republican-creole
site Search:


 
   
story category
Satellite: The 'Rodney Dangerfield' Of Broadband Connectivity
Have industry executives tried their own product lately?
Inmarsat CEO Andrew Sukawaty talks to the Washington Post and seems upset that satellite broadband didn't get more attention in the FCC's recently released national broadband plan. Sukawaty downplays the success other nations have had in deploying 100 Mbps as a product of geography, argues the country is just gosh-darn big, and then unrealistically pushes satellite's role as a broadband niche filler even above and beyond technologies like Mobile WiMax and LTE. Meanwhile, Viasat CEO Mark Dankberg talks to SpaceNews, and at least realizes that some of the satellite broadband industry's problems are self-inflicted:

Click for full size
Viasat Chief Executive Mark Dankberg said early satellite consumer broadband efforts in the United States, to make their profit goals, loaded too many subscribers onto a single transponder, resulting in poor service that tainted the young technology’s image among US policymakers. "From the U.S. government’s perspective, satellite is a failure," Dankberg said March 18 here during the Satellite 2010 conference. "That is totally due to perceptions established because of the race to stuff as many people as possible on a transponder. The service was not good, and that gave satellite broadband a poor reputation."

Dankberg goes to note that even new Ka-band satellite launches haven't been enough to help the sector, something made evident by the high prices, inconsistent connectivity, slow speeds and ultra-low usage caps common in the satellite broadband sector. The SpaceNews story goes on to quote White and Case lawyer Maury Mechanick, who does a lot of work for the satellite sector; Mechanick calls satellite the "Rodney Dangerfield" of the telecom sector, and goes on to lament the FCC's obsession with 100 Mbps:

"It’s not an issue of lobbyists," Mechanick said in explaining the US government’s view of satellite broadband. "The problem is that the politicians are fascinated by downlink speeds that satellites cannot deliver. Also satellites are not labor-intensive. So what we get is a policy — 100 megabits per second — that will satisfy a few uber-gamers who will take precedence over ordinary people."

Mechanick's apparently a little confused. The government's perception or fascination with speed isn't the problem, the satellite industry is the problem. Satellite broadband customers, long-held captives in under-served markets, have grown used to service that's slow, expensive, and inconsistent. These "ordinary people" have never asked for 100 Mbps -- they've just asked for reliable, relatively inexpensive connectivity -- and rarely even get that. What they get are connections that barely qualify as modern broadband, cost an arm and a leg, and come with daily caps as low as 200 megabytes.

These users have spent a decade hoping that the next satellite launch will cure what ails their connection (the launch of the high-capacity Viasat 1 next year being the latest hope on the horizon). But satellite technology can't defeat physics to improve latency, and until the capacity is in place to satisfy demand, the industry's reputation won't be getting any better. The problem isn't perception, the problem is the satellite industry has spent a decade delivering a low-quality residential product.

Mechanick and satellite industry executives should spend some time in our HughesNet or WildBlue forums listening to satellite users if they really want to know why they're considered the Rodney Dangerfield of connectivity.

view: topics flat text 
Post a:

jchambers28

join:2007-05-12
Alma, AR

satellite

satellite internet is one of the most expensive connections there is along with their caps the service sucks.

DrModem
Premium
join:2006-10-19
USA
kudos:1

Satellite is the only...

"High speed connection" that dialup has advantages over.
brianiscool

join:2000-08-16
Tampa, FL
kudos:1

heh

If Satellite can fix their delay time and costs then it will be worth it.

Omega
Displaced Ohioan
Premium
join:2002-07-30
Cheyenne, WY

Re: heh

said by brianiscool:

If Satellite can fix their delay time
All we have to do is increase the speed of light. It's so simple, I am sure the satellite companies are already working on a fix.
--
Whats smells like blue?

N10Cities
Premium
join:2002-05-07
Lavaca, AR
Reviews:
·World Lynx
·Cox HSI

2 edits

Re: heh

said by Omega:

said by brianiscool:

If Satellite can fix their delay time
All we have to do is increase the speed of light. It's so simple, I am sure the satellite companies are already working on a fix.
No kidding.....when are they gonna come out with subspace radio? That will fix the problems!! (obligatory Star Trek reference)

OTOH, the only way satellite service could be improved would be to have a LEO constellation of satellites for broadband (i.e. Iridium for BB), but that would be major $$$$$ and not affordable to Joe Blow....

The latency would be reduced since the birds are closer, but still wouldn't fix the cost factor...

BF69
Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
said by brianiscool:

If Satellite can fix their delay time.
Well as soon as someone at NASA finds a way to increase the speed of light they'll be able to fix that.
Rockin4D

join:2007-10-11
Beggs, OK
Reviews:
·AT&T Wireless Br..
·Verizon Wireless..

1 edit
First of all satellites in question are only 22k miles out in space total of a 44k round trip for the signal. Now light goes 186k miles a second the total delay should not be more than 1/4 a second. My Verizon MiFi typically has a delay from 160 to 240. The problem with satellite services like Hughesnet or Wildblue is that they have grossly oversold their bandwidth and care less about customer satisfaction. Typical latencies GENERATED by the satellite companies (on purpose) usually range from 1.1 second to 30 seconds if you try to hold on to a TCP instance too long. I was a Hughesnet subscriber for 6 years and i'd say the best time for me was 2006 when i upgraded to a business account. I could play World of Warcraft with barely a noticeable delay even in 40 man raids and Vent was flawless. fast forward to 2008 any gaming you could do was hijacked by Hughes flagrantly violating net neutrality by blocking and hijacking my port to play the game. Latencies were 30 seconds from 2008 onward. Even to this day 2 years after i told them to goto hell the service is utter garbage. I should know because i still goto my neighbors to see how it works.
It doesn't. Hughes has raised the prices 20% plus and reduced allowable daily download limits by 80% let alone you can barely surf with the service. The satellite companies deserve not a single penny in stimulus funds because they truly care less about service. GET US ALL WIRED BROADBAND i'm begging. I'd even be happy with 4G as long as its unlimited and truly neutral as far as traffic blocking and filtering. I'm using the Verizon service now with MiFi but i feel strangled with a 5 gig monthly cap. I'd move to town to get broadband but no one wants to buy a house without broadband. 6 months of silence while it was on the market is a good hint.

BF69
Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN

Re: heh

said by Rockin4D:

First of all satellites in question are only 22k miles out in space total of a 44k round trip for the signal. Now light goes 186k miles a second the total delay should not be more than 1/4 a second.
Actually it's 22.5k form your computer to the satellite then 22.5k from the satellite to wherever your sending the request too. Then 22.5K from that place to the satelite then 22.5k from the satellite back to you. So that's 90k round trip. That's 484 milliseconds latency. Of course that's not counting other parts of that whole process that have some latency. With satellites being that far up you'll never get under 500 milliseconds latency. Which pretty much rules out any online gaming or anything where nearly instantanious response is required.
sqinky
Premium
join:2001-01-24
Fernley, NV
Reviews:
·Charter

1 edit

Re: heh

AMEN!!!! I had a satellite connection for 3 years. When it was the ONLY broadband game in town, it was barely accecptable. My best latency time was in the 1 second range. My download speed was a pretty consistent 2.5meg, but the real killer was the low cap. As soon as DSL was available in my area, it was bye-bye satellite. Even though the speed was only "up to 1.5meg" (and I averaged about 1.3), the latency was down in the mid to low double digit milliseconds and NO CAP.

DSL was (and is) a better deal. The satellite companies are a lot like the only large grocery store in a rural area. They provide a service, but don't have to do anything to keep their customers (so their prices and policies reflect a non-competitive marketplace). As soon as ANYTHING potentially better comes along, they get kicked to the curb due to the way the customers feel they have been treated (taken for granted) all along.

The guy who posted the 1/4 second latency is mathematically challenged.
caco
Premium
join:2005-03-10
Whittier, AK

Not completely unfixable

Price wouldn't be such an issue if their FAP wasn't such a ballbuster, not to mention lost of folks I know that buy service say that FAB is no mentioned at all during sales pitch. Tey have lowered upfront cost.
--
Politicians and diapers have one thing in common. They should both be changed regularly, and for the same reason.

Linklist
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5

4 edits

Leo & Meo sats are the solution

»Satellite: The 'Rodney Dangerfield' Of Broadband Connectivity
But satellite technology can't defeat physics to improve latency
Read up on Leo & Meo sat systems here:
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Satellite_···t_access

Latency is between 40 & 125 ms/ Much better than GEO sat systems(250 ms).

An example:
»www.thefreelibrary.com/United+St···21310957
ViaSat will supply gateway teleports and high speed IP trunking terminals to O3b Networks, including full-motion tracking antenna systems for the Medium Earth Orbit (MEO) satellites, high-speed modems, monitor and control equipment, system development, and installation. Teleport installation is scheduled to be complete ahead of the planned launch of the O3b service in early 2012.

Each teleport will include three ViaSat 7.3-meter antennas and each IP trunking terminal will include two 4.5-meter tracking antennas together with high-speed modems and other baseband equipment. The O3b IP trunking terminal is designed for Internet backhaul by telecom carriers, operating at rates from 50 Mbps to 1 Gbps. ViaSat will develop a new 4.5-meter MEO antenna and a very high-speed DVB-S2 modem.

O3b stands for the "Other 3 billion", a reference to nearly half of the world's population that is not adequately served with broadband Internet access. Through partnerships with telecommunications providers and internet service providers (ISPs), O3b will be able to combine the speed of a fiber optic network with the global reach of a satellite system to serve billions.

Based on O3b's current spectrum allocation, the company has initial plans to launch 20 satellites by 2015 with long range capacity of over 90 satellites. The life span of each satellite is expected to be in excess of 10 years.
MEO's along with local high speed wireless systems can provide fast speeds and reasonable latency to remote areas.

--
NCAA® March Madness on Demand®

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:33

Re: Leo & Meo sats are the solution

Yeah, I've been seeing various low orbit satellite and latency improvement projects for a decade. I'll have to believe it when I see it....What was that low orbit Bill Gates wonder satellite solution? Does anybody remember that?

PapaMidnight

join:2009-01-13
Baltimore, MD

Re: Leo & Meo sats are the solution

said by Karl Bode:

Yeah, I've been seeing various low orbit satellite and latency improvement projects for a decade. I'll have to believe it when I see it....What was that low orbit Bill Gates wonder satellite solution? Does anybody remember that?
Do I remember it? Yes. Can I point to it as being any thing more than live vaporware? Negative.
genemcd

join:2008-01-04
Chehalis, WA
The name of the LEO project that Craig McCaw & Bill Gates worked on was "Teledesic" (started in the early 90's). I was hoping that that one would fly (pun intended). Now, Craig McCaw is one of the principles behind "Clear / Clearwire".

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:33

1 edit

Re: Leo & Meo sats are the solution

That was it -- thanks. i couldn't remember. I even remember attending a presentation for it with fancy global diagrams of how Bill Gates' new satellite vision was going to rule the world...

mod_wastrel
iamwhatiam

join:2008-03-28
kudos:1
BlimpNet?

Metatron2008
Premium
join:2008-09-02
Stockbridge, GA

Give more funding to satellite tv.

Not useless crap.
Joe12345678

join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL

Re: Give more funding to satellite tv.

said by Metatron2008:

Not useless crap.
Directv has good sat TV and they cost less then comcast!

Linklist
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5

Re: Give more funding to satellite tv.

said by Joe12345678:

said by Metatron2008:

Not useless crap.
Directv has good sat TV and they cost less then comcast!
But DirecTV isn't supplying internet service - which is the topic being discussed.
--
NCAA® March Madness on Demand®

45612019

join:2004-02-05
New York, NY
said by Joe12345678:

said by Metatron2008:

Not useless crap.
Directv has good sat TV and they cost less then comcast!
DirecTV is fucking garbage, C BAND is where it's at

SlickEnW
Premium
join:2003-01-21
Seattle, WA

I remember

back in the day when I had a second phone line while SBC was taking their sweet time deploying DSL (we called in for two years before they said "it's available" and were the first to have it in our area loL), I had looked at satellite in the interim. The cost was WWAAYYY too high and the caps way too low. Sorry Satellite, but it's your own fault.

fonzbear2000
Premium
join:2005-08-09
Saint Paul, MN

Sadly, satellite takes advantage of people with no choice...

Satellite takes advantage of people who can't get any other type of high speed internet. Sad but true.
--
»Please check out the band my sister, Emily is in

bolt
End of the line DSL sucks.
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Charlestown, IN
kudos:1

If satellite is broadband, so is ISDN

If I had to use satellite, I would simply go back to ISDN. No FAP. Low latency.
ShellMMG

join:2009-04-16
Grass Lake, MI

Ahh memories (and they ain't good ones)

I spent two years as a customer of Wildblue on Beam 29, Winnipeg Gateway. Nothing like having your monthly cap average reduced by 25% (and the bill did NOT go down), paying $70 a month for 1.5MB down (if you're lucky, 128Kbps if you were FAPped), and headbanging latency that rendered Flash and a lot of real-time applications useless.

Satellite is for the desperate, those who are landlocked in a mountain range with a window to the south, and for those with deep pockets and a LOT Of patience. Broadband it's NOT.

My providers, Waldron Communications, were very good. They did a good install and were easy to get hold of when needed. The problems with Wildblue were out of their control.
BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
Reviews:
·Comcast

Laws of Physics

Satellite is going up against the laws of physics. At the speed of light, it will take 250ms for the signal to go from dish to satellite to dish. It will never work. Aircraft at 100,000 feet might do the trick that are solar powered and maintain their own position...

PapaMidnight

join:2009-01-13
Baltimore, MD

Re: Laws of Physics

said by BiggA:

Satellite is going up against the laws of physics. At the speed of light, it will take 250ms for the signal to go from dish to satellite to dish. It will never work. Aircraft at 100,000 feet might do the trick that are solar powered and maintain their own position...
There's no way to possibly (at this present level of technology) keep Aircraft in geosynchronous flight over the globe. To keep it at a practical speed would essentially cause a stall and the plane would drop like a brick.

I also am not sure as to the practicality in terms of cost with regards to Solar Powering them. Solar Panels are expensive. Storing the power is even more expensive, plus you have to account for between 8-12 hours of no sun.

That's just in typical areas. We haven't even counted in areas such as Alaska which is potentially prone to a solid month or longer of darkness (and likewise of light during the summer).

It's complicated, to say the very least. Makes BoPL sound oh so much better if it had actually gone somewhere.

compuguybna

join:2009-06-17
Nashville, TN
Reviews:
·ooma
·Virgin Mobile Br..
·Charter
·HughesNet Satell..
·Millenicom

Re: Laws of Physics

Execs of Wildblue and Hughes KNOW how bad their service sucks. they dont need people in forums telling them that.

I am sure they read 1,000's of complaints each day.

i've talked personally to the CEO of Wildblue about how bad his service was. He claimed he could do nothing to help my ailing speeds and terrible service. To avoid dealing with me, they cancelled my contract and didn't charge me anything (interestingly enough, they keep billing me for the equipment I sent back to them). Bill on . . .

i've talked to Execs at Hughesnet. their only response is always "We do not guarantee speeds". Upon install, speeds are great. Even into the 30th day. After day 30, you're in a contract, and they can screw you however they please.
the NOC is at complete control of every system connected to their network. Corporate office EXECS act like they dont know what the word "throttling" means.

Satellite is an absolute LAST means for anyone that can't get dsl or mobile broadband.

Latency will never improve due to the simple physics involved.

Wildblue and Hughes continue to be driven towards profit, and care little about consumer issues once they are in a contract!!! (my dealings with them prove it).

I just happened to get lucky and find mobile broadband worked flawlessly in my area. I wish I had discovered it first!

Issues with Hughes? Write:

executivecustomercare@hughes.net or
bbbdc@hughes.net

I guarantee if you are disgusted with your service, you can get out of your contract!
BiggA

join:2005-11-23
EARTH
Reviews:
·Comcast
There have been small plane proposals, and they have a way to make them work, but probably not a business model. If the antennas have a 2.9 beam width, and the planes are 20 miles up, the planes could fly around in a mile figure 8 and still keep in contact. Of course these would only cover maybe a 50-100 mile circle at best, and you'd be pushing it for LOS beyond a 50 miles circle, as that's roughly equivalent to the look angles for satellite.

The ground-sat-ground latency is 239ms, but yes, if you wait for a reply from the server, then its 478ms, not counting network delays, plus the fact that the traffic is often offloaded hundreds or thousands of miles from where you are, so web content from your area will be that much slower, while stuff from CDNs would feed from the node nearest the satellite offload point, not near your actual location.

The issue is latency, not bandwidth. Wildblue has 1.5mbps with 22GB/mo. Granted, that's nothing compared to my school connection at 50mbps and 16GB/week or my home connection at 12mbps and 250GB/mo, but still, it's not horrible. The latency IS horrible. Even the latency on AT&T's EDGE makes me a little nuts, and that's ~900ms, compared to my usual 22ms connection.

Verizon could largely solve the problem single-handedly with a $50/mo 100GB/mo plan without overage charges that would be permanently mated to the five towers closes to the service address. The vast majority of these locations can get EVDO service, and in areas where its present but too weak, a masted repeater could get EVDO up to the mbit mark. Of course you could just do add-a-line, and get a tetherable phone and effectively get unlimited internet for $40/mo- on par with the cable and DSL companies...

EVDO is about 160ms ping, but that's mostly because once it gets to the tower, the data gets bounced all over Verizon's network before it hits the public internet. With some additional software to route fixed point traffic directly to the internet at the tower base, Verizon could become a really big player in the rural broadband market with their existing EVDO investment...

Chuck99

@gci.net
said by BiggA:

it will take 250ms for the signal to go from dish to satellite to dish.
Actually it will take 250ms to go from dish to satellite and another 250ms to go from satellie to dish. pinging a website or server off your network or outside of the geographical area of the receiving dish is is usually going to result in 600-1000ms pings.
Tige

join:2010-03-09
Greenville, SC

Satellite used not to be so pathetic.

Cramming people on the satellite(s) is what lead to traffic shaping which led to 1-2 sec latency which led to timeouts on secure sites, disconnected downloads and overall degradation of performance. Trying to listen to a 30 sec song preview on itunes or amazon is many times an exercise in futility now.

Prior to wildblue doing this the ping times where in the 400-600 hundred range which made most internet activities doable. Wildblue even reached out to gamers saying they where doing all they can to make most internet game types playable.

Since the infamous firmware update a few years ago wildblue has acted as if their customers have no other choice, caps on speed and data with pricing plans that are over even the most expensive dsl or cable data plan. Unfortunately they are right, we don't have another choice.

Going to hit the post button now and hope I don't time out

yolarry

join:2007-12-29
Creston, WV
Reviews:
·HughesNet Satell..

Re: Satellite used not to be so pathetic.

said by Tige:

Cramming people on the satellite(s) is what lead to traffic shaping which led to 1-2 sec latency which led to timeouts on secure sites, disconnected downloads and overall degradation of performance. Trying to listen to a 30 sec song preview on itunes or amazon is many times an exercise in futility now.

Prior to wildblue doing this the ping times where in the 400-600 hundred range which made most internet activities doable. Wildblue even reached out to gamers saying they where doing all they can to make most internet game types playable.

Since the infamous firmware update a few years ago wildblue has acted as if their customers have no other choice, caps on speed and data with pricing plans that are over even the most expensive dsl or cable data plan. Unfortunately they are right, we don't have another choice.

Going to hit the post button now and hope I don't time out
Good times. I can play a game of halo on my DW300 (I think the model)
--
HN7000S 5.8.0.72 - 99 West 1370 MHz -Transmit 1 watt - .74m Dish - Pro Plan - installed October 2007 - WRT54G V6 DD-WRT V24
Spice300
Premium
join:2006-01-10
That firmware upgrade in November 2006 to implement the DAMA scheduler changed our latency from about 600 ms to more than 1,200 ms killing gaming and making secure HTTP unbearably slow.
--
Value Pack, beam 31, Riverside gateway

cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27

Latency...

Inmarsat CEO Andrew Sukawaty talks to the Washington Post and seems upset that satellite broadband didn't get more attention in the FCC's recently released national broadband plan.

That's because his reply still hasn't gotten there yet due in part to (Bureaucratic) latency.
--
Splat
iansltx

join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
·Comcast

My Experiences

I've (forutnately) never had to use sat internet as my primary connection, but I certainly know what it feels like; many folks in my area have WB because they can't get fixed wireless and either don't know about 3G or are paying $50 instead of the $60-$70 that 3G requires.

As others have said, latency used to be better, but overloading has slowed connectivity down to a crawl. A few years ago one of the local telephone cooperatives hailed WB as the answer to rural broadband, citing DSL as too expensive. As of this time last year, they had had enough of WildBlue, and were deploying DSL to all of their customers.

As for the "gamers" argument, I'm really tired of it. Gamers don't need high speed as much as they need low latency and connection reliability 100% of the time. Downloading games (versus playing them) is another deal, but if you're just playing 'em latency is paramount, though 768 kbps down and 384 kbps up is nice, or more if you're hosting your own game server (a few Mbps symmetric should do the job). Of course, sat systems can't do low latency, particularly anything above LEO, so the "gamers are disenfranchised by satellite" argument is true, just for a different reason than 100 Mbps download speeds.

Speaking of download speeds, I find it interesting that the Sat folks didn't even bring up upstream bandwidth as a sticking point. Neither HughesNet nor WildBlue (for 99.9% of people the only sat companies they know of) offer upstream speeds above 300 kbps, which is absolutely pitiful in this day and age. 1-1.5 Mbps down isn't so bad, paired with low latency and high reliability, but 200-256 kbps of upload speed is downright crappy.

compuguybna

join:2009-06-17
Nashville, TN
Reviews:
·ooma
·Virgin Mobile Br..
·Charter
·HughesNet Satell..
·Millenicom

Re: My Experiences

After I moved from Hughesnet to mobile broadband I see an average of about 1.6mbps DOWN, and an average of about 500-600kbps.

Sometimes during peak time (tower load), i've seen UPLOAD speeds faster than download ones.

the service has only had 1 service outage that affected me in almost 8 months.
iansltx

join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
·Comcast

Re: My Experiences

I'm posting this from MBB (because I'm currently heading down I-10) so I know what you're talking about with mobile broadband. I'd personally pay extra for MBB over sat internet if given the choice, however for some folks the value proposition isn't quite there.

That said, I've personally switched one WISP customer over to Sprint MBB and they're very happy with the new connection. If the transition had been from satellite they would've been even more overjoyed

Van
Premium
join:2009-07-08
New Orleans, LA

Roomate had it a few years ago and it wasn't

terrible but it really was just not enough to warrant having it for home use consistently

Drop outs, unreliable, etc....
heimdm

join:2008-06-22
Martinsville, IN

Re: Roomate had it a few years ago and it wasn't

I live in the sticks when we were buying the property several providers said they could give us service.. but when they actually came to do it.. they all said.. oops no we can't. Our only option is a T1, which works about 90% of the time, but 1-2 day outages are not uncommon.

We are serious considering moving about 30 minutes to the north to be closer to my work and get rid of the Internet pain. The new place is DSL capable today and will have fiber internet next year. 20mb/4mb internet for $55 is a lot better than $350 for 1.5 up and down.
Aluminum
Premium
join:2006-01-23
Manassas, VA

Re: Roomate had it a few years ago and it wasn't

You lose service on a T1, are you kidding? You measure outages in DAYS...WTF?

What kind of outages, natural/disaster/etc usually in SLA clauses or do you mean like the flaky dsl/cable type of outage?

Please don't tell me you forked for a connection that is typically overpriced as hell for the bandwidth and don't even get a SLA with it. People would get fired if a non SLA-covered outage that long happened on some lines at previous work places.
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

Re: Roomate had it a few years ago and it wasn't

The SLA doesn't pay for lost business, and usually has 4 hour repair time before you can get credit. The credits are never worth more to the phone company than 4 union techs on OT with 2 trucks, atleast for a T1 line. Your T1 SLA won't replace a rotted 500 pair F1 feeder any time soon (hours or less than a few weeks) either.
Emiya

join:2006-03-30
Southington, OH

In defense of the service

I work for a small, business class VSAT ISP. I will agree that packing too many customers on a transponder is a huge issue, we have a hard time maintaining that balance ourselves. However, one of the biggest issues we see is improperly installed/maintained equipment.

Crappy cabling is a major issue. Copper clad steel instead of solid copper and/or dual-shield instead of quad-shield RG6 is a huge mistake, especially CCS cable. The dish also needs to be better pointed than a TV dish. It doesn't matter so much with receiving but when your trying to transmit a signal to a bird that far out in space with these systems the smallest bit off on Earth translates to a huge amount up in space and then you have a problem. An improperly pointed dish can cause errors and screw everyone on the transponder. This goes for polarization (skew) as well.

Making sure everything is in good condition makes a huge difference. Periodically checking cable ends for corrosion, making sure the grounding is OK and having the dish peaked every once in a while will reduce a lot of these problems. Satellite broadband isn't for everyone but it's not as worthless as people make it out to be and unless your in need of low latency it's not a bad option if you can afford it.

Oh, and that speed of light issue. We are trying to work around that with things like TCP packet spoofing.
kjpwv

join:2006-10-24
Fairmont, WV
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

Re: In defense of the service

And that is where it should stay. Its fine running CC numbers, I see rural places with it for that purpose all the time. For residential, it is beyond terrible for anything beyond the most basic web browsing and e-mail. Even making transactions can be a pain as SSL tends to at least double the ping. Glad I escaped to 3g a year ago.

BF69
Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN

Re: In defense of the service

said by Emiya:

Oh, and that speed of light issue. We are trying to work around that with things like TCP packet spoofing.
If I'm playing a game online how is that going to help? If I push the button to fire a weapon it's still going to take over 1/2 second to respond. Which is way too long. You can't "spoof" me pressing X for FIRE since you have no clue what I want to do.

Only way to fix latency with satellites is to use low earth orbit ones which means LOTS of satellites which would be VERY expensive to launch and even more expensive to maintain and control.

said by kjpwv:

Glad I escaped to 3g a year ago.
Not any faster and even worse caps. Worse yet $50 per GB overages. At least with satellite all they do is throttle down your speed.
kjpwv

join:2006-10-24
Fairmont, WV
Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..

2 edits

Re: In defense of the service

the speed is about the same (unless you count sat's daytime throttle), but 150ms as opposed to 1000+ makes it way better for about everything. And the FAP was less slow you down and more choke you to death til you give up trying to use it.

I have no cap and its 20 bucks less than I ever paid for sat.
--
HN7000S G16 970Mhz

cline3621
Mr. Yuk is MEAN Mr. Yuk is GREEN
Premium
join:2006-06-14
Clarksville, TN
As a Dish Network and Wild Blue installer, I can attest what you say about installs and maintenance is correct. It drives me crazy when I have to do a trouble call on a Wild Blue system, that has been improperly installed with Cu-clad wiring, by someone who supposedly is 'certified' to do the job correctly. I've also noticed that when the dish is pointed correctly, and you got to be just about dead on balls accurate, to get reasonably low ping times. The best I could average was between 600-1000ms. However when it comes to real time video, voip, or gaming, satellite can't overcome the physics involved to make it worthwhile.
Tige

join:2010-03-09
Greenville, SC
I'm sure installations are a part of the equation however installation and satellite distance are all too often made the scapegoat.

Much of what satellite customers deal with was inflicted by the provider.

Starting with the decision made to shape traffic which lead to doubling or tripling the latency and all the issues that brought with it had nothing to do with any installation. Additionally, loading the satellites to a point where users' up/down speed and latency change minute by minute are not due to installation or equipment.

I'm only familiar with wildblue so can't speak to hughes service and performance but if wildblue would have taken a different road a couple years ago things could have been different. At one time satellite was a viable alternative however due to their decisions which directly led magnifying satellites weaknesses they find themselves in the position they are in now.

ShakeIT

@embarqhsd.net

The day broadband was available

Was the last day I used the dish. Seriously, they have a horrible service for the price. To equate them with Rodney
Dangerfield is kind.

Friday, 24-May 07:14:56 Terms of Use & Privacy | feedback | contact | Hosting by nac.net - DSL,Hosting & Co-lo
over 13.5 years online © 1999-2013 dslreports.com.