Re: Why we are not opposing motion on Monday.

Author	All Replies
Optional join:2012-02-26 Mississauga, ON	reply to TSI Marc Re: Why we are not opposing motion on Monday. Even though I wasn't accused if this, this is still bull. You roll over for these guys? you'll be getting attacked by every production company this side of the sun. Enjoy that. Seriously considering taking my business elsewhere. I want to know that my privacy is just that, PRIVATE. I watch youtube and actually buy music off itunes as far as internet usage goes + a lot of online gaming, but this is just ludicrous. what's next?
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 02:31:16 ·

neuromancer1 join:2007-01-22 York, ON Reviews: ·TekSavvy Cable	said by Optional: Seriously considering taking my business elsewhere. I want to know that my privacy is just that, PRIVATE. I'm considering this as well. The lack of privacy is huge issue for me even though I'm not accused. Well that and TSI will be nothing but a huge target for copyright lawsuits after this.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 03:25:41 ·
ultramancool join:2004-12-22 Schenectady, NY	Indeed, if TekSavvy isn't going all out now when the laws are being brought into question, what can we really expect from them in the future, especially if the lawsuits ramp up?
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 03:29:05 ·
Tx bronx cheers from cheap seats Premium join:2008-11-19 kudos:3 Reviews: ·FreePhoneLine ·Rogers Hi-Speed ·TekSavvy DSL	said by ultramancool: Indeed, if TekSavvy isn't going all out now when the laws are being brought into question, what can we really expect from them in the future, especially if the lawsuits ramp up? Took the words right out of my mouth.. The wrongfully accused and the genuinely wrongfully accused will always be at risk since there is no "firewall" to protect them even the slightest. said by neuromancer1: said by Optional: Seriously considering taking my business elsewhere. I want to know that my privacy is just that, PRIVATE. I'm considering this as well. The lack of privacy is huge issue for me even though I'm not accused. Well that and TSI will be nothing but a huge target for copyright lawsuits after this. Absolutely. I believe I'll be doing the same and i'll be moving my father and grandmother off of it as well. Though i'm the one who setup their routers it still worries me.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 03:37:21 ·
ChuckcZar @teksavvy.com	Recall the days of istop. They had a proxy you had to go through to connect to the internet. So if Teksavvy had something similar what would voltage do? Either they would charge everyone with an internet connection or charge no one.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 06:55:50 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	reply to neuromancer1 said by neuromancer1: said by Optional: Seriously considering taking my business elsewhere. I want to know that my privacy is just that, PRIVATE. I'm considering this as well. The lack of privacy is huge issue for me even though I'm not accused. Well that and TSI will be nothing but a huge target for copyright lawsuits after this. Well you watch what Bell, Rogers and the other indies do. I can almost guarantee if they are targeted they will not inform their customers and simply pass on their records. Good luck to both of you.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:13:16 ·
neuromancer1 join:2007-01-22 York, ON Reviews: ·TekSavvy Cable	said by mlerner: said by neuromancer1: said by Optional: Seriously considering taking my business elsewhere. I want to know that my privacy is just that, PRIVATE. I'm considering this as well. The lack of privacy is huge issue for me even though I'm not accused. Well that and TSI will be nothing but a huge target for copyright lawsuits after this. Well you watch what Bell, Rogers and the other indies do. I can almost guarantee if they are targeted they will not inform their customers and simply pass on their records. Good luck to both of you. It's privacy issue as I said I'm not named in the lawsuit but I gave TSI personal information and some slime ball from Canpire can get it handed to him on silver platter with a few illegal scare tactics. Stop with the fanboy BS, really.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:26:09 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	said by neuromancer1: It's privacy issue as I said I'm not named in the lawsuit but I gave TSI person information and some slime ball from Canpire can get it handed to him on silver platter with a few illegal scare tactics. Stop with the fanboy BS, really. Then what is your problem? You are not named in the lawsuit so your information is not affected and either way, ISPs are LEGALLY required to keep logs for cases like this. They will not hand over information to just anyone without a lawful request but if it comes to it, they CANNOT evade a court order.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:32:37 ·
The Mongoose join:2010-01-05 Toronto, ON Reviews: ·TekSavvy Cable ·Rogers Hi-Speed	reply to neuromancer1 said by neuromancer1: It's privacy issue as I said I'm not named in the lawsuit but I gave TSI personal information and some slime ball from Canpire can get it handed to him on silver platter with a few illegal scare tactics. Stop with the fanboy BS, really. Has Teksavvy actually released any information? My understanding is this motion is to get the court order that would force them to turn it over.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:33:59 ·
The Mongoose join:2010-01-05 Toronto, ON Reviews: ·TekSavvy Cable ·Rogers Hi-Speed	reply to mlerner said by mlerner: said by neuromancer1: It's privacy issue as I said I'm not named in the lawsuit but I gave TSI person information and some slime ball from Canpire can get it handed to him on silver platter with a few illegal scare tactics. Stop with the fanboy BS, really. Then what is your problem? You are not named in the lawsuit so your information is not affected and either way, ISPs are LEGALLY required to keep logs for cases like this. They will not hand over information to just anyone without a lawful request but if it comes to it, they CANNOT evade a court order. I thought we'd established that there isn't a legal requirement to keep the logs, but that an ISP basically can't function without them. I may have missed something.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:34:56 ·
sanc5 join:2012-12-13 Mississauga, ON	reply to mlerner Well you watch what Bell, Rogers and the other indies do. I can almost guarantee if they are targeted they will not inform their customers and simply pass on their records. ============================================== ... on the other hand they could be watching what's going in here and decide to oppose any motion to disclose when they get targeted. And if they win? More customers to them? No? Of course, you could be right, they may just cave in right away! Oh well..
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:47:28 ·
johansmith join:2012-12-15	said by sanc5: Of course, you could be right, they may just cave in right away! Oh well.. You mean like Tek?......
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:50:42 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	reply to sanc5 said by sanc5: Well you watch what Bell, Rogers and the other indies do. I can almost guarantee if they are targeted they will not inform their customers and simply pass on their records. ============================================== ... on the other hand they could be watching what's going in here and decide to oppose any motion to disclose when they get targeted. And if they win? More customers to them? No? Of course, you could be right, they may just cave in right away! Oh well.. No one wins.. the ISP would have to take on the enormous legal fees for their own motives which these days would only result in short term gain and even if they end up winning the case, there goes an increase on your bill so in the end you still pay.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:52:52 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	reply to The Mongoose said by The Mongoose: said by mlerner: said by neuromancer1: It's privacy issue as I said I'm not named in the lawsuit but I gave TSI person information and some slime ball from Canpire can get it handed to him on silver platter with a few illegal scare tactics. Stop with the fanboy BS, really. Then what is your problem? You are not named in the lawsuit so your information is not affected and either way, ISPs are LEGALLY required to keep logs for cases like this. They will not hand over information to just anyone without a lawful request but if it comes to it, they CANNOT evade a court order. I thought we'd established that there isn't a legal requirement to keep the logs, but that an ISP basically can't function without them. I may have missed something. I'm trying to dig up some info as I thought there was something in the privacy laws about it. But also even if it's not in the law, you could make the argument, that if TSI didn't keep logs which then they would have to come back with "sorry, we don't have IP subscriber data" the court could view it as trying to evade the court order.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:55:58 ·
Rastan join:2007-04-25 Canada	reply to mlerner So we should all be happy Teksavvy isn't opposing Voltage because they will save money and that means our monthly bill won't go up? Come on.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:56:34 ·
johansmith join:2012-12-15	reply to mlerner said by mlerner: said by sanc5: Well you watch what Bell, Rogers and the other indies do. I can almost guarantee if they are targeted they will not inform their customers and simply pass on their records. ============================================== ... on the other hand they could be watching what's going in here and decide to oppose any motion to disclose when they get targeted. And if they win? More customers to them? No? Of course, you could be right, they may just cave in right away! Oh well.. No one wins.. the ISP would have to take on the enormous legal fees for their own motives which these days would only result in short term gain and even if they end up winning the case, there goes an increase on your bill so in the end you still pay. Confused. What "enormous legal fees"??? We are talking about opposing a motion. This is not a trial. Nobody is asking Tek to defend its customers in a trial. This is one heck of a cheaper deal than a trial. Beside, there is a huge upside to the ISPs. If this kind of bull is nipped at the bud, others won't even try it and then the ISP's won't have to spend time ratting on their customers and getting bad press. Instead, they could spend their time and energy in their business.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:57:40 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	reply to Rastan said by Rastan: So we should all be happy Teksavvy isn't opposing Voltage because they will save money and that means our monthly bill won't go up? Come on. No, it's just not realistically the ISPs job to protect you from the law. If you crossed the street at a red light, bit of an odd example but would you expect the traffic light manufacturer to bail you out of jail?
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 11:58:37 ·
johansmith join:2012-12-15	reply to mlerner said by mlerner: I'm trying to dig up some info as I thought there was something in the privacy laws about it. But also even if it's not in the law, you could make the argument, that if TSI didn't keep logs which then they would have to come back with "sorry, we don't have IP subscriber data" the court could view it as trying to evade the court order. Not in a million years. Nobody can be compelled to do something that a law does not compel you to do. If a judge would tried it, the order would be appealed and striken so fast your head would spin and the judge would be admonished.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 12:01:00 ·
Rastan join:2007-04-25 Canada Reviews: ·voip.ms ·TekSavvy DSL	reply to mlerner Voltage and all of the other copyright trolls are not the law. If Bell, Rogers & Shaw can stand up for their customers then so can Teksavvy. If you aren't familiar with how copyright trolls operate then you should look into it. Then you'll realize how bad those comparisons you made are.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 12:01:12 ·
mlerner Premium join:2000-11-25 Nepean, ON kudos:5	reply to johansmith said by johansmith: said by mlerner: I'm trying to dig up some info as I thought there was something in the privacy laws about it. But also even if it's not in the law, you could make the argument, that if TSI didn't keep logs which then they would have to come back with "sorry, we don't have IP subscriber data" the court could view it as trying to evade the court order. Not in a million years. Nobody can be compelled to do something that a law does not compel you to do. If a judge would tried it, the order would be appealed and striken so fast your head would spin and the judge would be admonished. Point taken so presumably they could do that.. but they've already identified subscribers by sending out notices so can't go back now or questions would be raised.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-15 12:03:47 ·

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