 sapoCruising Down Memory LanePremium join:2002-09-16 Sacramento, CA kudos:1 | The highest appeal The freedom and unrestricted nature of the internet is why I use it. Once you make tiers that make like it TV I will just lose interest in it. Youtube and Facebook are not that big of a deal to me. -- Don't think too much, you might hurt yourself. | |
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 |  | | Re: The highest appeal the whole idea is bullshit.closing the internet and creating a rich man's net and a poor man's net is a crock of shit.i can see it happening though and then we need to do something serious against those in power. and do it worldwide at that.
welcome to the corporate states of america | |
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·Hargray Cable
| Re: The highest appeal said by gorehound:the whole idea is bullshit.closing the internet and creating a rich man's net and a poor man's net is a crock of shit.i can see it happening though and then we need to do something serious against those in power. and do it worldwide at that.
welcome to the corporate states of america You don't even get everything going on here. Basically they are saying any where you go on the internet you will tracked. If they know you go to you tube they will also know you go to porn sites etc. All sorts of bad can happen from this. | |
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 |  |  |  56403739Less than 5 months leftPremium join:2006-03-08 Naples, FL kudos:2 | Re: The highest appeal said by Corehhi:any where you go on the internet you will tracked. If they know you go to you tube they will also know you go to porn sites etc. All sorts of bad can happen from this. Heh...you're already tracked everywhere you go on the Internet...your ISP already knows every visit you make to pornhub and how long you stay there. That is the least of the problems with this crap. | |
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·Hargray Cable
| Re: The highest appeal said by 56403739:said by Corehhi:any where you go on the internet you will tracked. If they know you go to you tube they will also know you go to porn sites etc. All sorts of bad can happen from this. Heh...you're already tracked everywhere you go on the Internet...your ISP already knows every visit you make to pornhub and how long you stay there. That is the least of the problems with this crap. But know one is really looking at them. Get the software a running and you end up with a very easily searched data base. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  56403739Less than 5 months leftPremium join:2006-03-08 Naples, FL kudos:2 | Re: The highest appeal Wrong again. The databases already exist, and are often subpoenaed by the government and the RIAA/MPAA among others. You're about 10 years behind what is really going on now. | |
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 |  |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 | said by gorehound: then we need to do something serious against those in power. and do it worldwide at that. and you think violent revolution over cell phone data plans is the solution?  | |
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 |  |  |  TamaraBQuestion The Current ParadigmPremium join:2000-11-08 Da Bronx Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Clearwire Wireless
| Re: The highest appeal said by Linklist:and you think violent revolution over cell phone data plans is the solution?  "Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
Fascism has only been successfully defeated by bullets. I suspect the next anti-fascist revolt won't be any different. | |
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 |  |  |  |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 | Re: The highest appeal said by TamaraB:said by Linklist:and you think violent revolution over cell phone data plans is the solution?  "Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini Fascism has only been successfully defeated by bullets. I suspect the next anti-fascist revolt won't be any different. And are you declaring HERE your intention to be a soldier in that revolution? | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  TamaraBQuestion The Current ParadigmPremium join:2000-11-08 Da Bronx Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Clearwire Wireless
| Re: The highest appeal said by Linklist:And are you declaring HERE your intention to be a soldier in that revolution? Are you declaring here your intention to be a quisling in that revolution? | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  Steve BPremium join:2004-08-02 Seattle, WA | Re: The highest appeal said by TamaraB:said by Linklist:And are you declaring HERE your intention to be a soldier in that revolution? Are you declaring here your intention to be a quisling in that revolution? LMAO | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  TamaraBQuestion The Current ParadigmPremium join:2000-11-08 Da Bronx Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Clearwire Wireless
| Re: The highest appeal said by Linklist:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law Try harder, you didn't use the "N azi " word yet. Come on, try again! | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD | Re: The highest appeal Meow. |
If we're gonna do Godwin's Law, we gotta do it right. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  wifi4milezBig Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace join:2004-08-07 New York, NY | said by Linklist:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law Wow that is hilarious. I had never actually heard of Godwin's 'law' until now, but it is so very true (especially on this site!). I especially like the etiquette surrounding what to do when someone breaks this 'law'.
quote: "there is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically "lost" whatever debate was in progress."
-- "No you won't" -The American people to President Obama (11/2/2010)
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | | Re: The highest appeal Screw Godwin. The Nazi's never went away! | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  | | said by wifi4milez:I had never actually heard of Godwin's 'law' until now, but it is so very true (especially on this site!). I especially like the etiquette surrounding what to do when someone breaks this 'law'.
quote: "there is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically "lost" whatever debate was in progress."
First of all... how the hell have you never heard of Godwin's law? I'd welcome you to the internet but your join date suggests you've been here for a while.
Secondly, no one actually follows that retarded etiquette. Try pulling that shit and see what happens. --
said by Metatron2008:But people who download thousands of movies and games.... Yes, they are as bad as any murderer | |
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 |  |  |  |  tim_kButtons, Bows, Beamer, Shadow, KaseyPremium,VIP join:2002-02-02 Stewartstown, PA kudos:25 | said by TamaraB:Fascism has only been successfully defeated by bullets. I suspect the next anti-fascist revolt won't be any different.
Not always. Franco's death ended it in Spain. -- RIP my babies Buttons 1/15/94-2/9/07, Beamer 7/24/08, & Bows 12/17/94-10/11/09 | |
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 |  |  |  |  DavePR join:2008-06-04 Canyon Country, CA | said by TamaraB:Fascism has only been successfully defeated by bullets. I suspect the next anti-fascist revolt won't be any different.
Don't tell Ghandi or Nelson Mandella | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  TamaraBQuestion The Current ParadigmPremium join:2000-11-08 Da Bronx Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Clearwire Wireless
| Re: The highest appeal said by DavePR:Don't tell Ghandi Gandhi or Nelson Mandella Gandhi fought Brit Imperialism, Mandela fought South African apartheid. Neither fought fascism. History 101! | |
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 |  |  |  | | "and you think violent revolution over cell phone data plans is the solution? "
it would be a really good place to start | |
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 |  56403739Less than 5 months leftPremium join:2006-03-08 Naples, FL kudos:2 | said by sapo:Once you make tiers that make like it TV I will just lose interest in it. Which is precisely why wireless Internet is outrageously over-hyped as the replacement for broadcast television (and ever radio for that matter). The dominant providers will never allow you to watch TV all day for "free". This is also a great argument against AT&T and Verizon's spectrum grab in what is left of the UHF Television spectrum. | |
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 |  |  | | Re: The highest appeal that is the type of protests and stuff that would need to be done maybe. | |
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 |  | | said by sapo:The freedom and unrestricted nature of the internet is why I use it. Once you make tiers that make like it TV I will just lose interest in it. Youtube and Facebook are not that big of a deal to me. Exactly correct on the first part and I don't do much Youtube and Facebook should be against the law anyway!!
Still, it would be totally wrong to charge for it. -- The Firefox alternative. »www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/ | |
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 |  Ulmo join:2005-09-22 San Jose, CA | said by sapo:The freedom and unrestricted nature of the internet is why I use it. Once you make tiers that make like it TV I will just lose interest in it. Youtube and Facebook are not that big of a deal to me. What this does to Facebook is amazing ("this" being content discrimination in data pipe companies):
Suddenly, everything anybody would ever want to do with Facebook, whether Facebook wants it or not, will be demanded of Facebook, since people wouldn't be able to just do it anywhere (forced to use Facebook). Facebook would AOLify, trying to be something to everyone, but even more so since carriers would REQUIRE you to use Facebook, whereas in theory you could STOP using AOL if you just canceled your credit card or bank account and stopped paying the credit card/bank account. The pressure on Facebook would be enormous. As soon as Facebook says "but we can do what we want", the users would dump the carriers to something that can do what the users want, and the carriers would bring big guns to Facebook to say "hey do what the users want, and damn your standards or individuality or desires for your site". The outcome would either be a watered-down weak Facebook, or the carriers would become more fractured when they start shutting out Facebook to choose their own systems. Either way, users would get 80% of what they want and 70% of what they need minimum, if not more. It would be screwed up, but it would not be exactly what the content-restricting types of entities want. Finally, all the control-types would find out that every ounce of control they attempt to put on it would bang back with tons of pressure.
Oh, they can do it. But the outcome would basically be to bankrupt the places doing it, or to overthrow the governments doing it, or both. In fact, if you want to tank a company or government, this would be one of the easy ways to do it. It would take a few decades, but it would not fail to tank them. But, they could be replaced with something that you don't want. Like a company that responds to the market, or a government that is for and by the people. | |
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 |  | | Re: ........ I've been under a rock for awhile....who are these two? Aside from both having the same first name...  | |
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 mmay149qPremium join:2009-03-05 Dallas, TX kudos:48 | Good job Karl!!! Glad to see that you got away with Rick Rolling anyone who clicked the link, maybe it wasn't meant as humor, but if it was I definitely enjoyed it!! XD
Matt | |
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 | | Then Use encryption and a proxy server instead? | |
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 maartenaElmoPremium join:2002-05-10 Orange, CA kudos:1 | All I want for xmas.... ....is a stable connection with a friggin' IP address.
I will take care of the rest of the services I need, thank you very much. -- "I reject your reality and substitute my own!" | |
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 | | typo "is particular y absurd" 4th para, 1st sentence. Just saying.
Anyways, if the internet moved to this pricing scheme, I see ultimate failure. There's a lot of people out there unlike us who just hop on every so often to watch some youtube or what not on low speed cheap DSL. They see this lame scheme now added to their billing? Gonners. Something like this seems like it would only stick on the people who like paying an ass load of money for few services, aka ridiculous cell phone plans for example...just my opinion. -- Core i7 920 @ 3.2ghz | OCZ Obsidian 6GB 1600mhz DDR3 RAM | EVGA X58 tri SLI-LE mobo | 2X EVGA 1GB GTX460 Video Cards | Antec 750w PSU | WD Black 1TB HDD | Antec 1200 Case | G15 keyboard | G9x mouse | G35 Headset | Asus 23" LED-LCD Monitor | |
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 baineschile2600 ways to livePremium join:2008-05-10 Sterling Heights, MI | why not why dont major traffic websites give a cut of their advertising sales to ISPs? cant a deal be worked out? | |
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 Frankis chillingPremium join:2000-11-03 somewhere | something similar to this already happens in australia although i'm not sure if they go as far as to do deep packet inspection. basically what the isps do is give you some ridicoulous monthly cap and then partner with (read: charge) companies so that thier content doesnt count against your cap.
example
»www.mytivo.com.au/whatistivo/unmetering/
in my opinion it is a step backward.....
what's next..... internet long distance charges for sites visited in other countries??? -- At first I thought everyone on the highway was drunk but then I realized I was driving in Florida  | |
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 |  | | Re: something similar to this already happens in australia That's quite possibly the scariest thing I've seen all week. Glad I'm not under the same restrictions as most of Australia (yet). | |
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 | | DPI? Ah, the DPI, how quickly they forget the Phorm...  | |
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 gballMaster YodaPremium join:2000-11-28 South Bend, IN | easy I will just not use the service...problem solved for me.. | |
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 |  CptGeminiInside your computerPremium join:2004-11-29 Corpus Christi, TX kudos:6 Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: easy I will probably loose some bit of intrest in the internet as well. | |
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 |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 | said by gball:I will just not use the service...problem solved for me.. A logical reaction and one that will make sure this doesn't actually fly as a viable option for wireless providers.
Unlike the other post calling for violent revolution as the solution. | |
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 grayem join:2000-09-22 Saint Louis, MO | Youtube would change names every day. Suddenly, instead of going to Youtube, we would all just go to u2ube, then othertube.com, then biffytube or whatever. The content would just slide around to avoid this. Then the ISPs wold come up with another way of overcharging people. | |
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 | | The Consumer is in Charge This scenario has been bantered about in broadband provider trade magazines for the past 18 months. These people are being pitched by all sorts of schemes to increase revenue.
It is true that the absolute dream of telcos and cablecos is this kind of pricing arrangement, the consumer won't accept it. Doing the math on the "Facebook tier" on average broadband consumption, that's an internet bill approaching $100.
They'll attempt all sorts of schemes at fleecing the consumer until the consumer revolts. | |
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 |  | | Re: The Consumer is in Charge Does anyone else here think that ISP's are simply trying to delay the inevitable?
Sure, they might get away with this crap for a while, and actually delay the demise of stupid data plans such as the examples given here, and a world where we need to pay for "voice" and "TV" from these people.
But if it's really true that the cost of bandwidth for backbones halves every 9 months, and will continue to do so for a while... they're just doomed. At some point it will get cheap enough so that new players enter the arena, and offer compelling data only flat rates.
I mean, if it wasn't for the "last mile" problem, we could already take advantage of all this unused bandwidth. So i guess what we need is for prices to drop for "last mile" deployment a lot more before we can take advantage of all the bandwidth they'd rather never have us get.
Wireless of course is a different story altogether, and it looks like a billionaire only business for quite some time.
But really, is it hard to imagine a 10 bucks 1 gigabit wired connections by 2020 if prices keep dropping like a rock?
I'm interested to know people's opinions about this subject. Because i'm a bit optimistic on the future of the internet. I think that once prices come down enough, we could very well see a surge of new ways to connect to that network that our current last mile land lords won't give us access to.
I dare say, that these monopolies will come crumbling down once bandwidth gets cheap enough. | |
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 |  |  | | Re: The Consumer is in Charge Bandwidth has almost never been the barrier to entry for other companies, except out in remote rural areas where there's no middle mile competition.
The issue has always been initial outlay of capital to lay down the lines, which is a HUGE expense, compounded by the necessity of competing with an incumbent who can easily price you out of the market. | |
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·Air Advantage
·HughesNet Satell..
| said by Kamus :Does anyone else here think that ISP's are simply trying to delay the inevitable?
Sure, they might get away with this crap for a while, and actually delay the demise of stupid data plans such as the examples given here, and a world where we need to pay for "voice" and "TV" from these people.
But if it's really true that the cost of bandwidth for backbones halves every 9 months, and will continue to do so for a while... they're just doomed. At some point it will get cheap enough so that new players enter the arena, and offer compelling data only flat rates.
I mean, if it wasn't for the "last mile" problem, we could already take advantage of all this unused bandwidth. So i guess what we need is for prices to drop for "last mile" deployment a lot more before we can take advantage of all the bandwidth they'd rather never have us get.
Wireless of course is a different story altogether, and it looks like a billionaire only business for quite some time.
But really, is it hard to imagine a 10 bucks 1 gigabit wired connections by 2020 if prices keep dropping like a rock?
I'm interested to know people's opinions about this subject. Because i'm a bit optimistic on the future of the internet. I think that once prices come down enough, we could very well see a surge of new ways to connect to that network that our current last mile land lords won't give us access to.
I dare say, that these monopolies will come crumbling down once bandwidth gets cheap enough. i'm not optimistic at all. until all these monopolies of ISP's are gone, prices will never go down nor will they feel the need to expand or upgrade their networks | |
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 |  |  Sammer join:2005-12-22 Canonsburg, PA | said by Kamus :But if it's really true that the cost of bandwidth for backbones halves every 9 months, and will continue to do so for a while... they're just doomed. At some point it will get cheap enough so that new players enter the arena, and offer compelling data only flat rates.
I mean, if it wasn't for the "last mile" problem, we could already take advantage of all this unused bandwidth. So i guess what we need is for prices to drop for "last mile" deployment a lot more before we can take advantage of all the bandwidth they'd rather never have us get. If unregulated corporations insist on schemes that rip-off consumers someday voters will insist on the government funding a competitive fiber optic based last mile that will be the feared dumb pipe! | |
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 |  |  WHT join:2010-03-26 Rosston, TX kudos:5 | said by Kamus :So i guess what we need is for prices to drop for "last mile" deployment Actually prices are going to go up by at least twice as much, and at least a month wait time for installations.
2.4 GHz is a RF waste land with a dozen APs on 200 foot towers or 120 foot water towers, all within a few miles of each other, and then you have the -70 dBm noise floor from SOHO wireless gear. 5.8 GHz is getting to be the same way, but at least the more tighter beamwidth antennas is helping; as well as 200 watts for the PtP backhaul links.
The next stage is 3.65 GHz and the equipment costs twice as much and each user's radio has to be licensed (it takes about a month for the FCC to process your application). | |
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 ARGONAUTgot android?Premium join:2006-01-24 New Albany, IN kudos:1 | Online Gaming Online gaming will die under this BS tier system. | |
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 | | Class Wars: The Internet Rebooted And now, you have the 'poor' internet and the 'Rich' one. Kid doing homework clicks on link for video to see a documentary about ancient Egypt. Portal page comes up and says. Opps, you don't have the 'online video (HD)' option on your data plan, would you like to upgrade for only 29.99/mo? Y/N?
And what if my Job needs me to work from home but I don't have the 'enhanced telecommuter' option. So no VPN for me!!!
Please, telcos/cablecos. Offer this so I can have the pleasure of throwing it right back in your faces. | |
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 | | hope this doesn't happen I make a lot of videos, if people have to pay extra no one is going to watch. This sucks. | |
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·AT&T Wireless Br..
| guys stop your fing b*tching please guys you need to stop your fing b*tching please the internet is a privilege not a right you know that right? just driving is a privilege not a right. Also you have to think most of these ISP have to fork sh*t load of money for bandwidth so they have to come up some way to recover the dang cost for bandwidth. I can see down the future your going to pay per site if its not already doing it. Just think about it your 3meg dsl connection can be costing you 400 dollars or more a month your lucky they aint charging you for it intead you paying from 30-80 dollars a month. | |
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 VanPremium join:2009-07-08 New Orleans, LA | Not only YouTube but imagine an internet where the companies all impose LAUGHABLY low caps for ALL INTERNET use thus Netflix, YouTube, etc....are all questionable to use
It is quite scary but I guess some love the idea of companies controlling it all | |
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 | | Then i would Then I would move to another.. ooooh... you got me... monopoly. -- Reach out and Tap someone! | |
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 | | how is this new? CEO's of ISP's. phone cos, content providers all want the same thing: make as much money from you as they can without you going to a competitor. If none exists then they have you
We are not a "socialist" country or at least people are led to believe we are not.
So the eternal fight goes on: you want cheap, they want to make money. Tug of war | |
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 |  | | Re: how is this new? "CEO's of ISP's. phone cos, content providers all want the same thing: make as much money from you as they can without you going to a competitor."
Is this much different than...
Employees (a.k.a. consumers) want the same thing. Make as much money as they can with out being fired or laid off?
Why is it greed when the provider of any service wants to make more money but when the Employee (consumer) wants to make more it's not? | |
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