 AJuanAnon JuanPremium
join:2002-08-14
Miami, FL | reply to PhoneBoy
Re: New Reg fee confirmed Sounds like that FREE fax line isn't so free anymore?
I wonder if you can turn off/refuse that free fax line if you don't want it anymore?
I wish they had just continued to roll everything together and announce the reductions/increases as such rather than introducing a questionable separate fee. My $0.02
BTW - I appreciate the reductions as well. Would much prefer more reliable service for the same price though. 
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Unofficial Vonage FAQs
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| reply to PhoneBoy
I thought I said that just a few post up?
ym |
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 PhoneBoyI Am
join:2002-01-02
Gig Harbor, WA | I didn't see you say that, but it's not important anyway.
It does make Voiceglo look a little more attractive now, since they're current business prices are now almost identical to Vonage. Yes, I actually use the extra fax line, though mostly for incoming faxes. Outgoing faxes are rare.
-- PhoneBoy
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The views expressed herein are not necessarily those of anyone else, including the poster. |
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| Your right, I put it in another thread. Sorry.
ym |
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 CamPremium
join:2003-01-25
Luther, OK
| reply to PhoneBoy
said by PhoneBoy:
It does make Voiceglo look a little more attractive now, since they're current business prices are now almost identical to Vonage. Yes, I actually use the extra fax line, though mostly for incoming faxes. Outgoing faxes are rare.
I've thought VoiceGlo looked interesting (if not attractive) since I first read through their web site. I'm not sure I have heard anyone who is actually using their service regularly, though.
[text was edited by author 2003-09-21 08:50:06] |
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 usa2kBlessedPremium,MVM
join:2003-01-26
Canton, MI
kudos:3
 ·VOIPo
 ·WOW Internet and..
| reply to usa2k
said by usa2k:
I can't complain.
[Two lines plus 1-866] $1.50 + $1.50 + $1.50 -$5.00 -$5.00 = -$5.50
[Two Regional lines plus 1-866] $1.50 + $1.50 + $1.50 -$1.00 -$1.00 = $2.50 more (my bad)
Unlimited Residential users have a better deal.
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jim
Voip on Vonage|iCH|FWD FWD# 24942
USA2K -- no Affiliate Links or Cookies |
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| reply to AJuan
I called and asked them about the "Free" fax line on my business account. It is, as you would expect, no longer free -- even though their website still advertises it as such.
There is no way, from the dashboard, to disable the FAX line. You have to call them up to do it.
Side note -- I think this recovery fee is complete BS. Simply put -- since Vonage is the 'end user' of each of the lines they get from their ILECs/CLECs they have been paying these fees all along. It could be said we have been paying them all along as part of our total monthly fee. (Exceptions to state sales tax in NJ -- don't know about the exise tax though).
I resent the fact that Vonage believes that we as a whole are naive enough to believe that we are getting a discount (or not in the case of business customers) but are now forced to pay the taxes that Vonage has been paying all along.
I would expect this from my politician, not Vonage. |
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gloint
join:2003-07-22
Satellite Beach, FL | reply to youngmoore
I have disputed the charge and asked for Arbitration via Vonage's TOS. Some of the charges aka TAXES that ILECS and CLECS charge you are valid but there are MANY that you can dispute and not have to pay them. There are people that make BIG money analyzing your phone bill and get paid from fees they recover for you. Just because they say its a tax doesn't mean its a tax you have to pay. Phone companies have been notorious on passing on fees to the consumer when actually these are fees that the phone company must pay themselves as part of doing business. I would recommend everyone disputing the charges and asking for Arbitration and ask Vonage to provide you the Federal or State statue that requires you to pay this new fee. Every tax has a WRITTEN statue that explains why this fee exists. If they cannot provide the documentation to you then its a non existing statue that you do not need to pay. I have done this many a time and won most of the time so I am speaking from experience. God you cant imagine the type of fees they try to tack onto a T-1 line that just don't exist. |
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| I wonder if some people will consider this a cram on the bill?
Cramming is the addition of bogus fees on a phone bill, phone companies(truthfully regulated) get in trouble for this all the time.
I don't know that adding a "regulatory" fee of any kind by an unregulated company is legal.
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| reply to youngmoore
gloint / clecrupt
Those are both interesting ideas... gloint - let us know what happens. |
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 oliphant5Got Identity?Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | reply to youngmoore
This just is a price hike. There are no regulatory fees that need to be reclaimed. What's next, parking lot striping fee. Corporate income tax recovery fee? So as Verizon is still a ripoff so I can't cancel all together, I've just cancelled my fax line and virtual numbers.
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-- Munis Killed the Telco Star -- Powered by Barry McKockenner Racing in association with Jack Mikkokov Motorsports |
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usa2kBlessedPremium,MVM
join:2003-01-26
Canton, MI
kudos:3 Reviews:
·VOIPo
·WOW Internet and..
| said by oliphant5:
...I've just cancelled my fax line and virtual numbers.
Is there a disconnect fee for cancelling the FAX line? I did not see a charge when I cancelled mine, but I had done it with the intent of transitioning to a 2nd Regional line on a 2nd ATA.
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jim
Voip on Vonage|iCH|FWD FWD# 24942
USA2K -- no Affiliate Links or Cookies |
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oliphant5Got Identity?Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | I just did it but I haven't seen any charges for canceling my fax line or my virtual numbers. |
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| reply to usa2k
I canceled my 'free' fax line on my business account. Pissed will not describe my attitude if I find out I was charged to disconnect something 'free'. YMMV |
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| reply to youngmoore
Yeah i feel for you Vonage poor saps. Vonage is hosing you. I am now glad I picked Packet8 for my service instead of Vonage. |
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usa2kBlessedPremium,MVM
join:2003-01-26
Canton, MI
kudos:3 Reviews:
·VOIPo
·WOW Internet and..
| reply to youngmoore
(I don't belive a fee for canceled FAX exists.)
Never been treated better!
Past experiences, ATT Wireless, Cingular, SBC Ameritech, AT&T Long Distance all hit a nerve. I could have prepaid a couple years of Vonage for what they cost me!
Only small bumps, and professionalism from Vonage.
Never had P8 -- people tend to like what they have unless something really goes wrong!
The forum shows the extremes -- I'm a happy Vonage customer! And they are always reasonable with reasonable situations
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jim
Voip on Vonage|iCH|FWD FWD# 24942
USA2K -- no Affiliate Links or Cookies |
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| reply to youngmoore
More info about new fee Thank you for taking an interest in Vonage. We appreciate this opportunity to respond to your concerns regarding the Regulatory Recovery Fee. As of September 20, we now charge a $1.50 per line fee separately from your Vonage service charges.
We calculate this fee based on a general apportionment basis. This means that Vonage collects $1.50 per line for every phone number assignment it has on its network. After careful analysis of Vonage fee expenses, this method was derived to be the most fair and least burdensome to our entire customer base. This method also fairly apportions fees where phone numbers originate in disparate geographic areas, as is frequently the case with our popular area code mobility and Virtual Phone NumberSM options.
Vonage has achieved an unprecedented level of success in delivering quality VOIP telephony to its customers, and we feel very fortunate to be leading this industry. With that leadership however, also comes the careful scrutiny of regulatory agencies who have the responsibility to protect our citizens and public communications in general. Technology advances have made our service possible only recently. We wish to give clarity to lawmakers around the nation, as this is uncharted territory that we all must navigate together. Our goal in separating the fee from the general monthly bill is to provide regulatory bodies and our customers transparency in how you and Vonage already contribute to our nation's public infrastructure.
Vonage has always paid into various regulatory funds on your behalf, so even though this manner of breaking the fee out from your Vonage bill is new, the obligations paid by Vonage are not.
Vonage relies upon telecommunications carrier partners to transmit calls across the traditional telephone networks.
Vonage must pay accordingly for the resources we use and the requisite regulatory fees associated with those services purchased from partners. As an end-user of telecommunications resources, we pay into Universal Service Fund charges as well as other state and federal telecommunication programs (like local number portability) on your behalf. 100% of the fees we collect go these costs.
Nothing is left behind for administrative costs, legal fees or any other Vonage purpose.
Our goal is to keep costs as low as possible for our customers. For this reason, we timed the RRF together with a Rate Reduction to minimize the impact of the fees to our customers. In the end, we're confident that we can work with regulatory bodies on your behalf to arrive at solutions for our young industry that are fair and balanced for everyone.
We hope that this explanation was helpful in understanding our new pricing format. Thank you for your continued loyalty and business.
Sincerely,
Vonage Customer Care
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| I called Vonage about their new rate increases. quote:
Vonage has always paid into various regulatory funds on your behalf, so even though this manner of breaking the fee out from your Vonage bill is new, the obligations paid by Vonage are not.
In other words, it has always been a "cost of business" for Vonage, and having us directly pay the fee (with no drop in the base rate to offset it) is just a price increase!
It's bad enough that they are raising their rates, when I have only had their service for a few months. And it bugs me even more that I really would have had a small "rate reduction" if I were on their "residential plan", but that isn't an option because I "telecommute" some (a violation of their residential TOS). But to "spin" it as a "price decrease" is the height of "sleezy" IMHO!
quote:
Our goal is to keep costs as low as possible for our customers. For this reason, we timed the RRF together with a Rate Reduction to minimize the impact of the fees to our customers.
But Vonage seems to have forgotten that they did not lower rates for any "business" customers. As a result, they are just trying to spin a rate increase as something that is good for us?!?
I called up Vonage Sunday, as soon as I first heard about this new policy. At first they tried to tell me that rates weren't going up, they were going down. It was only after I explicitly asked if the "business plans" were having any "rate reductions" (no), and if they had to pay this new "fee" (yes), that they even admitted that I would have to pay more. She even told me that Vonage doesn't get that money, it goes "directly to the government" to fund things like public libraries. While I admit that it may fund "good things", that still doesn't change the matter that this is really a "cost of business" for Vonage, not something that I should be happy about paying directly.
I also verified that it is still Vonage policy to leave the ATA "locked" even after you have dropped service and paid their "disconnect fee". Yep, that was true too.
I expressed my displeasure at them "changing things for the worse" on two separate occasions in the few months I have had their service (both the ATA locking, and Vonage directly charging us their fees have happened since I signed up). I asked them, since they have already changed things (for the worse) multiple times in the few months I have had the service, why should I believe that rates won't go up again next month (since they have a history of "changing the rules" on their customers)? You know what their response was? I can be assured that rates won't go up, because Vonage isn't regulated by the FCC, and therefore doesn't have to pay the expensive licensing fees.
I kid you not, that was the reason the Vonage rep gave me over the phone! As if the fact that they are not regulated was somehow going to assure me that they won't jerk their customer base around?!?
She also said that she would be opening a ticket, to escalate this to a supervisor, who would contact me "right away". To be fair to Vonage, I wanted to hear what that supervisor actually had to say before posting my experiences (good and bad) to this list. But I decided to go ahead and post, because obviously "right away" means wait several days, if they contact you at all. I have still not received either an email or a phone call from Vonage on this matter (and my ticket was supposedly opened last Sunday)....
I have only had Vonage for a few months, but I signed up with them thinking that (while there were "startup glitches") they were trying to treat their customers right. I also "cut them slack" when I was experiencing service problems, as I realized that they were working to resolve them (and eventually succeeded at fixing some of my issues). However, it really "gets my goat" that they have the balls to send an email out announcing a "rate reduction", when they are really "raising rates"! I also think that this "rule change of the month" B.S., is just not the way to make your customers think they can depend upon you (it reminds me more of the abuses of the ILEC industry, than what I thought I was signing on for)....
While I will "wait it out" a little longer, I will be paying close attention to how Vonage proceeds (as well as examine what alternatives I have to their service). Who knows, Vonage has been known to listen to this forum, and maybe they will take the hint that we don't like deceptive "spin doctoring" about things that make their service less desirable then when we first signed up. Such "spin" reminds me of the worst excesses of what we all dislike about the ILECs. Yes, I know that Vonage is also adding extra features, and I like that. But (as a customer) that is easily overshadowed by their policy to also quietly "take away" whenever they feel like it (often with little to no notice). As a customer, this means that I no longer feel I can count on Vonage to provide consistent service at a consistent price. |
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| I think many here are getting their knickers in a twist over what is really quite minor. For those who were paying $39.99 they will now pay $34.99, plus the $1.50 fee, and thus will pay $3.50 less than before. For those who were paying $25.99 the new rate is $24.99, plus the $1.50. They will then be paying $0.50 more than before.
I should think those on the unlimited plan should be delighted to pay $3.50 less per month and that those on the 500 minute plan might well be frown slightly at paying $0.50 more.
Is this all worth a humongous thread? I think not.
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oliphant5Got Identity?Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | You think this is going to be the last fee Vonage levies? I think not. |
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