[Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian telephone

Author	All Replies
BrettD Premium join:2009-12-26 Ottawa, ON	[Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian telephone Today, voip.ms compromised the privacy of their Canadian customers and the Canadians they talk with, by rerouting our Toronto-based registrations to a US server (in my case, Toronto-->Tampa). I expect voip.ms will tell us how they are made this change to avoid service disruption cased by a Toronto failure. Thanks for that consideration. But you did not think this through, voip.ms. As a Canadian company, you did not respect the privacy of your Canadian customers by your move. It's been long and widely known that the US government illegally intercepts and spies on foreign (Canadian) and domestic telephone calls. By routing Canadian's calls to a US-based server instead of another Canadian portal, voip.ms showed little or no regard for their privacy of their customers and the other Canadians who they talk with on the phone. I chose voip.ms because I live in Ottawa and wanted to keep my traffic in Canada - just as I specifically use a Toronto data-centre (151 Front Street) for hosting for my business website: to best protect the privacy of my Canadian audience. Nothing is perfect of course, but I do what I can. There's nothing particularly controversial in my phone calls. But my business calls and calls to and from my dentist and family are none of the damned US government's business. I will be reviewing if a complaint to the Federal Privacy commissioner is appropriate. voip.ms, you failed us. Canadians have a right to not have our communications illegally spied on and archived. And in my case, my phone service still didn't work at Tampa. But it worked when I re-registered at Montreal. But I was discouraged from doing so by the voip.ms service rep. voip.ms: I am asking for your confirmation that you will not route Canadian traffic through the US without our explicit permission from now on, and that you will make every effort to ensure Canadians' data and traffic in kept in Canada, where we have better legal protection and access to a legal and political system to better defend our rights of privacy. Thank you. Brett
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 14:34:46 ·
voxframe join:2010-08-02 1 edit	Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph Are you really that naive to believe that this DOESN'T already happen in Canada? Not that I'd be any less pissed off if I were in your shoes, but you're seriously an idiot if you think the same thing doesn't exist in some form in Canada already. You also should learn a thing or two about your internet connection and routing. You'd be surprised to learn that probably a decent sized portion of your traffic TO Canada, actually passes through the US. To top that off, if your ISP has any issues what-so-ever, your precious data will re-route somewhere else (Most likely the US) so you're right back to the same issue VIA your ISP. I'm 100KM from Montreal, yet a good portion of my traffic to there, routes either through Toronto, or New York. Pretty much 50/50. And if I go to Toronto, I still cross US soil at some point. You're argument is nearly invalid. Nice lawyers card though, well played argument too, but failed.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 14:57:27 ·
XCOM digitalnUll Premium join:2002-06-10 Spring, TX Reviews: ·flowroute ·Comcast ·voip.ms ·Callcentric ·SIPBRI	reply to BrettD said by BrettD: Today, voip.ms compromised the privacy of their Canadian customers and the Canadians they talk with, by rerouting our Toronto-based registrations to a US server (in my case, Toronto-->Tampa). I expect voip.ms will tell us how they are made this change to avoid service disruption cased by a Toronto failure. Thanks for that consideration. But you did not think this through, voip.ms. As a Canadian company, you did not respect the privacy of your Canadian customers by your move. It's been long and widely known that the US government illegally intercepts and spies on foreign (Canadian) and domestic telephone calls. By routing Canadian's calls to a US-based server instead of another Canadian portal, voip.ms showed little or no regard for their privacy of their customers and the other Canadians who they talk with on the phone. I chose voip.ms because I live in Ottawa and wanted to keep my traffic in Canada - just as I specifically use a Toronto data-centre (151 Front Street) for hosting for my business website: to best protect the privacy of my Canadian audience. Nothing is perfect of course, but I do what I can. There's nothing particularly controversial in my phone calls. But my business calls and calls to and from my dentist and family are none of the damned US government's business. I will be reviewing if a complaint to the Federal Privacy commissioner is appropriate. voip.ms, you failed us. Canadians have a right to not have our communications illegally spied on and archived. And in my case, my phone service still didn't work at Tampa. But it worked when I re-registered at Montreal. But I was discouraged from doing so by the voip.ms service rep. voip.ms: I am asking for your confirmation that you will not route Canadian traffic through the US without our explicit permission from now on, and that you will make every effort to ensure Canadians' data and traffic in kept in Canada, where we have better legal protection and access to a legal and political system to better defend our rights of privacy. Thank you. Brett I am starting to think you are a terrorist. -- [nUll@dcypher ~]$
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:02:40 ·
PX Eliezer Premium join:2008-08-09 Hutt River kudos:13 Reviews: ·callwithus ·voip.ms ·Optimum Voice ·Vitelity VOIP ·Gizmo5	reply to BrettD Interesting points, but geez the guys at Voip.MS hardly have any more hair that they can pull out. Let them have a little peace until after the holiday, anyway. If you are so concerned about avoiding US exposure, I would point out that you posted on a US-based website. And as [voxframe] said, your data can and does pass through the US all the time anyway.... --------------- Communications Security Establishment Canada (CSEC) is a partner with the American NSA and the British GCHQ, rest assured.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:03:49 ·
nitzan Premium,VIP join:2008-02-27 kudos:2	reply to BrettD Wow. Crazy people out there.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:05:32 ·
XCOM digitalnUll Premium join:2002-06-10 Spring, TX	said by nitzan: Wow. Crazy people out there. rofl!!! -- [nUll@dcypher ~]$
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:09:05 ·
Trev IP Telephony Addict Premium join:2009-06-29 Victoria, BC kudos:4	reply to BrettD Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph Has voip.ms given you a written contract stating that your traffic will remain in Canada at all times and under all circumstances? Did they guarantee that once your traffic hits their servers, they do not relay it through the US at any point? I suspect the answer to both is no, in which case you really need to chill out. The very nature of the Internet makes it impossible to guarantee traffic will remain on sovereign soil. -- Wondering what I do? Find out at »www.digitalcon.ca Get your Obihai ATA in Canada.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:13:59 ·
PX Eliezer Premium join:2008-08-09 Hutt River kudos:13 Reviews: ·callwithus ·voip.ms ·Optimum Voice ·Vitelity VOIP ·Gizmo5	reply to BrettD said by BrettD: Today, voip.ms compromised the privacy of their Canadian customers and the Canadians they talk with, by rerouting our Toronto-based registrations to a US server (in my case, Toronto-->Tampa). I expect voip.ms will tell us how they are made this change to avoid service disruption cased by a Toronto failure. Thanks for that consideration. But you did not think this through, voip.ms. If they did this, I assume that they HAD to, it was not avoidable, AND that if they routed all the way to Tampa it meant that other servers were not available and/or lacked sufficient overflow capacity. I think that MOST customers would be glad that their phone service kept working....! Given a choice between brief exposure to US soil (oh, the tragedy!!) compared to losing phone service, I am sure that Voip.MS made the right decision.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:15:26 ·
voxframe join:2010-08-02	reply to PX Eliezer Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph said by PX Eliezer: Given a choice between brief exposure to US soil (oh, the tragedy!!) LMAO Can picture walking across the border back into Canada and doing a full body shudder thinking about touching something hideous. Bllllllllllllleeeeeeeeech! I need a shower! ROFL
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:47:05 ·

JohaMart @ovh.net	reply to BrettD What's with these negative Voip.MS posts lately? Voip.MS is a North American company headquartered in Montreal Canada, nothing prevents them from either restricting services to, or notifying subscribers which servers carry traffic. I think it's well know that for a while ALL traffic in Voip.MS's beginning days were terminated at Dallas and Houston TX. You are being too paranoid.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:52:03 ·
Catarrh @fastwebserver.de	reply to BrettD I would like to keep my conversations out of the hands of those slimeballs too, but I think I read that a lot of the telephone communication between Eastern Canada and the West goes through the US anyway. I guess it is cheaper to route it that way than over the top of Lake Superior. What is needed, obviously, is encrypted communications - telephone, email, video, text - everything. But try to get a friend or family member to use any sort of encryption on any sort of communication. They don't want to be bothered.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:52:34 ·
Mango www.toao.net join:2008-12-25 Alberta kudos:11 Reviews: ·Anveo ·Shaw ·AcroVoice ·Callcentric ·callwithus ·voip.ms ·FreePhoneLine ·TELUS	reply to BrettD You could mitigate this to a certain extent by configuring your device to use the IP address of VoIP.ms' Toronto equipment rather than toronto.voip.ms. Note that I said "mitigate" and not "eliminate" - for the reasons others have already explained, there aren't very many ways to guarantee what you want with this technology. Note that by doing this you would prevent DNS failover from working, but if this issue is more important to you than reliability you can certainly do it. EDIT: I just checked and discovered that both major ISPs in Western Canada route traffic to montreal.voip.ms via Chicago. If you require a very high level of security, you should set up a VPN between you and the locations you want to call securely, and make direct IP calls over it, bypassing the PSTN. You may however decide that this is more trouble than it's worth. Also I suggest you try to be a little more understanding towards the staff at VoIP.ms who are trying desperately to satisfy the majority of customers who just want a working phone.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 15:57:43 ·
ConstantineM join:2011-09-02 San Jose, CA Reviews: ·Google Voice ·Junction Networks ·Callcentric ·T-Mobile US ·AT&T U-Verse	reply to BrettD Canadian traffic that goes through the US BrettD , I think in principle you have a valid point that I respect and can sympathise with. However, in reality, lots of traffic goes through the US, whether you like it or not. And that includes Canada-Canada traffic, too; more often than many people would think. I presume you use VoIP.ms SIP-to-PSTN services, too; are you really sure they aren't buying it from carriers through servers in the US? (I dunno the answer in case of voip.ms, but I recall CallWithUs buys calling to Canada through US-based carriers, which probably involves US servers of such carriers.) Also, did you check where voip.ms has their main web-site and user database? IIRC, it was New York; so, all your base are belong to US, anyways.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 16:06:30 ·
PX Eliezer Premium join:2008-08-09 Hutt River kudos:13	Excellent points, ConstantineM.
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 16:11:40 ·
PX Eliezer Premium join:2008-08-09 Hutt River kudos:13 Reviews: ·callwithus ·voip.ms ·Optimum Voice ·Vitelity VOIP ·Gizmo5	reply to BrettD Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph said by BrettD: voip.ms: I am asking for your confirmation that you will not route Canadian traffic through the US without our explicit permission from now on.... As others have said, this is simply impossible. Internet traffic does not stop at the border any more than broadcast signals do. But I am also going to say: Voip.MS has VERY cheap prices in the Canadian market, especially considering the features that they offer. Making this kind of demand of them seems a bit much. If you were paying sky-high prices to BellCanada it might be a different story....
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 16:19:16 ·
MichelR join:2011-07-03 Ottawa, ON Reviews: ·Start Communicat.. ·voip.ms ·Rogers Hi-Speed	reply to BrettD I used to do a lot of traceroutes and similar things "for fun". Sometimes just sending an e-mail across town, the e-mail would bounce around a few servers, including in the U.S. The Internet is distributed. If you don't want it to happen, well... I'm currently using the newyork.voip.ms server. Now the CIA knows I canceled an hydro account this morning. ack!!!!
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 16:20:27 ·
ancodia join:2006-07-10	reply to BrettD Well I'm pissed about this for a different reason. I'm trying to get work done and I start getting complaints that some of the inbound lines are down. After spending 10 minutes checking into it I see that voip.ms changed SOME of my DID #'s (without permission or notice) to Tampa & knocked them offline! WTF. FU voip.ms, F U
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 16:46:57 ·
rblizz join:2001-12-16 North Richland Hills, TX Reviews: ·Callcentric ·Charter	reply to PX Eliezer said by PX Eliezer: Interesting points, but geez the guys at Voip.MS hardly have any more hair that they can pull out. Let them have a little peace until after the holiday, anyway. I'll second that. I could never understand "piling on."
	to forum · permalink · 2012-12-21 17:01:06 ·

VOIP etc > Voice Over IP - VOIP > VOIP Tech Chat > [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian telephone

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Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph

Canadian traffic that goes through the US

Re: [Voip.ms] voip.ms compromised the privacy of Canadian teleph