1 recommendation |
milnoc
Member
2011-May-23 8:52 am
Fools!North Carolina, say goodbye to any economic development in the technological sector.
You fools! | |
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| FFH5 Premium Member join:2002-03-03 Tavistock NJ |
FFH5
Premium Member
2011-May-23 9:03 am
Re: Fools!said by milnoc:North Carolina, say goodbye to any economic development in the technological sector.
You fools! That is a gross overstatement. Say that to all the tech firms in RTP. This law will have virtually zero effect on whether NC continues to be a tech center or not. Cities, instead of building broadband systems, can use the money saved to reduce business taxes. That will do a lot more for encouraging businesses to locate in NC. | |
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tman852
Member
2011-May-23 10:37 am
Re: Fools!said by FFH5 Cities, instead of building broadband systems, can use the money saved to reduce business taxes Won't happen. If businesses really want lower taxes, they'll move out of this country period, like many have already. | |
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Re: Fools!I have to agree what the companys are doing is moving over seas. We need strict fedral laws with big fines or etc for comapnies that do that. | |
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| | | | pinjas join:2011-01-31 River Falls, WI |
pinjas
Member
2011-May-23 8:30 pm
Re: Fools!Not fines, import levies. Do away with income tax, make it pure sales tax and create import levies. Not only would that elimiate the gross and vast number of ridiculous loop holes in the taxation system, it would also eliminate the concept of saving cash on taxes for big business taxing advantage of cheap labor and no taxes. | |
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| | marigoldsGainfully employed, finally MVM join:2002-05-13 Saint Louis, MO |
to FFH5
said by FFH5:Cities, instead of building broadband systems, can use the money saved to reduce business taxes. That will do a lot more for encouraging businesses to locate in NC. Except that cities in North Carolina have no control over business taxes. Those are set at the State level only. | |
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to FFH5
said by FFH5:said by milnoc:North Carolina, say goodbye to any economic development in the technological sector.
You fools! That is a gross overstatement. Say that to all the tech firms in RTP. This law will have virtually zero effect on whether NC continues to be a tech center or not. Cities, instead of building broadband systems, can use the money saved to reduce business taxes. That will do a lot more for encouraging businesses to locate in NC. That doesn't even make sense. Money for building the fiber networks comes from bonds, not taxpayers. Instead now taxpayers have to pay inflated monopoly rates to Time Warner to satiate their profit margins, and you're suggesting they *lower* business taxes? Where will the money come from? | |
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| | | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144
1 recommendation |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 10:51 am
Re: Fools!Who pays the bondholders if projects fail? I realize the answer depends on the circumstances, but it's not always that clear cut.
There's a whole debate regarding the viability and benefit of lowering/eliminating corporate taxes. | |
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| | | | marigoldsGainfully employed, finally MVM join:2002-05-13 Saint Louis, MO |
Re: Fools!said by openbox9:Who pays the bondholders if projects fail? I realize the answer depends on the circumstances, but it's not always that clear cut.
There's a whole debate regarding the viability and benefit of lowering/eliminating corporate taxes. While the bond backing could come from many sources, it almost never is the State. So, the bond backing for the projects should have zero effect on corporate taxes. | |
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| | | | | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 10:59 am
Re: Fools!I didn't mean to suggest that it does. Pros/Cons of corporate taxes and bond liabilities are two separate discussions. | |
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Re: Fools!not fools but greedy motherfuckers. more stupidity form the us government. | |
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| | | | | | | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 7:24 pm
Re: Fools!You mean North Carolina state government. | |
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| | | | rebus9 join:2002-03-26 Tampa Bay |
to openbox9
said by openbox9:Who pays the bondholders if projects fail? I realize the answer depends on the circumstances, but it's not always that clear cut. It's unlikely a fiber buildout would fail, if the incumbent(s) are neglecting a territory. And if the network does run into financial issues, the residents could vote to sell it off to a commercial entity. I seriously doubt there would be no takers of an already-built and in-production FTTP network. | |
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to sonicmerlin
Exactly! talk about corporate Totalitarianism, they want to control every aspect of your life, and now they will control broadband in every town and people have lost the right to vote on any sort of municipal broadband project. So now Broadband will falter in that state in the long term unless this is resolved quickly. Just think, it's bigger than just municipalities not being come together and provide there own internet service through bonds for instance, THIS IS THE START OF A LOSS OF A RIGHT, what's next, electricity? sewage?! Deficit_Hawk rarely says anything worth to consider to take seriously, he just spews what ATT/Verizon/Comcast/TWC whatever huge corporation that wants something there way he is one of the main cheerleaders for that on this for them, he really doesn't care what they say, because they are always right about everything according to him it seems. The best thing is, Deficit_Hawk touts that the money should be used for lowering business taxes, like as sonic says, the money will be coming somewhere, and now people will be paying more money for hugely inflated "taxes" (aka "because we can fees") and real taxes because of this. Tell me how that saves money? oh wait it doesn't . | |
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| | | | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 12:34 pm
Re: Fools!said by aboben3 :and now they will control broadband in every town and people have lost the right to vote on any sort of municipal broadband project. Read the bill. | |
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| | axus join:2001-06-18 Washington, DC |
to FFH5
I think he means good bye to "additional" economic development, like Sweden and South Korea have from their broadband initiatives. The status quo of broadband monopolies and duopolies probably don't actually destroy economic value except in their own industries. | |
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| TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus join:2001-06-20 Cheyenne, WY |
to milnoc
A friend of mine was going to transfer to a VA hospital in NC. He looked at the housing market, houses that have been on the market for extended periods of time make for good prices then he found out the property taxes had not been adjusted for the actual value so he could have purchased a 300,000 dollar house for half that price but the property tax would still be assessed for a 300,000 dollar house. He wisely decided to stay where he was. | |
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| | ke4pym Premium Member join:2004-07-24 Charlotte, NC |
ke4pym
Premium Member
2011-May-23 9:40 am
Re: Fools!said by Transmaster:A friend of mine was going to transfer to a VA hospital in NC. He looked at the housing market, houses that have been on the market for extended periods of time make for good prices then he found out the property taxes had not been adjusted for the actual value so he could have purchased a 300,000 dollar house for half that price but the property tax would still be assessed for a 300,000 dollar house. He wisely decided to stay where he was. This state has a law that requires counties to conduct property reevaulations every 8 years. So, if it hasn't been done, it'll be done soon. | |
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| | | ArrayListDevOps Premium Member join:2005-03-19 Mullica Hill, NJ |
Re: Fools!they have the same law here but they just make up things to keep the property taxes high. they have to make sure the budget isn't too far in the red. | |
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| | | | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 10:33 am
Re: Fools!You can usually request a review of your assessment anytime you believe it to be in error. It depends on the county as far as how difficult or easy the process might be. | |
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| | | | | WhatNow Premium Member join:2009-05-06 Charlotte, NC |
WhatNow
Premium Member
2011-May-23 4:55 pm
Re: Fools!openbox9 is correct your friend could have appealed the assessment. If he paid less then $300K he would have a strong case. | |
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to Transmaster
Normal in most cities. The $1,000,000+ homes are usually under-assessed though. | |
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to milnoc
Welcome to North Carolina we have a stupid governor I sure didn't vote for her !! | |
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to milnoc
It will not prevent tech investment. However, it is still a defeat for the people of NC. On the the other hand, the people of this state chose these kinds of politicans to represent them and especially in the general assembly where this should have not had a chance in the first place. My fellow NC citizens, you made poor choices in last year's election. And the current republicans have not fixed the state budget but rather squandering their time on petty disputes and "moral" issues. Also wasting OUR time wanting to create local, useless fiat currency that would only be good in NC. Politicians in general are idiots. Its apparent that purdue is sold out like the rest. I won't vote for her again. | |
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| | openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
openbox9
Premium Member
2011-May-23 10:35 am
Re: Fools!said by jkeelsnc:On the the other hand, the people of this state chose these kinds of politicans to represent them and especially in the general assembly where this should have not had a chance in the first place. Bingo. The people have spoken through their elected officials. If a majority of them are dissatisfied, then they can voice their opinions during future elections. My guess is that a majority won't know, or care enough, to make a difference. | |
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to jkeelsnc
What?? Currently I thought only the federal government could print and mint money? Thats just plain illegal. Well, i suppose theres a bad portion in every bunch... Of coarse the Dems are by no means any better. Our current batch of politicos' are somewhat goofy. If they ever go though with such arediculas plan you should put them to impeachment, for forsaking their oath of office and their loyalty to the United states constitution. | |
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| rebus9 join:2002-03-26 Tampa Bay |
to milnoc
said by milnoc:North Carolina, say goodbye to any economic development in the technological sector.
You fools! I tend to agree. My family is in a desperately under-served market where the only choice at all is Morris Broadband. There are no wireless carriers, and DSL never made it to the area. Anyone who's had Morris knows they leave a LOT to be desired. A competitively priced FTTP buildout would pick up a lot of subscribers pretty quickly in that area. | |
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Matt3All noise, no signal. Premium Member join:2003-07-20 Jamestown, NC |
Matt3
Premium Member
2011-May-23 8:53 am
VotingI voted for her. I won't be in the next election. | |
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GovtControl
Anon
2011-May-23 9:27 am
Re: VotingMaybe this "Flooz" will end up as a Sr. VP at Time Warner, just like that D-Bag over at Comcast....
How dare we let our citizens decide what they want.... remember, TW is the one that said "Customers want this"
Looks like TW Has been selling cool-aid along the side of the road again.... WTF | |
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to Matt3
I agree. I have agreed with some of the things the governor has done. But she has not lived up to what should be done in this state. And she folded like a cheap lawn chair on this broadband bill. Time to find someone else to do the job. | |
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TypicalThis is typical for a democrat governor. Democrats have only one agenda. Buying votes by keeping donors happy. Time Warner probably gave her a big donation. | |
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Robert Premium Member join:2001-08-25 Miami, FL |
Robert
Premium Member
2011-May-23 9:07 am
And...quote: There is a need to establish rules to prevent cities and towns from having an unfair advantage over providers in the private sector.
And there needs to be established rules to prevent the private sector from having an unfair advantage over cities and towns. It's clear that she was bought and is owned by TW. NC - please vote her out. | |
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gatorkramNeed for Speed Premium Member join:2002-07-22 Winterville, NC |
SuddenLinkWhile this does effect the whole state, here in my area, we have CenturyLink on the DSL side, and it's a very poor product, but we also have SuddenLink on the cable side, and they have been doing a lot of upgrades, for no other reason, but for pride of the company, and to outdo anything Centurylink could offer without doing fiber.
We can get 50 down and 3 up as of right now, it is a bit on the expensive side, $100 a month, but I enjoy it so much, I have 2 connections in my house for it.
So here in Greenville NC, I think we are being taken good care of, well enough for now, not to need any local efforts.
As soon as they turn up the 107/5 package here, who knows what the future holds, I know I am excited. | |
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Duramax08To The Moon Premium Member join:2008-08-03 San Antonio, TX |
I'd pitch in a few bucks To get her a nascar jacket with logos from TWC and such and mail it to her. Was looking for that pic someone posted but cant seem to find it... | |
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| KearnstdSpace Elf Premium Member join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ |
Kearnstd
Premium Member
2011-May-23 11:50 am
Re: I'd pitch in a few bucksActually I think all of our Lawmakers should wear NASCAR jackets.
If Jeff Gordan is not afraid to tell us who pays his bills than why should our bought out lawmakers be scared to. | |
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| winsyrstrifeRiver City Bounce Premium Member join:2002-04-30 Brooklyn, NY |
to Duramax08
» www.sodahead.com/enterta ··· -262615/Here ya go. I'm not sure what the problem is with communities wiring themselves with decent internet services...if TW has shown they have no interest in doing so themselves, should the community be forced to wait another 7-15 years before they're up for another provisioning review? | |
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io chico Premium Member join:2003-12-30 Marble Falls, TX |
io chico
Premium Member
2011-May-23 9:58 am
GenderI know this is sexist, but I'm naive enough to have thought that women in politics would make a difference. I was wrong. I'm ashamed of both sexes and both Demo & Rep. | |
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embarrassment for AmericaWhat an embarrassment for America. This is a complete and total free market failure. | |
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Not a complete surpriseAll this proves is what I've known for a while now. Both parties are bought and owned by corporations. I was reading a post here a minute ago blaming democrats. And yet at ONE time the democrats used to fight against bills like this. Not anymore. They are bought just the same as the republicans. Furthermore, the republican majority in the house and senate were really the force that made all of this possible. Every year prior to this the democrat controlled general assembly refused to pass the bill. This also shows that if you have enough money, enough lawyers, and enough money in the back pockets of politicians and enough patience that you can now buy anything you want want from the government in America. It definitely is no longer "for the people, by the people" of this country. I think its time to kick out ALL the politicians and outlaw all political parties and outlaw politicans from receiving any private donations or using any of their own money for political campaigns. Have limited public campaign funds and no political parties. Also, every office in the land down to the lowest level town alderman should have term limits. | |
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waynemr
Member
2011-May-23 10:19 am
Why the fear?This always perplexed me and nobody has ever given me a good answer to it.
If the conservatives believe government-run programs are so wasteful, inefficient, and doomed to failure, why are they so afraid of muni-broadband? What is to fear? Clearly, if government-run broadband is going to be such a failure, then the commercial alternatives should be able to easily surpass them in quality and service.
If the commercial providers don't have a product that is clearly superior to any government-run program, certainly doomed to failure, then perhaps those commercial providers should make a better product.
By having local governments provide the lowest tier of broadband service, it sets a benchmark for commercial providers to meet and exceed. | |
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Re: Why the fear?Valid point. I think that TWC's main objection was that the municipality would have a huge cost advantage because the city already owns its own property and doesn't have to pay taxes to themselves for the systems and property used to provide the service. That is a cost advantage that could be passed on to the customer that TWC cannot match. If they own any property in a city or county (buildings, vehicles, etc) then TWC has to pay taxes on this. Well, I say 'WHAAAHHHH!" for TWC. the bill is written so that the county or city that does provide a service has to pay itself the equivalent costs and expenses that TWC does which is a bunch of BS. Why would you make taxpayers pay an extra tax or fees to their own government (to match TWC expenses) for property that the municipality owns? That is just artificially inflating the cost so that it costs the taxpayer more to provide such a service to the ADVANTAGE of TWC. TWC doesn't deserve my money and these politicians need to be kicked out of office. Sadly, NC has embraced the ignorant tea party and right wing republicans (lately corporate bought democrats as well) in state government more than it has in the past so we are stuck with this. When I am done with grad school here I think I will move away. The people of NC have really voted some real idiots into the general assembly lately. They claimed they would balance the state budget. But all they've really done is sit around squandering time on other useless issues like creating a local "currency" and focused most of their time on "moral" issues they "disagree" with. I think when I get out of grad school I will leave this sinking ship of a state and go somewhere else where people know a little more about what is really going on in the world. | |
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| openbox9 Premium Member join:2004-01-26 71144 |
to waynemr
said by waynemr:If the conservatives believe government-run programs are so wasteful, inefficient, and doomed to failure, why are they so afraid of muni-broadband? Precisely for the reasons you point out? said by waynemr:Clearly, if government-run broadband is going to be such a failure, then the commercial alternatives should be able to easily surpass them in quality and service. But the government-run, taxpayer funded, projects have unlimited resources (paid for by you whether you want to or not) to ensure the projects don't fail. That's a primary complaint of the private sector. | |
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HB 129If I had been the governor I would have signed it but only if one provision was added. "None of the provisions of this bill will apply or are binding in any city, county or municipality in the state of North Carolina unless there are at least three private internet service providers available for internet service in at least 95% of the area of a city, county or municipality". Then I would sign the bill otherwise I would veto it. The above provision would basically gut the bill and prevent it from being applied in places that are under or unserved. Many of the places that are the most likely to need to create a municipal system could do so. Granted, here in Greensboro where the choices are still not GREAT (TWC, ATT, Clear) it would apply and the city and county wouldn't really be able to provide such a service. Surrounding counties that have less service could though. | |
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idoitsFreaking morons (checks North Carolina off the list of future move to spots) | |
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Yet another shining example wherepeople can scream and yell about the big-bad government only for their own private interests yet turn around and use the big-bad government whenever it suits them
The stupidity and hypocrisy is frankly still amazing to me and it shouldn't since it happens daily | |
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Re: Yet another shining example whereYour statement is duplicitous and not surprising given that you are in DC. I assume that you spend your time lobbying politicians with private money in Washington. | |
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Re: Yet another shining example wheresaid by jkeelsnc:Your statement is duplicitous and not surprising given that you are in DC. I assume that you spend your time lobbying politicians with private money in Washington. Setting aside that numerous people here know who I am (in the sense that they know me personally and know what I do for a living which has no relevance to government work), I am sure you do wish that I lobby because otherwise, you would be embarrassed trying to argue the merits of the hypocrisy in crying about the big-bad government. People like you are why more and more of the country turn away from political arguments, period. They hear people crying about the government one day then DEMANDING why they are not doing more in their time of need. Peoples necks must be killing them from the whiplashes caused by their turnarounds. I assume you have a low-paying job that causes you to be angry at others for your own failings and the government is an easy target b/c you can kick and scream like a child with nothing factual behind it and sound 'cool' to a certain part of the country. | |
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Ubee E31U2V1 (Software) pfSense Netgear WNR3500L
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post on her facebookI dont even live in NC, and I feel if we, the people, whether we live in NC or not, should post on her sites, her walls, her twitters, and send her letters to show our complete displeasure of how she sold out.
I have mailed a letter to MN representatives, and senators at the state and federal level(wasn't free, but it wasn't that much, Email where you can). I have received several hand written responses on bill that has been passed in MN regarding laws like this, and how they effectively remove a source of competition. However unfair, a muni's funds ARE NOT bottomless (i worked for a city, as a finance manager, i should know :P), actually, if the corporations wanted to, they could stomp on the muni projects themselves(speed, price, area), but the corporations chose to, instead, spend that money to lobby and buy laws, and pay out bonuses, where as, a muni spends it on service, and look what it gives the consumers. TBH, i think all corporate shills are obvious in the government, because they vote outside of party lines(dems would NEVER vote for this, as its against party lines to want less gov't, but many did in NC, hmmmm.....) on corporate sponsored bills. | |
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Avila Lied...PeriodWhat is so sad about all this is that Marilyn Avila lied and the rest of either went along or believed it was true. It is rather disgusting I think that elected officials would vote for a bill they HAD to know was not only against the good of rural communities , but was also overwhelmingly unpopular with constituents. Avila on many occasions could not even answer questions about the bill and referred them to the TWC lobbyist! Someone needs to relate to Avila the Hun that "Though Shalt Not Bare False Witness" is one of the big ten... | |
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IHateNC
Anon
2011-May-23 7:01 pm
IdiotsThe slowest form of broadband wasn't even offered in my area, outskirts of hickory, until about 5 years ago when we had Light Leap. About 3 years ago Embarq finally offered broadband to us. We were forced to purchase the bundle since we can't get Cable here and the prices were so high without bundling.
Even though the tech that checked my line said we can get a 3 MB connection Century Link will not offer it to us and refuses to upgrade our connection even though our address is listed right on their web page as qualifying for it. So I'm stuck with 768 which actually is around 600 as the download speeds are always 60Kbps.
This bill has made it so that the only other option I have is to go back to Light Leap and pay $99 per month just for 1.5MB internet. | |
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| ophelus join:2004-01-11 Kansas City, MO |
Re: Idiotssaid by IHateNC :The slowest form of broadband wasn't even offered in my area, outskirts of hickory, until about 5 years ago when we had Light Leap. About 3 years ago Embarq finally offered broadband to us. We were forced to purchase the bundle since we can't get Cable here and the prices were so high without bundling.
Even though the tech that checked my line said we can get a 3 MB connection Century Link will not offer it to us and refuses to upgrade our connection even though our address is listed right on their web page as qualifying for it. So I'm stuck with 768 which actually is around 600 as the download speeds are always 60Kbps.
This bill has made it so that the only other option I have is to go back to Light Leap and pay $99 per month just for 1.5MB internet. You should be able to get EVDO from sprint/verizon just about anywhere.. you might check into that.. though there are caps and higher ping times.. (the price maybe lower) the LTE deployments going on the next few years may also give you some new options | |
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GARBAGE!I'm glad i moved out of NC half ass backwards state i wonder how much money Time warner cable paid them off to pass this bill..
What a bunch of horse s***. | |
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FreedomBuildWell done is better than well said Premium Member join:2004-10-08 Rockford, IL |
Election campaing funds"Time Warner Cable lobbying in the state has finally paid off" Well we know someone was paid for sure | |
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Against ALLIn current days of our mass-corruption, corporate buy-out and 8-12% voter turnout for some politician office elections, we (citizens of that state/county etc) should obviously have an option of "Against ALL" -A.K.A. Mickey Mouse name spot just to show how many people actually do not agree with any dirt politicians now.
And it should be mandatory to have an impeachment option out of any public servant position, elected or not, that is available at any time via ballet submissions. If certain % of voters vote on removal then bye-bye and no any kind of severance packages or any other money-laundering shills bonuses.
Might as well throw in mandatory COMPLETE income reports for every politicians and their family down to the last cent. | |
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