dslreports logo
site
 
    All Forums Hot Topics Gallery
spc

spacer




how-to block ads


Search Topic:
uniqs
22
share rss forum feed


BoteMan

join:2002-11-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL

1 edit
reply to One_Drop

Re: [Connectivity] Sharing drop with neighbor

said by One_Drop :

I live in an apartment complex. Each building has eight apartments. There is only one power drop and one Comcast cable drop for each building. The power and cable is fed from a common junction box (with separate power meters for each apartment) to each apartment. I don't see why a duplex would require any different treatment.

The trunk hardline will have a splitter up on the pole; this would be analogous to the one serving your 8 apartments. Then if the tech splits it again at my neighbor's service entry that's another 3dB drop on my leg (and my neighbor's). I get that.

I just don't know if he can remove an attenuator up on the pole or somehow adjust the signal level to our split drop to undo the effects of the second split? Or just run the drop all the way from the pole to me and eliminate one potential source of trouble, if it is one. And any additional installation cost because of this drop run (I doubt it based on reading similar threads here).

--
»www.trackstreamer.com
Streaming police & fire public safety online scanners


One_Drop

@comcast.net

said by BoteMan:

said by One_Drop :

I live in an apartment complex. Each building has eight apartments. There is only one power drop and one Comcast cable drop for each building. The power and cable is fed from a common junction box (with separate power meters for each apartment) to each apartment. I don't see why a duplex would require any different treatment.

The trunk hardline will have a splitter up on the pole; this would be analogous to the one serving your 8 apartments. Then if the tech splits it again at my neighbor's service entry that's another 3dB drop on my leg (and my neighbor's). I get that.

I just don't know if he can remove an attenuator up on the pole or somehow adjust the signal level to our split drop to undo the effects of the second split? Or just run the drop all the way from the pole to me and eliminate one potential source of trouble, if it is one.

And the eight way split on the apartment building would mean a proportionally larger db drop for each apartment. What's your point? The tech only has to adjust the level before the split to compensate. I have quite acceptable modem stats despite the eight way split (and a two way split inside my apartment).



sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state
reply to BoteMan

said by BoteMan:

said by One_Drop :

I live in an apartment complex. Each building has eight apartments. There is only one power drop and one Comcast cable drop for each building. The power and cable is fed from a common junction box (with separate power meters for each apartment) to each apartment. I don't see why a duplex would require any different treatment.

The trunk hardline will have a splitter up on the pole; this would be analogous to the one serving your 8 apartments. Then if the tech splits it again at my neighbor's service entry that's another 3dB drop on my leg (and my neighbor's). I get that.

I just don't know if he can remove an attenuator up on the pole or somehow adjust the signal level to our split drop to undo the effects of the second split? Or just run the drop all the way from the pole to me and eliminate one potential source of trouble, if it is one.

Unless something changed, tap plates are installed (measured in loss/ohms etc) based on signal and number of buildings it needs to feed. Sometimes you cannot just change to a different plate as that effects the rest of the resistance etc. If this building is 2 addresses, that tap plate has a port and proper signal to connect both halves. Even Comcast under their policy does not allow 2 modems to be connected via the same drop. Again maybe there is lee-way, but even a Comcast authorized contractor states: "If you have two modems, they must have separate connections to the main line tap plate. They can not both exists on the same RG6 coax building drop."

So, if there is room on the plate (if 2 addresses), than that tech needs to run another drop. Possibly even if he follows the first til it gets to the building.

I still do not understand the issue with him running another drop ?? Did he explain?

sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state
reply to One_Drop

said by One_Drop :

said by BoteMan:

said by One_Drop :

I live in an apartment complex. Each building has eight apartments. There is only one power drop and one Comcast cable drop for each building. The power and cable is fed from a common junction box (with separate power meters for each apartment) to each apartment. I don't see why a duplex would require any different treatment.

The trunk hardline will have a splitter up on the pole; this would be analogous to the one serving your 8 apartments. Then if the tech splits it again at my neighbor's service entry that's another 3dB drop on my leg (and my neighbor's). I get that.

I just don't know if he can remove an attenuator up on the pole or somehow adjust the signal level to our split drop to undo the effects of the second split? Or just run the drop all the way from the pole to me and eliminate one potential source of trouble, if it is one.

And the eight way split on the apartment building would mean a proportionally larger db drop for each apartment. What's your point? The tech only has to adjust the level before the split to compensate. I have quite acceptable modem stats despite the eight way split (and a two way split inside my apartment).

You are not getting it. It is split eight ways on a tap plate! Just like any neighborhood is split. You cannot split 8-ways on RG6 and keep your signal. The tech does not adjust anything. Only if something is wrong with overall signal at the tap plate, can the higher tech-2 or similar come out to change something. They could up the amp setting but that effects the whole tap plate at once (every port)


One_Drop

@comcast.net
reply to sapreaper

said by sapreaper:

Even Comcast under their policy does not allow 2 modems to be connected via the same drop. Again maybe there is lee-way, but even a Comcast authorized contractor states: "If you have two modems, they must have separate connections to the main line tap plate. They can not both exists on the same RG6 coax building drop."

That would mean that a business class customer who had both Internet and voice services would need to have two drops, because none of the officially approved "modems" that are allowed to be used for a business class account have FXS (voice) ports. That restricted modem list means that two modems are required if a business class customer is a CDV subscriber. I really don't think that Comcast is going to run a separate drop just for the voice modem.

sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state

Maybe due to the low bandwidth that VoiP uses. I used "modems" loosely as in used for internet and speeds above 10-15Mbps etc. I do not deal with VoiP, and wish I would never have to get it myself. Low cost garbage..



not

@comcast.net

Bottom line everyone... the splitting can only happen at the TAP plate. If he splits off somewhere else down the line from there, when your neighbor cancels his/her account, Comcast comes out or remotely cuts off his connection and inturn yours as well.



bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·T-Mobile US
·Sprint Mobile Br..

1 edit
reply to sapreaper

said by sapreaper:

said by BoteMan:

said by One_Drop :

I live in an apartment complex. Each building has eight apartments. There is only one power drop and one Comcast cable drop for each building. The power and cable is fed from a common junction box (with separate power meters for each apartment) to each apartment. I don't see why a duplex would require any different treatment.

The trunk hardline will have a splitter up on the pole; this would be analogous to the one serving your 8 apartments. Then if the tech splits it again at my neighbor's service entry that's another 3dB drop on my leg (and my neighbor's). I get that.

I just don't know if he can remove an attenuator up on the pole or somehow adjust the signal level to our split drop to undo the effects of the second split? Or just run the drop all the way from the pole to me and eliminate one potential source of trouble, if it is one.

Unless something changed, tap plates are installed (measured in loss/ohms etc) based on signal and number of buildings it needs to feed. Sometimes you cannot just change to a different plate as that effects the rest of the resistance etc. If this building is 2 addresses, that tap plate has a port and proper signal to connect both halves. Even Comcast under their policy does not allow 2 modems to be connected via the same drop. Again maybe there is lee-way, but even a Comcast authorized contractor states: "If you have two modems, they must have separate connections to the main line tap plate. They can not both exists on the same RG6 coax building drop."

So, if there is room on the plate (if 2 addresses), than that tech needs to run another drop. Possibly even if he follows the first til it gets to the building.

I still do not understand the issue with him running another drop ?? Did he explain?

This is a terrible way to install regardless of the circumstances. Even if there were no tap ports, which is possible the drop should have been split at the pole off the neighbors tap port and ran to your power meter etc. Even then should only be temporary. This is most likely a case of a lazy tech.
Edit: fixed some things lol.
--


sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state

@BobJohnson , what is a terrible way to install? Not sure where your reply was directed



bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·T-Mobile US
·Sprint Mobile Br..

I edited my post previous to kinda make more sense out of it. I'm not sure what happened on my phone but I thought I shortened the quote the first time. Anyway, all of your post was correct and I was saying that there is not an excuse for not running the drop.


sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state

said by bobjohnson:

I edited my post previous to kinda make more sense out of it. I'm not sure what happened on my phone but I thought I shortened the quote the first time. Anyway, all of your post was correct and I was saying that there is not an excuse for not running the drop.

Ah gotya, no problem at all. Nice to have some support when trying to explain to others


BoteMan

join:2002-11-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL
reply to bobjohnson

said by bobjohnson:

...This is most likely a case of a lazy tech.

Welcome to south Florida!
--
»www.trackstreamer.com
Streaming police & fire public safety online scanners


gar187er
I do this for a living

join:2006-06-24
Dover, DE
kudos:4
reply to sapreaper

quote:
Even Comcast under their policy does not allow 2 modems to be connected via the same drop
ummm no.. wrong dude....

so when a customer has two modems in a house (phone/hsi) you need to dual drop?!?!?!
--
I'm better than you!


bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·T-Mobile US
·Sprint Mobile Br..
reply to BoteMan

Lol... I don't think it's isolated to you guys... I know quite a few myself up in these parts... But seriously though, How far do you think it is from the tap to your power meter? I've zip-tied a drop about 100ft down a hard line to get across so I didn't have an aerial trespass in a similar situation...



NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage
reply to gar187er

said by gar187er:

quote:
Even Comcast under their policy does not allow 2 modems to be connected via the same drop
ummm no.. wrong dude....

so when a customer has two modems in a house (phone/hsi) you need to dual drop?!?!?!

Before I ordered my business class HSI, I connected an old modem that I had previously used for residential HSI (I still subscribed to TV service, but not HSI), just to see what the line levels looked like. That old modem was still connected (I simply forgot to remove it) when the business class installer installed and setup the SMCD3G BC gateway. He just put the SMCD3G BC gateway on the 3.5db leg of the splitter that was already installed, and moved the old modem to a 7db leg, and left the TV on a 7db leg. There was no consideration given to my needing another drop just because I had another modem connected to the line.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.


bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL
Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
·T-Mobile US
·Sprint Mobile Br..
reply to gar187er

said by gar187er:



so when a customer has two modems in a house (phone/hsi) you need to dual drop?!?!?!

No, but if you have two people in one house that want their own HSI modems there has to be an individual account and drop for each HSI modem.


NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

said by bobjohnson:

said by gar187er:



so when a customer has two modems in a house (phone/hsi) you need to dual drop?!?!?!

No, but if you have two people in one house that want their own HSI modems there has to be an individual account and drop for each HSI modem.

Individual accounts, yes.

Individual drops, no. While that might seem to be an ideal solution, that is not the way that Comcast does it for a single residential address (at least not in my franchise area).

I asked about getting a second drop for my business class service. My residential service is in my name, and the business class service uses a DBA business name, and I wanted them to be totally separate; but I was told that Comcast never puts in two drops to the same residential address.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.


bobjohnson
Premium
join:2007-02-03
Orlando, FL

Depends on market then... In Jacksonville, FL they will only allow the two modem, two account setup with individual drops and tags unless there is not an extra port on the tap, then I don't know what they do.



NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

said by bobjohnson:

Depends on market then... In Jacksonville, FL they will only allow the two modem, two account setup with individual drops and tags unless there is not an extra port on the tap, then I don't know what they do.

Of course in the context of this thread, the OP's duplex probably has two distinct addresses, so that would/could make a big difference in how the Comcast franchise in that area would handle a new installation in a previously unconnected duplex residence. With Comcast, each franchise area has a great deal of autonomy in what products are marketed and how certain services are provided.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.

sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state

The 2-drop 2-modem rule may have been for Business class and not residential. I never said i knew 100% what the comcast policy was, but still you CANNOT share a single RG6 drop between 2 residential dwellings (individual addresses). If the OP replies, maybe we can figure out WHY the installer cannot run another RG6 Quad drop..



NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

1 edit

said by sapreaper:

The 2-drop 2-modem rule may have been for Business class and not residential. I never said i knew 100% what the comcast policy was, but still you CANNOT share a single RG6 drop between 2 residential dwellings (individual addresses). If the OP replies, maybe we can figure out WHY the installer cannot run another RG6 Quad drop..

If you look at my other posts in this thread (instead of just cherry picking a generic reply), you will see that I have business class, and when it was installed I already had another modem attached to my residential class service (and I did not get, nor was I offered a second drop for my business class modem).
»Re: [Connectivity] Sharing drop with neighbor
»Re: [Connectivity] Sharing drop with neighbor

What it really depends on, as several members of this site (including some Comcast techs) have said, is where you live and the policy of the Comcast franchise in any given area.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.

sapreaper

join:2007-06-01
united state

and i never said your area specifically. I was stating a generic reply, and what i stated originally was from a Comcast COntractor. I did read the posts.....

I am more worried about the OP, where we are talking about One drop for 2 different dwellings.



BoteMan

join:2002-11-11
Fort Lauderdale, FL

1 edit
reply to NetFixer

said by NetFixer:

...With Comcast, each franchise area has a great deal of autonomy in what products are marketed and how certain services are provided.

Now we leave the hypothetical and enter the actual.

Today's resked brought a more savvy installer (and sunshine instead of rain). He dismissed the notion that I would be disconnected when my neighbor disconnects his HSI, and that's a fact. They do everything at the head-end now, where it's substantially cheaper to do, I learned elsewhere.

He mounted a splitter in the plate on my neighbor's wall and staked down new cable along the eaves, drilled a hole in my bedroom outer wall, hooked it up to my new SB6121 and was up and running shortly thereafter. No new drop from the pole.

A couple observations: the modem did not do anything useful until he apparently ran a little app on his smartphone that turned it up at the head-end. (At the start of the installation he called in the MAC address and model of the modem.) That was the magic that got it talking as far as I can tell.

Then he pulled up the modem's status screen on my desktop computer and looking over his shoulder I noted that the receive levels were a bit anemic, from -14 to -9 dBV. He went back outside, changed something, and refreshed the status to see levels between -9 and -6dBV.

Overall, I'm tickled pink after living in AT&T DSL he|| for years. That aint getting any better, so as long as Comcast is at least as reliable I'll be happy.

Now I can even make phone calls on my Obi110 box without having to kill my scanner feeds to avoid uplink bandwidth starvation. How cool is that?! Yes, that's how bad it was :- )
--
»www.trackstreamer.com
Streaming police & fire public safety online scanners


NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

said by BoteMan:

Overall, I'm tickled pink after living in AT&T DSL he|| for years. That aint getting any better, so as long as Comcast is at least as reliable I'll be happy.

Now I can even make phone calls on my Obi110 box without having to kill my scanner feeds to avoid uplink bandwidth starvation. How cool is that?! Yes, that's how bad it was :- )

How well I remember that scenario!

At least Comcast is moving their products (and in some cases dragging their customers kicking and screaming) into the 21st Century. AT&T on the other hand, is still keeping some of their customers locked into the 19th Century.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.


NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

1 edit
reply to BoteMan

Oops, nevermind. This was a DSLR gateway error triggered double post.
         

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3FnpaWQJO0

         
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.

TomS

join:2008-01-21
Gloucester, MA
reply to BoteMan

"resked" ? That is a particularly ugly excuse for a word.



NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
The Boro
Reviews:
·Cingular Wireless
·Comcast Business..
·Vonage

said by TomS:

"resked" ? That is a particularly ugly excuse for a word.

It is a fairly common SMS/Twitter pseudo word that means "reschedule" (just in case you thought it was a typo). However, I agree that it (and most SMS/Twitter pseudo words) are ugly excuses for words.
--
A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.

When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.