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ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA

1 edit

2 recommendations

reply to Telco

Re: Back to worst-case-scenario to start with!

Continuation of »Back to worst-case-scenario to start with!

said by Iscream:

Callcentric is 100% redundant locally, in all possible means - lines, equipment, databases, etc., but is NOT multi-site'd - it doesn't have geographical redundancy.

You obviously don't have ANY power redundancy. Not only do you have no generator, but you keep claiming that "companies" in NYC are not allowed to have a generator, only "buildings" are allowed. As if a building has the purchasing power to get itself a generator!

Did you mean "landlords" / "companies with real estate" when you say "buildings"; and "tenants" when you say "companies"?

said by Iscream:

It's NOT clear [to me] that "there are hardly any plans.." - this is incorrect to say the least, it's rather that economics play a major role here - CC slowly builds its network while providing the best service quality and reliability possible FOR THE CURRENT BUDGET. When a city that never sleeps goes OFF because of a natural disaster - CC keeps its service as long as it can, but then it also goes off until it can restore its utility power.

Thanks for being Callcentric customer.

CallCentric is too cool to co-locate in a real data-centre, with other customers and real power generators and power redundancy.

An extra server or two in San Jose and Amsterdam would cost you next to nothing compared to the salary of yours or your fellow engineers, or even customer support specialists (dunno if you're one, too). However, it won't necessarily have as much redundancy as your operation in New York, would it? So, you'd rather have a super-redundant operation in NY (apart from the pre-planned power supply fiasco), that breaks down with man-made and natural disasters every 8 years or so, than to invest in backup operations out of a remote location that could potentially experience minor problems much more often than every 8 years or so. This is clearly your plan and line of thought. And it's a disappointing one.

Because of your poor planning, I lost all service, including my Google Voice and IPKall service. My own planning is at fault there, too, of course: I simply couldn't imagine that the setup of the most highly regarded VoIP company could be that faulty and NYC-power-grid dependent; you invested literally nothing into any kind of next-911 planning.

said by Iscream:

Before I'm going to sleep a couple hours:

- took only 2 days (53 hours) to restore the service. NASDAQ and NYSE's floors are still down for general public. Perhaps Thursday or Friday.

- speaking of MAJOR national and world-wide carriers, about those who were and still are down - here is not compete list:

Belgacom, Telia, KPN (including former iBasis), TATA (not just BIG - this is THE LARGEST CARRIER in the world, no one is LARGER - TATA has TWO POPs in NY State - both were down), Verizon - still down, no even sign of life, ATT, T-Mobile, Sprint - either fully or still partially down along the way from Staten Island, through Brooklyn and Lower Manhattan including our offices. Speaking of "smaller" ones - Broadvox, iNetworks (that's Bandwidth and Dash-911 and Republic Wireless). Want even smaller ones - how about VoxBone ? Huh?

I'm in California, with connections to North Carolina and Ontario. T-Mobile USA in California was not down, AT&T Wireless in North Carolina was not down, AT&T and HE.net are not down (might have had some very brief (under 10 minutes) connectivity issues due to Telia, dunno), Google Voice (outside of NYC-based mnemonic numbers) was not down. OnSIP, which has their main servers in NYC, were not down. CallCentric is the only one that let me down by failing to secure any kind of power generators with their landlord.

Telco

join:2008-12-19

1 recommendation

If your phone service was that critical to you, why is it their fault?

Using ipKall or google voice for example, which are free services with a ZERO SLA, allows you to forward your calls to whomever immediately.

CC is a small BYOD provider after all. Rest assured, if the same occurred to any one of these basement fly-by-night providers, they'd be down for weeks; with their support staff being told to deny that there is any problem.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
How it occur with the smaller providers, if nearly every over provider that is much smaller than CallCentric is employing geographic redundancy? Both Anveo and voip.ms have a multi-server setup across the world.

Telco

join:2008-12-19

2 edits
reply to ConstantineM
said by ConstantineM:

I'm in California, with connections to North Carolina and Ontario. T-Mobile USA in California was not down, AT&T Wireless in North Carolina was not down, AT&T and HE.net are not down (might have had some very brief (under 10 minutes) connectivity issues due to Telia, dunno), Google Voice (outside of NYC-based mnemonic numbers) was not down. OnSIP, which has their main servers in NYC, were not down. CallCentric is the only one that let me down by failing to secure any kind of power generators with their landlord.

That fact that you just compared cell networks of organizations with a market cap of over $150 billion dollar to a small BYOD provider says it all really.

Telecommunications networks are not some data network. Telecommunications networks are not the same as some Facebook or the next pyramid scheme dot.com shell company out there. POTS is still dead in vasts sections of NYC, even when one of the largest telecommunications companies on the planet is working on it.

BTW.. Onsips's plans 'start' at $39.95.

nitzan
Premium,VIP
join:2008-02-27
kudos:8

2 recommendations

reply to ConstantineM
said by ConstantineM:

How it occur with the smaller providers, if nearly every other provider that is much smaller than CallCentric is employing geographic redundancy? Both Anveo and voip.ms have a multi-server setup across the world.

Add Future Nine to that list.

The problem isn't that it's hard or expensive to do it (it's not) - the problem is that CallCentric is using proprietary systems that make it hard and expensive for them.


UHF
All static, all day, Forever
Premium,MVM
join:2002-05-24
Reviews:
·Mediacom
·Callcentric
·Dish Network

1 edit
said by nitzan:

the problem is that CallCentric is using proprietary systems that make it hard and expensive for them.

I'm not sure of what CallCentric is using for a switch, but from what they've said in the past, it's carrier grade telecom switches (most likely Lucent), connected to an SS7 and most likely TDM network. That's not any more "proprietary" than an Asterisk server. More expensive to make redundant - definitely, I can't argue that point. Which one is better? When all hell breaks loose probably the Asterisk box!

Edit: this isn't meant as an attack on Nitzan on F9, just saying there's different ways to do things, and one isn't necessarily and better/worse than the other. They bot have advantages and disadvantages depending on the situation.

Telco

join:2008-12-19
said by UHF:

I'm not sure of what CallCentric is using for a switch, but from what they've said in the past, it's carrier grade telecom switches (most likely Lucent), connected to an SS7 and most likely TDM network. That's not any more "proprietary" than an Asterisk server. More expensive to make redundant - definitely, I can't argue that point. Which one is better? When all hell breaks loose probably the Asterisk box!

They're also doing their own switching and interconnecting with actual telecommunications networks. Whereas, these Asterix box providers are basically reselling services and using trunks wholesaled from other providers and are essentially tier 3 voip providers.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
reply to Telco
said by Telco:

BTW.. Onsips's plans 'start' at $39.95.

Nope, OnSIP plans start at $0,00. I can call from any of my phones to any other phone through OnSIP for free; I don't pay anything to OnSIP; I only pay for a 519 DDI to CallCentric, which gets forwarded to OnSIP (that is, when CallCentric has power at their self-made DC).

Anveo and voip.ms are cheaper, yet have better redundancy. Of course, you continue to completely ignore that every other provider mentioned has proper geographic redundancy, other than CallCentric!


Arne Bolen
Happy Anveo customer
Premium
join:2009-06-21
Cyberspace
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Anveo
·voip.ms
reply to ConstantineM
said by ConstantineM:

Because of your poor planning, I lost all service, including my Google Voice and IPKall service.

Google Voice and IPKall has nothing to do with Callcentric. You can at any time set another destination phone number in your Google Voice, it takes only a few seconds to do that. The same applies for IPKall.

I don't think it's fair to blame Callcentric for your failure to change the forwarding settings in Google Voice and IPKall.
--
My VoIP News


ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA
reply to UHF
said by UHF:

said by nitzan:

the problem is that CallCentric is using proprietary systems that make it hard and expensive for them.

I'm not sure of what CallCentric is using for a switch, but from what they've said in the past, it's carrier grade telecom switches (most likely Lucent), connected to an SS7 and most likely TDM network. That's not any more "proprietary" than an Asterisk server. More expensive to make redundant - definitely, I can't argue that point. Which one is better? When all hell breaks loose probably the Asterisk box!

What you have to understand though is that those systems are much more complicated. If it were as simple as you have stated, then why are all those Verizon CO's still down and no one has phone service? They should have a backup system on the other side of the country for all their interconnects.

Telco

join:2008-12-19

1 recommendation

reply to ConstantineM
said by ConstantineM:

Anveo and voip.ms are cheaper, yet have better redundancy. Of course, you continue to completely ignore that every other provider mentioned has proper geographic redundancy, other than CallCentric!

Okay, but their rates are also more expensive.

I am not trying to convince you to stay with them. If you feel others are better for your needs, then go for it.

However, for me, with all things being factored, I don't share your grievances about CC or how they handled it. In fact, I praise them for it and didn't expect them to contact me every 5 minutes to tell me where they are at.

Heck, I pay comcast out of the a--, and it took them 6 months to fix my issue. Half of that time was spent trying to get in contact with someone who cared and had a clue. Never ever had this problem with CC, not even if I messaged them in the morning.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
reply to Telco

the cloud

said by Telco:

Telecommunications networks are not some data network. Telecommunications networks are not the same as some Facebook or the next pyramid scheme dot.com shell company out there. POTS is still dead in vasts sections of NYC, even when one of the largest telecommunications companies on the planet is working on it.

Except that telco networks are in fact data network. Take a look at any tutorial on how a PSTN to VoIP system works. The call gets to the CO, then it gets to the internet usually right from the CO. Noone here is complaining about COs being down (that's completely understandable). In fact, it's pretty clear that most COs outside of NY/NJ are not down at all. And anything other than the CO part of VoIP can, in fact, be hosted from the cloud (as some insiders here clearly indicate); so, it's entirely CallCentric's decision to decide to not provide any service during a hurricane, whereas much smaller companies with smaller budgets can easily afford to provide such services.


UHF
All static, all day, Forever
Premium,MVM
join:2002-05-24
Reviews:
·Mediacom
·Callcentric
·Dish Network
said by ConstantineM:

Except that telco networks are in fact data network. Take a look at any tutorial on how a PSTN to VoIP system works. The call gets to the CO, then it gets to the internet usually right from the CO.

But you or I don't know where the conversion from TDM to VOIP is taking place. At the switch the DID terminates at? At CallCentrics switch? Somewhere in between? We don't know. So we can't argue that it was easy to re-route because we don't know that. Only Callcentric does.

I was actually thinking about this last night before they came back up, and I decided my biggest, and probably only legitimate complaint (although I had lots of complaints initially!) is that they could have sent a mass email before powering down informing the users of what was happening. But hindsight is always 20/20, and I'm sure they were panicking over the situation and wanted to preserve the integrity of their systems so did a clean shutdown right away.


ploogman

@verizon.net
reply to ConstantineM
From what I understand, CallCentric does not use Tier 4 Data Centers or any data center. They have their systems in their offices with whatever internet connectivity they have as well.

They should either using cloud or hosting or colocation services
within multiple (at least 2) Tier 4 Data Centers. T4 Data Centers have extensive power backup, generators, physical security, some are underground and protected, and they typically have 20-30 disparate internet connections to various top tier internet carriers.

That would also give CC the ability to scale up massively if necessary to withstand attacks instead of leaving everyone without service during attacks. And for storms, this would have been a lot better. Sure, reaching a call that terminates in NY/NJ might have been hard, but it would not have totally taken out CallCentric's system entirely for users all over the US and overseas. Really bad planning in my opinion. And they carry and charge for 911 service too!

I do not know a lot about voip.ms, but they claim to host service in multiple cities so users can switch on the fly to another location. Of course, they probably have some kind of centralized system, and I don't know where that is, or whether it needs to be operational, but overall, the topology of voip.ms seems better at least from where I am sitting.

Maybe CC can be more transparent and discuss their operations. I fear their systems and NOC is just in their office building which is certainly not a T4 data center. And, I believe the most secure T4 data centers are not in NYC.

This is not an issue of cost by the way, just planning. Using real data centers would not be a big cost issue for CC and they could even use hosting to get rid of reliance on their own hardware.

Hope the CC staff all made it through the storm Ok. They have been so wonderful and I hope they can make some changes and keep it going. Worst case scenario planning is needed though.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
reply to UHF
said by UHF:

said by ConstantineM:

Except that telco networks are in fact data network. Take a look at any tutorial on how a PSTN to VoIP system works. The call gets to the CO, then it gets to the internet usually right from the CO.

But you or I don't know where the conversion from TDM to VOIP is taking place. At the switch the DID terminates at? At CallCentrics switch? Somewhere in between? We don't know. So we can't argue that it was easy to re-route because we don't know that. Only Callcentric does.

No, we actually know -- reportedly, all their TDM-to-VoIP conversions that actually take place at CallCentric's office are currently down (e.g. the free New York numbers). (BTW, my bro's Google Voice 347 number is no longer down, yet my CallCentric's 845 is; however, I'm not blaming CC for 845 being down, that's what comes with the number being in NY.) All non-NY and non-NJ numbers that are up, are most certainly converted to VoIP somewhere else other than CallCentric. So, it's pretty clear that this whole thing could have been avoided with quite little effort, just some good preparation.


MRcheap

@sbcglobal.net
reply to UHF
Callcentric never even refunded me for the amount of days their service was out. I don't care that the charge is negligible. For personal unlimited incoming number and 911 service they charge something just below $8. My service was out for at least 9 days. 2 dollars is still 2 dollars. It seems callcentric believes they are entitled to keeping the money without providing services just because the amount is minimal. That's like going to to a fast food restaurant and getting a sandwich that's been quarter of the way eaten and getting the explanation that a quarter of a sandwich isn't worth that much.

Iscream
Premium
join:2009-02-17
New York, NY
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
Thanks for rising this point.

Throughout its more than 11 year business history and 8 years in serving retail (end customers) Callcentric has NEVER had charged any, even smallest amount, in an unfair manner. Any requests for refund were always and still are handled with 100% precision. In most cases - even contradicting our own Terms&Conditions policies - Callcentric returns 100% money back AFTER a customer has already spent some, large or even ALL amount from their account - just to save time on talking to fraudsters and those who want take an advantage of credit card transaction system.

It doesn't matter - $2 or $2000 - Callcentric always returned 100%.

On another hand - many aspects of billing systems are fully automated in order to save money and avoid time lost on manually performing transactions - therefore systems do whatever they are programmed for while customers are entitled to open trouble-tickets when/if something goes wrong.

And on totally another hand (or shall I say - foot? ) - all Callcentric personnel [during October - since DDOS started and until now] had been overwhelmed serving ongoing technical issues related to DDOS and customers' settings related to that while it had been communicated to ALL customers [not once] that appropriate financial arrangements will be made and fair credits will be issued.

And on another foot - the outage itself lasted TWO days due to the hurricane. All other days, due to DDOS attack - it was a major impact on Callcentric employees and systems, but NOT for customers who could/was_able_to modify their settings and keep using our service without any issue. Or, in case of severe limitations - at least, a customer might configure an unconditional call forwarding and keep enjoying PSTN-like quality of Callcentric services. To say the truth - a waste majority of our customers, until the hurricane, HAD NOT EVEN noticed that Callcentric experienced anything unusual.

Have you at least ever asked about a refund? - you're welcome!

Thanks you. More updates to follow up later.


MrCheap

@sbcglobal.net
That's amusing because the first thing callcentric did once they went back online was drop my phone number and 911 service for being 2 days late on my payment. Whoops, sorry I forgot to refill my account for a service that was rarely reliable in the past month. So essentially you dropped my number and cancelled my service after I had non-existent 911 service for the better part of a month and an unreliable and mostly unusable service for the good portion of the previous month. The more amusing part of it is that once I realized I was late and wanted to make a payment, your website was gone for 3 days. But the second you went back online you sent me an email saying you had dropped my service.

I do have an open ticket that hasn't been answered. But it's nice to see you guys active on these boards on a Saturday. Though, I wish you answered trouble tickets instead.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
reply to Iscream

still not an email nor a press release from CallCentric

said by Iscream:

And on another foot - the outage itself lasted TWO days due to the hurricane. All other days, due to DDOS attack - it was a major impact on Callcentric employees and systems, but NOT for customers who could/was_able_to modify their settings and keep using our service without any issue. Or, in case of severe limitations - at least, a customer might configure an unconditional call forwarding and keep enjoying PSTN-like quality of Callcentric services. To say the truth - a waste majority of our customers, until the hurricane, HAD NOT EVEN noticed that Callcentric experienced anything unusual.

Before the tropical cyclone, I have only noticed that it took slightly longer time to register with a SIP server. I use OnSIP throughout my phones, since CallCentric doesn't support multiple SIP registrations. I can understand that it's always difficult to fight a DDoS attack, and the DDoS never really affected my experience with CC. Infrequent outgoing international calls worked as usual; incoming calls were seemingly unaffected.

Moreover, I also haven't noticed that my CallCentric line was completely down, until maybe after 5 hours that it has been down. (This might have been different, however; I might have actually had some important conversation scheduled to occur; and would have had to coordinate an alternative accommodations at the last minute.)

I still have not received any emails about the downtime incident, the only recent emails from CallCentric in my mailbox are about my credit card being billed.

I think it's rather pointless to be opening trouble tickets and asking for 50 cent refunds here (I'm on Personal Unlimited). I'm hopeful that CallCentric will give out all due refunds automatically, instead of expecting to get away with their lack of Business Continuity Planning, as madjeff See Profile explained earlier (»Re: CC Disaster). If refunds are issued, they should be issued to everyone.

Would it help if I open a trouble ticket, asking for refunds to be issued to everyone whose services were unduly affected due to CallCentric's lack of BCP?

Iscream
Premium
join:2009-02-17
New York, NY
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

1 edit

1 recommendation

reply to MrCheap

Re: the cloud

Sir - I do respect your opinion and clearly understand your frustration.

Yes, we're active on all levels - in trouble-tickets and these boards because the quality of our support is one of our key selling points (on top of quality of our voice and service in general).

Unfortunately, due to matters much beyond our control, we're overloaded 10x compared to our normal levels of "overload" - we don't over-subscribe our tech. personnel while always accepting more engineers to our company. Just to compare - normally we have 1-2 pages of trouble-tickets' headers pending in queue - during last month until now - it averages at 20-24 pages. All our guys work almost without having private/family time last 4 weeks. We're trying to speed things up, but it may take about one week more to catch up. I'm not saying the above to get an excuse - just to show you the facts.

I'm sorry about _what_ happened to your account, but unfortunately there is nobody behind that "evil" thing... Simply our automated billing system, many years already, at 20th each month sends e-mail alerts to everybody that a billing period is about to begin at 27th and everybody should make sure that their account balance and/or credit card information is current and correct. At 27th each month's the system runs a first billing cycle trying to bill for all products and services while notifying customers whose accounts had not been charged, due to one or another reason - that they have until the end of the month to add missing information or funds to their accounts. The same cycle is attempted each day until last night of current month.

At first hour (GMT) of next month's first day - the system removes all canceled/unpaid products from customer records and issues monthly statements (or alerts about them) ready on customer's account.

Everything above is fully automated otherwise it would not be possible to provide the service at prices we do it.

Our WEB site as well as technical support guys have ready (as many like to say "canned") receipts of _what_ should be done to restore by an accident missed/lost service. No additional charges are applied in order to restore any products (there are automated setup charges which are [also always explained by our guys] refunded once the service/product were restored).

It's rather very simple process to restore your products (and I'm glad that you consider it - better angry than lost ) - may people on this forum may explain the procedure in details.

I'm apologizing again that, due to events above and beyond our control, the system was unavailable last two days for you (and many more other people, unfortunately!) to add funds/credit cards, etc.

Thank you very much.

P.S. I may bet that many people _here_ will confirm that our system was available and reliably providing service during most time when our customer's side SBC interface was under DDOS attack (b/w - that attack is still there - it resumed by end of Thursday and began fading again around noon time today - the behavior is as usual; but it [the attack] doesn't get anymore to levels of load posing threat to our established quality level due to many layers of mitigation procedures and algorithms established during last weeks are still being applied).

Many thanks to hardware and software vendors who quickly stud up to closely cooperate with us on fixing their firmwares (I'll write about this and other things later, in more details, when time permits).

Edit - fixed typos.

PX Eliezer70
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to ConstantineM

Re: Back to worst-case-scenario to start with!

said by ConstantineM:

Because of your poor planning, I lost all service, including my Google Voice and IPKall service. My own planning is at fault there, too, of course: I simply couldn't imagine that the setup of the most highly regarded VoIP company could be that faulty and NYC-power-grid dependent; you invested literally nothing into any kind of next-911 planning.

You feel that you phone service is crucial and cannot afford outages, yet you depend on GV and IPKall?

Really?

said by ConstantineM:

CallCentric is the only one that let me down by failing to secure any kind of power generators with their landlord.

They had other backups, and those other backups would have been fine in anything other than an extraordinary event like this.

I am 57 years old, and have lived for 52 of those years in metro NYC, New Jersey, and Norfolk VA, major coastal areas all.

I have never been through anything like this in those 52 years and hope to hell I never have anything like this again.

said by ConstantineM:

CallCentric is the only one that let me down by failing to secure any kind of power generators with their landlord.

A whole bunch of NYC hospitals (most notably NYU Medical Center) had generators fail.

You'd better make plans to never use a NYC hospital.

PX Eliezer70
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to nitzan
said by nitzan:

said by ConstantineM:

How it occur with the smaller providers, if nearly every other provider that is much smaller than CallCentric is employing geographic redundancy? Both Anveo and voip.ms have a multi-server setup across the world.

Add Future Nine to that list.

FutureNine has had its own failures, as I recall.

said by nitzan:

The problem isn't that it's hard or expensive to do it (it's not) - the problem is that CallCentric is using proprietary systems that make it hard and expensive for them.

I like and respect you, but sometimes you say that CC systems are proprietary, and at other times you say that their systems aren't much different from anyone else's.

PX Eliezer70
Premium
join:2008-08-09
Hutt River
kudos:13
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
reply to MRcheap

Re: the cloud

said by MRcheap :

Callcentric never even refunded me for the amount of days their service was out.

There was an old Carol Burnett comedy skit in which there is an airplane in distress, a takeoff on the "Airplane" movies. After much difficulty, the plane is finally landed safely.

But 3 seconds after landing, the runway is split apart by an earthquake....

CC is not yet done with the aftermath of the DDoS attack. Debriefing is coming. I have no idea what that will include, but like the guy in the Levitra commercials, it will come.

They really never had a chance to do it yet, with Sandy happening. The DDoS attack and Sandy were two big floods, back to back....

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA
reply to PX Eliezer70

After days of downtime, who's more reliable?

said by PX Eliezer70:

said by ConstantineM:

Because of your poor planning, I lost all service, including my Google Voice and IPKall service. My own planning is at fault there, too, of course: I simply couldn't imagine that the setup of the most highly regarded VoIP company could be that faulty and NYC-power-grid dependent; you invested literally nothing into any kind of next-911 planning.

You feel that you phone service is crucial and cannot afford outages, yet you depend on GV and IPKall?

Really?

Google Voice is obviously much more reliable than CallCentric is!

My brother's Google Voice mnemonic number in NYC, 347 NPA, didn't work only for about a day or two (when CallCentric was completely down, too, BTW). Whereas my 845 NPA number in Nyack, NY, with CallCentric, is still down, nearly a week, and counting!

Yet, in your view, CallCentric is somehow more reliable than Google Voice?

Really?

For one, now I know that I certainly can't depend on CallCentric for not having prolonged outages. And something tells me that should this free 845 number in Nyack be ported, it'll actually be working with another carrier right away, long before the free NY-based numbers will come back up with CallCentric.

My beef, however, is not the free NY numbers, but the fact that ALL numbers, EVERYWHERE in the world, didn't work with CallCentric due to their lack of BCP. I'm sure they could probably even make these NY numbers work right away by porting to another carrier, but aren't going to bother due to high costs of such an operation (and I won't be blaming them for this, I will just note that these free numbers are what they are).

hardly
Premium
join:2004-02-10
USA
said by ConstantineM:

Google Voice is obviously much more reliable than CallCentric is!

My brother's Google Voice mnemonic number in NYC, 347 NPA, didn't work only for about a day or two (when CallCentric was completely down, too, BTW). Whereas my 845 NPA number in Nyack, NY, with CallCentric, is still down, nearly a week, and counting!

Yet, in your view, CallCentric is somehow more reliable than Google Voice?

Really?

For one, now I know that I certainly can't depend on CallCentric for not having prolonged outages. And something tells me that should this free 845 number in Nyack be ported, it'll actually be working with another carrier right away, long before the free NY-based numbers will come back up with CallCentric.

My beef, however, is not the free NY numbers, but the fact that ALL numbers, EVERYWHERE in the world, didn't work with CallCentric due to their lack of BCP. I'm sure they could probably even make these NY numbers work right away by porting to another carrier, but aren't going to bother due to high costs of such an operation (and I won't be blaming them for this, I will just note that these free numbers are what they are).

Why don't you go ahead and port it and let us know if your hunch is correct?

Iscream
Premium
join:2009-02-17
New York, NY
kudos:6
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

2 recommendations

reply to ConstantineM
Dear Constantine,

How would you call a person speculating about things they have no clue about yet judging based on those speculations?

To make it simpler - do you want to bet for ONE MILLION DOLLAR against just ONE THOUSAND declared publicly here that you CANNOT port those numbers out now? That even if you'd bring this MILLION DOLLAR to our building or anywhere near it - that you'd still NOT be able to port those numbers out?

That even if you'd convince Callcentric to get that ONE MILLION DOLLAR and let you port just ONE NUMBER (or any other amount) out - that would still fail?

Do you know an English word giving an exact descriptive characteristic to people who match with the above description - it's, by the way, the same word in Russian and is spelled the same way?

Do you want to know "why"? - because unlike of Google - Callcentric is the REAL OWNER of those numbers. They belong to Callcentric's exchanges in their respective NPA-NXXes. Why? - Because Callcentric's CLEC division has those numbers and is responsible for them.

Until Callcentric's switching and signaling facilities are reachable from outside via SS7 links and ISUP trunks - those numbers are DEAD for anywhere on the planet even if some company may tell you that they port them for you.

I'd suggest to read at least that part which is related to LNP and how it's accomplished. If you'd bother reading the threads here (versus just trolling here) - you'd found out my post where I wrote that we attempted to perform a cross tandem routing by establishing a Sigtran SS7 connection to Atlanta SCP (go figure for this abbreviation means). Then we'd be able to call NPAC (figure that too) and move some our NPA-NXXes to other tandems where we have connectivity to thus bringing up at least some ranges (our own, in-office ranges in particular). But this task was not accomplish-able due to too many unknown ISUP (figure that too) routing segments required to establish correct signalling at least to one tandem for one NPA-NXX block.

I must say - you're not alone on those forums. I've seen many - this is why I'm so upset and "arrogant" as many call my tone. Be it. If somebody doesn't like it - their choice, I agree - I'm arrogant and not politically correct by calling things by their real names. Just yesterday here was another one who declared that another provider is able to move their entire POP from one geographical location to another one just within minutes because they use BGP for exchanging information. That's exactly _what_ you've done in your post. The person doesn't even know what the abbreviation BGP stands for not talking about principles behind. When hit with a question (not from myself) - the person just answered that he is not an expert in networking, but surely is one in VoIP and that he figured that [BGP based momentarily moving to another place - what a BS just by itself] feature from their provider...

Well (Dave - do you read me?) - those things clearly show [to me] what kinds of "experts" are expressing their judging and claiming "opinions" here.

ConstantineM

join:2011-09-02
San Jose, CA

1 recommendation

I appreciate your reply, Iscream. My assumption about these NY numbers is clearly wrong; in my excuse (and, come on, this thread is full of excuses, so, I surely can have one, too), it was your statements about all your SS7 links etc still being down, due to the local flooding of local NYC infrastructure, which made me hypothesize that those numbers might be ported and brought up elsewhere, since, supposedly, the infrastructure back in Nyack is not supposed to have been affected; I didn't realise they'd have to always pass through your NYC infrastructure.

What do you expect people will do if there are hardly any official updates or explanations available regarding the situation, and when it is painstakingly clear that many parts of the disaster could have been avoided and more pro-active communication should have happened?

Anyhow, as I see you're really upset and think that everyone is against you at this point (the only trolls in this thread I saw were fully registered users), I'd like to make an official disclosure: I still haven't ported any of my DIDs from CallCentric. So, it must be not all that bad. (But I am investigating my options.)

I'm looking forward to your full report.

josephf

join:2009-04-26
reply to ConstantineM
Area Code 845 is Westchester, bordering NYC, and part of the disaster area.