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Buzzati

@verizon.net

Unresolved Fios Packet loss

I've had a Fios tech come over the house and try to figure out an issue i'm having with packet loss. Online games are near impossible to play, and I assume streaming to a media box will be problematic.

The issue entails lag spikes as well as packet loss. The tech was a nice guy, but after one test on pingtest.com that showed a decent speed, he concluded that things were okay. The problem still persists.

I went to the source cable (the one that goes directly from the Fios Box to the splitters that route to the rest of the house) - and I plugged in a laptop and the router directly. Same packet loss issue. Could the problem be a telephone line? I remember reading that someone had a similar problem - and they fixed some hop in his traceroute. I don''t know what that means.

Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. This is very problematic and nobody seems to know how to fix it. Thank you!


hubrisnxs

join:2009-12-30
Fountain Valley, CA
kudos:2

streaming to a media box from two machines or destinations inside the house is not an outside problem or a outside network problem, but an inside problem, either with the wireless signal or with the cabling.

Online gaming would be an inside problem if you are hardwired, but if you are wireless, it's probably a wireless interference issue. How exactly are you doing things ?

Also if it's suspected routing issue, then you can try to get a new ip/route by doing the following.

Actiontec MI424-WR
1 Click on MY NETWORK icon at the top.
2 Select NETWORK CONNECTIONS from the menu on the left.
3 Select BROADBAND CONNECTION (coax or ethernet) depending on your connection to the ONT.
4 Click SETTINGS
5 Click RELEASE
6 Click APPLY
7 Disconnect the router immediately to prevent it from re-requesting a DHCP lease.

Leave it disconnected for AT LEAST 5 minutes preferably 10 and then reconnect it.

If you reconnect it too fast, it will grab the same route, same IP and you will be in the same boat.



More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:31
reply to Buzzati

How are you determining you have packet loss?
Please post a traceroute showing the packet loss.

If you don't know how to do a traceroute:
Open a cmd window.
At the prompt enter:
tracert somehost.com

where somehost is a host you're having trouble with, then paste the results here.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27
reply to Buzzati

Oh my gosh. It took me forever to find this thread and for some reason I had to re-register at DSL reports. I'm sorry for not addressing your questions. I have this thread bookmarked now, incase you guys come back to help.

Here goes:

the wireless signal or with the cabling.

hubrisnxs wrote:

Online gaming would be an inside problem if you are hardwired, but if you are wireless, it's probably a wireless interference issue. How exactly are you doing things ?

Also if it's suspected routing issue, then you can try to get a new ip/route by doing the following.

Actiontec MI424-WR
1 Click on MY NETWORK icon at the top.
2 Select NETWORK CONNECTIONS from the menu on the left.
3 Select BROADBAND CONNECTION (coax or ethernet) depending on your connection to the ONT.
4 Click SETTINGS
5 Click RELEASE
6 Click APPLY
7 Disconnect the router immediately to prevent it from re-requesting a DHCP lease.

Leave it disconnected for AT LEAST 5 minutes preferably 10 and then reconnect it.

If you reconnect it too fast, it will grab the same route, same IP and you will be in the same boat.


I did this. I have a new ip. Same old packet loss issues.

More Fiber wrote:

How are you determining you have packet loss?
Please post a traceroute showing the packet loss.

If you don't know how to do a traceroute:
Open a cmd window.
At the prompt enter:
tracert somehost.com

where somehost is a host you're having trouble with, then paste the results here.

Here we go:

tracert www.google.com

Tracing route to www.google.com [74.125.131.147]
over a maximum of 30 hops:

1 1 ms 1 ms 1 ms Wireless_Broadband_Router.home [192.168.1.1]
2 7 ms 7 ms 6 ms L100.NWRKNJ-VFTTP-90.verizon-gni.net [173.70.27.
1]
3 10 ms 9 ms 9 ms G0-13-1-2.NWRKNJ-LCR-22.verizon-gni.net [130.81.
110.78]
4 17 ms 17 ms 21 ms ae0-0.NWRK-BB-RTR2.verizon-gni.net [130.81.209.1
62]
5 12 ms 12 ms 12 ms 0.so-7-1-0.XL4.EWR6.ALTER.NET [152.63.16.129]
6 12 ms 12 ms 11 ms 0.so-1-0-3.XT2.NYC4.ALTER.NET [152.63.17.110]
7 13 ms 11 ms 14 ms TenGigE0-5-1-0.GW8.NYC4.ALTER.NET [152.63.21.73]

8 * * * Request timed out.
9 13 ms 11 ms 12 ms 72.14.238.232
10 11 ms 14 ms 12 ms 209.85.251.88
11 23 ms 21 ms 23 ms 209.85.249.11
12 28 ms 29 ms 29 ms 209.85.241.222
13 31 ms 29 ms 29 ms 209.85.251.228
14 * * * Request timed out.
15 32 ms 31 ms 29 ms vc-in-f147.1e100.net [74.125.131.147]

Trace complete.

tracert www.google.com

I also use Pingplotter to show me the packet loss. Not sure if I can post a picture - but it shows that I have quite a bit of packet loss.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27
reply to Buzzati

Click for full size
Is there anything I can do about this? The problem still has not resolved.

Here is a picture from Ping Plotter: »i49.tinypic.com/27yoj85.jpg
The red bars designate 100% packet loss.

Here is a picture from Pingtest.net: »i48.tinypic.com/27yvqs5.jpg

I am going to switch to Optimum Online if I can't figure it out, but I don't know if this problem has to do with the infrastructure in my house.


More Fiber
Premium,MVM
join:2005-09-26
West Chester, PA
kudos:31

said by Buzzati:

The red bars designate 100% packet loss.

Since you're getting to node 14, there is nothing wrong with node 13. It is simply configured not to return ICMP responses.
--
There are 10 kinds of people in the world; those who understand binary and those who don't.

Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

But assuredly, there is something wrong with my connection. An online game for example is unplayable with the spikes. It doesn't matter if I ping google, altavista, or anything on the list - I get tons of red bars (illustrated in the graph along the bottom) and my connection is ostensibly bad through normal use.


serge87

join:2009-11-29
reply to Buzzati

It seems a lot of people on FIOS in the Northeast(NY/NJ/MD/PA) are having latency or timeout problems especially more recently. It's improved slightly for me compared to the past weekend but not 100% gone yet.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

Interesting. For me, and for as far as I can tell, it's been going on for 5 months now. I've given up on the idea that this will resolve on its own. I would switch providers, if not for the idea that it could be the infrastructure in my home that is causing the problem. The FiOS tech was unable to give me any idea.


serge87

join:2009-11-29
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by Buzzati:

Interesting. For me, and for as far as I can tell, it's been going on for 5 months now. I've given up on the idea that this will resolve on its own. I would switch providers, if not for the idea that it could be the infrastructure in my home that is causing the problem. The FiOS tech was unable to give me any idea.

This should be escalated higher than a tier 1 tech but unless you have a "connection" that can get that done all that can be done is to wait


SonosLover

@verizon.net
reply to Buzzati

I spent a half an hour on the phone with Sonos customer support, I was having massive problems with streaming audio. They found an internal alert regarding FIOS users in the northeast, seems there is a problem with verizon's DNS servers. Recommended fix --> Setting the router's DNS lookup to Google DNS. Worked like a charm!! On the Actiontec router, go to My Network > Network Connections > Broadband Connection (Ethernet/Coax) > Settings. Set "DNS Server" to "Use the Following DNS Server Addresses" and set the DNS servers to 8.8.8.8 and 8.8.4.4 (secondary).


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27
reply to Buzzati

Thanks Sonoslover, but it didn't fix the issue. Strange enough, because I'm in the northeast, i was really optimistic! Oh well.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

Sonoslover,

I left pingplotter on all night. No red bars! I ran pingtest.net and Megapath's packet loss test and they have confirmed it.

EVERYTHING IS FIXED! 0 packet loss.

You fixed what the FiOS guys couldn't in 5 months with one post. Thank you so much!!!


serge87

join:2009-11-29
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by Buzzati:

Sonoslover,

I left pingplotter on all night. No red bars! I ran pingtest.net and Megapath's packet loss test and they have confirmed it.

EVERYTHING IS FIXED! 0 packet loss.

You fixed what the FiOS guys couldn't in 5 months with one post. Thank you so much!!!

So your problem was fixed by changing to non-VZ DNS servers?


RolteC
0h

join:2001-05-20
Fresh Meadows, NY
kudos:1

1 edit

Click for full size
Google DNS Ping Plotter
Makes no sense that an ICMP packet is now working during the graveyard hours/morning hours of the day when the network is least used all because of a DNS server change? Two different things all together.

Try again tonight is all I am going to say. I believe its the beginning of congestion on FiOS and as more time goes by, the more people will experience it in more areas.

Just because its 100% fiber doesn't mean anything. Research PON technology. Its not like metro ethernet. Its not dedicated. Its shared bandwidth on a specific card that can become over-subscribed. That or the routers in the path to your destination are also overloaded.

Also remember, while this is affecting thousands of people, how many of those thousands in the same area come on these forums.... Makes it hard to also pinpoint anything.

Also, good luck trying to have Verizon fix anything. They are in it to make money, not add more capacity to make people happy 24/7.

Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

Good idea, Roltec. I'll report back tonight. So far it seems fine, though. Serge87, I think as much - however, I'll let you guys know if the problem persists in the evening.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

1 edit

Roltec, it looks like you were right. The packet loss seems to be a function of the time of day. At the moment of 7:00 PM - Pingplotter is showing quite a bit of red bars. The history shows that it gets progressively worse until the evening.

At least I know it's not the wiring in my house. Bummer, though.


serge87

join:2009-11-29
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Buzzati

I know some people were experiencing drops in speed when this was occurring but even at it's absolute worst I still can achieve a full 300Mbps at all times of the day, it's just the damn timeouts and latency that is the problem. I'm not that familiar with CO or carrier-level hardware but is it possible some switching equipment far upstream is malfunctioning? Or that Verizon's peering pathways are becoming saturated(not necessarily oversubscription)?



RolteC
0h

join:2001-05-20
Fresh Meadows, NY
kudos:1

Click for full size
Last 2 Hours from my connection
I say its both because some IP blocks give me bad speeds and bad pings even to my 1st/2nd hop 24/7. While other blocks like the one I am finally on don't.

But tonight:
Tracing route to resolver1.opendns.com [208.67.222.222]
over a maximum of 30 hops:
 
  1    <1 ms    <1 ms    <1 ms  [192.168.1.1]
  2     3 ms     1 ms     1 ms  L.NYCMNY-VFTTP.verizon-gni.net [7.1]
  3     5 ms     7 ms     7 ms  G0-1-1-3.NYCMNY-LCR-21.verizon-gni.net [130.81.188.74]
  4     4 ms     4 ms     4 ms  ae0-0.NY325-BB-RTR2.verizon-gni.net [130.81.209.110]
  5     4 ms     7 ms     6 ms  0.xe-9-1-0.BR1.NYC1.ALTER.NET [152.63.4.241]
  6     *        *        *     Request timed out.
  7    58 ms    60 ms    62 ms  vlan51.ebr1.NewYork2.Level3.net [4.69.138.222]
  8    27 ms    13 ms    12 ms  ae-4-4.ebr1.NewYork1.Level3.net [4.69.141.17]
  9    96 ms    98 ms   101 ms  ae-61-61.csw1.NewYork1.Level3.net [4.69.134.66]
 10    97 ms     *       96 ms  ae-14-60.car4.NewYork1.Level3.net [4.69.155.6]
 11     4 ms     3 ms     3 ms  SPLICE-COMM.car4.NewYork1.Level3.net [4.53.94.218]
 12     *       20 ms    19 ms  resolver1.opendns.com [208.67.222.222]
 
Trace complete.
 

Buzzati

join:2012-12-27
reply to Buzzati

It went from completely 0% packet loss for hours to this: Started from about 5 PM on.

»i46.tinypic.com/14t66xi.jpg

Expand your moderator at work

muva2003

join:2005-06-01
Emerson, NJ
reply to Buzzati

Re: Unresolved Fios Packet loss

So where do I go from here? Still have tons of packet loss in the evenings. I'm unable to stream. Can't really play an online game. If I have no options, should I go to Optimum Online or do they have the same issue? I'm really frustrated with this.



RolteC
0h

join:2001-05-20
Fresh Meadows, NY
kudos:1
reply to Buzzati

Finding a new service to meet your gaming and streaming needs is one thing. Keeping FiOS because of what it is and the speeds it actually provides is another. Its a toss-up depending on your requirements. What are you seeing so much loss to? I see the same every night myself, and I am pretty sure everyone else does as well. But its not enough to cause issues. The major problem is the lack of bandwidth between Verizon, or maybe its Alter.net and its peers.


Buzzati

join:2012-12-27

For example, I tried to stream last night (Ustream). I had 80% dropped frames, which means 80% of what I tried to stream did not work. It's more than just a little problem. This is totally non-functional internet.

The download speeds are great. The upload speeds are great. It's just the packet loss that completely kills it. I left pingplotter on overnight. Everything is functional until around 1:00 AM to 7:00 AM. Then everything becomes a mess. It shouldn't be this way.

If Optimum doesn't have this problem, I'd switch in a heartbeat. But I have no idea.



norm

join:2012-10-18
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1
reply to Buzzati

I'm having the same issue with packet loss and high latency. Has anyone heard anything in regards to this?


serge87

join:2009-11-29
reply to Buzzati

Every night between 7:30-8pm EST, like clock work. Horrible latency and lowered download speeds to any destination on the internet.


norm

join:2012-10-18
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

I'm pushing the issue through tech support and billing now. The nice lady in billing has credited my account for the internet portion and stated that she would continue to do so until the issue is resolved. In the event that they can't resolve the issue, she said that she would work with me to terminate my contract without an early termination fee. God forbid I have to switch to Comcast but at this point, it'd be a welcome change.


norm

join:2012-10-18
Pittsburgh, PA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
reply to Buzzati

Hi,

I've spoken for several hours now to numerous people. The most recent person I spoke to is a supervisor in Tampa, FL by the name of Ramone. Ramone stated that the issue is a result of congestion within the Verizon network and that they are not going to fix it. I believe our only option now is to cancel service.


serge87

join:2009-11-29
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

said by norm:

Hi,

I've spoken for several hours now to numerous people. The most recent person I spoke to is a supervisor in Tampa, FL by the name of Ramone. Ramone stated that the issue is a result of congestion within the Verizon network and that they are not going to fix it. I believe our only option now is to cancel service.

What Verizon tier support was Ramone working for? I'm going to give it a few more months before I go with that option. For all I know it could all be due to the network infrastructure damage from Superstorm Sandy. Though if it ends up never being fixed it would be a damn shame since FIOS was such a great service.


RolteC
0h

join:2001-05-20
Fresh Meadows, NY
kudos:1

A lot of people will say the issue can't be seen without a reverse tracert back to your connection from the affected host/server.

But honestly, there are a few routers that going out show high ping times to the last verizon router, and same thing when a reverse route it done from that same host.

No way its not a Verizon congestion issue then. So far, I can only say peering between Verizon and Alter.net is affected at a few places, especially when routing to time warner cable and sometimes to cablevision.

As a Verizon technician put it to me a while back; don't expect it to be fixed, expect them to blame your connection and wait weeks for equipment replacement that is a waste of time. Awesome people, but way to money hungry.