J0k3r
join:2002-03-15
Lebanon, PA | reply to j23s3afj
Comcast APU Customer Protocol!! Hello,
I have just fell victim to Comcast's Unlimited bandwidth limits! I just got my pretty little letter in the mail which pretty much tells me I use too much internet and if I fail to bring it down to an acceptable level my service will be terminated. The funniest part about is, no where on the letter does it indicate what an acceptable level is. After a few hours of dealing with them on the phone (All sorts of departments) I found a tech who was willing to share some information with me. I will keep my source hidden, but will tell you this is what I got from a person I spoke with.
I hope this information helps people get some answer to this problem. I will do my best to post any information I get to help shed some light onto this subject.
Not to be used in customer interaction:
BACKGROUND:
Comcast High-Speed Internet continues to rank as customers’ first choice when choosing a broadband Internet provider. In addition to the service’s high levels of availability and speed, Comcast High-Speed Internet is highly reliable and provides a superior experience due in large part to the manner in which Comcast builds and manages its Internet network.
Upon subscribing to Comcast High-Speed Internet, customers agree to use the service within the terms and conditions of the Subscriber Agreement and Acceptable Use Policy (AUP). The Subscriber Agreement and AUP define Comcast High-Speed Internet as a residential service and prohibit users from engaging in, among other things, activities that exceed current bandwidth, data storage or other limitations established by Comcast. Specific examples of activities that may contribute to excessive bandwidth use include running a server on the network or using Comcast High-Speed Internet for commercial activities.
To continue providing a superior high-speed Internet experience for all of our customers and to maintain the integrity of our network, Comcast will continue its active enforcement of the AUP including focusing on curbing excessive bandwidth consumption. This initiative will most likely impact less than 1 percent of our customers who consume nearly 20 percent of our entire bandwidth in any given month.
At this time, Comcast has no plans to implement a “bandwidth cap” or limit bandwidth consumption of Comcast High-Speed Internet. Comcast is only enforcing the provisions of the AUP that our customers have already agreed to upon subscribing to Comcast High-Speed Internet.
MEDIA INQUIRIES:
As always, please direct any media inquiries (i.e., calls from news reporters) to Sarah Eder, Director of Public Relations for Comcast Online, at . Please note that Sarah’s name and number should never be given to customers.
The following Comcast Positioning Statement may be used as stated:
POSITIONING STATEMENT:
To continue providing a superior high-speed Internet experience and to maintain the level of quality and reliability that our customers expect, Comcast will intensify its enforcement of its AUP including the excessive bandwidth use limitation provided for in the AUP. Enforcing our policies is part of running a well-managed network.
Upon subscribing to Comcast High-Speed Internet, customers agree to use the service within the terms and conditions of the service. Comcast High-Speed Internet was created for residential use and, as a result, the company prohibits users from engaging in activities for commercial purposes or that may degrade our service or network.
Comcast offers a variety of Internet services for customers ranging from entry-level residential services through commercial services. Customers who use significant amounts of bandwidth may be best served by commercial services such as our Comcast Commuter service or another Comcast commercial-grade service. Customer care reps can match service plans that are best for an individual customers needs.
The following Q&A have been approved for customer interaction
Q & A:
Q: Why is Comcast enforcing the bandwidth limitation provision of its Comcast High-Speed Internet Acceptable Use Policy? Why now?
A: To continue providing a superior high-speed Internet experience for our customers and to maintain the integrity of our network, Comcast will intensify its enforcement of its AUP and dedicate more time to curbing excessive bandwidth use.
The AUP states that Comcast High-Speed Internet is a service designed for residential use. The vast majority of customers use the service as it was intended. Based on aggregate network data, some users are using an excessive amount of bandwidth that doesn’t correlate with normal residential usage characteristics. In many cases, these users would be better served by subscribing to a commercial online service such as Comcast Commuter or another Comcast commercial-grade service.
[Only if pressed on: Why now?] In the past years, Comcast has been focused primarily on effecting smooth customer transitions from Excite@Home to the Comcast High-Speed Internet network as well as moving former AT&T Broadband Internet customers to Comcast. With these transitions behind us, we are able to dedicate additional resources and time to enforcing our policies such as excessive bandwidth use.
Q: Where is the provision about excessive bandwidth use in the Acceptable Use Policy? What does it read?
A: Upon subscribing to Comcast High-Speed Internet, customers agree to use the service within the terms and conditions of the Subscriber Agreement and Acceptable Use Policy. The Subscriber Agreement and AUP define Comcast High-Speed Internet as a residential service and prohibit users from engaging in activities that exceed current bandwidth, data storage or other limitations. Specific examples of activities that may contribute to excessive bandwidth use include running a server on the network or using Comcast High-Speed Internet for commercial activities.
The Comcast customer Acceptable Use Policy may be found at by clicking the Terms of Service link at the bottom of the start page at www.comcast.net or by visiting »www.comcast.net/terms/use.jsp directly.
The excessive use provision reads:
Network, Bandwidth, Data Storage and Other Limitations
You must comply with all current bandwidth, data storage, and other limitations on the Service established by Comcast and its suppliers. In addition, you may only access and use the Service with a dynamic Internet Protocol ("IP") address that adheres to the dynamic host configuration protocol ("DHCP"). You may not access or use the Service with a static IP address or using any protocol other than DHCP unless you are subject to a Service plan that expressly permits otherwise.
You must ensure that your activity (including, but not limited to, use made by you or others of any Personal Web Features) does not improperly restrict, inhibit, or degrade any other user's use of the Service, nor represent (in the sole judgment of Comcast) an unusually large burden on the network. In addition, you must ensure that your activities do not improperly restrict, inhibit, disrupt, degrade or impede Comcast's ability to deliver the Service and monitor the Service, backbone, network nodes, and/or other network Services.
Q: What is the excessive bandwidth use threshold?
A: There is no predetermined bandwidth usage threshold. It is important to note that customers who are being contacted show bandwidth usage that skews quite disproportionately high as compared to overall average bandwidth use.
Q: About how much bandwidth are these “excessive” users consuming?
A: There is no predetermined bandwidth threshold. However, the amount of bandwidth that an excessive user may consume may be analogous to downloading 90 movies or 4,500 movie trailers in a single month.
Q: Comcast has previously discussed how customer usage breaks down on the network. What are the statistics?
A: Overall usage breaks down as follows:
· About 1 percent of users consume about 18 percent of the network’s bandwidth.
· About 5 percent of users consume about 50 percent of the network’s bandwidth.
· The remaining 94 percent of users consume about 32 percent of the network’s bandwidth.
Q: About how many customers will be affected by the enforcement of the policy? Is Comcast pursuing the top one percent of users?
A: A very small group of customers will be affected by the enforcement of the policy. This initiative will most likely impact less than 1 percent of our customers who consume nearly 20 percent of our entire bandwidth in any given month.
Q: Will Comcast provide users with a tool so that they can meter how much bandwidth they are using?
A: Comcast is considering the development of a bandwidth usage meter. Customer feedback suggests that customers like to know how much traffic is flowing to and from their computers.
Q: Is Comcast concerned that the enforcement of the AUP will alienate some of its best customers?
A: It is important to note that many of our customers have told us that they support Comcast’s enforcement of its policies to ensure that excessive bandwidth use by some customers doesn’t interfere with the quality of their service.
Q: In what kind of activities are these customers engaging?
A: Comcast doesn’t monitor its customers’ online activities as a general matter. However, Comcast does monitor its network and examines aggregate network data. Based on this information, we know that some users are using an excessive amount of bandwidth that doesn’t correlate with normal residential usage characteristics. Users engaged in activities that consume excessive amounts of bandwidth maybe better served by subscribing to one of Comcast’s commercial Internet services.
Q: What is Comcast’s privacy policy?
A: Comcast holds customer privacy in the highest regard. We believe that consumer education and communication about privacy issues is the first step in establishing trust with the Internet community. To that end, Comcast is a member of TRUSTe, a leading privacy certification and seal program on the Internet. Comcast’s privacy policy may be found through its customer home page at www.comcast.net.
Q: At some point will Comcast create “byte caps” for all customers?
A: At this time, Comcast has no plans to implement a bandwidth cap or limit bandwidth consumption of Comcast High-Speed Internet. Comcast is only enforcing the provisions of the AUP that our customers have already agreed to upon subscribing to Comcast High-Speed Internet.
Q: How will Comcast notify customers that they’ve breached the AUP?
A: Customers who breach any part of Comcast’s AUP are notified via U.S. Mail. If needed, they are contacted via telephone and/or email as well.
Q: Is this a backdoor means of curbing online piracy?
A: Comcast is simply enforcing its Acceptable Use Policy as a means of preserving network integrity.
Q: Instead of enforcing the excessive bandwidth use provision of the Acceptable Use Policy, why wouldn’t Comcast just charge these customers more?
A: These users are a very small fraction of our overall user base and are consuming an excessive amount of bandwidth. Designing a network to serve these customers would require capital investment beyond the normal scope of building and maintaining a residential Internet network. Charging these users more would not compensate for the overall company investment. Comcast High-Speed Internet is a residential service and is not suited for commercial service or other uses that may place an unusual burden on the network. Comcast has a variety of plans available for all types of users from entry-level residential users to commercial services.
Q: Have other cable companies or DSL providers implemented a similar excessive use policy?
A: Most Internet Service Providers have Acceptable Use Policies that outline excessive use of their services. You’ll have to contact other providers regarding their policies.
Q: Will the enforcement of the excessive bandwidth use policy be a competitive advantage for DSL providers?
A: The enforcement of our Acceptable Use Policy will affect very few users. We see the enforcement of our AUP to be a competitive advantage for Comcast. By curbing excessive use, we’ll be able to better manage the network to average usage characteristics thereby creating a better online experience for all of our customers. Further, most companies enforce their acceptable use policies.
ADDITIONAL TIPS:
Q: Does Comcast offer a Commercial Service that can accommodate our usage patterns?
A: Comcast Commercial Services offers a single Ethernet Interface that can be ordered in 1Mbps increments. This connection provides dedicated Internet access speeds ranging from 5Mbps up to 1Gbps. I will need to confirm a few pieces of information and a representative will contact you with information on availability and pricing of this Commercial service.
Create an email with the following customer information:
Customer Name
Service Address
Contact Phone Number
Send this Email to ccs-sales@cable.comcast.com
If the customer is interested you can direct to them to the Comcast Commercial Services website: »www.comcast-ccs.com
Q: I don’t use any file sharing programs or engage in any of the activities you described, how could I be in violation of the usage policy? Do you think my computer has been compromised?
A: We can certainly look into that for you. I am going to provide your information to our Abuse team for further investigation.
Open a Remedy ticket and assign the ticket to the Abuse Queue. Make sure to give the customer the Ticket Number and advise them that someone from the Abuse team will contact them within 3 business days.
If someone should call back for status on an existing ticket you should provide the Abuse phone number 856.317.7272.
~ END ~ |
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| reply to J0k3r
Re: Comcast APU Customer Protocol!! Interesting. Very interesting... |
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| Wonder when our other Comcast employee will come back and say that joker's post is a total fabrication.
That whole document shows the contempt that Comcast has for its customers.
Reminds me of the time American Airlines had a pilot's manual that said that Latin American passengers;
- like to call in bomb threats to delay the plane if they are late.
- are frequently intoxicated before and during the flight.
- are difficult in general.
A local TV station interviewed my mom (my parents own a few travel agencies) and her words were, "For American Airlines to even have that type of manual, shows a lack of tact and lack of concern for the public."
This seems to be the same road Comcast is going down. |
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | reply to J0k3r
"Q: Does Comcast offer a Commercial Service that can accommodate our usage patterns?
A: Comcast Commercial Services offers a single Ethernet Interface that can be ordered in 1Mbps increments. This connection provides dedicated Internet access speeds ranging from 5Mbps up to 1Gbps. I will need to confirm a few pieces of information and a representative will contact you with information on availability and pricing of this Commercial service."
Hmmm, I don't have that option around here in the NE. Only 3 bands to choose from:
512 Kbps / 256 Kbps
1.5 Mbps / 384 Kbps
3.0 Mbps / 512 Kbps
So even the script they use doesn't match with what they actually offer. Go figure! ;P |
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| This is what that section refers to: »www.comcast-ccs.com/frames.asp?s···services
My read of the implications is that one needs to go beyond Pro/Workplace. |
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | I asked about ALL the packages when my company first signed up as we were looking to not use T1/T3 lines and go straight cable. We ended using cable($189 Package) for web access for the local office only to cut down on the traffic to the Corporate office. I was directed to and verbally told and fax a hard copy the prices I posted previously. See them here:
»www.comcast-ne.com/business/pricing.html |
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| Comcast Commercial Services might not serve your area. Did you specifically ask only for cable offerings? If so, it does not appear that Comcast Commercial Services offers cable internet service: »www.comcast-ccs.com/frames.asp?s···cription |
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J0k3r
join:2002-03-15
Lebanon, PA | Goto work.comcast.net and you will see the packages they told me would eliminate the "Usage limits" |
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 JTRockvilleData HoPremium,MVM
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD | Pro (the subscription you currently have) used to be displayed on that page, J0k3r  . |
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | reply to J D McDorce
That must not be available in my area as I asked on numerous occasions for all options offered from Comcast. I told them the bandwidth requirements my company was looking for and was given the 3 tier pricing and nothing more. They said they had no other offerings. We originally signed up 3 years ago when they first rolled it out here and went through it all again 6 months ago when we moved and nothing had changed.
Thank god we didn't go with the top tier like we were going to as we would have gotten the letter by the looks of the AUP. The amount of bandwidth with all our remote users and clients would have surely shown up on their invisible radar. LOL! |
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| reply to J0k3r
said by J0k3r:
Goto work.comcast.net and you will see the packages they told me would eliminate the "Usage limits"
The risk associated with that is that the AUP for those packages has nearly the same verbiage as was noted in the Q & A section here: »My experience with Comcast bandwidth suspension . said by »work.comcast.net/legal/aup.asp :
Network, Bandwidth, Data Storage and Other Limitations
You must comply with all current bandwidth, data storage, and other limitations on the Service established by Comcast and its suppliers.
You must ensure that your activity (including, but not limited to, use made by you or others of Web Site Hosting) does not improperly restrict, inhibit, or degrade any other user's use of the Service, nor represent (in the sole judgment of Comcast) an unusually large burden on the network. In addition, you must ensure that your activities do not improperly restrict, inhibit, disrupt, degrade or impede Comcast's ability to deliver the Service and monitor the Service, backbone, network nodes, and/or other network Services.
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | reply to J0k3r
Read the AUP for the service..... same as the home user... here it is:
»work.comcast.net/legal/aup.asp
Network, Bandwidth, Data Storage and Other Limitations
You must comply with all current bandwidth, data storage, and other limitations on the Service established by Comcast and its suppliers.
You must ensure that your activity (including, but not limited to, use made by you or others of Web Site Hosting) does not improperly restrict, inhibit, or degrade any other user's use of the Service, nor represent (in the sole judgment of Comcast) an unusually large burden on the network. In addition, you must ensure that your activities do not improperly restrict, inhibit, disrupt, degrade or impede Comcast's ability to deliver the Service and monitor the Service, backbone, network nodes, and/or other network Services.
So the invisible bandwidth usage limitation is present via the AUP for that service also. |
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| reply to J0k3r
said by J0k3r:
Q: About how much bandwidth are these “excessive” users consuming?
A: There is no predetermined bandwidth threshold. However, the amount of bandwidth that an excessive user may consume may be analogous to downloading 90 movies or 4,500 movie trailers in a single month.
Since this is at least the third time of heard the "90 movies" limit (but possibly the first time I've heard the "4,500 trailers" limit), perhaps we should read between the lines and try to deduce what the limit probably is? I just watched the broadband trailer for the Polar Express from the Quicktime site. It was 22 MB (checked my browser's cache). 22 * 4,500 = 99,000, or 99 GB. The trailer for House of Sand and Fog is 24 MB. 24 * 4,500 = 108,000 or 108 GB. This does suggest to me that if you stay under 100 GB a month you'll probably be all right.
Yes, I agree with everyone here that I'd rather know what the limit is rather than have to guess at it, but I believe Matisaro is correct in one important respect: if Comcast actually were to spell out what the limit is, they would probably have to give a much lower number than what the current "classified" number really is. The 30 - 40 GB seems pretty likely based on what other ISPs have implemented.
I think people should try to calm down, stay under 100 GB a month (way under shouldn't be difficult at all), and quit threatening legal action or negative press attention. I think that kind of knee-jerk hysterical reaction will cause more harm than good and will probably end up hurting those of us who have reason to be concerned about these limits in the first place. |
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | I was an ex-ATTBI user and was told by Comcast that I would receive the same service I was receiving from ATT which was unlimited 24/7 access to the internet with no caps. Now they say there is a cap but won't tell me what it is or when they even implemented it other then they started targeting users about 2 months ago. They never notified me via phone/email/postal mail that the service was changed. That, I have a problem with and have a right as a consumer to challenge it. |
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| reply to BaloksPuppet
quote:
I think people should try to calm down, stay under 100 GB a month (way under shouldn't be difficult at all), and quit threatening legal action or negative press attention. I think that kind of knee-jerk hysterical reaction will cause more harm than good and will probably end up hurting those of us who have reason to be concerned about these limits in the first place.
I totally agree here. I realize that it must be a little unpleasant to have the rug pulled out from underneath your feet, but it does look like this is the situation we are in.
Another problem with asking Comcast to set limits is that they probably wouldn't have the manpower to deal with the additional load on their abuse department from the increased number of people that would be calling them.
Setting limits would help those who are tech-savvy enough, or have all the computers in their house connected in some way to the internet where they are able to monitor exactly how much bandwidth they are using. How many routers (unless it's a real computer acting as a router) can do this? It still doesn't really help the tens of thousands of people who are going to fall under the restrictive hard cap who have a number of computers scattered throughout the house, or a wi-fi setup, or those who just don't have a clue about what a gigabyte is. You can't really implement hard caps if you don't have a place where customers can log in and check their usage levels - it's just not really doable. An ISP has lots of users; you can't expect them to cater only to the heavy users, the ones they have been losing money on for years.
So while it would make many of the people who post here lives' easier to have a specific cap stated (how many times have we said 100 gigs), there are many many users just a little lower down the pecking order whom a specific cap being stated won't do any good at all.
I agree that we should all make the experience pleasant for everyone, but most of what we are hearing here, besides myself and a few other people, is that Comcast should change their policies so that those who use hundreds of gigs a month can have an easier time with it. There are so many people who simply wouldn't know what to do with a number of gigabytes per month (unless Comcast had a counter).
And every month, every month... this. I am so sick of reading these posts, but I feel compelled to re-iterate that everybody should just chill out. See, people read these posts, then they make Slashdot stories, or other stories. It just really irritates me that the only "action" going on is to make it easier for the "bandwidth hogs", at whatever price it's going to cost to everyone else. It's simply not fair to those of us who try to be considerate in the way we use the internet. |
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1 edit | said by sago5:
I agree that we should all make the experience pleasant for everyone, but most of what we are hearing here, besides myself and a few other people, is that Comcast should change their policies so that those who use hundreds of gigs a month can have an easier time with it.
I prefer to look at it as being a request for Comcast to define their policies so users know ahead of time that if they use hundreds of gigs a month that they face termination of their service. The AUP states It is the responsibility of all Comcast High-Speed Internet customers and all others who have access to Comcast's network ("customer," "you," or "your"), to comply with this AUP and all Comcast policies. It would follow that Comcast would make these policies available to its customers in order for the customers to comply with them.
Shared Bandwidth is a means to make high speed internet economical to the masses. To what degree it is shared is a mystery to individual users. Many of these users referred to as "bandwidth hogs" have no way of knowing what effect their specific use has either on Comcast's network or on other users.
Providers like to create an illusion of an Internet Promised Land where you can get more movies, more music, play more games at speeds X times faster than competitive connection means because that is what sells subscriptions. Describing in detail the methods used to deliver broadband and placing caps on monthly usage tends to dispel the illusion. So instead of addressing the issue of excessive use publicly, Comcast is attempting to address it privately. Except that very few things are private any more. |
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| reply to sago5
I have no problem with Comcast telling the uber-heavy 100+ GB users a month to cool it. Pulling down hundreds of gigs a month does place an excessive burden on the network. What disturbs me is that the invisible usage barrier seems to be getting lower and lower. Now, people who are at about 70GB are getting notices. I believe that earlier in this thread I saw that someone who went between 50-60GB got a letter. How low will they go? |
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| said by The_Franz:
I have no problem with Comcast telling the uber-heavy 100+ GB users a month to cool it. Pulling down hundreds of gigs a month does place an excessive burden on the network. What disturbs me is that the invisible usage barrier seems to be getting lower and lower. Now, people who are at about 70GB are getting notices. I believe that earlier in this thread I saw that someone who went between 50-60GB got a letter. How low will they go?
Got to remember that they are using percantages. When people get disconnected the chances of you getting a letter is greater, since the percentage would be higher. Not to mention that you got no where to go but down. |
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AKSkinz
join:2003-12-12
Tewksbury, MA | reply to The_Franz
said by The_Franz:
I have no problem with Comcast telling the uber-heavy 100+ GB users a month to cool it. I believe that earlier in this thread I saw that someone who went between 50-60GB got a letter. How low will they go?
I have no problem cooling it, but they can not tell me exactly by how much. And it seems to fluctuate as you can see, so what is MY limit this month? I don't know and Comcast won't tell me. And they don't give you any way to check. |
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