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swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

[Internet] Questions on Router Performance

I have been reading the forum post: »[Internet] Best Routers for Bridged Networks

This post I have found interesting and confusing at the same time as there are multiple ‘sub-conversations’ happening… Since I had some questions that may help others I figured I would post in a new thread. (I hope this is okay)

Our family is what I would consider a high internet usage house and would like to get some input to what would be our best options for optimum performance. Here is what we currently have:

-Ubee Modem as supplied by BHN
-Linksys WRT610N Router (bridged to the Ubee)
-3 Computer systems – 1 is direct to router and 2 connect via D-Link Powerline 200Mbps
-Sony Blu-Ray/Home Theater connected to Internet via D-Link Powerline 200Mbps (Netflix, etc..)
-Xbox 360 and Playstation 3 (Games, Netflix, etc)
-Multiple Smart Phones and Tablets

Now for the most part the Router works well but I suspect some of our performance issue are caused from this router and this is what I am hoping to get feedback on. What issues do we encounter:

-Movies in HD will have to buffer every 10 -20 minutes. The Sony Blu-Ray is the worse but occurs with both the Xbox and Playstation. I have tried multiple connections methods and the Powerline was the best results but still nowhere near perfect.

-Online gaming…
I can only describe what we see as ‘slowness’ not lag but slowness. Let me explain a little better:
Say in an online game you see something you want to pickup, so you start moving to the location and when you get there you see someone else (another online player) also moving to it. On my screen this person is further away and you click on the object and a message comes up… Now this happens ALL the time. To me it appears that the sync between client and server are not updating quick enough to properly communicate my nor the other persons location to the object. So I ‘THINK’ I’ll be the first one to the object, maybe I was… but based on the client to server communication the server didn’t know I was there and thus the other play receives the item… did that make any sense?

-My computers are all newer with fairly high end equipment designed for games so I don’t think the computers themselves are at fault…. Maybe the NIC cards could be better not sure.

-All ‘Speed Tests’ I have done show our BHN working at or slightly above the 40/5 speeds. On average I see between 40-41 download and 4.9 – 5.3 upload speeds.

So based on the above information I am looking to see if you think my streaming and game performance could be related to the Linksys Router or possible combination of things?

ASUS has several Routers available and wondering if the RT-N65U is still the way to go and if I would see better performance with this model verses their others??

What about at the Computer with this router, is there a NIC or Wireless card that would also help performance?

I have been a software person far too long and the home networking hardware is not something I have kept up to date. It is also hard to view online reviews as in most cases they appear bias, which is why I wanted to post the questions here as I feel I will get honest opinions

If I missed some important information please let me know or feel free to point me to a post I may have missed if this has been covered.

Thank you for your time.



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House

For starters Bridging your UBEE was the right thing to do great job!!!. Now if your looking for a high end Router I suggest ASUS RT-N66U flash with Tomato by Shibby. Asus RT-N66U not only does it have alot of power under the hood 600MHz CPU Processor, 256 MB RAM, But you have External Antennas that provides great signal Range. However with that said for Gamming and Netflix Streaming its best to use a wired LAN Cord or the very least a powerline adapter. BHNtechXpert Swears by the ASUS RT-N56U , I'm sure he will have some suggestions also about that model
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Hey Swanny before I give you my answer (I'm sure there will be others) I want to check your equipment real quick and make sure there isn't something I can fix before you spend the money. Simply post a direct thread with this thread title and your IP only...no need for additional text as conversation will continue in this thread the other is just so I can verify stuff on my end.

After I check that I'll have several questions and then my answer for you.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to Guide_Tim

said by Guide_Tim:

For starters Bridging your UBEE was the right thing to do great job!!!. Now if your looking for a high end Router I suggest ASUS RT-N66U flash with Tomato by Shibby. Asus RT-N66U not only does it have alot of power under the hood 600MHz CPU Processor, 256 MB RAM, But you have External Antennas that provides great signal Range. However with that said for Gamming and Netflix Streaming its best to use a wired LAN Cord or the very least a powerline adapter. BHNtechXpert Swears by the ASUS RT-N56U , I'm sure he will have some suggestions also about that model

Actually either the 56 or 65 I have no problems with. The 66 is a different beast at the moment...still too many unresolved issues from my standpoint. But more on that later...I first want to make sure there are no service impacting issues...no need to spend extra money if its something I can solve.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
reply to swanny

Direct Forums Link to post your IP for BHNtechXpert
»Bright House Networks Direct
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL
reply to BHNtechXpert

said by BHNtechXpert:

Hey Swanny before I give you my answer (I'm sure there will be others) I want to check your equipment real quick and make sure there isn't something I can fix before you spend the money. Simply post a direct thread with this thread title and your IP only...no need for additional text as conversation will continue in this thread the other is just so I can verify stuff on my end.

After I check that I'll have several questions and then my answer for you.

I have opened as reqested and provided the IP. thank you all!


BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Okay Swanny,

Nothing screams problem at me so lets move forward as this being a router specific thingy...so first things first..

1) I want to commend you on your choice of networking purchases that minimize your use of wireless whereever possible (Homeplugs). Very good decision on your part. That said it does not appear that your gaming consoles take advantage of them but instead are wireless...why?

2) Make sure you have installed the lastest firmware from Cisco with that router.

3) Do you have the latest firmware on the Sony Bluray player. Sony has several models which have received serious complaints about this specific thing both wired and wireless. The assumption is they will or have fixed it via firmware.

4) Are most of the concerns you have related streaming or do the PC's also have issues and explain in detail please.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

Thank you for the reply.

1-I actually got the original idea for the Powerline adapters from this site… so the credit is back to you

As for the Game Consoles, sorry if I was not clear… The game consoles will use the Powerline units as well. Currently the Xbox is in my son’s room and I have a 4 port switch that his computer and Xbox plug into and that connects to the Powerline. He only games with this and currently doesn’t have an Xbox Live subscription so he has limited online interaction with his Xbox.

The Sony Blu-Ray and Playstation are in living room and I manually switch the network cable between the 2 units as needed. The only items using wireless now are one laptop (used very little), the phones and 2 tablets.

2-I have not updated the firmware on the Router for awhile… I will get that done tonight.

3-I believe the Blu-Ray is up to date on its firmware but I need to double check the model number to confirm.

4-As for my concerns… Yes, the majority of my issues are based on Streaming and the online gaming. We use the online games as one source of our ‘family’ entertainment. The online game issues are minor, but would like to try and optimize our performance as best as we can. In reading this forum I started wondering if the router could be a bottleneck of the performance.
Streaming I would say IS a concern. If we want to watch anything streamed we will encounter multiple times the system will pause to buffer the data… then continue. This occurs on the Blu-Ray, the Playstation or the Xbox.

The PC’s do not have any issues, non-online games play fine. We are not heavy PC gamers, but for the few games we have there is no issues playing. Can’t say there isn’t something going on with PC’s but I don’t see any issues other than the online game issue.

Hope this helps...



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Okay next question and thanks for clarifying...

Go into the management console for the homeplug adapters and what are the respective datarates to/from each adapter. The software should tell you and also give you a quality rating of excellent, good, fair, poor.


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

The 2 that are currently used have:

Device 2 = Rate (Mbps) 113.00
Device 4 = Rate (Mbps) 83.00
Device 3 = not in use right now

The quality is a hard to read as it has a bunch of bars... not sure what best is but both appear to be on the higher side say if 15 total bars...

Device 2 = 11 of 15
Device 4 = 9 or 15

I can post a screen shot if needed. Just to be completly clear.. The powerline units are TrendNet TPL-303E2K 200Mbps.

Let me know if more specific details on these would help, I can post in the direct thread.

Thanks



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Okay so you have excellent connection quality across the house then so we know its not something there...well that leaves the router based on what I see so far. Get that software updated, make sure all your settings are golden and lets see how it goes...

My preference on the Asus is still the 56 but the 65 now has custom firmware for it as well so either would be a good choice...let me check the stats side by side.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

okay so the Router is up to date on the firmware:

Router = Firmware Version: 2.00.01 build 15 Sep. 13, 2010

Cisco Website = Firmware 09/13/2010 Ver.2.00.01.15



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

And has this always been this way or did it just recently start and is it consistent day and night or?


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

It has been this way for awhile which we have been living with... Just getting to a point where I know we should be able to do better



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Okay just to be sure its not something we missed on this side I'm going to send you a test link I need you to let run for 24 hours...no streaming or big downloads during the test and it must be on a wired pc please...


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL

The test you requested is now running.



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Perfect... I'll take a look at it mid day.



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

Click for full size
Swanny I think I can safely say this is not a service issue on our end because it just doesn't get much better than that. The above are the results of your UDP capacity test which essentially is the same protocol used by streaming services. So lets move forward on this being a router issue....if you decide to go the Asus route please buy from Amazon or somewhere with liberal return policies in case this doesn't solve your problem.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~


ecollin2

join:2012-12-15
Orlando, FL

Well I am not a networking expert but hey, this is an open forum so I will throw out an idea. Since bandwidth looks good with only one machine generating traffic maybe it is the way contention is handled on your lan that is causing an issue. Do you think wireless settings like Wi-Fi Multimedia (WMM) and wired settings like flow control and interrupt moderation could be causing an issue? Someone once told me that throughput is affected by bandwidth AND LATENCY. If contention exists and is not managed properly on your LAN I guess that could increase latency. Maybe a pro can chime in.


swanny

join:2009-10-23
Apopka, FL
reply to BHNtechXpert

I want to thank you for the time and really going the extra mile to ensure everything checks out. A+ in my book!

Based on the findings and recommendation I will be looking at the ASUS RT-N56U and update with the custom firmware.

Thanks again for all the help!



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House

1 edit
reply to BHNtechXpert

I agree with BHNtechXpert your bandwidth looks pretty rock solid. I think you should upgrade to ASUS router as BHNtechXpert suggested. When you have all those computers and devices on your network you need a nice high end Router with plenty of power under the hood to run everything flawlessly. One more suggestion I just thought of just now for shits n giggles login to your Current Router and Disable QOS sometimes that Helps. Honestly with Lightning you really dont need QOS turned on QOS is located under applications & Gaming look for QOS and find "internet access priority" Turn it off Its been so long since I have used a Linksys hehehe Double check that...
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147
reply to swanny

said by swanny:

I want to thank you for the time and really going the extra mile to ensure everything checks out. A+ in my book!

Based on the findings and recommendation I will be looking at the ASUS RT-N56U and update with the custom firmware.

Thanks again for all the help!

The current flavor of Padavans firmware is awesome....that's what I run on mine.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House

1 edit

Gary hehehehe You love your ASUS RT-N56U just as much as I love my Asus RT-N66U Gary Honestly they worked out most of the bugs with the N66U both with the latest ASUS firmware and Tomato firmware from shibby , They fixed the NVRAM 32>64 Issue like 6 months ago and fixed alot of bugs. Everything is smooth as silk now.

I would love to have my N66U go head to head with your N56U someday hehehe. But Either Router would most likely out perform a Linksys or a Dlink-655 on Benchmark Tests anyday
But yea the RT-N56U is still awesome and is $50 cheaper over the RT-N66U
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147

said by Guide_Tim:

Gary hehehehe You love your ASUS RT-N56U just as much as I love my Asus RT-N66U Gary Honestly they worked out most of the bugs with the N66U both with the latest ASUS firmware and Tomato firmware from shibby , They fixed the NVRAM 32>64 Issue like 6 months ago and fixed alot of bugs. Everything is smooth as silk now.

I would love to have my N66U go head to head with your N56U someday hehehe. But Either Router would most likely out perform a Linksys or a Dlink-655 on Benchmark Tests anyday
But yea the RT-N56U is still awesome and is $50 cheaper over the RT-N66U

Yes but consumer sentiments haven't changed quite yet...once I see the trending upwards like the good old 56 then I will go buy one and add this to the list of monsters. Lets give it til March and I'll revisit the 66. I tend to play things very conservative once things have gone bad the first time and the launch of the 66 was a disaster...I was truly shocked Asus allowed that to happen.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House

Gary I fully agree with you on that Asus allowed that to happen To be honest I think ASUS used alot of fixes for their latest firmware from the help of 3rd party open source firmware Coders lol
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003



BHNtechXpert
BHN Staff
Premium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:147

said by Guide_Tim:

Gary I fully agree with you on that Asus allowed that to happen To be honest I think ASUS used alot of fixes for their latest firmware from the help of 3rd party open source firmware Coders lol

Well there is nothing wrong with that when you think about it. Good things come from those who have the time and resources to tinker and they don't mind sharing for the common good. Asus and other companies should not fear private innovation that improves their products.
--
~All truth goes through three phases. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as self-evident. - Arthur Schopenhauer ~



bigdaddy

join:2009-11-18
kudos:2
reply to swanny

ASUSWRT-Merlin Reviewed

This look's like an interesting read.

ASUSWRT-Merlin firmware for the popular ASUS RT-N66U Dark Knight.

The primary goals of this project are to fix bugs, add a few basic features and tweaks to the original firmware. This firmware will try to remain as close as possible to the original firmware. If you are looking for a slew of advanced features, then this project is not for you. Look at TomatoUSB or DD-WRT, two excellent products that might suit your needs better.

If however you prefer something as close as possible to the manufacturer's firmware, then this is for you.

»www.smallnetbuilder.com/wireless···reviewed



Guide_Tim

join:2012-02-28
Taft, CA
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Bright House

1 edit

Yes I've tried Merlin's firmware for ASUS RT-N66U I had no issues with it, its like the Asus Firmware but with Extra settings and performance tweaks and fixes. Out of all the firmware for ASUS RT-N66U I chose to stick with Tomato by Shibby
Tomato Firmware 1.28.0000 MIPSR2-104 K26 USB AIO-64K
Everything just works great and its so stable I love it
--
Bakersfield Region Taft CA Brighthouse Customer Since 2003