestic flight within Canada. As Transport Canada regulations state that you must have at least one (1) piece of government issued photo ID if travel within Canada.

Read the details here: »www.passengerprotect.gc.ca/ident···nts.html

As air transport security is under federal jurisdiction, those laws trump (override) provincial laws. Likewise, many federal agencies do follow provincial law, others don't.


NCRGuy

join:2008-03-03
Ottawa, ON

said by simon726:

In fact, you can use your Ontario photo ID Card - to board a domestic flight within Canada. As Transport Canada regulations state that you must have at least one (1) piece of government issued photo ID if travel within Canada.

Read the details here: »www.passengerprotect.gc.ca/ident···nts.html

As air transport security is under federal jurisdiction, those laws trump (override) provincial laws. Likewise, many federal agencies do follow provincial law, others don't.

Who are you debating with, and which provincial laws are being overridden by federal law?

And all federal agencies follow provincial law insofar as it applies.


rogersmogers

@start.ca

reply to elwoodblues

said by elwoodblues:

Show me your papers.. another step towards everyone carrying identify cards.

there is nothing wrong with this.

Bob
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey
Reviews:
·Optimum Online

reply to simon726

said by simon726:

If you want to stop driving - whether temporarily or for good - then you must surrender your drivers licence.

OK, I'll bite. Is there some sort of requirement to periodically drive if you have a drivers license? If so, what is the maximum time interval between mandatory driving episodes? And is there a minimum distance to be driven during a mandatory driving episode?

Why can't you keep your drivers license and just not drive a car?


urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable

reply to Gone

said by Gone:

It is perfectly acceptable to accept an Ontario health card as photo ID.

While it's acceptable to accept it, one of the arguments made by people on CBC Radio was that it's not accepted at clubs and bars and there are plenty of young adults that don't want to drive so it seems a good idea that we have an appropriate ID card specifically for identification purposes.

Of course people can always get their passports, which are always accepted.


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

reply to Bob
If you run into health issues that prevent you from driving, your doctor will have your drivers license suspended and you will be required to surrender it. People with certain health issues would never be allowed to obtain a license to begin with.

Furthermore, if decide to no longer drive and you let your license expire it then becomes a invalid piece of ID even though you may have never surrendered it (even though you're legally supposed to). People over 80 are required to re-test every two years, so it's not like they can just continue paying for a license they never intend to use, either.

The Photo ID card is also a considerably cheaper than maintaining a drivers license you never intend to use for driving.



Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

reply to urbanriot

said by urbanriot:

While it's acceptable to accept it, one of the arguments made by people on CBC Radio was that it's not accepted at clubs and bars and there are plenty of young adults that don't want to drive so it seems a good idea that we have an appropriate ID card specifically for identification purposes.

A health card is perfectly acceptable ID at clubs and bars. The only reason it someone wouldn't accept it is because they're falling for the same "it's not valid ID" game without knowing any better. For what it's worth, it's also acceptable at the LCBO, and a cop will use it to verify your identity if you ever found yourself in that kind of situation.

It's only an issue if they need to copy the ID or write the number down, which is a legal no-no. This is why banks will run for the hills if you try to hand them a health card. This is what the Photo Card is for, since it is a 100% analog to a drivers license as far as ID goes.

As for a passport, I'm not sure I'd want to carry that with me during a night on the town, but that's just me.

Bob
Account deleted

join:2012-07-22
New Jersey

reply to Gone
OK, but simon726 said if you want to stop driving (implies this is being done voluntarily), you must surrender your drivers licence (implies this is mandatory).



urbanriot
Premium
join:2004-10-18
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Cogeco Cable

reply to Gone

said by Gone:

The only reason it someone wouldn't accept it is because they're falling for the same "it's not valid ID" game without knowing any better.

Well, it probably doesn't help that the Alcohol and Gaming Commission of Ontario (AGCO) site states:

quote:
You should not ask for the Ontario Health Card as identification, but if offered voluntarily you may accept it at your discretion.
»www.agco.on.ca/en/whatwedo/legal_age_id.aspx


Paolo
Mr. Wireless

join:2004-05-29
canada

reply to Gone

said by Gone:

said by Guspaz:

Ontario doesn't allow OHIP cards to be used as ID, but the opposite is true in Quebec

Not true. It is perfectly acceptable to accept an Ontario health card as photo ID. The issue is that it is illegal for the OHIP number to be copied down by anyone other than the Ministry of Health or a health care provider, meaning anyone that keeps copies of identification or the numbers (e.g. banks) can't use a health card.

I'm surprised that Quebec has no similar provision, being that one's health records are... well... about as private as anything the government keeps track of can be. Those numbers are not exactly something I would want anyone to have a copy of.

As for the Ontario Photo ID being a travel document, it's in the works. It'll eventually work the same way as an EDL once the program is up and running for those who want the option added. It was their intention to offer this all along, but apparently there were cost issues or so they say.

i have a letter FROM OHIP that specifically states, you are not requird to show your ohip card to anyone who is not authorized helth care professional. I went to a bar/club once and they asked for my id, i said i only have my ohip card on me and he asked to see it so i opened my wallet and instead of pulling out my ohip card i handed him the little letter i got, i cut it smaller so it would fit in my wallet and highlighted the part where it said your not required to show it to anyone who is not health care professoinal, and i askd him if he was a doctor or nurse? and he read the letter, felt embarrased and let me in and did not bother me any more.
--
Happiness is like peeing your pants... Everyone can see it, but only you can feel its Warmth!!


Gone
Premium
join:2011-01-24
Fort Erie, ON
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Start Communicat..

reply to urbanriot

Re: [Rant] Ontario Photo ID card now available at more locations

said by urbanriot:

Well, it probably doesn't help that the Alcohol and Gaming Commission of Ontario (AGCO) site states:

... AGCO says exactly what I've been saying all along.

And for what it's worth, it's illegal for anyone to ask for a health card as ID. It can only be offered.


donoreo
Premium
join:2002-05-30
North York, ON

said by Gone:

said by urbanriot:

Well, it probably doesn't help that the Alcohol and Gaming Commission of Ontario (AGCO) site states:

... AGCO says exactly what I've been saying all along.

And for what it's worth, it's illegal for anyone to ask for a health card as ID. It can only be offered.

Such nuances are lost on many.
--
The irony of common sense, it is not that common.
I cannot deny anything I did not say.
A kitten dies every time someone uses "then" and "than" incorrectly.
I mock people who give their children odd spelling of names.

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