Shaw 'Listens,' Proceeds With Usage-Billing Anyway

Their information is false. Canadian consumers are not okay with paying more than what they already are.

and neither would people here in the USA.
shaw sounds like a real scumbag company

Not poker, not blackjack,,, pure Bullshit!

$40 a month for only 512 upload and a 60 gig cap! this is the real cap on crap...wait ... quite quiet! lets not talk to loud and let ATT hear about this !!!

It is funny it is like At&t never did their research on UBB. It requires a pure doupoly system like bell/rogers with no overlap of competition. Then both company's have to enforce overage fees on caps well lowering monthly caps. Sure ATT has little to no consumer loyalty which is usually a last resort or lesser or 2 evils kind of choice. UBB failed for shaw because it has to compete with Teksavvy,sasktel(planning on FTTH deployment,Telus(which does not enforce caps and now has IPTV for the all in one solution with bundle savings), Novus(fiber to apartments)

The question becomes can pissing off so many people and gouging people really more profitable then retaining or growing a client base.
I'm sure ATT thinks it can just buy up any competitors tell it is the only market left but technology is constantly advancing and trying to hold it back from the masses at this point is going to be impossible without a government mandated duopoly system that systematically prevents any competition. Even to the point of allowing the CRTC to effectively force Bells business model on customers that are not even theirs(if not for mass outrage it would have slipped threw).
--
Can you BOINC it?!?

Thats not really how much it is either. Its actually about 56 bucks a month after everything is said and done and all the bullshit "extra's" are factored in.

Teksavvy for 32 bucks a month with a 300gb cap anyone?
40 bucks for unlimited?

I wonder where i will be come june.

Win Win for customers and shareholders - Is that even possible?

Depends. Which reality are you talking about?

Yes - if it is something that cuts costs enough that part of the savings can go to lower costs for the consumer, and part goes to higher revenue.

UBB definitely does not fit that description.

It COULD be, if companies would remember the bygone era of "serving the customer first" and "growing the business for the long term". When you provide the best service out there, you'll have plenty of people willing to pay you money for it- hey, there's that "profit" stuff. But too many shareholders would rather have $5 now than $50 next week, and so everything is run for big next-quarter profits, no matter how much it hurts the customers or the business. After all, if the business goes down in flames, the shareholders can just sell short and go look for the Next Big Thing to cannibalize.
--
Justin Timberlake brought sexy back. I'm putting it away again.

This content may not be retransmitted by your cable company without significant rate increases!

Only in Shirley MacLaine's alternative universe.

I think anybody with an alternative provider should cancel SHAW service and convince their friends and family to do the same.

I mean I appreciate that you have opinions like:

sarcastic quote marks around "listens"
sarcastic comments about how Canadians "really love UBB"
"anti-competitive, punitive, and generally ridiculous"
"paying more money for the same service"
"steep new overage charges on all users"

But... how can I appreciate these opinions without you laying out the factual information first?

Just a simple table of "Here's what Shaw is planning to impose" with one row per tier, and the columns being base cost per month, base data allowance per month, size of data overage unit, and cost per overage unit per month.

This would actually lay out the facts first, before you launch into opinion. And give the reader a chance to appreciate and reflect on your opinions.

How does that sound? It would really help me as I read these news items. I'm tired of having to dig through links and other stories and forum posts to get the actual facts.

Thanks, Karl!

Only recent Shaw news was good. Internet speeds are up:
»www.canadiancontent.net/ ··· 066.html
I couldn't find anything recent about Shaw doing UBB changes anytime soon.
--
Record your speedtest.net results in DSLReports SpeedWave
»www.speedtest.net/wave/a ··· 84d45c88

I agree to a point that there is no conclusive evidence but after listening to the conference call last night it is clear they did not get the anti UBB memo we sent them.

The problem is shaw has been very secretive about UBB and its future plans for them. The first time they tried to slip UBB in was in an Edmonton pilot program that very few people were informed about it in a vague sense(letters only sent to people marked as going over caps consistently by a meter that was vastly inaccurate and under reported). This was around november december when everyone was busy with the holiday season which was a good distraction and prevent real protests from forming due to the cold winters. On December 18 or around their they tried to sneak vastly lowered monthly caps in well nobody was paying attention but they got caught.

Lowering caps and enforcing overage fees because their pilot system was so successful(people in Edmonton had not even been billed for their overage costs yet because their was 2 month grace period of being able to go over their now nerfed caps) it was claimed no consumers would be effect(or 2-5%) due to no complaints. That was when the anti shaw movement really started to take off.

My point is shaw has a history of jumping the gun and coming out of nowhere with these kind of things. Heck their official UBB announcement was from a rep these forums who has not shown his face since the UBB backfired. If he had never said nothing we would not have even known about UBB until it was in place. Most people were not even sent letters about usage during months that were in our 2 month grace period so we were not going to find out until the huge bill came.

»Shaw charging for extra bandwidth.....

"Hello all. James from Shaw here.

I've seen a lot of discussion here about the new policy, and quite a bit of inaccurate or incomplete information and speculation, so I'd just like to set all of this straight.

Essentially, the system works like this: your package includes an allowance for a certain amount of traffic. If you exceed that traffic for one billing cycle, you will receive a notice on your bill advising you of the fact. We also automatically activate your traffic monitor so that you can monitor your usage from that time forward.

Since the bill arrives, of necessity, after your billing cycle ends, we give you a cycle's grace between the period when you exceeded and when we start charging. That is to say that if you exceed in billing cycle one, you'll receive your bill part of the way through billing cycle two, and so we won't start charging for excess traffic until billing cycle three.

As to how much bandwidth will cost, here's how it works:
If you exceed your monthly traffic allowance, you'll receive a bill for $1 per GB for Extreme and above, $2 per GB for High Speed and High Speed Lite. Considering how much media, etc, you can obtain in 1 GB, $1 is not expensive.
However, if you plan to exceed by a considerable margin, data packs are also available, and what these do is allow you to increase the traffic allowance by the following amounts:

$5 for 10 GB
$20 for 60 GB
$50 for 250 GB

So this gives you the option to increase your monthly traffic allowance to meet your needs. It's also considerably less expensive than the standard $1-$2 per GB rate.

The best part about the data packs is that you can apply them at any time up to three days before the end of your billing cycle. So if you discover that you've exceeded your included usage allowance, and still have three days to the end of the billing cycle, just give us a call (or chat) and ask that we add the appropriate data pack for you."

It is clear that mentality is still in place at shaw and they are waiting for the right time(when they can get telus to collude with overage fees i reckon) to put UBB in place.
--
Can you BOINC it?!?

I have read what you posted and still see nothing whatsoever that contradicts what Karl said and what he was getting at.

The cap being at 100gb (which in itself is laughable in a growing amount of video-using homes...and expanding) is what Shaw was forced to do after MASSIVE backlash for their 15gb initial limit.

I mean, seriously....15gb? Can you think of a single reason for such a low limit other than intentionally screwing consumers?

Do we really think they ACTUALLY spoke to people and they WANTED to pay more?

I wasn't trying to contradict Karl. I simply wanted to know what the numbers actually are, and I thought it was reasonable to ask for that somewhere in the story, preferably up front. Then the editoralizing can start. For all I know I'd totally agree with everything Karl said, but I have no data, so how do I figure that out?

In the past I've complained about this several times. I'd rather not have to spend time digging through links, stories, and forums. Why shouldn't that be the job of the reporter, to gather the facts?

And what else would we expect out of you?

Maybe it is me, but I am smart enough to realize this is not a "Fact News Site". It is an "Editorial News Site" that gives the runner of the site the opportunity to give his opinion in posting of the news he so chooses and gives the user's the opportunity to give theirs. Which is the entire reason you troll around here to begin with.

Me personally, knowing what Shaw and ATT and all the other monopolistic crap companies are up to, agree with him and see his quotes and sarcasm as entertainment and "facts".

Am I the only one who doesn't know what Shaw is doing? What good does an editorial do if it's not introduced with some background for those who are not up to speed?

You're welcome.

So, you added the one graphic for the low cost option? Or was it already there?

Really looking for a table like this, with one row for each tier:

Cost/mo | Speed | GB limit | Add'l data cost | Add'l data amt. GB

a) Declining costs or not, they can't be expected to give up their video revenue without a price increase.

b) The overall environment the big Canadian ISP's (lack of competition, regulatory support) offer a huge opportunity for them to take some advantage of. The equivalent of leaving money on the table, and risking business malpractice if they don't.

c) The absolute worst thing that could happen is that they 'might', have to roll back a varying portion of the UBB changes.

d) Corporations are by their very nature amoral entities, and have no interest in the benefit of consumers beyond the rewards of the market. (see b)

Re to a) - Why? If there was a competitive marketplace then they would not be able to increase price without losing market share, thus losing even more than just the lowered video revenue.

I don't know why companies seem to think they are entitled to a set amount of profits and growth and anything they do to keep that up is immediately okay.

You have to keep in mind that Jason boy here is of the distorted view that it is all OK for the immediate and instant gratification of profits as well.

The single biggest issue in the US and Canada is the lack of competition. A very close second is the bought and paid for governmental and regulatory systems put in place to protect the "people" that actually protect the corporations first.

It's sad but true. I'd say it's because we're too nice, nice to a fault even.

Having shareholder profits as the number one priority seems to screw over the other stakeholders in business.

There are ample court decisions, both in Canada & US, which place the shareholder's interests first - ahead of employees, customers, and the country.

The UBB boys have not described what their customers will be paying for. Are they going to charge for system overhead? Apparently Comcast developed a method to filter out traffic related to system overhead. It should be mandatory to have a ISP's prove the accuracy of their metering system before they are permitted to be used to charge customers. It would be great to have an independent test of actual data carried versus data usage billed for.

This is Canada he's talking about. The isp's in Canada make up whatever they want and you get billed like it or not. If you have the funds and track your bandwidth sue like thousands have done in the eastern parts of Canada already.

when one of the shareholders goes way over their cap? maybe when they start noticing how stupid it is, they'll rethink it

SURE, bring it on ... BUT YOU MUST HAVE ZERO MONTHLY BASE FEE AND ALL DATA IS BER BYTE - no BS ... Oh wait, they want to gouge you with a big fee AND pay PER BYTE! DOUBLE DIPPING!!! Bastards!

UBB for WIRED INTERNET is really stupid, I hope anyone that implements it FAILS and CRUMBLES!!!

I like the way you think.

okay lets see what we've learned
1) shaw cable doesn't care at all
2) there needs to be a lawsuit as soon as possible
3) we're still paying asinine prices of "series of tubes"
4) this country needs more competition and no ACTA
5) we're still the laughing stock of the world when it comes to "series of tubes"
6) the ISP CEO's still make over $12,XXX while everyone else is going bankrupt

Should I add more? I think it seems pretty conclusive things need to change and not just in the "shaw" sarcastic way.

Can you site some facts or an article for this piece of news? Seems that it is personal, and I can't seem to find this hard hitting news anywhere else.

Don't let facts get in the way of a good story!

Seriously Karl. Put up or pull the "made up" article.

The audio is from the meeting of shaw directors with investors. Its proof enough.

Oh really!
you wouldn't know by looking at all the UBB rants in the canadian forums.
--
The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese

Ah, Shaw sure likes short term gain for long term pain. OTA is now available in my city for multiple channels for HDTV goodness. My shaw cable gets cut this summer after 20 years of service.

Other wired internet providers are available that don't have these rediculous 'overage' charges. Also, wireless providers are in a position to take over the market in the next 5 years. My shaw internet is getting cut next week.

Cellular services from unlimited providers have now made my home phone service useless. My shaw home phone is getting cut next week.

There you go shaw, try and get fewer customers to each pay more than their fair share.

Bad business model.

I actually emailed shaw about this while i was at college today, never got a response out of them after i sent the youtube link.

In the replies i received i got nothing but denial, same with the phone calls.

Way to go shaw.. after UBB prepare to never see another dime

Canada has become a digital ghetto and our ISPs are the slumlords.

Don't let it happen to you.

I attended a Shaw Customer meeting and I did say:

"If Shaw attempts to monetize their customer base more through UBB or other methods I will leave for a provider not attempting to do this"

This is not win-win, and I will not be continue to be with Shaw.

Heres "The" deal, Right now it is cheaper to buy SSHDD "Solid State" Gig/Gig Ship them and then throw it out. Over Buying internet from an isp. Remember I said per Gig and I don't mean "bite".

Let us break down this situation. Say I run a company that provides internet. I need Hardware and if I can not service it my self I need to pay someone else to do it. Then I need software and also the same problem arises in servicing. I need access to lines or run my own and running my own is really costly and not just in wires. Well I have almost got a business now I just need employees and a few managers $, A place to run it all and well of course lots of power and we know how much that costs. >.

Say I have a well developed business running that has all these extra costs involved which are not even required to be there. I charge people 50$ a month for internet. "Which is the average for cable, phone and internet monthly" I have a base of 500,000 Customers in lets say Canada a population of 33mil. I am pulling in 25 million per month.

In 5 Major cities I run establishments that each deal with 100k people. I have 2000 people that I pay 22$/hour to run my business I pay 11mil/mo just to have it running 9 hours. Each person deals with an estimate of 250 people a day if thats even needed which most of the time its not. Say my power bill is 3m/mo and rent is also 3m/mo "5 buildings that house 2000 people 9 hours a day"

Okay my bills are around 17m I am making 25m that leaves me with 8m/mo...... I personally know nothing about a business or how much it actually costs to do it but I can assure you If I where running a business It would be for efficiency and quality not profit.

With all of this said, Re arrange your business so if you charge us this month cost we are not paying to run your business we are paying for the service And I DO NOT mean someone to talk to when something goes wrong.

Hey all. I am a tech for one of the big telco companies so i thought i would put that up front. The usage based thing is short sighted and hopefully the company i work for doesn't implement it. I wrote the different parties about my thoughts and the only one who actually said something useful was the NDP. I have been a long time conservative voter but the CRTC taking the side of big business on numerous occasions (ex letting cable companies and telcos not have to apply for price increases, the UBB and numerous others) has shown me that the government has swung to far towards big business. When a consumer organization is blatantly ignoring its mandate we have an issue. Anyways here is the letter I received from the NDP Make sure you vote May 2...
------------------------------------------------------

Thank you for your previous email regarding consumer issues. I provide
this email as an update on our plans to protect Canadian consumers and
put them first in the digital economy.

I have heard from thousands of Canadians who tell me that internet
access and cell phone affordability are critical issues for them. Please
know that New Democrats recognize the importance of these issues in
today's rapidly changing society.

The following are highlights from our 2011 election plan:

- We will prohibit all forms of usage-based billing (UBB) by Internet
Service Providers (ISPs);
- We will unlock cells phones, allowing consumers to change providers
without changing phones;
- We will rescind the 2006 Conservative industry-oriented directive to
the CRTC and direct the regulator to stand up for the public interest,
not just the major telecommunications companies;
- We will enshrine "net neutrality" in law, end price gouging and "net
throttling," with clear rules for Internet Service Providers (ISPs),
enforced by the CRTC; and,
- We will apply the proceeds from the advanced wireless spectrum auction
to ensure all Canadians, no matter where they live, will have quality
high-speed broadband internet access.

For more details, I invite you to visit these links:
»www.ndp.ca/press/layton- ··· -economy
and
»www.ndp.ca/platform/lead ··· ion-5-14.

--------------------------------
Make it an election issue as with everything else they will all screw it up equally anyways.

I've been voting for the conservatives for the last 7 years. They have so far refused to take a stand on UBB. It seems like I'm voting for the NDP this year.

I'll be canceling both my digital cable and internet if Cogeco decides to go the same route.

I'll put that same amount of money to good use like going on vacations. Don't worry Cogeco I'll send you a postcard.

Older technology is supposed to get cheaper not more expensive. I remember paying $200 for 4 MB of RAM for my 486. Now a days you can get at least 4 GB ( 1000 times that ) for less than $100.

Companies only understand one thing, and that's money. They will only understand a loss.

Since the CRTC hasn't grown a pair yet, if enough people band together and cancel all services with these companies, you will see a change.

I think people have grown an addiction to both cable TV and the internet. I am one of those people but, I'm not one of those people who bends over and accepts being run over.

My family will learn to go outside and do things that don't cost as much like hiking, playing soccer.