Zorglub
join:2000-11-18
Fremont, CA | reply to DanB
Re: Watchdogs: Cable gouges broadband users
Comcast is the only residential broadband provider in most areas, like a monopoly.
Comcast increases prices like a monopoly.
It looks like one, it behaves like one, hmmm... it might be one! |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| said by Zorglub  :
Comcast is the only residential broadband provider in most areas, like a monopoly.
not a monopoly. comcast does not have exclusive control.
quote:
Comcast increases prices like a monopoly.
using your faulty logic then every company would be a monopoly.
quote:
It looks like one,
it doesnt
quote:
it behaves like one,
it doesnt
quote:
hmmm... it might be one!
its not. |
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DonLibes
Premium,ExMod 2001
join:2003-01-19
| said by gharney :
said by Zorglub :
Comcast is the only residential broadband provider in most areas, like a monopoly.
not a monopoly. comcast does not have exclusive control.
Maybe not where you live, but they sure do where I live. |
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mig288
Premium
join:2002-07-13
Merchantville, NJ
| reply to DanB
Mabee not A monopoly but they sure are the only game in town and DSL is not available here either..so..Monopoly mabee not...Soul provider YEP YEP..We need something more options in NJ. Having 2 Cable co's would be pretty cool. How about Optimum online vs Comcast I wonder how many would switch lol ........Hrm.... |
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triske
join:2002-02-15 |  reply to aTmFan
Help me Please????? can I order a White Casle with no Bun Please?? |
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billybagoil
join:2002-10-03
Franklin, TN
| reply to Zorglub
so Zorglub you equate hsi to healthcare? yea that makes sense. i wonder how people like you function in the real world. do you also need the government to regulate your toilet paper prices? bottom line is the market sets the price. if it is to much people won't buy it and they will go back to dialup or isdn. hsi is not a right, it is a luxury(Something inessential but conducive to pleasure and comfort). |
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nshulga
join:2002-06-06
Morrisville, PA
| reply to gharney
said by gharney :
internet access is not a utility.
there is nothing stopping another cable company from coming in and overbuilding.
Oh, yeah? Ask RCN about expanding into Philadelphia area.. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| reply to JTRockville
said by JTRockville :
LAST THREE QUARTERS IN FY02: Q2 50.1%, Q3 49.5%, Q4 49.5%.
It is important to note some real world figures here;
Comcast's NET profit margin was -2.2% |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
 ·LINGO
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·surpasshosting
 ·Verizon FIOS
| reply to billybagoil
said by billybagoil :
hsi is not a right, it is a luxury(Something inessential but conducive to pleasure and comfort).
billybagoil used the term "inessential", but regulators use the term essential when talking about broadband. said by FCC Commissioner Kevin J. Martin:
Encouraging the deployment of broadband services to all Americans should be a national priority. Such services are essential to the economy of the 21st century, dramatically reducing the costs of exchanging information and allowing previously local businesses to serve the world. Broadband services are especially important to rural America, providing business, educational, and healthcare opportunities to remote parts of the country. I am hopeful that, just as rapid developments in telecommunications and technology have driven much of this nation’s economic growth in recent years, broadband deployment will lead to a new period of growth. I thus believe that all levels of government should work to eliminate barriers to infrastructure investment and to accelerate broadband deployment.
said by MCMD Bill 28-02 FAQ:
Q: Why are cable-modem service requirements so important?
A: The Internet has become an essential tool in business and in many individual’s lives. Cable modems are by far the most common way of getting high-speed, broadband Internet access. Reliable broadband access will encourage telecommuting to reduce traffic and improve workers’ quality of life. It will help promote education, commerce, and employment. Montgomery County has one of the highest levels of computer use anywhere in the world. As the home of many high-tech employers, such as the National Institutes of Health, a thriving biotech industry, and several key media and communications companies, our community is more dependent than most on the wide availability of reliable broadband Internet access.
As a telecommuter, I find residential broadband to be an essential tool. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| said by JTRockville :
As a telecommuter, I find residential broadband to be an essential tool.
if it is that essential, you would want something with SLA's. |
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Zorglub
join:2000-11-18
Fremont, CA
| reply to billybagoil
[QUOTE= billybagoil ]so Zorglub you equate hsi to healthcare? yea that makes sense. i wonder how people like you function in the real world. do you also need the government to regulate your toilet paper prices? bottom line is the market sets the price. if it is to much people won't buy it and they will go back to dialup or isdn. hsi is not a right, it is a luxury(Something inessential but conducive to pleasure and comfort).
Where did you see that I was equating cable to healthcare? With all due respect, I'm not following your logic.
Even in a monopoly environment, the market sets the price, albeit higher than in a competitive market. As for the luxury analogy, if we were buying only goods that are truely necessary, most of our economy would crumble. We wouldn't be buying SUV, we'd be driving Ford Focus, we would not have big screen TV, but still be watching B&W 19" screens, and I could go on and on.
Bottom line, Comcast is acting like a monopoly. While it's not the end of the world, it's still worth being noted. |
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DonLibes
Premium,ExMod 2001
join:2003-01-19
| reply to gharney
said by gharney :
said by JTRockville :
LAST THREE QUARTERS IN FY02: Q2 50.1%, Q3 49.5%, Q4 49.5%.
It is important to note some real world figures here;Comcast's NET profit margin was -2.2%
Nonetheless, JT's observations are important. It's easy to get from a gross profit margin of 50% down to a negative net profit margin. Comcast's debt servicing, their practice of paying stratospheric executive salaries, and their "contributions to the community" are good examples of why customers pay twice the price what it actually costs Comcast to provide the service. So while it's correct to say Comcast isn't turning a profit, it's also extremely misleading as to what's really going on.
The bottom line is that JT's statement earlier was true, she provided valid references, and you're just looking for a way out of admitting she had a good point and had proved her case. That appears to be your tactic to my statements as well regarding the issue of whether Comcast is a monopoly. |
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DonLibes
Premium,ExMod 2001
join:2003-01-19
| reply to gharney
said by gharney :
said by JTRockville :
As a telecommuter, I find residential broadband to be an essential tool.
if it is that essential, you would want something with SLA's.
Indeed, that's part of why her community passed Bill 28-02. |
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gharney
join:2002-01-04
Laurel, MD
| reply to DonLibes
said by DonLibes :
The bottom line is that JT's statement earlier was true,
which was?
quote:
she provided valid references,
which is what i asked for, yes.
quote:
and you're just looking for a way out of admitting she had a good point
that comcast makes money?
quote:
That appears to be your tactic to my statements as well regarding the issue of whether Comcast is a monopoly.
they arent.
[text was edited by author 2003-04-01 12:33:53] |
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degauss1
join:2001-07-02
Hillsboro, OR
·ViaTalk
·Verizon FIOS
 ·Comcast
·Axvoice
|
Bottom line is that Comcast are making business decisions to eliminate the debt they incurred by the purchase of ATTBI. While I may not like the small increases, the practice of charging more to non-CATV-subscribers is a predatory practice. Now then, if they were to charge the same rate for subscribers and offer a multi-service discount backing out the extra cash as a line item, then the discount philosophy would apply. They don't present it that way...so they open themselves to this kind of criticism. |
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halfband
Premium
join:2002-06-01
Huntsville, AL
| said by degauss1 :
Now then, if they were to charge the same rate for subscribers and offer a multi-service discount backing out the extra cash as a line item, then the discount philosophy would apply. They don't present it that way...so they open themselves to this kind of criticism.
Is this just another case of bad marketing by comcast. They are not doing anything different than Bellsouth, or Burger King, but the action has been deemed a “predatory practice.”
JT,
While those 50% gross profit margins look impressive it is the bottom line, net margin, that counts to investors (sorry  ) until Comcast can get the debt load down.
[ For those who have not had basic economics, if I own a candy store and get my snickers bars for 55 cents and sell them for a dollar, I have a 45 cent gross margin. But if rent, utilities, taxes and transportation eat up 44 cents for each candy bar my net is only 1 cent.] If the bottom line margins in cable broadband were really that good, companies would be tripping all over each other trying to provide service.
If I follow your argument correctly (and I may not):
Since Comcast charges the same prices in both monopoly position and competitive position areas, are you assuming that Comcast is sacrificing some business in the competitive areas hoping that they will make even more in the sole provider areas?
It would be interesting to know how the higher internet only rate affects the subscriber levels in competitive areas where users can switch to DSL/satellite.
--
Registered Bandwidth Offender #40812 |
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JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD
clubs:
·LINGO
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·surpasshosting
·Verizon FIOS
| said by halfband :
JT,
While those 50% gross profit margins look impressive it is the bottom line, net margin, that counts to investors (sorry ) until Comcast can get the debt load down.
True enough. But the suggestion that Comcast should discontinue broadband service in non-competitive areas would hurt their financials, no matter which measurement you look at: gross profit margin, net profit margin, free cash flow, and probably many others. I skipped basic economics, so toss a clue if I'm off-base here. said by halfband :
Since Comcast charges the same prices in both monopoly position and competitive position areas, are you assuming that Comcast is sacrificing some business in the competitive areas hoping that they will make even more in the sole provider areas?
It's been alleged, around these parts anyway, that Comcast gives out "specially priced offers" only in competitive areas. So yes, I do believe their intention is to make even more $$$ where they have no competition. |
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degauss1
join:2001-07-02
Hillsboro, OR
·ViaTalk
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast
·Axvoice
| reply to halfband
said by halfband :
said by degauss1 :
Now then, if they were to charge the same rate for subscribers and offer a multi-service discount backing out the extra cash as a line item, then the discount philosophy would apply. They don't present it that way...so they open themselves to this kind of criticism.
Is this just another case of bad marketing by comcast. They are not doing anything different than Bellsouth, or Burger King, but the action has been deemed a “predatory practice.”
...
If I follow your argument correctly (and I may not):
I don't think you get the point completely. Margins aside, using your candy store analogy. If I own a candy store and buy the candy at $.45 and sell it to people that go to my wife as their dentist for $1.00 but sell it to the people that go to some other dentist for $1.50 that's predatory pricing. The fact is, it costs me the same for the candy bar and other expenses no matter where you go for dental work. Comcast has f'd up on the marketing side by 'penalizing' people that don't use Comcast CATV and that IS predatory. It costs Comcast the same to provide internet whether you take the CATV services or not. If it didn't, why don't they charge more for the Digital Phone services if you don't buy CATV? The key difference here is that by charging a higher price for internet only than one would pay for internet AND basic CATV reduces the likely-hood that someone is going to go for satellite TV bacause they pay more for the ISP services and the price advantage for satellite at that point is minimized. If you know economics, you should also know predatory business practices too. It should be clear that the way they present it to the market leave this interpretation to occur. Now lets say that they charged everyone $58 up front for internet and gave a multi service discount to lower the internet price to the rate most pay now, the interpretation would be that as a valued customer, you get a discount and your Burger King value meal analogy would apply. Granted, it's all semantics but that is the point here... |
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MikeDz3$
join:2003-03-15
Weirton, WV
| the fact is comcast isn't going to change anything. So basically all this fuss is basically for not. The point is comcast is in the game to make money. If you want broadband bad enough you will pay the $60/month. If you didn't like comcast's prices you should have wrote the fcc,doj and your senators NOT TO APPROVE THE MERGER WITH ATT BROADBAND. Now it's too late. Look at microsoft. They got off free basically. Microsoft is bigger than comcast and basically owns the operating system market yet our courts decided they are NOT a monopoly. The same will happen with comcast. If Microsoft isn't a monopoly then comcast surely isn't. So basically either pay up or leave. |
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MikeDz3$
join:2003-03-15
Weirton, WV
| before i get slammed for my post I want to make clear that I do not agree with microsoft's or comcast's pricing strategies but the fact remains we are stuck with these two companies. The courts have ruled in microsoft's favor and will almost surely rule in comcast's favor as well. I urge everyone to do as i did and email every cable company you can to see if they are interested in coming to your city. So far out of cox,time warner,wide open west,and rcn only wide open west replied saying:
"Thank you for your note and the interest in our services. We are continually monitoring the areas we serve and evaluating new oppportunities. I'm not aware of any current plans to build out in your area, however I will be sure to pass this along to the appropriate individuals that make those decisions for future consideration.
Thanks again for your email" |
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