| Hauge water treatment (filtration, r osmosis and softening) We had a "free water test" from a Hauge water treatment salesman come to our house and test our water for hardness and contaminants. What he did was drop some dyes in a flask of water from our sink and it turned red which meant we had hard water. I already knew we had hard water, in fact our whole neighborhood has hard water and it's a huge problem in this area with the local water company.
By putting another dye in the flask, he said each drop would equal 1 ppm of hardness, and he had to count how many drops it takes to make the flask blue again. It took 18 drops so he said our hard water is extremely high at 18. Normally 10+ is considered "very hard water" he said.
Then he put two chemicals in another flask called precipitation a and precipitation b. In 15 minutes it was to separate the contaminates and minerals from the water. Boy did it ever. When the time was up it looked like a bunch of snot and debris floating on the top of the water in the flask. He also connected a temporary filter that he put into another flask with both chemicals again and showed us after 15 minutes it never showed that gross looking debris in it like when it was straight out of our kitchen sink.
Then he used some other chemical to test the pH level. At least that was ok.
So he tries to sell me this Hauge water softener with built in filtration and a reverse osmosis system that goes under the kitchen sink which is T'd off to the fridge for better tasting ice and it also gets it's own spigot.
The catch? $5200. Ouch. If I signed today he would give me 5 years of cleaning products for FREE. He was telling me that if I spend $100 a month on cleaning products, it would be no more and that soft water only needs a tiny dime amount of detergent or soap, plus dishwasher would only need a tablespoon of detergent. The whole sell of the system was that in 5 years after the loan is paid off that I would be getting money back for the investment because I didn't have to spend so much on cleaning products and maintenance of fixtures or pipes.
That was a hard price to swallow so when I said no, he went outside and gave my wife and I some time. Upon returning he said he called his boss and offered a display model from a trade show for $4000 if we agreed to install it tomorrow.
I still passed up on the offer. $4000 is a lot to spend on a water system, even if it is a 5 year loan, thats another monthly payment I don't want to deal with.
Anyone have any experience with this type of water system? I do have very hard water and may want to remedy it in the future, but I think I can do it for a lot less than $4000.
Thanks for your input. |
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| my ex-MIL had a system put in 7ish years ago i think a rain-soft. want to say she spent $3000 otd? with i want to say at least 5yrs but i think a 'lifetime' of cleaning products. we have hard icky water down here so it's really abusive on the plumbing and clothing. my parents had one done 20yrs ago for $2500ish. big improvements on the taste and feel of water and the clothes really did seem brighter/cleaner and didn't seem to wear as fast due to color fade etc(bearing in mind a lot of the fade esp in cottons comes from the heat of the drier)
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 jjoshuaPremium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ
kudos:3
 ·Verizon FiOS
| reply to cypherstream
There is no way that you're getting a water softener that fits under your sink.
A real water softener is plumbed to your main water line and softens everything. It has a brine tank that you fill with salt to keep it working, not some mystery cleaning products.
You can get a reverse osmosis filter for under the sink which may help with water quality but these sell for a fraction of the price that you were quoted.
Sounds like a scam. |
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| reply to cypherstream
Our house came with a softener and UV since it failed the state well water test, but it passed with the softener and UV.
Our water is pretty hard. In fact if you leave it running for a few days in the sink slowly you'll see the sink turn rusty with the dissolved iron.
$5000 would be the cost of a system like ours but it's pretty big, a tank about 5 feet tall and a brine tank about 4ft. We keep it topped off with salt (above the water line) and we need to add 1-2 40lb bags monthly. |
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| reply to jjoshua
said by jjoshua:There is no way that you're getting a water softener that fits under your sink.
A real water softener is plumbed to your main water line and softens everything. It has a brine tank that you fill with salt to keep it working, not some mystery cleaning products.
You can get a reverse osmosis filter for under the sink which may help with water quality but these sell for a fraction of the price that you were quoted.
Sounds like a scam.
Agree....
A whole house softener is only $200-500 bucks and a undersink RO unit with storage tank is like 150-300. For RO unit info check out "Air water and ice" website. Really good guys with lots of patience. While playing with your plumbing you could also install a couple larger canister filters for carbon and micron filtration for about 300 bucks. |
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| reply to cypherstream
For reference only Home Depot has:
(all numbers taken from home depot search and I choose the high side of the $)
Water softeners from $325'ish to $450'ish.
Reverse osmosis (large under cabinet systems) for $475'ish.
Whole house incoming filters for $50'ish
Whole house UV filters $400'ish.
So 450+475+50+400= $1,375 for materials cost only (not labor) |
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1 edit | reply to cypherstream
Water treatment is expensive. $4K for a new system is probably a little closer to the truth.
We've got a 1.5 cubic foot softener and an acid reducer. Cost me about $1500 in equipment, I installed myself. I think our hardness was like 23, Ph was like 6.2. Iron is our biggest problem (so says my wife who's hair turned a little orange) and if I remember, I think it was like 4.5ppm We are able to control that between the acid reducer and water softener, any more and we were told we would need to get an iron filter though.
It's been working well for 5+ years now. Goes through about 10lbs of salt per regen and we regen every fourth day. Acid reducer regens every three days.
You get all sorts of opinions on water softening. I don't think it's right or wrong more than there are different ways to solve the same problem... I do think though that prices are a little higher than they need to be because of fear and uncertainty. I don't really think the treatment technologies have changed in many many years. |
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 Jack_in_VAPremium
join:2007-11-26
Mathews, VA
kudos:1 | reply to cypherstream
Overpriced SCAM. Run away as fast as you can. |
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| reply to cypherstream
The previous owners of our house had a Hague water softener installed. I'm sure that they overpaid by a HUGE amount. My main problem with Hague is that you can't find ANY technical info about their stuff online. If it needs repaired or adjusted, you have to pay their "dealer" to do it. I make it a point not to buy anything from companies that operate like that.
Water softeners are cheap. RO systems are cheap to buy, but READ THE INSTRUCTIONS before you purchase one. They waste a lot of water, have multiple filters that need changed on a regular basis and require lots of maintenance. Once I got to the page that said I needed to drain and flush the storage tank with bleach every 6 months I decided against it.  |
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| reply to cypherstream
This is not a recommendation , since I have not personally bought anything from them , but might just be worth reading .
»www.budgetwater.com/
Will at least give you a good idea of what prices should be like . |
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| reply to averagedude
said by averagedude:For reference only Home Depot has:
(all numbers taken from home depot search and I choose the high side of the $)
Water softeners from $325'ish to $450'ish.
Reverse osmosis (large under cabinet systems) for $475'ish.
Whole house incoming filters for $50'ish
Whole house UV filters $400'ish.
So 450+475+50+400= $1,375 for materials cost only (not labor)
I didn't install it (came with the house) but labor is a biggie. Plumbers aint cheap here in jersey. |
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| reply to cypherstream
Hope I wasn't too confusing, but the Water softener and filtration is all in one in a 16"(l)x16"(w)x42"(h) unit that does go in line with the water main and the rest of the home down in a mechanical room / laundry or wherever you can get the plumbing. There is another unit that looks the same (same dimensions and casing) that the "solar salt" goes into.
Under the kitchen sink is where they put the reverse osmosis system. It looked like there were two filters on it and a storage tank. It could produce 25 gallons a day. That would be piped through its own spigot at the kitchen sink, but under the sink were our line to the fridge runs, they would attach that as well. We do have ice and water dispensing through the fridge and it does taste better because I have a water filter (GE filtration) as a part of the fridge itself. The sales guy said that's just a carbon filter and it may help with the chlorine and taste but other than that it's not doing anything at all.
Anyway he said this water system was state of the art because it regenerates in 25 minutes and only uses 15 gallons of water. It also makes no noise and runs on 12 VDC so it uses very little electricity. The other selling point is that it does filtration in one so I would see 60% improvement in water quality with just this unit.
Supposedly install is $700 for this and the RO system together, no matter how long it takes - including if they have to run an electric outlet for the power supply. It was one of those act now and get free install and huge discounts! I just can't make a $4000-$5000 decision on a whim like that. I didn't do it so apparently my name and address is flagged in the system now where I can't get a deal like that ever again... |
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1 edit | reply to cypherstream
It's likely a scam.
My sister is involved in a law suit with several other neighbors after being scammed by someone in South Carolina. They put a fixture lien on your home as soon as you sign the papers, they won't remove the lien after they are paid off, nobody will service the unit, they won't provide an owners manual, and told each neighbor a different story about how often to add salt. For one, they ran an extension cord through the garage wall and along the house to plug the unit into an outdoor receptacle. One unit they buried in the ground. The owners wife poses as their office manager using a fake name, and handles the loan paperwork.
The water tests are high school science tricks. If you are on a municipal water system, contact them to test your water or let you know someone reputable who can test it.
If you didn't have any problems with your hard water before the salesman told you you had a problem, you don't have a problem. And the price is outrageous. |
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Mr Matt
join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
kudos:1 Reviews:
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| reply to cypherstream
Check with your water supplier, they should be able to send you a report on your water quality or they might have a report on line. Occasionally we receive a water quality report in our water bill. Most of these water testing companies engage in deceptive high pressure sales practices. When you resisted their outrageous price they came up with a lower price with more pressure. The salesman probably told you you had to act immediately or you would miss out on the deal.
Here is an article in Wikipedia that discusses hard water:
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_water
This article discusses water quality in general:
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_quality |
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 MsradellP.E.Premium
join:2008-12-25
Louisville, KY
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| reply to cypherstream
said by cypherstream:It also makes no noise and runs on 12 VDC so it uses very little electricity. The other selling point is that it does filtration in one so I would see 60% improvement in water quality with just this unit. The voltage doesn't have anything to do with how much power it uses! It's just a scam saying low voltage uses less power.
Supposedly install is $700 for this and the RO system together, no matter how long it takes - including if they have to run an electric outlet for the power supply. It was one of those act now and get free install and huge discounts! I just can't make a $4000-$5000 decision on a whim like that. I didn't do it so apparently my name and address is flagged in the system now where I can't get a deal like that ever again...
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Jack_in_VAPremium
join:2007-11-26
Mathews, VA
kudos:1 | reply to HarryH3
said by HarryH3:The previous owners of our house had a Hague water softener installed. I'm sure that they overpaid by a HUGE amount. My main problem with Hague is that you can't find ANY technical info about their stuff online. If it needs repaired or adjusted, you have to pay their "dealer" to do it. I make it a point not to buy anything from companies that operate like that.
Water softeners are cheap. RO systems are cheap to buy, but READ THE INSTRUCTIONS before you purchase one. They waste a lot of water, have multiple filters that need changed on a regular basis and require lots of maintenance. Once I got to the page that said I needed to drain and flush the storage tank with bleach every 6 months I decided against it.
Water Softeners do not waste a lot of water and definitely do not need a bleaching of the storage tank every 6 months. Contaminating the tank is careless operation by the homeowner.
I wouldn't give up mine for any amount of money but the OP is being scammed. |
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 SparkChaserPremium
join:2000-06-06
Downingtown, PA
kudos:3
·Verizon FiOS
| reply to Jack_in_VA
said by Jack_in_VA:Overpriced SCAM. Run away as fast as you can.
What Jack said.
Geez, we got sales guys like this in PA  |
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jjoshuaPremium
join:2001-06-01
Scotch Plains, NJ
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| reply to cypherstream
said by cypherstream:It also makes no noise and runs on 12 VDC so it uses very little electricity.
Water softeners do not use electricity to soften water.
The only part that uses electricity is the electronic timer mechanism. |
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Jack_in_VAPremium
join:2007-11-26
Mathews, VA
kudos:1 | Consumer Reports best water softeners
Water softeners come in 4 different types. Consumer reports gives you both the advantages and disadvantages of all four types. They also provide you with the top 5 brands of water softeners. Consumer reports uses actual reviews from consumers who have used these water softeners.Consumer reports can give you a more realistic idea of how a water softener will actually preform than information
provided by the manufacturer.The four types of water softeners are Ion exchange, salt free, reverse osmosis and magnetic. Salt free water softeners are the preferred type by consumers.Salt free uses a filter so no chemicals, potassium or salt is required. This means that the minerals in the water are not effected. The only disadvantage is that they are not recommended for very hard water. Ion exchange softeners exchange the ions in the water with sodium or potassium ions. This removes the ions that cause the hardness in water and can prolong the use of washing machines and dish washers. This type is not recommended for drinking water due to the high sodium levels. Magnetic softeners use magnets in or around water pipes so that the magnetic field will alter the water. The disadvantage is that water will return to a hard stage within 48 hours after leaving the magnetic field.Reverse osmosis softeners use pressure to remove impurities through a semi-permeable membrane. This does remove up to 98% of impurities but it also removes minerals and nutrients at the same time.The top 5 brands chosen by consumers are Culligan, Tapworks AD, Kinetico 2020, Soo-Soft digital water treatment system and The Pelican PSE1800. Tapworks is a reverse osmosis water softener. Soo-soft is a magnetic water softener that is very environmentally safe. Culligan and Kinetico are both Ion exchange type softeners. The Pelican is the highest rated water softener because it provides both filtration and softening. More reference links: health-individual.com www.allwaterpurification.com www.reference.com |
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 tschmidtPremium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
kudos:8
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| reply to cypherstream
As others have posted sounds like an over priced scam. If you have water problems ought to invest in a whole house solution.
We have a well and luckily water quality is good but we have a fair amount of sand that causes problems. This spring I put in the whole house sediment filter from »www.waterfilters.net/
They have a bunch of videos and also sell test kits. I'd get one of the test kits to get a second opinion from them on what they recommend.
If you don't want to go the DIY route find a local water quality company and have them suggest a solution.
/tom |
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