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LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE

89 Bronco II - Wont go into gear. Leaking Fluid Reservoir

Greetings.

89 Bronco II - clutch pedal going to floor. Wont go into gear.

Clutch pedal going to floor. Wont go into gear. Popped hood, found signs of fluid leakage, but cant pinpoint where.

I linked some pics, you can see where the fluid has eaten the paint on the firewall.

In the pics you can see where the paint is eaten around the sides of the panel that the fluid reservoir is connected to.

Also in the pics you can see all the way down the paint being eaten from the fluid.

I tried looking online, but cant find what is behind that panel.

heres the pics:

»imgur.com/a/intkP#0
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


shdesigns
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join:2000-12-01
Stone Mountain, GA
WHere does that hose from the clutch reservoir go? That will be the master cyl and probably where the leak is.

Is the reservoir empty?


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE
said by shdesigns:

WHere does that hose from the clutch reservoir go? That will be the master cyl and probably where the leak is.

Is the reservoir empty?

the hose goes down to a connection just below Brake booster, which seems dry, on the engine compartment side anyway.

It looks to me like it is coming from behind the 3 bolt panel that the reservoir is connected to.

Another question, the reservoir is only bolted on one side, as you can make out in one of the pics. the other side has no bolt hole or anything. I cant find and part breakdown diagram of whats behind that panel.
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


shdesigns
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join:2000-12-01
Stone Mountain, GA
Again, is the reservoir empty?

I think the other side hooks into a hole.


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE
said by shdesigns:

Again, is the reservoir empty?

I think the other side hooks into a hole.

Apparently its been leaking for awhile but the driver failed to mention it to anyone. They have just been putting fluid into it.

It was close to empty when I got to it.

Yes the other side looks like it hooks to a hole. I cant tell it the fluid squirted everywhere or if its leaking from behind that panel.

Not sure if anything clutch related is even behinf that panel.
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


shdesigns
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Stone Mountain, GA
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The clutch master cylinder will be at the other end of the hose. That or the slave cylinder is likely the source of the leak.

The master cylinder could be leaking inside the firewall; usually behind the carpet.

I would doubt the reservoir would leak unless you could see a crack.

The mess on the firewall could be from the PO spilling fluid refilling the reservoir.

Check the master and slave cylinders for leaks.
--
Scott Henion

Embedded Systems Consultant,
SHDesigns home - DIY Welder


ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA
reply to LeftOfSanity
From what I remember from my old Bronco II, the reservoir is just mounted to that plate. Nothing behind it.

The hose from the reservoir should go down to the master cylinder for the clutch. There should them be a steel line that goes down to and enters the tranny for the slave cylinder.

My guess is that the clutch master cylinder has a broken seal and needs to be replaced. Really isn't that hard to do except for having to bleed the air out. I cannot remember the procedure for that off the top of my head.


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE
reply to shdesigns
said by shdesigns:

The clutch master cylinder will be at the other end of the hose. That or the slave cylinder is likely the source of the leak.

The master cylinder could be leaking inside the firewall; usually behind the carpet.

I would doubt the reservoir would leak unless you could see a crack.

The mess on the firewall could be from the PO spilling fluid refilling the reservoir.

Check the master and slave cylinders for leaks.

Thanks for the help. I'm going to look further, is there an easy way to tell if its either the master or slave thats bad?

Ill obviously watch it while someone pumps it to see where fluid comes out, but other than that?
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


shdesigns
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Stone Mountain, GA
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You be able to see stains on either if they have a leak.

Take a look around the master cylinder. It could be leaking where the rod enters it from the pedal.

The slave looks to be a concentric type. So look at the transmission bell housing to see if brake fluid is dripping from bottom.
--
Scott Henion

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SHDesigns home - DIY Welder


ironweasel
Weezy
Premium
join:2000-09-13
Belen, NM
kudos:1
reply to LeftOfSanity
The BII uses the same (horrible) design for the clutch hydraulic system as the first generation (1990 - 1994) Explorer which I've replaced twice on our Explorer. The clutch master cylinder is indeed below the reservoir at the end of the hose and there is nothing related to the clutch on the other side of the firewall from the reservoir. 90% of the time on the BII / Explorer when the clutch hydraulic system fails it's because the seal on the slave cylinder blew out or rotted away.

I would bet dollars to donuts that the slave cylinder is the culprit in this case. As shdesigns See Profile pointed out, check around the bellhousing of the transmission and see if there is any hydraulic fluid or wetness present. If there is then you've found the problem. Do yourself a big favor (if it is indeed the slave) and buy a replacement from Napa or a Ford dealer. It will cost a bit more but it's an updated design and differs greatly from the one you'll get at Autozone / Advance / other discount chains.
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shdesigns
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Yes, ironweasel is right about crappy design. My '90 Cherokee uses a concentric design also.

I replaced it once and it lasted a few years. The original had a slow leak so you could keep adding fluid to keep going. The new one just suddenly blew the seal completely leaving me stuck on the road.

Replaced it with one from NAPA and no more problems. Also the quick disconnect can fail to hold. Mine had the fittings removed years ago in favor of a standard flare fitting.
--
Scott Henion

Embedded Systems Consultant,
SHDesigns home - DIY Welder


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE
reply to LeftOfSanity
UPDATE:

Spoke with owner again, it was driven twice since the original post.

They said the truck was drivable if they pumped the clutch a few times, but now its done.

The clutch pedal goes to the floor with no resistance. It comes back up on its own, the reservoir is full.

The truck will start with pedal pushed in, but putting truck into gear and letting clutch out, the engine just rev's, doesn't move.
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


ironweasel
Weezy
Premium
join:2000-09-13
Belen, NM
kudos:1
said by LeftOfSanity:

The truck will start with pedal pushed in, but putting truck into gear and letting clutch out, the engine just rev's, doesn't move.

This bit confuses me a little.

Starting with the pedal pushed in: OK, that's normal...the safety switch is working.

Truck in gear, let clutch out, doesn't move: How is it being put in gear if the clutch isn't working? Is the truck being started with the transmission in gear already or what?
--
I'll be stretching out the rhyme like gravity stretches time.


LeftOfSanity
People Suck.

join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE

1 edit
said by ironweasel:

said by LeftOfSanity:

The truck will start with pedal pushed in, but putting truck into gear and letting clutch out, the engine just rev's, doesn't move.

This bit confuses me a little.

Starting with the pedal pushed in: OK, that's normal...the safety switch is working.

Truck in gear, let clutch out, doesn't move: How is it being put in gear if the clutch isn't working? Is the truck being started with the transmission in gear already or what?

I start the truck in Nuetral. I push the clutch pedal in, put it into first gear, let the pedal out, nothing happens. Where normally it would buck.

I can put it into any gear, let the pedal out, nothing happens. If I give it gas, engine just revs.

I can put it into any gear while the truck is running without using the pedal at all. What does this tell us?
--
"I'm against picketing, but I don't know how to show it" - Mitch Hedberg


ironweasel
Weezy
Premium
join:2000-09-13
Belen, NM
kudos:1

1 edit
That tells us that either the clutch is disengaged all the time or something on the transmission is catastrophically broken.

It's a hydraulic clutch system so if the clutch is disengaged then there might be something stuck and causing hydraulic pressure on either the master or slave cylinder. You said in an earlier post that the pedal goes down to the floor with no resistance so I'm leaning towards one of the cylinders being the culprit.

First off, look around the transmission and see if there is any type of inspection hole on or near the bellhousing. On our Explorer which uses the M5OD-R1, which was also available on the B2, there's a decent size hole where you can see a portion of the slave cylinder and you can see it actuate. So check to see if that's possible on that transmission and see if you're able to see it move or just see it in general.

Also, you should be able to disconnect the hydraulic line at the slave cylinder, so I would suggest doing that and then using a small screwdriver or other object to depress the valve in the end of the line and then have someone depress the clutch pedal and see if any fluid comes out. If you don't get anything more than a dribble of fluid out then you're likely going to need a new master cylinder. If, however, you get a bunch of fluid then it's time to drop the transmission and take a look at the slave cylinder and all the other associated clutch components like the clutch disc itself, the pressure plate, flywheel, input shaft on the transmission and just give everything the "once over".

Pay attention to the "fingers" on the pressure plate and make sure none of them are broken or excessively worn and also make sure that there is still a sufficient amount of material left on the clutch disc.

small>--
I'll be stretching out the rhyme like gravity stretches time.

rody_44
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Quakertown, PA
reply to LeftOfSanity
Man that is one toasted clutch, Forget about it all and replace it all. Its toast


ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA
reply to LeftOfSanity
After you start the vehicle, can you put it in gear without pushing the clutch pedal? If you can, this would indicate to me either the clutch is just shot (unlikely as you normally get some type of engagement), something is broke in the tranny, or the clutch is stuck for some reason (could be mechanical or even something in the hydraulic line not letting the pressure release).

When you push in on the clutch, do you feel resistance or does it go in with no back pressure. I have a feeling it is time to pull the tranny to see what is going on. If I remember correctly, you have to pull the tranny regardless in order to get to the slave cylinder.