J D McDorce
Premium
join:2001-12-29
Westland, MI
| reply to halfband
Re: Watchdogs: Cable gouges broadband users
said by halfband  :
The only reason Comcast has a monopoly position (Not the whole monopoly, just the position JD  ) for HSI in most areas is because the telcos or another cable company do not want to invest in the build out of the area.
This falls into the area of economic barriers to entry. |
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halfband
Premium
join:2002-06-01
Huntsville, AL | Actually I thought it had to do with government regulation, line sharing and all making it economically unattractive, but point taken.
--
Registered Bandwidth Offender #40812 |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| reply to JTRockville
So what you want is a government mandated discount solely because you live in a monopoly area.
If that happens are you then going to agree with me when I start whining about that not being fair?
You can't punish comcast because they moved HSI into an area competitors won't go into; which is what you want to do even if you don't realize it realize it or not.
If I were Comcast and this goes thru I would just stop offering HSI in noncompetitive areas.
--
So it begins.
[text was edited by author 2003-03-31 01:18:00] |
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DonLibes
Premium,ExMod 2001
join:2003-01-19
| said by Combat Chuck :
You can't punish comcast because they moved HSI into an area competitors won't go into; which is what you want to do even if you don't realize it realize it or not. If I were Comcast and this goes thru I would just stop offering HSI in noncompetitive areas.
You should realize that Comcast is already treated differently. For instance, in Montgomery County (where JT resides), Comcast is subject to rate regulation while Starpower (a much, much smaller cable franchisee) is not. This is just one of several mechanisms the county is using to encourage competition.
Is Comcast being penalized? In a sense, yes. Is Comcast a de facto monopoly? Yes. Should Comcast be treated differently? Yes, and the local government is already doing so. Is Comcast leaving or withdrawing service in noncompetitive areas? On the contrary, they're trying harder than ever to win over customers. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
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| reply to Combat Chuck
Competition keeps pricing fair. Without competition, something else is needed to constrain prices.
If you want to whine about it Combat Chuck , go right ahead. That's your choice. And though I'll probably never agree with you, I encourage you to become an advocate for consumers in any situation you find unfair. said by Combat Chuck :
If I were Comcast and this goes thru I would just stop offering HSI in noncompetitive areas.
Think Comcast's financials could survive the "free cash flow" hit? I don't know about other jurisdictions, but our franchise covers 200k installed subscribers. Even if only 20% of 'em receive broadband, that figure has lots of digits. And we're not the only non-competitive area in the country.
Added:
If Comcast did yank my broadband, I'd yank their coax off my property faster than you can say: Satellite TV.
[text was edited by author 2003-03-31 10:35:01] |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| said by JTRockville :
Competition keeps pricing fair. Without competition, something else is needed to constrain prices.
All prices below are for 15147 zip code and 412 area code.
Comcast HSI (1500/256): about $60.00 ($0.04 per kbps download)
Speakeasy DSL (1500/128): about $60.00 ($0.04 /kbps download)
(and I only get 1 email address, if I want 2 it goes up to $70.00)
Verizon DSL(768/128): about $50.00 ($0.06 /kbps download)
Stargate DSL (768/128): about $50.00 ($0.06 /kbps download)
or (1500/384): about $80.00 ($0.05 /kbps download)
------------------------
Clearly in competitive areas comcast has the lowest price for the service it offers with very few exceptions (those mainly being government subsidised competitors and it's not really fair to compare the two until the gov't sponsored ones show a sustained profit for several years). Yet somehow they are offering you an unfair price, solely because there isn't competition in your area?
If two houses are 20ft apart; one can get dsl the other can't and has no other options should the one who can't get a lower price? What would be that lower price? What would they base it on? They can't base it on competitive areas because then their price would go up because....
Currently freemarket pressures are setting the price of broadband in competitive areas to around 4.5 cents per kbps, you're paying less than that in noncompetitive areas; it's not any more unfair for you to pay that in a monopoly area than it is for me to pay it in a competitive area.
BTW: the government doesn't regulate monopolies (or they aren't supposed to) until it can be shown that they are using that monopoly status to unnaturally inflate prices, which they obviously aren't doing if you look at what everyone else is paying.
You (referring to those who want the government to regulate Comcast HSI just because they offer HSI where no one else will or can) are mistakenly equating your dissatisfaction that the price went up, with anticompetitive practices on Comcasts part.
--
So it begins.
[text was edited by author 2003-03-31 14:22:57] |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
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| This objection was raised by ex-ATTB'ers, whose price of a monopoly service was increased by 33% because they do not also purchase a competitive service.
In areas where there's competition: you can choose the discounted bundle of competitive services that best suits your needs.
In areas where there's no competition: you get raped by inflated individual pricing if you don't submit to the demands of the monopolist. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| reply to JTRockville
said by JTRockville :
Even if only 20% of 'em receive broadband, that figure has lots of digits.
dont forget the expense of providing the service. there are a lot of digits in that as well. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
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| I didn't gharney . Comcast collects double what the costs are, hence their 50% profit margin. The absence of all that "free cash flow" would be quite troublesome. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| said by JTRockville :
I didn't gharney . Comcast collects double what the costs are, hence their 50% profit margin.
really?
citations please. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs: | Go ho the data yourself dude. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD | you made the claim.
you back it up.
dude. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
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| aight, gharney . I'll humor you, even though you've never backed up any of your statements with facts:
LAST THREE QUARTERS IN FY02: Q2 50.1%, Q3 49.5%, Q4 49.5%. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| said by JTRockville :
aight, gharney . I'll humor you, even though you've never backed up any of your statements with facts
really? show me. im still waiting for a reply from you on how you think that passive theft is not theft. the ball was left in your court, you chose not to reply. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
·LINGO
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·surpasshosting
·Verizon FIOS
| I didn't reply because you offered no new information. The subscriber is not stealing a signal, because a signal was ordered, installed, and billed. Whether or not the cable company used proper procedures couldn't possibly be determined by the subscriber unless a copy of procedures were publicly available. A logical conclusion for the subscriber, since the requested services were installed, would be that Comcast followed proper procedures, but refuses to block the non-requested channels, which they are required to do.
Now...
Back to the topic. Still think Comcast wants to lose all those digits from their quarterly bottom line? |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| said by JTRockville :
I didn't reply because you offered no new information. The subscriber is not stealing a signal, because a signal was ordered, installed, and
billed.
as i have explained to you, and have provided you references that support my explanation;
the subscriber is stealing because he is receiving something he is not paying for (as he even admitted). passive theft is stealing.
quote:
Comcast followed proper procedures, but refuses to block the non-requested channels, which they are required to do.
and yet again as i have explained to you this has no relevance as what you cited is in regards to content. please go back to the thread and pay attention to the details and links that i have supplied you.
quote:
Back to the topic. Still think Comcast wants to lose all those digits from their quarterly bottom line?
still? where in my post have i said that i think comcast wants to lose or not lose? |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
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| * sigh *
That's it. I'm going to experiment with the ignore feature. Usually, I encourage opposing viewpoints (like those of Combat Chuck et al) because I enjoy reading different perspectives.
I've not found anything you've ever contributed to a discussion useful, interesting, or knowledgeable. Bye bye gharney . Can't say it's been nice. |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| reply to JTRockville
said by JTRockville :
This objection was raised by ex-ATTB'ers, whose price of a monopoly service was increased by 33% because they do not also purchase a competitive service.
So, my price went up 33% as well. They raised the price, it's still competitive.
said by JTRockville :
In areas where there's competition: you can choose the discounted bundle of competitive services that best suits your needs.
No I can't; no one else offers a TV/HSI service bundle. If I want sat. I have to either double up services or pay the higher price.
said by JTRockville :
In areas where there's no competition: you get raped by inflated individual pricing if you don't submit to the demands of the monopolist.
Nope, the higher price isn't inflated it's actually below market price, for what you're getting. The profits they're making have nothing to do with it, there is no law (nor should there be) that limits what profits a company can make.
You do realize that if you get your way you will be discouraging the rollout of new services into previously unserviced areas. Why would a company roll out a service
that may be considered a monopoly when they get punished for doing so.
--
So it begins.
[text was edited by author 2003-03-31 17:48:47] |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| reply to JTRockville
said by JTRockville :
* sigh *
That's it.
another one gives up when the facts prevail over fiction. |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
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| reply to Combat Chuck
Your price went up by 33% and you've got no complaint?!?!? Sheesh Combat Chuck - you're an ideal customer.
You have the choice of Sat TV + DSL broadband, right? I'm sort of clueless when it comes to DSL pricing, cuz it's moot for me, but doesn't DSL offer a bundle with phone service that includes broadband? |
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