 vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD
| SpamAssasin the HDTV version Need I say more? How hard would it be to detect computer data in an MPEG stream? Also equipment manf. arent in support of this move so "whoops" someone stole our white papers on what we use to block the signals.
I guess the secret is out:/
Just like region free DVD players.
Edit: Woo hoo first post!!!!
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I tie a rope around my penis and jump from a tree, don't you wanna grow up to be just like me!!!!
[text was edited by author 2003-11-05 09:42:04] | |
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cyberthugin
join:2002-03-12
Kew Gardens, NY | Re: SpamAssasin the HDTV version Anyone have a mod chip? | |
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X_Digit
Binary Enhanced
Premium
join:2003-06-12
Mansfield, TX
| Yeah right... "ensures that Americans will continue to receive free, high quality programming in the digital age."
Yeah right, who are they kidding? Ensuring FREE high-quality programming? Come on people... we've learned NOTHING is for free at about the age of 7. Any company with a statement like that makes me run in the opposite direction! | |
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| m_2jo
join:2003-10-29
27000 |  Re: Yeah right...
see ya | |
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TheHelpful1
Premium
join:2002-01-11
Upper Marlboro, MD
| If the broadcast is FREE the first time around, who the hell cares if someone records it to their PC for later viewing, or transfers said record to a friend who may have been out of town?
Oh wait, this means that the out-of-town friend won't be buying the Shows DVD when it comes out because their ever-vigalent friend (first guy) has recorded ALL the shows in digital content to his PC.
So what this boils down to is, first time is free, seconds are an arm and a leg?
Sounds like the crack-dealer method to me.
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Omega
Displaced Ohioan
Premium
join:2002-07-30
Cheyenne, WY
clubs:  | Re: More trusted computing blunders What exactly does this prevent us from doing?
Are they saying we can no longer record our programs?
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"The doctor's X-Rayed my head and found nothing" | |
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE | Re: More trusted computing blunders The way I understand it, you can still record the programs like many people still do with the VCR. It's just if you try to distribute the program on the Internet it will be corrupted.
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
 ·VOIPo
| Re: More trusted computing blunders said by ArchAngel21x  :
The way I understand it, you can still record the programs like many people still do with the VCR. It's just if you try to distribute the program on the Internet it will be corrupted.
So how will this work? If I use my DVR to record the program, then copy the resulting file to my PC to watch it will it be corrupted? What if I want to change formats and copy it over to my PocketPC or my Archos Jukebox Multimedia to watch during an airplane flight? That's all just time-shifting for personal use/enjoyment and is perfectly legal under Fair Use.
And if I can copy a file to my PC, PocketPC, or MP3 player to watch it, what's stopping me from sending the file to anyone else? I don't see how a technology can be created that lets me watch something on all the formats mentioned above yet makes it impossible for me to send the file to someone else for viewing... At least not with MPEG files-- I guess that the entire industry can shift toward the backwards digital rights "management" scheme used in WMP9.
I have serious concerns about how this is going to impact Fair Use. It will probably lead to some dramatic changes for the worse...
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Cox cable: the hallmark questionable business practices and lousy cable service! | |
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE
 ·Internet Nebraska
| Re: More trusted computing blunders said by NOVA_Guy :
I have serious concerns about how this is going to impact Fair Use. It will probably lead to some dramatic changes for the worse...
Yeah, that's why the EFF is fighting this.
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE
·Internet Nebraska
| Re: More trusted computing blunders said by Omega :
Just pop the recorded program into the VCR, then record the output of your VCR with your TV tuner.
Yeah....just like I said in my post....
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TheHelpful1
Premium
join:2002-01-11
Upper Marlboro, MD
| Re: More trusted computing blunders Basically it says that whatever you record it ON is the only thing you can play it back on.
God help you if the original digital recorder breaks down and you have weeks upon weeks of recorded material that are now inaccessible because of the encryption.
Guess that means you have to put out MORE money to BUY back what was originally FREE.
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"Not that you would, but you could" | |
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Sarick
It's Only Logical
Premium
join:2003-06-03
USA
·FrontierNet Intern..
| Either way a few companies are fighting it tooth and nail.
Microsoft wants power of this tech, Real Networks and sun are just a few crying foul play.
»news.com.com/2100-1025-5103601.h···efd_lede
People don't realize it but the new pay Napster, Kazaa and iTunes are setting a trend the big brother is going to rule with an iron fist sooner than we think.
»www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3···3,00.asp
Take for instance the recent change in DVD players. Where you can't fast forward on the DVDs YOU OWN.
Another example is how TiVo, and dish network charge fees for DVR/PVR recording hardware. This stuff used to be free in some cases. Even though recording shows isn't a new Idea.
The next step in the world of digital rights is nullifying the right to fast forward TV you recorded.
Yea they want POWER over what and when you watch TV. They want money to force your hands even if the stuff is released.
It all STINKS!!
"Fair use appears to be getting trampled by content owners (yet again)." Dave Salvator
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Sarick's Dungeon Clipart Page
Trouble spelling? www.iespell.com | |
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE
·Internet Nebraska
| Re: More trusted computing blunders For me this new technology really doesn't matter. If I like a show enough to want to keep the episodes I will buy them on DVD. As for the companies controlling what I can do with the DVDs I bought (fast forward through intro junk for example) that's when I get pissed off.
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Sarick
It's Only Logical
Premium
join:2003-06-03
USA | Re: More trusted computing blunders It's already getting done with Disney movies. You put it in and your forced to watch the previews and advertisements at the start of the movie. | |
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Vvian Kalyss
join:2003-10-14
Stage 5.0
clubs:
| interesting... Hmm... more from the FCC: www.indiantelevision.com/headlines/y2k3/nov/nov40.htm
Sure it will inconvenience the casual copier (i.e. the consumers this is intended for), but it'll be a mere speedbump to digital pirates bent on warezing.
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" In Defeat, Malice; In Victory, Revenge! " | |
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE
·Internet Nebraska
| Another Waste Of Money How hard would it be to record your favorite program via an analog connection so the "flag" won't be an issue. Just use the video in on your PCI input card. The technology isn't even out yet and already a work around was thought up in less than a minute. Also, who's to say a way to get around that copy protection and still come out with a perfect digital copy won't come around?
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Death Is Irrelevant.
[text was edited by author 2003-11-05 10:36:32] | |
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| oldhand
Premium
join:2003-05-16
Saugus, MA
| No analog outputs A few days ago on another site (I don't remember where) there was a technical explanation of the Broadcast Flag. In the text, it stated that hardware containing the decryption chip would not be allowed to have analog output connectors to prevent analog copying. This would render current hardware unable to record or display these encrypted signals. If true, this would mandate a new cable/satellite channel for encrypted movies that would be usable only with decrypting TVs. The implication was that even current plasma displays without digital inputs and decryption chips would be unable to display movies broadcast with the Broadcast Flag. I sincerely hope that my reading of this technology article was incorrect. | |
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE
·Internet Nebraska
| Re: No analog outputs said by oldhand :
In the text, it stated that hardware containing the decryption chip would not be allowed to have analog output connectors to prevent analog copying.
Most interesting.....thanks for the info. O well, that won't stop copying, just delay it a little.
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ArchAngel21x
MacFan Pro
Premium
join:2001-10-28
Lincoln, NE | Re: No analog outputs My guess is when HD TV tuners for computers are made (if they aren't already out there) this technology will be included. I also foresee modded HDTV tuner cards being sold on the Internet.
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| dave
Premium,MVM
join:2000-05-04
not in ohio
·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Another Waste Of Money Yeah, but analogue copies are inferior. The main point is not necessarily to prevent all copies (hell, if you like watching lousy quality, just point your $9.95 webcam at your $29.95 TV screen) but to prevent copies that are indistinguishable from the original. | |
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dleehend
Howdy
Premium
join:2002-03-11
Jasper, TX
·AT&T DSL Service
| Receive or Act Upon Does the ruling say the receiver must act upon the marker or just recognize it? Seems to me that the receiver could see the marker and still give the user a setting to either pay attention to it or ignore it, much like some DVD players do with region codes as was mentioned above.
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Prepare well for tomorrow. You might have to give an account.»straitway.org | |
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
·VOIPo
| How long will it take... ...to have people develop a way to disable this crap on digital receivers that will have it embedded?
If someone did develop a way to disable this junk, I'd buy it in a heartbeat... It's not that I want to distribute programming to people across the Internet; it's just that I disagree with it so much.
I was initially opposed to the idea of eliminating copyright laws in this country, but I'm beginning to shift more and more towards this with each passing day. As our Fair Use rights erode away and greedy corporate America owns more and more of our culture, we need to start fighting back.
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Cox cable: the hallmark questionable business practices and lousy cable service! | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA
| Re: How long will it take... Maybe not eliminate, but they certainly have to be scaled back quite a bit. As they stand now, they were all but dictated to the government by big businesses who have no incentive to protect the consumers' rights. Fair Use needs to be re-established and copyright terms need to be scaled back. Sorry, but you shouldn't get to keep the copyright 70 years after you are dead.
I think that 30 years from the date of release is plenty. After that, it should fall into the public domain. How this would cover "followup works" (new issues of a Superman comic book, new versions of a software program, movie sequels/remakes, etc) would have to be ironed out of course. Perhaps just the old versions would fall into public domain and the new versions wouldn't be.
Of course, all this is moot because corporations would fight tooth and nail and wallet against this. Can you imagine the outrage at Disney if they learned that Mickey might fall into public domain? Imagine how much money they (and other companies with deep pockets) would throw at Congress to kill that law.
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-Jason Levine
http://www.jasons-toolbox.com/
http://www.PCQandA.com/
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| One more thing to pay for Great, they are adding one more thing I have to pay for, jacking up the cost of equipment even more than it already is. Nothing I hate more than paying for something I am going to find a way to NOT use anyway.
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AMD XP2500+ @2300mhz/ Asus A7N8X Deluxe rev 1.04/ 2x 512Mb Kingston HyperX PC3500/ WD 120Gb on serial/ Gainward GF4 4600/ Enermax 465P-VE/Custom water cooler | |
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Urnso
I Like You The Most, Will Kill You Last
join:2001-02-26
Cleveland, OH
| Can't Stop it!! Listen, they can sniff packets they can spy on ports but they cannot detect the content of an Encrypted file. Even a simple file encrypted by Blowfish is undetectable to someone watching your connection. It is simply Data. Many people have said this before me... they will never stop it. You have to remember, the best programmers in the world are not the ones working for these corporations. They are the Elite hackers that believe in Digital Free Trade and bucking the system. It's a game to them and the public is winning. | |
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SaBo7Ge
join:2003-03-12
US
| TCPA is only one step away Who would have ever thought that a nation liberated and built upon offering freedoms to all citizens within a 200+ year span would end up turning into a nation that stiffles creativity & the rights of the "common citizen" simply to protect big business interests.. Our country is fastly sinking down the crapper folks and it's looking worse day by day simply because our elected officicals are more concerned about bribes and campaign contributions than actually making a difference in the policies they create..
Canada and Europe are quickly becoming more attractive because they actually care about the rights of their citizens; offering socialized medicine,a national broadband policy w/ lines/speed that people can afford, et cetera.. Thomas Jefferson said it best when he suggested we should overthrow the system every 20 years, and with it the laws that protect big business.. I for one will not stand for this type of abuse in the coming future. If my government will not support the rights of the majority rather than those of the corrupt few then I and so many others will probably end up moving to a country that cares. | |
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| NoFatChicks
No, I'M The Exon And You're The Intron
join:2002-06-15
Blountsville, AL
| Re: TCPA is only one step away You fail to mention one point… they tax the snot out of their citizens for the services that are usually substandard. I would much prefer to be taxed @ 40 - 50% (including Federal, State ect) than the 60 – 70% in these other countries. You also fail to mention that these services are RAMRODDED, without much choice. Personally I like the choice between DSL or Cable, or which doctor to see and not have some government bureaucrat tell me how high to jump because they know I have no other choice.
Sure you can find flaws in the free market, but overall I think it is the best way to go. | |
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HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| Re: TCPA is only one step away And you forgot to mention that in Europe, they also get 30 days a year PAID vacation! Now you may pay more taxes, but when my work offers me 30 day paid vacations here in the States, I will be all over it!
yes their gas is more, but in fair trade, their food is MUCH LESS than we pay in grocery stores here. So many Americans are uninsured (ask me I know....) because of costs involved.
Services are hardly ramrodded.....that's a myth. I could walk into ANY doctor and be treated. Literally. Cause they all accept the providers, unlike here where you have HMO's. I lived in Germany for 6 years, (non military) and I was treated to some of the best health care I ever had. Unlike here, where my pregnant wife (who is German) was refused service because she owed 79- from a previous visit. I never once encountered a line, I never once had any poroblems. Infact, I am covered in the whole EU for insurance. How ironic is that, I can get coverage in Europe with my provider AOK, but here, in my own country, I can't even afford it.
[text was edited by author 2003-11-06 08:57:07] | |
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mr_cool
join:2003-10-14
USA | Wow "If someone did develop a way to disable this junk, I'd buy it in a heartbeat... It's not that I want to distribute programming to people across the Internet; it's just that I disagree with it so much."
True, true | |
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smthmlk
join:2003-11-02
Sunnyvale, CA
| Yet we keep supporting them.. How many of you bought a DVD today? In the last week? In the last month? If you have, you're actively supporting the group that is actively taking away your rights.
Capitalism has officially failed in the USA. When people are too blind and stupid to see that they're feeding the hand that bites them, it's time to revolt, kill the stupid, and start a new government with REAL limits on monopolies.
Companies are now getting so large, with such a firm grasp on such large markets with pockets so deep that they can put up dollar signs that no mortal man or woman can possibly turn down. There's no hope for a government when man can't say no. The only way to stop it is to remove the threat--keep companies from becoming that large. Manditory competition... true-capitalism wont work, we need to implement the right amount of socialist idea's.
What i really like is that we've got a huge global problem.. POLLUTION. The environment is toe-down, and we can't even get a corporation/cartel to buy out the government and institute laws that require all vehicles be electric or fuel-cell powered by 2005... yet this cartel walks in, throws down checks with more 0's than your avg lowlife politician can count and the said politician signs whatever paper is in front of them without even reading it.
Either the people need to start assasinating the heads of these cartels, or a revolt needs to occur. Man... where's the crazy ppl with guns with nothing better to do? Oh shit, that's right.. thanks anti-gun activists. and with that, we've lost the last hope of fighting our own "bought-out-government". Complete slaves to those 5 companies who own the entire country, government included.
Really, this is a sad, sad day. Im ashamed of being an American now.
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GnuLinuxHelp.org / don't take life too seriously :] | |
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reub2000
Premium
join:2001-12-28
Evanston, IL
| Re: Yet we keep supporting them.. As you said, this a monopoly. The MPAA controls the DVD market. It's impossible to get a dvd without more copy protections than zeros in the senator's bribes.
What we need is to extend fair use, and say that not only are you exempt from being sued, but copy protections also can't stop your fair use rights. | |
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| npyoung
join:2002-09-23
Jacksonville, OR
| I'll agree with that. Capitalism, thinking that communism is now safely in it's grave, takes the wraps off what really is no more than a high tech feudalism. I loved the right wing foundations crowing about the melt-down in the "Evil Empire" without so much as a glance at our own problems in the early 90's. Just an early example of what happens to an economy of monopolies (these just happened to be owned by the state, instead of private, like here) in an environment of increasingly decentralizing technology. (See the Internet.) But fight like heck, will those indolent elites used to their corporate dachas and comfortable lifestyles, as the rabble starts to employ those technologies to undermine their monopolies.
It's going to be a bloody game, but very, very entertaining. | |
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reub2000
Premium
join:2001-12-28
Evanston, IL
| Free as in free beer. This is free as in free beer, not the fsf definition of free.
I would rather have less content on tv that I can record, then a ton of content I can't record.
What if I'm asleep or not available while something is on? What if I want to create a collection of a tv show? (Like I'm doing with the simpsons on my winfast tv 2000xp.) | |
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tsr
@cable.earthlin
| This is great - really This is a great descision, honestly. Here's why: it's much cheaper to implement than encryption. Obviously we need to have some form of DRM on high quality digital streams, so let's at least have the cheapest and the simplest form. And a do-not-copy flag is exactly that. Would you rather pay for a complex encryption scheme instead? | |
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ctrlphreak
@pacbell.n
| MPAA=Major Pains And Asses "IF YOU LET THEM TALK LONG ENOUGH , THEY'LL ANSWER THIER OWN QUESTIONS"
TV SUX so does MPAA, but what we all know is that Warez is gonna be around forever
and where there is a WILL there is a Death
Like there is gonna be for MPAA
So Long Live the hard workin Blood Sweat and Tears that comes with even the basic Warezing and Go Die FCC and them Fascist MPAA Faggs | |
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theophilus
@mchsi.com
| Where is the FCC to prohibit questionable business practices such as this?
New sellers are required to attain a 10 or better feedback rating before they are allowed to use the buy it now option, or sign up for this thing called IdVerify. To be approved for that I have to give them my birthdate, social security number and drivers license number; as well as give them permission to do a credit check on me and then pay a 5 dollar processing fee as well. I found the Entire request preposterous and absolutely out of the question. I am considering contacting the FCC or someone just that they would make such a ridiculous request in the first place. Talk about setting yourself up for identity theft. I guess Ebay (the owners of PayPal) didn't think it was enough to own my banking information, now they want to know everything they need to become me. I didn't so much mind the 5 dollar fee but there is no way under any circumstances will I give them all that other sensitive information. I'm adding this news to all my listings because what they have done is bound to be against some law and if not then it should be.
Maybe I need to look at my options for an alternate online selling place because with actions like this occuring maybe Ebay is becoming a less then desirable online marketplace. | |
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More trusted computing blunders
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I may be wrong (hope so)
