Let's Play Pirate Bay Whack A Mole Site's linked content lives on, in various incarnations... While fans of the Pirate Bay last week lamented the site as a "sell out" for selling itself to a Swedish company named the Global Gaming Factory, Torrent Freak last Friday indicated that it wouldn't really be a big deal to mirror the website's functionality. As of Sunday, Torrent Freak indicates this was already happening to some degree, with other outfits copying the Pirate Bay's torrents onto a new tracker, with other indexes pointing to the new tracker. Of course the Pirate Bay itself still remains the same, but from the sound of this interview with Pirate Bay spokesman Peter Sunde, it may not be for long.
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  knightmbEverybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN | No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites Given how many sites are similar (but with a different theme) to the site. It just being the most popular makes the biggest target, so really, nothing has changed.
Google is still here, the number torrent search engine as far as I'm concerned. 
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| Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by knightmb:Given how many sites are similar (but with a different theme) to the site. It just being the most popular makes the biggest target, so really, nothing has changed. Google is still here, the number torrent search engine as far as I'm concerned. Exactly - after all this time and money no one has prevented a single user from pirating.
epic waste of time and money. | |
| | |  MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12
1 edit | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by DataRiker:said by knightmb:Given how many sites are similar (but with a different theme) to the site. It just being the most popular makes the biggest target, so really, nothing has changed. Google is still here, the number torrent search engine as far as I'm concerned. Exactly - after all this time and money no one has prevented a single user from pirating. epic waste of time and money. Not really. Although the current torrents are mirrored, NEW torrents will be harder to add. The torrent tracker is still the weak link and OpenBitorrents.com is not going to be any less susceptible to takedown than TPB was. | |
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|  ThrowDemsOutIf you can't convince 'em, confuse 'emPremium
join:2002-03-03
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:4 | said by knightmb:Given how many sites are similar (but with a different theme) to the site. It just being the most popular makes the biggest target, so really, nothing has changed. Something has changed. Grow large enough to be noticed and the MPAA & the RIAA will paint a big target on your back. If you plan on running one of these sites that will replace TPB, then you better hope you make a lot of money - to pay for all the lawyers you will need.
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| | | | | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by ThrowDemsOut:Grow large enough to be noticed and the MPAA & the RIAA will paint a big target on your back. Funny how that huge RICO target on the backs of the RIAA and MPAA has not caused the Feds to go after them. Money talks, especially in DC.
There is no honor among thieves, corporate or "pirate". The artists and actors still get screwed by both. | |
| | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
2 edits | said by ThrowDemsOut:said by knightmb:Given how many sites are similar (but with a different theme) to the site. It just being the most popular makes the biggest target, so really, nothing has changed. Something has changed. Grow large enough to be noticed and the MPAA & the RIAA will paint a big target on your back. If you plan on running one of these sites that will replace TPB, then you better hope you make a lot of money - to pay for all the lawyers you will need. How is that change? Napster anyone?
same show different day
Also, with at least 50% of people using DHT (unknowingly) expect all of TPB to live on for a very long time. | |
| | | | ThrowDemsOutIf you can't convince 'em, confuse 'emPremium
join:2002-03-03
Mullica Hill, NJ
kudos:4 | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by DataRiker:By the way, the RIAA did not take down TPB. Then who did? Who pushed for their prosecution from behind the scenes? | |
| | | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
2 edits | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by ThrowDemsOut:said by DataRiker:By the way, the RIAA did not take down TPB. Then who did? Who pushed for their prosecution from behind the scenes? NV -
doen't matter - the point is with so many DHT enabled on so many clients expect to see TPB live on for quite some time without any need for servers (well enormous static servers that is) | |
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| | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | said by DataRiker:Also, with at least 50% of people using DHT (unknowingly) expect all of TPB to live on for a very long time. TPB disables DHT on their torrents. | |
| | | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by Matt:said by DataRiker:Also, with at least 50% of people using DHT (unknowingly) expect all of TPB to live on for a very long time. TPB disables DHT on their torrents. Yes, as do many private trackers, and guess what DHT still works. Just like ratio spoofing still works. | |
| | | | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by DataRiker:Yes, as do many private trackers, and guess what DHT still works. Just like ratio spoofing still works. I'd be curious to know how DHT works if it's disabled in the torrent? Just because you're logged into DHT, doesn't mean you're actively using it for every torrent. Your client can log into DHT, but if it's disabled for the torrent, you won't use DHT peers for that torrent.
Unless by associating it with ratio spoofing you mean you have to use a hacked client? If so, how many people do you think will run a hacked client or even know how to? | |
| | | | | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by Matt:said by DataRiker:Yes, as do many private trackers, and guess what DHT still works. Just like ratio spoofing still works. I'd be curious to know how DHT works if it's disabled in the torrent? Just because you're logged into DHT, doesn't mean you're actively using it for every torrent. Your client can log into DHT, but if it's disabled for the torrent, you won't use DHT peers for that torrent. Unless by associating it with ratio spoofing you mean you have to use a hacked client? If so, how many people do you think will run a hacked client or even know how to? Well to the last of my knowledge anyone with an older client of Utorrent that had enabled DHT would have it enabled on every torrent.
This allowed many to trade on pivate trackers without incurring ratio penalties.
As for TPB i can 100% assure you DHT is alive and kicking. | |
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| Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| No, you're making the mistake of equating a technically possible solution with wide market penetration.
All that the owners are trying to do is to shut down and cripple the most popular, most visible, and easiest-to-use sites. This will stop 90% of the casual users from going the pirate route.
Just because it's technically possible to share pirated material doesn't mean that that techical solution has any significant usage or penetration.
All the owners really want to do is to raise the barrier of entry for the average user to become a pirate. | |
| | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 |  Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites
said by MyDogHsFleas:No, you're making the mistake of equating a technically possible solution with wide market penetration. All that the owners are trying to do is to shut down and cripple the most popular, most visible, and easiest-to-use sites. This will stop 90% of the casual users from going the pirate route. Just because it's technically possible to share pirated material doesn't mean that that techical solution has any significant usage or penetration. All the owners really want to do is to raise the barrier of entry for the average user to become a pirate. Bingo! Very well said. | |
| | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| A rational consumer will look at this as a tradeoff.
Pay $10 or $20 for a CD or DVD, or less than that to buy from iTunes....
vs. figure out where to go to start, download the app, start it, configure it, search for what you want, worry about whether it's really a virus, download it, and play it.
Now... iTunes and the like make the latter process dirt simple, reliable, well-known, and cheap. Whenever the owners see something springing up that approaches that level, they will react. They want the average consumer to say, "Screw it, this is too hard/dangerous, I'll just buy it." | |
| | | | knightmbEverybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by MyDogHsFleas:A rational consumer will look at this as a tradeoff. Pay $10 or $20 for a CD or DVD, or less than that to buy from iTunes.... vs. figure out where to go to start, download the app, start it, configure it, search for what you want, worry about whether it's really a virus, download it, and play it. Now... iTunes and the like make the latter process dirt simple, reliable, well-known, and cheap. Whenever the owners see something springing up that approaches that level, they will react. They want the average consumer to say, "Screw it, this is too hard/dangerous, I'll just buy it." No need to, with google, yahoo, etc. isn't much more difficult to find the torrent than it was on the pirate bay. Yeah, they took down a big target, but so what. If the piratebay was the only place in the world to find stuff, then yeah, store a big one for corporate. But really, the end user isn't as helpless as you make them out to be. They know that in the infinite wisdom of the Internet, it only takes a few clicks to find it elsewhere.
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| | knightmbEverybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN | said by MyDogHsFleas:No, you're making the mistake of equating a technically possible solution with wide market penetration. All that the owners are trying to do is to shut down and cripple the most popular, most visible, and easiest-to-use sites. This will stop 90% of the casual users from going the pirate route. Just because it's technically possible to share pirated material doesn't mean that that techical solution has any significant usage or penetration. All the owners really want to do is to raise the barrier of entry for the average user to become a pirate. The piratebay was the easiest to use? All it had going for it was a search engine and torrent trackers, you still needed the right software to play movies, burn mp3 to CD, run programs (and hope a virus didn't lurk inside).
From an end user standpoint, it won't matter at all. I have friends that are half-way technical still don't know how to use the piratebay properly.
I think once people figured out that 'any torrent' = free stuff, the piratebay name became moot. Most of them just look in google, yahoo, bing, whatever now anyway because the pirate bay was too difficult for them to use.
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| | | They will never stop the Pirates.
Boycott the RIAA, any label who signs with them, and any artist who signs with them.
Support local artists and independent labels and/or artists. | |
| | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by gorehound:They will never stop the Pirates. Boycott the RIAA, any label who signs with them, and any artist who signs with them. Support local artists and independent labels and/or artists. While this is great in concept, local bands typically suck. There is a reason they are local. | |
| | | | | | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by Matt:said by gorehound:Support local artists and independent labels and/or artists. While this is great in concept, local bands typically suck. There is a reason they are local. »www.ilovemetric.com/ | |
| | | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by derekm:said by Matt:said by gorehound:Support local artists and independent labels and/or artists. While this is great in concept, local bands typically suck. There is a reason they are local. » www.ilovemetric.com/ I should have stated local bands that aren't in the extremely large cities. (like New York, LA, Toronto, etc.) | |
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| | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by gorehound:They will never stop the Pirates. Boycott the RIAA, any label who signs with them, and any artist who signs with them. Support local artists and independent labels and/or artists. There is absolutely nothing stopping you, or anyone else, from choosing which artists/labels you want to "support" or "boycott" -- whether that's monetarily, fan-wise, whatever. It's a free country.
What this has to do with piracy, I don't know. Somehow the idea's gotten twisted around that if you pirate, you are somehow making a noble gesture against the RIAA. Um, no.
Unless of course you go public and declare, "I, Joe Blow, stole ONE THOUSAND SONGS from the RIAA! And I distributed them to FIVE THOUSAND PEOPLE! Here's my address and phone number and ISP user ID!" Now that would be making a statement.
But of course, that's not what people do. They don't want to be caught getting something for free and distributing it to others that they should be buying. (I'm trying hard to avoid the words "trafficking in stolen goods" here.) | |
| | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: No surprise, old site, meet the new (same) sites said by MyDogHsFleas:What this has to do with piracy, I don't know. Somehow the idea's gotten twisted around that if you pirate, you are somehow making a noble gesture against the RIAA. Um, no. Unless of course you go public and declare, "I, Joe Blow, stole ONE THOUSAND SONGS from the RIAA! And I distributed them to FIVE THOUSAND PEOPLE! Here's my address and phone number and ISP user ID!" Now that would be making a statement. But of course, that's not what people do. They don't want to be caught getting something for free and distributing it to others that they should be buying. (I'm trying hard to avoid the words "trafficking in stolen goods" here.) It's all a rationalization. It's not about teaching the RIAA a lesson for the exact reasons you mention.
I wonder how effective the civil rights sit-ins would have been if they were held in secret and no one wanted to admit they were doing it? | |
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| | Pirate Bay benefit? I am somewhat familiar with TPB but a noob about some of this but I had a thought...
Isn't the benefit of TPB that at least you can get a feel for who you are getting torrents from? Don't they have "ratings" associated with them live "VIP"?
If you used someone like google wouldn't it be a crap shoot and you could wind up downloading from say "joe's virus warehouse" or the fbi or something of the like?
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| Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by fishacura:I am somewhat familiar with TPB but a noob about some of this but I had a thought... Isn't the benefit of TPB that at least you can get a feel for who you are getting torrents from? Don't they have "ratings" associated with them live "VIP"? If you used someone like google wouldn't it be a crap shoot and you could wind up downloading from say "joe's virus warehouse" or the fbi or something of the like? No not any different. There is nothing to prevent the same treacherous type of files on TPB. Its up to the user to be savy enough.
Think of it as darwin's law for the internet. Here are a few rules:
1.) never run .exe files
2.) check file sizes before downloading.
3.) be familiar with pirate nomenclature.
4.)make some friends
5.) if you must use Bit Torrent enable forced encryption (both ways) to weed out 99% of sh!theads.
These are just a few, if you need more let me know | |
| | | | | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? What exatly is forced encryption? Is this a setting available on a tool like bit-torrent? | |
| | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by fishacura:What exatly is forced encryption? Is this a setting available on a tool like bit-torrent? Encryption doesn't help weed out bad people, it was originally a tool designed to work around throttling. There is nothing stopping a bad or nefarious user (or the RIAA/MPAA) from enabling encryption. If YOU can do it in a publicly available client, so can the enforcement organizations. I fail to see why people don't realize this. | |
| | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Yes, bit torrent has it depending on the client.
The "forced" part implies you will only accept rather than the default send only encrypted packets.
This is usually only enabled by those who know what they are doing.
But anyone could do it though. | |
| | | | | | | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? OK...I will look for it tonight when I get home. HOpefully I can figure out where the setting is. | |
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·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by fishacura:OK...I will look for it tonight when I get home. HOpefully I can figure out where the setting is. Let me explain this, as my friend i am arguing with me has a good point. This will not hide your identity.
But several months ago many "power users" of bit torrent made a type of agreement to force encryption to weed out slower peers. This philosophy has sense spread wildly.
This is true only of public trackers though. | |
| | | | | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by DataRiker:said by fishacura:OK...I will look for it tonight when I get home. HOpefully I can figure out where the setting is. Let me explain this, as my friend i am arguing with me has a good point. This will not hide your identity. But several months ago many "power users" of bit torrent made a type of agreement to force encryption to weed out slower peers. This philosophy has sense spread wildly. This is true only of public trackers though. Do you think it's possible you're seeing a placebo effect? What I mean is, could the decrease in the number of simultaneous sessions which results from enabling forced encryption actually be what provides the increase in speed? I've noticed that the default uTorrent setting of 600 connections will slow my torrents down drastically, but decreasing that to 100-200 total immediately increases speeds. | |
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See 8 replies to this post |
| | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | said by DataRiker:This is usually only enabled by those who know what they are doing. Actually, I would argue it's only enabled by those who DON'T know what they are doing. It doesn't offer you any protection because the RIAA and MPAA don't need to "decrypt your packets." You are busted because they join the swarm you're in and grab your IP. Enabling encryption doesn't do a damn thing to prevent this. If it did, Bittorrent would fundamentally fail.
All you do by enabling forced encryption is to decrease the number of available peers and seeds you can connect to. Unless of course you're using it to evade ISP throttling. | |
| | | | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
3 edits | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by Matt:said by DataRiker:This is usually only enabled by those who know what they are doing. Actually, I would argue it's only enabled by those who DON'T know what they are doing. It doesn't offer you any protection because the RIAA and MPAA don't need to "decrypt your packets." You are busted because they join the swarm you're in and grab your IP. Enabling encryption doesn't do a damn thing to prevent this. If it did, Bittorrent would fundamentally fail. All you do by enabling forced encryption is to decrease the number of available peers and seeds you can connect to. Unless of course you're using it to evade ISP throttling. Yes, it was originally intended for throttling. I never said it was used to hide your identity.
everything you have said is 100% accurate, but sadly you have missed my point
Many, like myself, have noticed people much faster peers with this. (consistently on public trackers)
Please don't condescend to me, when your the one who made a false assumption. (especially someone who claims DHT does not work)
AGAIN - I was referring to the "quality" of the peers
To my original poster, you would be wise to at least try it and see for yourself. | |
| | | | | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? Disagreeing with you is not condescending to you.
I simply don't feel you have a correct understanding of how Bittorrent works, so I posted what I felt was more accurate information. You are free to disagree with me and so is anyone who reads our posts. It's always good to have opposing viewpoints so people can decide which they feel is correct or incorrect. | |
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·RoadRunner Cable
2 edits | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? no.
You simply made a false assumption and put words into my mouth. I guess in some type of attempt to "one up" me.
i never said encryption will hide your identity ( as we both know it will not)
Many have enabled encryption as sort of "flag" to connect to other users on public trackers, sort of a network in a network.
AGAIN - all info is still public.
Please stop putting words in my mouth, thanks
To my original poster who I was attempting to advise, I can assure you if you are on a large public tracker try enabling "forced encryption" under utorrent. This is especially beneficial if you are using TPB trackers. As many power users have elected to do the same.
even more so, most power users have banned many clients like ABC Comet Bit Vomit Bit Tornado ect.. | |
| | | | | | | | | MattAll noise, no signal.Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12 | Re: Pirate Bay benefit? said by DataRiker:no. You simply made a false assumption and put words into my mouth. I guess in some type of attempt to "one up" me. No, I expanded upon what you said and could care less about trying to get "one up" on you. I think perhaps you shouldn't get so defensive when someone disagrees with you.
I just checked TPB and DHT has been in fact re-enabled, so you are correct. If I really cared about getting one up on you would I admit that? No. I am just concerned with the correct information and I'd hate for people to think they are safe from nefarious users or enforcement organizations by simply enabling encryption when in fact, enabling encryption only serves a single purpose, to evade throttling (although that is questionable at best now since DPI isn't used). | |
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quatrixPremium
join:2005-02-11
Davie, FL
kudos:2
1 edit | I'm curious... how many people who are "against" the RIAA, MPAA, government, authority, the law, etc. DON'T pirate. They're the only ones who'd have any credibility. The rest are like burglars complaining about the police cracking down on burglary. | |
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 ·TELUS
| Makes sense to move the tracker. If you don't run a tracker, your basically just a search engine. If you run a tracker, your directly facility the movement of the content between users.
If the pirate bay is going to be a money making company now, then this is all moot anyways, no one will use it if they have to pay for the content.. lol. | |
|  DavidI have a son- d3Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
kudos:68 | I wonder if they got hit by the "retractable baton"
I have been hearing that "TPB has been torpedoed and sinking!" | |
| Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| one tracker is as good as the next bittorrent is a protocol... which cannot be blocked, shut down, or steered in a direction content holders want. tpb's unique way of coalescing the vapors of copyrighted materials may have been stunted from growing unchecked, but this trend will evolve and continue to serve the needs of it's core of loyal file sharers.
just think, instead of ONE target to go after, now they will have several mini TPB's to deal with each specializing in it's content. then, the mpaa will become interested in taking down one, the riaa, another, the spaa yet another, cable tv & broadcast tv yet another... and the list goes on... that's what happens when litigation breaks what was good about TPB into a million little pieces... now each of those pieces begins to develop on their own-- decentralized from being the targets of sympathetic legal systems with contrary agendas, and so on (and knowing the internet, a faq/roadmap will be established connecting the dots for the uninformed). | |
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