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Will All ISPs Follow AT&T's Cap & Overage Lead?
Or Will They Paint AT&T As Greedy, Cheap And Lazy?

Yesterday we were the very first to exclusively report that AT&T will soon be imposing new caps of 150GB and 250GB on legacy DSL and U-Verse customers respectively, charging both sets of users $10 for every 50GB over the cap they travel. The move comes after previous trials by AT&T were shuttered, and on the heels of a failed effort by Time Warner Cable to charge by the byte in 2008. That latter effort failed in part because of a customer backlash, but also because competitors were using the meters as a competitive advantage, painting the company as a cheapskate with inferior network capabilities.

AT&T's move provides air cover that makes it easier for all ISPs to follow
-Sanford Bernstein analyst Craig Moffett
With more than fifteen million subscribers and a more sophisticated public relations apparatus, AT&T is another animal entirely. Their dominance of the market could allow ISPs in AT&T markets to use this opportunity to jump on the overage bandwagon, since users in monopoly or duopoly markets can't vote with their wallets. We've long argued that if the United States was going to shift from flat-rate to metered billing like in Canada, it would require all the largest ISPs to do so uniformly, to prevent any competitors from using their unlimited service for a marketing advantage.

An ISP bull rush toward metered billing is certainly the hope of investors like Sanford Bernstein analyst Craig Moffett, who has relentlessly been pushing for steep broadband overages for as long as we can remember. Moffett takes any opportunity to try and push meters; like when the FCC imposed neutrality rules, when the discussion of cord cutters recently heated up -- or as a huge fan of AT&T's decision to kill off unlimited iPhone data. In a research note Moffett was quick on the gun to argue AT&T's latest decision -- you guessed it -- could mean a stampede of metering:

quote:
"AT&T's move provides air cover that makes it easier for all of them to follow. We view the move as good news for all the terrestrial broadband operators."
Maybe, and maybe not. Competitors could use this opportunity to impose a very unpopular and confusing pricing model on consumers, or they could use the opportunity to badger AT&T, arguing that as a supposed next-generation broadband company, AT&T isn't making the grade. Cable is already winning the race against DSL, more than half of the AT&T network remains on legacy DSL (and will for years given AT&T's U-Verse investment cuts), and now many of those customers face new limits and higher costs.

It's a marketing attack that essentially writes itself. Take a look at the users in our AT&T forums threatening to leave AT&T (assuming they have the choice), and you'll see the marketing potential for any ISP that wants to highlight the fact they don't need to charge you by the byte.

With Moffett's help this week (he'll be quoted extensively and often exclusively as this story evolves), AT&T is hoping to convince the public that the new caps and meters are absolutely necessary without a shred of supporting data of any kind and few if any press outlets asking for any. While both Moffett and AT&T would love consumers to believe that such overages are both necessary and inevitable, Time Warner Cable's botched implementation of metered billing still strongly suggests consumers know better, and still have a say in the matter -- if their market sees competition.
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wahoospa
join:2006-03-23
Charleston, SC

wahoospa

Member

Will All ISPs Follow AT&T

"painting the company as a cheapskate with inferior network capabilities"

WELL THEY ARE!
JonBoySC
join:2009-06-26
Pickens, SC

JonBoySC

Member

Re: Will All ISPs Follow AT&T

Warning to Rich Oppressors

1 Now listen, you rich people, weep and wail because of the misery that is coming on you. 2 Your wealth has rotted, and moths have eaten your clothes. 3 Your gold and silver are corroded. Their corrosion will testify against you and eat your flesh like fire. You have hoarded wealth in the last days.

James 5 (NIV). If these are God fearing men, then their just punishment is coming.

The Limit
Premium Member
join:2007-09-25
Greensboro, NC
kudos:2

The Limit

Premium Member

Re: Will All ISPs Follow AT&T

So true.

nothing00
join:2001-06-10
Centereach, NY

nothing00

Member

Re: Will All ISPs Follow AT&T

OK, now where's my lower bill?

r81984
Fair and Balanced
Premium Member
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX
·AT&T U-Verse

r81984 to wahoospa

Premium Member

to wahoospa
said by wahoospa:

"painting the company as a cheapskate with inferior network capabilities"

WELL THEY ARE!

They had the superior network until yesterday.
Before caps you could download more on ATT than with any other ISP. You could download twice as much as the fastest comcast package if you had 1.5mpbs.

ATT F*cked Up as they went from the fastest real internet provider to a slow restricted internet provider.
They are no longer an ISP, but now an RISP (restricted internet service provider)

Thespis
I'm not an actor, but I play one on TV.
Premium Member
join:2004-08-03
Keller, TX

Thespis

Premium Member

Re: Will All ISPs Follow AT&T

said by r81984:

Before caps you could download more on ATT than with any other ISP.

We FIOS users would disagree...

FreedomBuild
Well done is better than well said
Premium Member
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL

FreedomBuild to wahoospa

Premium Member

to wahoospa
said by wahoospa:

"painting the company as a cheapskate with inferior network capabilities"

WELL THEY ARE!

I whole heartily agree
WernerSchutz
join:2009-08-04
Sugar Land, TX

WernerSchutz

Member

Both

Both. Most ISP's are greedy, cheap and lazy and with duopolies in place, collusion agreements and government inaction, a race to the bottom that will hurt customers will most likely occur.

There are some good ISP's, but the competition from the large duopolies will eventually drive them out of business.
zed2608
Premium Member
join:2007-09-30
Cleveland, TN
kudos:1

zed2608

Premium Member

it depends on wether there is mass outrage from consumers in

form of calling congressmen etc and how the consumer reacts to the meter billing i doubt many isps are gonna jump ether way till they get cleaerer idea of how it is gonna shake out

S_engineer
Premium Member
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL

1 edit

S_engineer

Premium Member

Re: it depends on wether there is mass outrage from consumers in

The mass outrage could happen only if you could pry the masses away from such drival as Jersey Shores and Dancing With the Has-Beens and inform them on the predatory nature of this pricing scheme. Plus, the premise that a cap reduces congestion is absolutely false. This is what needs to be learned by our fearless leaders.

Theres one way we can enlighten the masses. Create a day when at a certain time, everybody start downloading Linux ISOs. Thus proving, that even when you have a small cap, it's irrelevant when talking about congestion. The only thing relevant will be over-subscription!
backness
join:2005-07-08
K2P OW2

backness

Member

I'd say

All the companies that tried to install a parallel IPTV infrastructure will try to implement caps and those who actually spent on the network instead will not.

Its a classic case where technological innovation bypasses an existing product. In this case, expensive IPTV gear is replaced by highspeed internet and a webbrowser connected to a TV.
jarrodholder
Premium Member
join:2002-07-22
Rossville, GA

jarrodholder

Premium Member

So glad to be gone

So glad I dropped ATT last year. I do miss some of the options I had on DirecTV, but much more happy (speed and price wise) with EPB Fiber.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop

Member

Re: So glad to be gone

EPB has caps too.
sparc
join:2006-05-06

sparc to jarrodholder

Member

to jarrodholder
why is ATT getting made out to be worse than all the other ISPs that have instituted caps?

Heck this article makes it sound like ATT is the first to start a cap and will cause the industry to change. Except it is really not any worse after comcast capped at 250gb.

karl's gloom and doom doesn't seem to be coming...

88615298
Premium Member
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness

88615298

Premium Member

Re: So glad to be gone

said by sparc:

why is ATT getting made out to be worse than all the other ISPs that have instituted caps?

Heck this article makes it sound like ATT is the first to start a cap and will cause the industry to change. Except it is really not any worse after comcast capped at 250gb.

karl's gloom and doom doesn't seem to be coming...

Comcast cap is soft. Never heard of anyone being cut off for using 251 GB a month.

PaulHikeS2
join:2003-03-06
Fitchburg, MA

PaulHikeS2

Member

Re: So glad to be gone

said by 88615298:

said by sparc:

why is ATT getting made out to be worse than all the other ISPs that have instituted caps?

Heck this article makes it sound like ATT is the first to start a cap and will cause the industry to change. Except it is really not any worse after comcast capped at 250gb.

karl's gloom and doom doesn't seem to be coming...

Comcast cap is soft. Never heard of anyone being cut off for using 251 GB a month.

Nor does Comcast charge an additional penny for going over the cap.
Hoss
Sauters A Walrus
join:2000-10-05
Tulsa, OK

Hoss

Member

Re: So glad to be gone

said by PaulHikeS2:

said by 88615298:

said by sparc:

why is ATT getting made out to be worse than all the other ISPs that have instituted caps?

Heck this article makes it sound like ATT is the first to start a cap and will cause the industry to change. Except it is really not any worse after comcast capped at 250gb.

karl's gloom and doom doesn't seem to be coming...

Comcast cap is soft. Never heard of anyone being cut off for using 251 GB a month.

Nor does Comcast charge an additional penny for going over the cap.

Cox is the same. Soft caps, so soft even that unless you are in a saturated node and aren't a habitual offender, you'll never ever know it from corporate.

Duramax08
To The Moon
Premium Member
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX

Duramax08

Premium Member

For a old technology

They are really trying to preserve it as much as possible. FFS, its copper.

en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA

en102

Member

They're all sheep

They'll all follow to a certain extent - but may offer different 'flavors' of cap/overage models.

Wall Street profits are tied to this, and I'd expect high pressure by WS for these carriers to implement - even if it is a very high cap/low overage charge. This will make bandwidth a commodity which can be raised / dropped by supply/demand ( of which we know that supply will tighten and demand will increase).

A relatively high cap will keep users from having overages/issues for a while - long enough to have overages/caps adopted for a decent amount of time by most carriers before users start seeing overages from items like Netflix/YouTube, etc.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop

Member

Re: They're all sheep

"Wall Street profits are tied to this"

I hate to break it to you but there are more ISPs that are not on Wall Street than ISPs that are.

Consumer greed has sent the message to Wall Street that it's OK to screw the consumer because they will line up and ask for more. They will take what ever crap is put on their plate as long as it's cheap. AT&T will not take a big hit on this and will likely raise any eyebrows in that 98% of people it does not effect. If the 2% it does effect leaves and goes else where then it's a Win for AT&T. They shed an unprofitable customer that will jump on their competition's network.
Skippy25
join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Skippy25

Member

Re: They're all sheep

said by battleop:

They shed an unprofitable customer that will jump on their competition's network.

Please teach me how someone that uses 10gb cost abundantly more than someone that uses even 1terabyte in traffic a month?

Once the infrastructure is in place it is fractions of a penny to move lots and lots of data. Enough that I would be willing to bet that if AT&T actually had a cost on this and you compared their lowest user with their highest user it would be indeterminable once it was rounded to the nearest penny.

This is just a stepping stone to the ultimate goal.

r81984
Fair and Balanced
Premium Member
join:2001-11-14
Katy, TX
·AT&T U-Verse

r81984

Premium Member

Re: They're all sheep

said by Skippy25:

said by battleop:

They shed an unprofitable customer that will jump on their competition's network.

Please teach me how someone that uses 10gb cost abundantly more than someone that uses even 1terabyte in traffic a month?

Once the infrastructure is in place it is fractions of a penny to move lots and lots of data. Enough that I would be willing to bet that if AT&T actually had a cost on this and you compared their lowest user with their highest user it would be indeterminable once it was rounded to the nearest penny.

This is just a stepping stone to the ultimate goal.

You are exactly right.
It is also sad how consumers are already brainwashed to believe caps save ISP costs and caps prevent them from paying for others high usage. We have a lot of stupid people in America that will believe lies.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop to Skippy25

Member

to Skippy25
DSLAMs are usually not connected with 10GE connections. Many are not even connected with 100Mb connections. I know of a market where most of the dslams are currently connected with bonded T1s.

Take one that's bonded with 8 T1s (12Mb). AT&T offers 6Mb DSL service in that area. There are probably 50 homes or so fed by that DSLAM and I would guess that most users have 3Mb service.

A very small number of users can ruin everyone's connection. While I agree that AT&T should upgrade, fiber does not just fall out of the sky and neither does the equipment needed to connect it at the CO.
Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO

Lazlow to battleop

Member

to battleop
I hate to break it to you but there are more people served by ISPs that are on Wall Street than people served by ISPs that are not.

att will also loose a lot of customers who just do not want to have to worry about caps. Unfortunately many people do not live in areas that will have any other choice. Be that another ISP that will serve them, an ISP that does not cap, or does not cap this low. Funny that on the same day this comes out, a major ISP in the UK stops using caps.

en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA

en102 to battleop

Member

to battleop
While I do agree that more ISPs are not on Wall Street that ISPs that are... the few that are - also run Internet backbones and are looking for more $$$:

AT&T, Comcast, TimeWarner, Verizon (haven't seen caps on their land based ISP yet) probably account for the vast majority of connections in the county.

Since these ISPs also run TV, they have an interest in capping - packet shaping to ensure that their TV and voice products aren't devalued.
jjeffeory
join:2002-12-04
USA

jjeffeory to battleop

Member

to battleop
Wow, I agree with you. And it is sad.

IPPlanMan
Holy Cable Modem Batman
join:2000-09-20
Washington, DC
kudos:1

IPPlanMan

Member

Metaphors...

Sports and "war" metaphors are annoying as hell and this guy is a schill of the highest order.

Hey AT&T: I just want you to know that my goal is to use as much unlimited data on my iPhone 4 as possible... And I'm doing it....

Overage this...

Duramax08
To The Moon
Premium Member
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX

Duramax08

Premium Member

Moffett the Douche

WTF? Why cant we have nice things without some dumbass screwing it up? We dont need your comments Moffett, you are doing more harm then good. Get out of the ISP's asses and see what the consumer wants. This is becoming total bullshit. Not even canada likes this UBB scheme. What makes you think we want this?

OMG those 0's and 1's from the pipe not being used are going to waste! What to do?
brianiscool
join:2000-08-16
Tampa, FL
kudos:1

brianiscool

Member

well

This will make people want Universal Broadband. I rather pay $20 - $30 in taxes for 100Mbs to the home.

Duramax08
To The Moon
Premium Member
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX

Duramax08

Premium Member

Re: well

I can already see the republicans crying "oh my gawd, obama is getting into the internet game, leave the goverment out of this!". Thats cool, we dont need competiton anyways. I dont mind getting screwed each bill every month, and if the isp wants to lower the quality of service that I get, I wont mind. Corporate greed all the way!

/sarcasm
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

patcat88

Member

Re: well

But the feds run the internet as it is, FBI, CIA, NSA, etc.

Duramax08
To The Moon
Premium Member
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX

Duramax08

Premium Member

Re: well

said by patcat88:

But the feds run the internet as it is, FBI, CIA, NSA, etc.

Probably for good reasons.

Drex
Beer...The other white meat.
Premium Member
join:2000-02-24
Not There
kudos:1

Drex to Duramax08

Premium Member

to Duramax08
»www.lusfiber.com/custom/?id=12

Local government run fiber to the home. The people voted for it, they got it, AT&T/Time Warner (I think) were not happy and tried to block it...

I'll take 10Mb synchronous for $30 a month.
MyDogHsFleas
Premium Member
join:2007-08-15
Austin, TX
kudos:5

MyDogHsFleas to brianiscool

Premium Member

to brianiscool
said by brianiscool:

This will make people want Universal Broadband. I rather pay $20 - $30 in taxes for 100Mbs to the home.

Me too! But I think it's a pipe dream. Either it'd cost hugely more, or there'd be all kinds of hidden subsidies that you're really paying for in the end. The math just doesn't work.
nanaki333
join:2010-08-11
Chantilly, VA

nanaki333

Member

bring on more muni fiber!

all the more reason for more areas to push for muni fiber.
milkman82
join:2006-06-19
Cleveland, OH

milkman82

Member

Re: bring on more muni fiber!

Yeah, I did not want to see that happen, but so true.

LH
@comcast.net

LH

Anon

soon to be ex AT&T DSL subscriber

As soon as I get the letter from AT&T I will cancel my service. Although I do not use anywhere near their proposed cap, it will only be a matter of time until they lower the caps and up the overage charges.

Lucky I have other choices for Internet access.

Time to get out now.
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

patcat88

Member

Re: soon to be ex AT&T DSL subscriber

And a 1000 other people will never open it and never care. They have paperless billing anyway. What do they know about overages?
Albert71292
join:2004-10-31
West Monroe, LA

Albert71292 to LH

Member

to LH
said by LH :

As soon as I get the letter from AT&T I will cancel my service. Although I do not use anywhere near their proposed cap, it will only be a matter of time until they lower the caps and up the overage charges.

Lucky I have other choices for Internet access.

Time to get out now.

I didn't wait for the letter. Went earlier this afternoon, signed up with a LOCAL DSL provider with NO caps! Should be active within 48 hours they said.

treichhart
join:2006-12-12

treichhart

Member

No I will not

soon as I get my wisp going I will not have any caps. I also dont think all isp's going to follow att,comcrap or any other isp's already have caps.

pokesph
It Is Almost Fast
Premium Member
join:2001-06-25
Sacramento, CA
kudos:1

pokesph

Premium Member

overages

I have no problem with being billed for overages.. AS LONG AS THAT OVERAGE is ABOVE and BEYOND what MY CURRENT PACKAGE / PLAN can realistically (i.e. real world bandwidth) supply.

example: 6 Mb/s = 1926.08191 GB /month max, less overhead = ~1770Gb /mo (1 771.99536 at 8% overhead) = set cap at 1700GB total /mo. etc..

Artificial caps are just a easy way to make even more money.

•••
sparks
join:2001-07-08
Little Rock, AR

sparks

Member

do they get a tax break for doing this?

Isn't comcast a 250GB cap?
To see at&t going even lower is just a greed setting for F the customer.
OF COURSE my opinion is F the customer even more than they are now.

and my service gets worse every week...but I am sure this will fix everything and they will cut their rates too.....YEA SURE

ps they dont' pay taxes unless you call the money they give to the politicians taxes.

fonzbear2000
Premium Member
join:2005-08-09
Saint Paul, MN

fonzbear2000

Premium Member

Actually, it's AT&T who have followed other ISP's

If I remember correctly, Comcast did it first, then Roadrunner, then Charter. I wonder who's next.
kevin_pink
join:2006-10-15
Bronx, NY

kevin_pink

Member

Re: Actually, it's AT&T who have followed other ISP's

i hope not Verizon
firedrakes
join:2009-01-29
Arcadia, FL

firedrakes

Member

another bad pr stunt happening

well this is going to backfire like other ones and it will be nice to watch
Mr Matt
join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
kudos:2
·Xfinity
·CenturyLink
·Millenicom

1 edit

Mr Matt

Member

ISP's should be requried to provide accurate meters.

First, if ISP's want to charge for usage they should be required by law to demonstrate that their meters are accurate just like the power company.

Second they will really get to gouge the customer because of rounding error. I am sure that the ISP weasels will charge the customer the $10.00 overage fee even if they only exceed their cap by 1 Kilobyte.

When AT&T was selling measured Wide Area Telephone Service Lines one part of the sales pitch was to advise the customer that they would save 20% on their long distance service with WATS over regular long distance because calls were billed in Six Second increments versus billing in One Minute increments. It will be great for profitability to charge customers $10.00 for one Kilobyte.

Edit:

Why not $1.00 per 5GB? $10.00 for 50GB = Greed

•••

spewak
R.I.P Dadkins
Premium Member
join:2001-08-07
Elk Grove, CA
kudos:1

spewak

Premium Member

+1million%

Follow times infinity!
Greedy basTURDs!

compuguybna
join:2009-06-17
Nashville, TN

compuguybna

Member

AT&T are greedy F**kers

AT&T is greedy ! ! ! ! !

I refrained from getting one their nice smartphones (Inspire or Atrix) strictly due to the fact of the 2GB cap for $25....

Then 1kb over, and you're popped with another $10 for 1GB.

Its simply milking customers for every cent they can.

while I dont stream movies on 3G, the phone is always pushing data updates and normal stuff a smartphone does, but i'll be damned if I'm going to pay an arm and a leg to own an AT&T smartphone.

I just bought a Virgin Mobile Optimus V from Sprint, and all of that is unlimited for $25 a month.

AT&T, take note, you need to change your business model and stop robbing your customers. (especially when Verizon has unlimited for $29)

rootuser
@comcast.net

rootuser

Anon

put em out of business

we seen enough of ma bell and at&t. time to move on. once the fiber speeds kick in with docsis 3 youll start to see dsl providers bite the dust. dsl=Disgusting Slow Lame. grow up at&t. just gives the cable companies now a reason to raise caps to keep ahead of dsl providers.
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