[X] Panther + GeForce users -- results?

Author	All Replies
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	[X] Panther + GeForce users -- results? I just finished installing Panther on my Sawtooth G4. Things looked great up until I tried to drag a window. The screen was not refreshing properly and there were all sorts of artifacts on the screen. I also had trouble dragging scroll bars, and iChat didn't redraw properly when chat windows scrolled automatically. To resolve the problem temporarily, I have put back in the Rage 128 Pro agp card that came installed in this machine. Everything works fine, I'm just not getting the same video performance. I know this problem has been reported on other sites as some sort of bug with GeForce cards and Panther, but I was curious to see who else was using Panther and a GeForce card, and whether or not you were having video problems. This information might be helpful to isolate exactly what the problem is. So if you fit into that category, supply this information: 1) Your machine base model 2) Your OS and build number 3) Which model GeForce video card you have, including amount of vram 4) What monitor(s) are connected to the card, and how 5) What video mode (resolution and colors) 6) Whether or not you have had problems with it in Panther e.g. 1) PowerMac G4 AGP (Sawtooth) 2) Mac OS X 10.3 (7B85) 3) GeForce4 MX (32 megs vram) 4) 1 Envision 19" CRT, connected via DVI-VGA adapter to the DVI port of the GeForce 5) 1024x768 @ 32 bits (Millions) 6) Have been seeing strange video problems in Panther. Also, I'm curious - for those who have been using developer builds of Panther, and had tested it on GeForce cards - has this problem always existed, or did it just crop up in the latest build? -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 17:23:27 ·
mkcompu Premium join:2001-02-23 Wyckoff, NJ	Power mac g4 gigabit ethernet, vga crt, 7b49, geforce 4 mx 64 mb, 1027*768, 85hz, mills of colors, works well for me. May be it likes gigE better. DB had issues with his geforce 2 and sawtooth in panther.
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 18:24:14 ·
rjackson Premium,Mod join:2002-04-02 Ringgold, GA kudos:1 Host: SMC Networks VOIP Tech Chat ViaTalk Teleblend Vonage	reply to prwood 1) Power Mac G4 1.0GHz "MDD" (specs) 2) Mac OS 10.3 7B85 3) GeForce 4 MX 64MB vram 4) Sylvania F70 CRT monitor with VGA->DVI adapter 5) 1280x1024, 60Hz, Millions 6) No problems with Panther. I've also used Panther 7A202 and 7B44 on this machine, no problems with either one. I did upgrade installs with the previous builds and a clean install with 7B85.
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 18:45:11 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	reply to prwood So two people with a 64 meg card are having no problems with Panther, and at least one person (me) with a 32 meg card is having a problem with Panther, and perhaps one more if Livebeat56 's GeForce2 is a 32 meg card as well. "Obvious" conclusion: 64 meg good, 32 meg bad... time to "Bug" Apple about it. More survey data is welcome.... -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 19:07:56 ·
Livebeat56 join:2000-11-19 Berkeley, CA	reply to prwood Peter, My G4/400, Geforce2 MX has the same redraw problems....but Rage Pro is OK. I haven't been keeping up with the latest info about all this, but a couple days ago I read these: One thread from MacFixit. One thread from a MacNN forum. User-installed nVidias, not Apple supplied OEM nVidias, definitely seem to be causing trouble with Panther and Sawtooth mobos. I should check out the latest Apple discussions. _ [text was edited by author 2003-10-26 20:02:06]
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 19:59:17 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	said by Livebeat56: Peter, My G4/400, Geforce2 MX has the same redraw problems....but Rage Pro is OK. I haven't been keeping up with the latest info about all this, but a couple days ago I read these: One thread from MacFixit. One thread from a MacNN forum. User-installed nVidias, not Apple supplied OEM nVidias, definitely seem to be causing trouble with Panther and Sawtooth mobos. I should check out the latest Apple discussions. _ [text was edited by author 2003-10-26 20:02:06] Thanks for the links. I read through the threads, and it seems like I'm having a slightly different problem than those folks. My computer boots up just fine, and the display doesn't go black or anything - it's just that there are weird artifacts on the screen when I drag or scroll. Also, the impression I got from OWC was that the card I bought (specs here) was an Apple OEM card... so you'd think it would have a better chance of working. I submitted a full bug report at »bugreport.apple.com/ - I've had good luck getting responses through that channel in the past, we'll see if they acknowledge the bug. -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 20:36:47 ·
Livebeat56 join:2000-11-19 Berkeley, CA	said by prwood: Also, the impression I got from OWC was that the card I bought (specs here) was an Apple OEM card... so you'd think it would have a better chance of working. Hmmm...I wonder, maybe the fact about having a gigabit mobo (like mkcompu mentioned) has an influence, even though that certain video card situation is just suppose to affect the use of an ADC monitor connection. _
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-26 21:06:52 ·
Fronkman An Apple a day keeps the doctor away Premium join:2003-06-23 Saint Louis, MO	reply to prwood maybe you guys using a user supplied gf2 might want to trying flashing the mac ROM on it. i know i had lots of artifacting, etc when i used my pc card in the cube, but flashing it with the mac ROM helped. i still had artifacting though, but if you go into the ROM and under-clock the card (by 33MHz) then all the problems are solved, except that i have no ADC.... hope that helps a little -- The G5 Cube. One day the wait will be over...In the mean time we have 10.3!
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 10:21:21 ·
Livebeat56 join:2000-11-19 Berkeley, CA	said by Fronkman: maybe you guys using a user supplied gf2 might want to trying flashing the mac ROM on it. i know i had lots of artifacting, etc when i used my pc card in the cube, but flashing it with the mac ROM helped. i still had artifacting though, but if you go into the ROM and under-clock the card (by 33MHz) then all the problems are solved, except that i have no ADC.... hope that helps a little That's an interesting suggestion, Fronkman. I wonder it your idea has cropped up in any of the other Mac forums. If I remember correctly, one needs a pc (which many Mac-users own or use at work) to do this flashing, correct? Still...I'm hoping some sort of correcting update will surface. _
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 12:12:13 ·
Fronkman An Apple a day keeps the doctor away Premium join:2003-06-23 Saint Louis, MO	said by Livebeat56: If I remember correctly, one needs a pc (which many Mac-users own or use at work) to do this flashing, correct? _ yes you do need a intel box to get this done. as far as instructions go... »www.xlr8yourmac.com/Graphics/PC_···ube.html i realize these instructions refer to putting the card in a cube, but i see no reason why this would not work in other models as well. there also are instructions for hacking the bios to clock down the core and memory too. hope this helps ! -- The G5 Cube. One day the wait will be over...In the mean time we have 10.3!
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 13:43:44 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	said by Fronkman: said by Livebeat56: If I remember correctly, one needs a pc (which many Mac-users own or use at work) to do this flashing, correct? _ yes you do need a intel box to get this done. as far as instructions go... »www.xlr8yourmac.com/Graphics/PC_···ube.html i realize these instructions refer to putting the card in a cube, but i see no reason why this would not work in other models as well. there also are instructions for hacking the bios to clock down the core and memory too. hope this helps ! Sorry for this ignorant question... can I assume that to flash an AGP GeForce4 MX card, I'd need a PC with an AGP slot? The card won't work in a PCI slot, right? -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 14:03:31 ·
Fronkman An Apple a day keeps the doctor away Premium join:2003-06-23 Saint Louis, MO	said by prwood: Sorry for this ignorant question... can I assume that to flash an AGP GeForce4 MX card, I'd need a PC with an AGP slot? The card won't work in a PCI slot, right? wont even fit in a pci slot unless you force it... and you should never force your connector into a slot if it wont fit... -- The G5 Cube. One day the wait will be over...In the mean time we have 10.3!
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 14:10:00 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	said by Fronkman: said by prwood: Sorry for this ignorant question... can I assume that to flash an AGP GeForce4 MX card, I'd need a PC with an AGP slot? The card won't work in a PCI slot, right? wont even fit in a pci slot unless you force it... and you should never force your connector into a slot if it wont fit... Ok, good to know. I never really paid attention to the difference in the slots... unfortunately I don't have an AGP-equipped PC to use for flashing the card, but I might be able to find one... -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 14:17:25 ·
Fronkman An Apple a day keeps the doctor away Premium join:2003-06-23 Saint Louis, MO	reply to prwood place i got my ROM/tons of info from... »www.cybercoment.com/macgeforce.htm good luck with it all! -- The G5 Cube. One day the wait will be over...In the mean time we have 10.3!
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 14:35:45 ·

prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	reply to prwood Just an update. I've been fishing around in other forums (Macfixit and Apple discussions). The problem seems to be, for the most part, limited to folks using a Sawtooth G4 with a GeForce card. Also, I submitted a bug report to devbugs@apple.com, and have received a few emails back... one requesting an Apple System Profiler report, and another acknowledging receipt of said report. Not a whole lot else I can do at this point. -- homepage\|geeky gallery\|home server
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-27 20:02:31 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	reply to prwood I just got a response from OWC tech support, from whom I purchased the conflicting GeForce card: said by OWC Tech: The GeForce4MX nVidia card we sell seems to be incompatible with systems lacking the 28v power connection on the logic board (Sawtooth machines). There may be more machines affected, but it's too soon to tell with 100% confidence. Hopefully that Apple fixes this issue in a future 10.3.x release. There is a good possibility that this will prove to be a solution. I have known for a while that the Sawtooth's logic board did not fully support the GeForce4's ADC connection (which is basically what the 28v power connection is). In other words, you can't hook and ADC monitor up to a GeForce4 when it's plugged into a Sawtooth, since the card is not drawing that additional power. But that should be the only limitation of the card. You can still use it normally by connecting to the DVI port, or by using some type of ADC video extractor to connect to the ADC port with a non-ADC monitor. I'm still holding out some hope that Apple can resolve this issue. -- homepage\|geeky gallery
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-30 13:35:42 ·
prwood Premium join:2001-09-04 Danvers, MA	reply to prwood OWC has posted a temporary workaround for the issue - basically involves copying the GeForce driver from a 10.2.x system, and replacing the one in 10.3. It supposedly makes the problems go away, but disables Quartz Extreme. For me it's not worth it for now, since I was able to swap back in an older video card, but if you have no alternative but to use your GeForce card, you can try it. This link has info on OWC's diagnosis and research on the problem, as well as a link to download the older GeForce driver: »eshop.macsales.com/Reviews/Frame···103.html -- homepage\|geeky gallery
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-30 19:42:11 ·
mkcompu Premium join:2001-02-23 Wyckoff, NJ	reply to prwood As they say in España, ¡Dios Mio! I guess thats what happens when you overextend the G4's power [hey im biased gigE power!!! ] But this is why apple is all no upgrade cards are supported - it would be hard for them to test it all. I wouldnt be surprised if it was somewhat intentional... The Original King of the Beige G3 The Air-Coolin', HD Spinnin' CD Burnin' G3 0wnz. Send Me Your Useless Mac Parts! The "Noise Killer" of the ATM Forum... [text was edited by author 2003-10-30 20:24:25]
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-30 20:15:58 ·
rjackson Premium,Mod join:2002-04-02 Ringgold, GA kudos:1 Host: SMC Networks VOIP Tech Chat ViaTalk Teleblend Vonage	said by mkcompu: Send Me Your Useless Mac Parts! The "Noise Killer" of the ATM Forum... You have to get through Thinkdiff and Wiz first...
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-30 22:44:11 ·
sporkme drop the crantini and move it, sister Premium,MVM join:2000-07-01 Morristown, NJ Reviews: ·Optimum Online	said by rjackson: said by mkcompu: Send Me Your Useless Mac Parts! The "Noise Killer" of the ATM Forum... You have to get through Thinkdiff and Wiz first... Yeah, my dream of one day owning an LCII is fading fast. -- just a minute
	to forum · permalink · 2003-10-31 00:01:13 ·

OS and Software > All Things Macintosh > [X] Panther + GeForce users -- results?