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88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
reply to Twaddle

Re: Attention: your FCC as been pimped out

exactly what is your issue with this?

silbaco
Premium
join:2009-08-03
USA
I am going to guess he doesn't like the fact that At&t is getting more spectrum when they already have a lot on hand and right after they lied to the FCC about needing T-mobile.

I see this point. There are a lot of smaller carriers that would benefit from having more spectrum instead of At&t. However, if we give more spectrum to smaller providers will it really spur competition? Not really. Most of the regional carriers I have seen price just slightly below the big boys. And their networks usually suck, regardless of spectrum. Look at US Cellular's 4G network. In many places you can't push more than 5Mbps on their LTE network. That's crap. And it is not because of their spectrum shortage, it is because of the crap backhaul they are using. Allowing them to buy more spectrum won't fix their problem or many of the problems that plague smaller carriers. They need to get more experienced network engineers and better phone selections.


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
said by silbaco:

I am going to guess he doesn't like the fact that At&t is getting more spectrum when they already have a lot on hand and right after they lied to the FCC about needing T-mobile.

I see this point. There are a lot of smaller carriers that would benefit from having more spectrum instead of At&t. However, if we give more spectrum to smaller providers will it really spur competition? Not really. Most of the regional carriers I have seen price just slightly below the big boys. And their networks usually suck, regardless of spectrum. Look at US Cellular's 4G network. In many places you can't push more than 5Mbps on their LTE network. That's crap. And it is not because of their spectrum shortage, it is because of the crap backhaul they are using. Allowing them to buy more spectrum won't fix their problem or many of the problems that plague smaller carriers. They need to get more experienced network engineers and better phone selections.

Once Sprint gets the rest of Clearwire spectrum they'll have more than Verizon an At&t combined. No one seems to have an issue with this. T-mobile not only got spectrum from at&t after the failed merger they just got some from Verizon. once again no one complained about that.

Most people use one of the big 4 and people want unlimited data or something close. Well guess what that isn't going to happen without more spectrum. And for companies like Net10 or Straight Talk that piggyback off the networks of the Big 4 they aren't going to get access to the 4G networks unless the Big 4 gets more spectrum. Otherwise they'll use it for their own customers. which is really going to hurt Straight Talk Net10 and other once the big 4 start refarming their 2G and 3G spectrum for LTE.


JasonOD

@comcast.net
You are overestimating sprint. Clearwire has 2.5ghz spectrum, so against VZ and ATT's deployed LTE, sprint will be bringing a knife to a gun fight.

sprint will also be softbanks nextel, a weight which will drag them down billion by billion.


Twaddle

@sbcglobal.net
reply to 88615298
My issue is their relationship with the Feds is just too sleazy for my tastes. Who else can make false statements to the Feds and not have any repercussions or meaningful penalty? ATT is getting their "wants" rubber stamped by Julius and we get our Internet funneled to "who knows where" for review no warrant
no questions asked and no protest. It's a wonder what great lobbying and probe bribery can do to enhance the bottom line.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000
reply to 88615298
The spectrum Sprint will gain is essentially a junk band in the context of cell phones.

It requires higher power devices that often times have large external antenna ( and often even line of sight )


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
said by DataRiker:

The spectrum Sprint will gain is essentially a junk band in the context of cell phones.

It requires higher power devices that often times have large external antenna ( and often even line of sight )

for metro area where you can put mini towers( for lack of a better term ) on every streetlight it's fine.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000

1 edit
On every streetlight? LOL, that is exactly why it is considered a junk band. That is extremely impractical, not to mention unbelievably expensive.

Once you get above 2100 Mhz, your done as far as becoming practical for cellular devices.

For devices with out battery or antenna concerns you can go above 2100


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
said by DataRiker:

On every streetlight? LOL, that is exactly why it is considered a junk band. That is extremely impractical, not to mention unbelievably expensive.

Once you get above 2100 Mhz, your done as far as becoming practical for cellular devices.

For devices with out battery or antenna concerns you can go above 2100

Then what's the point of Sprint buying out Clearwire then?

tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
reply to DataRiker
said by DataRiker:

On every streetlight? LOL, that is exactly why it is considered a junk band. That is extremely impractical, not to mention unbelievably expensive.

Once you get above 2100 Mhz, your done as far as becoming practical for cellular devices.

For devices with out battery or antenna concerns you can go above 2100

This is why Verizon got first dibs on 1800 & 1900mhz spectrum way back when.. If Sprint were smart, they'd revamp their entire network for 700mhz wide-band spectrum. For AT&T to have as much spectrum as Verizon, they need almost twice as much bandwidth above 2ghz. IIRC, Verizon operates ptt on some 900, 1850/1900mhz frequencies depending on which version of the legacy ptt equipment you have.

Let's be clear about what the spectrum is for.. DATA, the entire network is data driven. The more bandwidth & bits they can push over the air, the more money they make and the less spectrum for competitors. It's an easy slippery slope to see 3 wireless carriers emerge from this mess-- after the eventual merger of Sprint/Tmobile (2017) as neither company has the assets to build a national network in over 4k cities, suburban outlays and rural towns.
What there should be a push for is to evolve LTE to be interop at any carriers' frequency for all services (voice, data, text, ptt, etc) on roaming each others' network the way analog roaming used to way back when.. then a smart-phone will finally be a "SMART NETWORK (DATA) PHONE"


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
said by tmc8080:

This is why Verizon got first dibs on 1800 & 1900mhz spectrum way back when.. If Sprint were smart, they'd revamp their entire network for 700mhz wide-band spectrum. For AT&T to have as much spectrum as Verizon, they need almost twice as much bandwidth above 2ghz. IIRC, Verizon operates ptt on some 900, 1850/1900mhz frequencies depending on which version of the legacy ptt equipment you have.

Ok first of all Verizon says it will refarm it's 1X and 3G spectrum for 4G by 2012. Now could they do it sooner? sure but if they don't that's 8 years from now.

Second anything about 2000MHz is bad yet in less than a year Verizon will be rolling out 4G over 1700/2100 MHz. In fact phones that have 1700/2100 MHz radios in them will be on sale within a few months. 2100 is above 2000 last time I checked. Someone better tell Verizon they are wasting their time.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000
Who said anything above 2000 Mhz is bad?

2100 Mhz represents that last usable band for cell phones.


Metatron2008
Premium
join:2008-09-02
united state
reply to DataRiker
You realize they were not using anything at all of the actual bandwidth they have in the 2.5 ghz band?

The length of the signal will suck, but they could literally drive a couple hundred mbit a person AT LEAST if they used all the mhz they have available.

Look:



DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000
said by Metatron2008:

You realize they were not using anything at all of the actual bandwidth they have in the 2.5 ghz band?

Yea....we just spent a whole thread discussing why that won't ever happen for cell phones at least.

The propagation properties generally require external antenna's and high power output.


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
And you still have Yet to explain then why Sprint would want to buy Clearwire out for the spectrum if the spectrum is useless. Doesn't make a whole lot of sense.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000

4 edits
said by 88615298:

And you still have Yet to explain then why Sprint would want to buy Clearwire out for the spectrum

Fixed Wireless.

What else would it have been for? Just because people erroneously implied it would be used in cell phones does not mean you have to believe it.

I have serious doubt ATT can make 2300 Mhz work for typical cellular usage, but it would make an awesome fixed wireless band.

zephxiii

join:2012-12-12
Fort Wayne, IN
WiMax was being used in 2.5ghz band on cell phones

The 2.3ghz band can very well used by AT&T on their cell sites and cell phones. 2.3ghz can be used to offload lots of data congestion from 700/AWS networks with those in enough range to use it. It would be especially valuable in extremely dense data traffic areas where it is harder to get the most out of a slim band of spectrum (700mhz).

With VZW's and T-mobile's recent AWS acquisitions, AT&T is behind in the 4G spectrum race. 850/1900 is already too congested for re-farming in dense areas.


88615298
Premium
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness
reply to DataRiker
Even if it's for fixed wireless that still help mobile. For example Verizon currently uses 700 MHz for both mobile and it's fixed wireless Homefusion service. No doubt the fact that some bandwidth has to be used for fixed service limits how much can be used for moible. If Verizon had HomeFusion on another band that would free up bandwidth for mobile on 700 Mhz. Thus Sprint using 2500 MHz for fixed wireless means they are not having to use spectrum they also use for cell phones thus leaving more bandwidth for mobile.


DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
00000

4 edits
reply to zephxiii
said by zephxiii:

WiMax was being used in 2.5ghz band on cell phones

Firstly Sprints WiMax in Kansas City was primarily in the 2.6 Ghz band. Sprint is no longer releasing WiMax enabled phones for a reason. We are literally saturated with WiMax in Kansas City and you can't even hold a connection inside a car with an EVO4G.

At one point they were giving away 4G/Wimax access point for peoples homes so they wouldn't return their devices.

Sprint is now focusing on developing the 1900 Mhz band.

99% of Wimax uses fixed receiver base stations with significant power to reach the multi-mile point. (In exactly the same way you can achieve multi-mile access over wifi - minus interference )

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WiMAX