dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
23
share rss forum feed


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
reply to tshirt

Re: Getting 305/65

said by tshirt:

It's still branching off the cable plant just doesn't convert from fiber to coax for the last (1/2)mile.

sure the telcos could do something like that, but they don't match the price, even where they have capacity.
cable plants reach ALMOST as many homes as telco's and should have this expandtion capability.

Like Comcast's HFC plant, AT&T's "U-verse" plant is fiber to the node. I expect if Comcast was picking up enough 305 customers in the AT&T U-verse footprint, AT&T could introduce a competing service. So much for "Monopoly", eh?

Should we call it FFTN? (Fiber From The Node.)
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum


Donkee87

@rcn.com

Sorry NormanS, comcast HFC is nothing like uverse. Uverse is FTTN and uses VDSL technology over 100 year old twisted pair with something like 24mbps maximum for convinced data and tv to the home. HFC can deliver much more with virtually no limit on amount of boxes in the home.

said by NormanS:

said by tshirt:

It's still branching off the cable plant just doesn't convert from fiber to coax for the last (1/2)mile.

sure the telcos could do something like that, but they don't match the

Like Comcast's HFC plant, AT&T's "U-verse" plant is fiber to the node. I expect if Comcast was picking up enough 305 customers in the AT&T U-verse footprint, AT&T could introduce a competing service. So much for "Monopoly", eh?

Should we call it FFTN? (Fiber From The Node.)



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

2 edits

said by Donkee87 :

Sorry NormanS, comcast HFC is nothing like uverse. Uverse is FTTN and uses VDSL technology over 100 year old twisted pair ...

Hyperbole! I love it. Some points to ponder though:

• Copper wireline signaling is well over 100 years old (Samuel F. B. Morse patent, 1847).
• Coax is at least 100 years old (Oliver Heaviside patent, 1880).
• More than half the telco copper plant is less than seventy-five years old. (U.S. population has more than doubled since the end of World War II).

Furthermore, DOCSIS (1997) is not a whole lot newer than ADSL (1988). Nine whole years newer!

... with something like 24mbps maximum for convinced data and tv to the home. HFC can deliver much more with virtually no limit on amount of boxes in the home.

Which does not detract from the fact that both use a hybrid of a century-plus-year-old wireline medium and optical fiber (FTTN) in their respective plants.

For television I find that satellite beats wireline (coax, or copper) hands down.

For Internet I would much rather pay <$30 a month for DSL speeds than >$50 a month for DOCSIS speeds.

P.S. I don't think YouTube much cares whether they are streaming over copper, or coax in the "Last Mile".

--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum


Donkee87

@rcn.com

said by NormanS:

said by Donkee87 :

Sorry NormanS, comcast HFC is nothing like uverse. Uverse is FTTN and uses VDSL technology over 100 year old twisted pair ...

Hyperbole! I love it. Some points to ponder though:

• Copper wireline signaling is well over 100 years old (Samuel F. B. Morse patent, 1847).
• Coax is at least 100 years old (Oliver Heaviside patent, 1880).
• More than half the telco copper plant is less than seventy-five years old. (U.S. population has more than doubled since the end of World War II).

Furthermore, DOCSIS (1997) is not a whole lot newer than ADSL (1988). Nine whole years newer!

... with something like 24mbps maximum for convinced data and tv to the home. HFC can deliver much more with virtually no limit on amount of boxes in the home.

Which does not detract from the fact that both use a hybrid of a century-plus-year-old wireline medium and optical fiber (FTTN) in their respective plants.

For television I find that satellite beats wireline (coax, or copper) hands down.

For Internet I would much rather pay <$30 a month for DSL speeds than >$50 a month for DOCSIS speeds.

P.S. I don't think YouTube much cares whether they are streaming over copper, or coax in the "Last Mile".

My reference to age is the actual installed infrastructure, not the year it was invented smarty pants. Last mile of virtually all uverse plant is 40 years old or more but regardless HfC limits way surpass the capabilities of ADSL or VDSL. You may be the dying few that prefer dsl over DOCSIS, peoplemare voting with the wallets and go DOCSIS on call or FTTP like fios. Sure YouTube doesn't care if you're streaming over twisted pair or coax but the one sitting bhind the computer screen on coax most likely can watch tha video in a higher resolution without buffering.


NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

said by Donkee87 :

My reference to age is the actual installed infrastructure, not the year it was invented smarty pants. Last mile of virtually all uverse plant is 40 years old or more ...

I can show you significant parts of Santa Clara county where that is not true. According to U.S. Census data, the population has nearly doubled (~1,000,000 to ~1,800,000) in the last 40 years. I'd guess nearly 55% of the AT&T plant is newer than 40 years. More when you add older neighborhoods where they upgraded F2 spans for deployment of U-verse.

... but regardless HfC limits way surpass the capabilities of ADSL or VDSL.

"HFC" is not a transport technology. DOCSIS is a transport technology, as is any form of DSL. "HFC" can be construed as "Hybrid Fiber Copper", as well as the traditional "Hybrid Fiber Coax". Now DOCSIS limits surpass any version of DSL; but either way, the plant topology is a mix of optical fiber and traditional metal.

You may be the dying few that prefer dsl over DOCSIS, peoplemare voting with the wallets ...

My wallet can't afford DOCSIS or fiber. Comcast does offer a little known tier with DSL speed; but most MSOs are shying away from such offers because they will lose high profit custom to we penny-pinching fool, who'd rather save the difference between DSL price and DOCSIS price for items like 's PIECES.


... and go DOCSIS on call or FTTP like fios. Sure YouTube doesn't care if you're streaming over twisted pair or coax but the one sitting bhind the computer screen on coax most likely can watch tha video in a higher resolution without buffering.

Buffering 720p video on YouTube was never a problem on my 3Mbs AT&T ADSL connection. And the real skinflints I know just let the clip buffer, then hit replay. They are willing to put up with that annoyance to save a few bucks.

Here is a thought: If the MSOs truly wish to bury the telcos, offer slower speed tiers at lower prices. They can do it, if they are willing to settle for lower profit margins.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum

BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH

You're the outlier. Most people recognize that since the internet is used for a lot of things in life, it's better to have more bandwidth (up to a point). Cable's normal packages are quite reasonably priced, usually around $50/mo. If you think of how much you use it, and what you do with it, it's totally worth it.



NormanS
I gave her time to steal my mind away
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:11
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC

said by BiggA:

You're the outlier.

"I am "Legion".

Most people recognize that since the internet is used for a lot of things in life, it's better to have more bandwidth (up to a point).

Except for those who don't.

Cable's normal packages are quite reasonably priced, usually around $50/mo. If you think of how much you use it, and what you do with it, it's totally worth it.

If you buy a TV package with your Internet; else it is closer to $70 (at least in the S.F. Bay Area).
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum