 
The Beer
I Love It When A Plan Comes Together
Premium
join:2001-07-24
Omaha, NE
clubs: | Huh? Hogwash thats like saying Lindows is the same as Windows, no wait.. it's not.
How does CallVantage sound like Vonage?
Unless Vonage is trying to say Vonage stands for VOIP and that Vantage sounds too much like Vonage.
What Gives? | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
Albany, NY
| Re: Huh? said by Nightfall  :
Great example! Lindows has nothing to do with Windows. If Microsoft filed a lawsuit, I would think that would be dumb as well. The only winners in this case will be the lawyers.
Microsoft did file a lawsuit and didn't succeed. (In the US at least. In a few other countries Lindows has to go by a different name or can't be sold at all.)
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-Jason Levine
http://www.jasons-toolbox.com/
http://www.PCQandA.com/
http://www.urateit.com/ | |
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| | | Freezone
join:2000-09-29
Southfield, MI | Re: Huh? Mike Rowe had to give up his website. His company name was mike Rowe Soft or something like that. | |
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ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN
clubs: | »www.lindows.com
View the link at the top to support Lin----.
And yes I agree with the first post, How does Call Vantage, Sound Like Vonage????? | |
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budgetcents
Premium
join:2004-02-15
Chicago, IL
| I think it is referring to AT&T buying up the domain www.callvontage.com.
If you are trying to go to www.callvonage.com and you miss type, you could possibly end up at CallVantage. AT&T bought the domain, but pulled the website behind it earlier today. | |
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jersey_born
join:2002-01-02
Hawthorne, NJ
| Another example of PC run a muck That would explain how I ended up with both services..:D
I agree... the names issue does not matter to geeks like us... but have a look at the mailbag on this website and you might come away with the idea that some people will have trouble with this similarity...
I was a beta tester for AT&Ts Consumer Digital Service [CDS for short] - I think Vonage has it right though I really don't think the argument holds any water... | |
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erin1
Premium
join:2002-02-22
Buford, GA
 ·Charter Pipeline
| Re: *sigh* Still, there is a clear difference between CallVantage and Vonage in the name. I don't see what they have to complain about. These lawsuits are totally dumb.
Actually Vonage has some truth in this. Vonage and Vantage are too close. Also CallVonage.com and CallVantage.com are ridicously similar so ATT wants to try to trick some customers away i am sure that's the whole purpose!
Also about Lindows and Windows. Note that Windows IS a GENERIC word. That's why windows did not win the case in US, and that "L" in Lindows is too noticeable to be a threat.
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jpl931
join:2001-02-22
Herculaneum, MO
|  The lawsuit gets their name into the press without having to pay for advertising!!!! And I am sure that they have lawyers who need something to do given their retainer fees that they are receiving. Ah yes the legal system, where the more frivolous the suit the more ink it gets from the press. Lawyers....you gotta it. | |
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inteller
Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK | they should sue them for... sabotaging the VoIP industry. CallDISADVantage straps people with HIGHER rates and contracts that the upstarts have so far avoided.....oh, and did I mention the $60 EARLY TERMINATION fee? Fuck ATT. | |
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72276539
Premium
join:2001-01-19
Atlanta, GA | Re: You all have it wrong So if Lindows and had released say, Lindows2000 server or LindowsXP they would in fact be bent over in court? | |
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tomkb
Premium
join:2000-11-15
Avon, OH
clubs: | Re: You all have it wrong Honestly, I'm not sure. | |
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Stewy85
Premium
join:2003-01-16
Delavan, WI
clubs:
| Imho I think Vonage is right. It doesn't matter to me but when my parents saw CallVantage they said "Isn't that what you have?" When I actually have Vonage. So to the tech geek it doesn't matter but to the older generation who might be switching it could be a problem.
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| icecold976
join:2002-07-20
Orlando, FL
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·Vonage
| Re: Imho My parents did the same thing. They got something in the mail and were asking me about it. They said you have CallVantage right? I said no it is Vonage. They said, "Thats what I said Call Vonage". I said. "No they are 2 different companies that are in the same thing".
It say it out loud a little. Us Geeks know the difference, but I would guess 7 outta 10 would think they are the same thing on the street. | |
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NJChris
What, Me Worry?
Premium
join:2000-02-08
Pompton Lakes, NJ
| Re: Imho said by icecold976 :
My parents did the same thing. They got something in the mail and were asking me about it. They said you have CallVantage right? I said no it is Vonage. They said, "Thats what I said Call Vonage". I said. "No they are 2 different companies that are in the same thing".
No offense against your parents (mine prob would do this too).. but come on... READ.... difference in letters.. it was pretty basic when we were in 4th grade. They are two different sounding words... People are so lazy today. 
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I know you're talking, but all I hear is Blah Blah Blah... | |
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| | | icecold976
join:2002-07-20
Orlando, FL
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Vonage
| Re: Imho Its more word of mouth.
CallVantage does sound like Vonage and I can see that causing some people to be confused. If I say it out loud a few times and just change something I can easily morph between the two. If the were in a different business not competing with Vonage this would be a non-issue.
I just walked over to someone at work that knows I have Vonage. I asked them have you ever heard of CallVantage, and their response was.... isn't that what you have, why are you asking me..
go figure I have Vonage, but did Beta for ATT's service. | |
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boogie74
join:2001-06-19
Neenah, WI
clubs:
| IMHO, CallVantage is a contraction of two words- Call and Advantage. Vonage doesn't seem to fit that definition as a word.
This seems to be the same as if General Electric started selling automobiles (which isn't far off from possible considering the fact that the majority of their business is in military vehicle production) and General Motors sued General Electric because "GE Trucks" sounds too much like "GMC Trucks". In fact, why not have General Nutrition Centers (GNC) suing General Motors because GMC sounds too much like GNC?
This isn't the situation of McDowells having a restaurant with the "Golden Arcs" instead of the "Golden Arches" and selling "Big Micks" instead of "Big Macs" except the "Big Mick" comes without sesame seeds on the buns. (Bonus points for those catching the movie reference of "Coming to America")
It's a situation of two similar and competing products that have names that happen to both have a "V" and they also share the last four letters- "AGE"
When AT&T starts using the color schemes and logos of Vonage, then there's a basis for a lawsuit. Beyond that, this is frivolous and will be settled if not outright dismissed out of court.
Boogie | |
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Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
Albany, NY
| Vonage Registered their domain after AT&T? I can't see CallVantage being confusingly similar to Vonage. The only claim of theirs that I think might have merit would be the domain name claim. (And that's ignoring that Vonage's main domain name seems to be Vonage.com.) However checking WHOIS I get the following:
Domain Name: CALLVONAGE.COM
Record created on 26-Feb-2004.
Domain Name: CALLVONTAGE.COM
Created on..............: Tue, Feb 24, 2004
So, unless I'm reading this wrong, Vonage registered their domain name two days after AT&T registered theirs. Almost sounds like Vonage was trying to set up a lawsuit against AT&T there.
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-Jason Levine
http://www.jasons-toolbox.com/
http://www.PCQandA.com/
http://www.urateit.com/ | |
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tomkb
Premium
join:2000-11-15
Avon, OH
clubs: | Re: Vonage Registered their domain after AT&T? The first to use it IN COMMERCE usually has the trademark rights to it (including common law). | |
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X
join:2003-05-27
Sacramento, CA
| mdaaa... i think youre right jason. but there is another possibility that Vonage gonna redirect visitors from callvonage.com to their own website... so some unsuspecting customers can very well find themselves on vonage.com signing up with another company... so therefore vonage can successfully steal some customers. | |
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dinkerdnk
join:2003-02-04
Arlington, TX | Boy are we full of ourselves!! Give me a freakin break...CallVantage.....Vonage..? WHAT!
Yeah...sounds just like it! | |
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tunes
Run Away
join:2002-01-31
Grosse Ile, MI | How about Voipage? There is a company called voipage.com out there too. Did Vonage sue them? I think it's easier to confuse Voipage and Vonage than CallVantage and Vonage.;) | |
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mario55
join:2002-02-12
Pompano Beach, FL | Re: How about Voipage? remember that some people are easier to trick than others | |
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erin1
Premium
join:2002-02-22
Buford, GA
·Charter Pipeline
| Re: Not confusing to me... To me CallVantage and Vonage are "close" but aren't close enough to create confusion.
Dude, Please read better before u reply.
We are talking about "CALLVONAGE" and "CALLVANTAGE", not vonage and callvantage.
See the difference?
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX | Re: Not confusing to me... Vonage... Vantage... Still sounds different enough to me. Seems like Vonage is just crying sour grapes and getting picky about the details. | |
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Freezone
join:2000-09-29
Southfield, MI | ATT will buy vonage one day. I can smeel this merger 2000000 miles away. The pres of att said they will offer "Vonage like service." This would catch att right up and give more cred to vonage.
ATT has to replace its LD business which is on life support. | |
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verolom
join:2002-03-23
Eatontown, NJ
·Comcast
edit:
March 31st, @03:56PM
| Re: ATT will buy vonage one day. said by Freezone :
ATT has to replace its LD business which is on life support.
Actually the LD business is the only part that does make money, although with shrinking revenues that will not be the case much longer. | |
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nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| I agree with vonage I think the real issue here and what probably scares the sh*t out of vonage is the fact that it's AT&T. Somebody already pointed out another service, "voipage", that I have never heard of; probably a small outfit, not much money. Vonage probably doesn't give a crap about them.
But AT&T has been around the block and has tons of money; I don't doubt for a second that AT&T would spend obscene amounts of money and go out of their way to take advantage of the (admittedly slight, but it's there) similar sound of the two names.
Unfortunately, vonage shouldn't win but copyright and trademark law is so fvked up now, they probably will. | |
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zemus
join:2001-01-13
Brooklyn, NY
| vonage is right if Callvantage wasn't in telecommunications then this wouldn't be that big of a problem, but they are so it's legit concerns. Ever heard of the company Xpedior? well I don't blame you cause they were forced to change their name cause it sounded like expedia, altho SPELLING is completely different. guess what, microsoft owns expedia. so they don't every time, they lost the Lindows battle on other grounds. | |
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| TercelChick
join:2002-08-13
|  Re: vonage is right
said by zemus :
if Callvantage wasn't in telecommunications then this wouldn't be that big of a problem, but they are so it's legit concerns. Ever heard of the company Xpedior? well I don't blame you cause they were forced to change their name cause it sounded like expedia, altho SPELLING is completely different.
www.xpedior.com is a pay-for search site registered in Hong Kong. MS doesn't own it. All the info I found on an old consulting firm by that name indicated it went under along with iXL at the turn of the millennium.
Domain Name: XPEDIOR.COM
Registrant:
Ultimate Search
GPO Box 7862
Central
HK
HK
0000 | |
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alex4life
Alex4life
Premium
join:2001-06-22
Delta, BC
| Re: vonage is right said by TercelChick :
said by zemus :
if Callvantage wasn't in telecommunications then this wouldn't be that big of a problem, but they are so it's legit concerns. Ever heard of the company Xpedior? well I don't blame you cause they were forced to change their name cause it sounded like expedia, altho SPELLING is completely different.
www.xpedior.com is a pay-for search site registered in Hong Kong. MS doesn't own it. All the info I found on an old consulting firm by that name indicated it went under along with iXL at the turn of the millennium.
Domain Name: XPEDIOR.COM
Registrant:
Ultimate Search
GPO Box 7862
Central
HK
HK
0000
I suggest your re-read what was said.
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"For in the final analysis, our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this small planet, we all breathe the same air, we all cherish our children's future, and we are all mortal." - John F. Kennedy | |
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BillRoland
Premium
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL
clubs: | hmm Vonage just wants to be the new same old phone company.
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"Don't steal. The government hates competition." | |
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shosho
Premium
join:2001-02-13
Arlington, VA
| Trademark Law As a trademark attorney, the names dont have to be THAT similiar in this case. There is a two part test used for "confusingly similar". The first is the sound, appearance and meaning of the two marks. The second is the market for the goods/services, how they are sold/presented to consumers etc. (this is a very very basic overview).
When the services are exactly similar like they are here, the marks can be further apart in similarity and still be "confusingly similar".
This is not legal advice and is only my personal opinion, but the Vonage people are right to sue and I think have a very strong case.
I think the title of this article on BBR is misleading as it makes it sound as if this is some sort of ridiculous lawsuit when if they were my client (and I think 95% of tradmark lawyers would agree) I would tell Vonage to do the exact same thing.
You have to protect your brand.
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| icecold976
join:2002-07-20
Orlando, FL | Re: Trademark Law aka. google v. booble. | |
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| jekler
join:2000-11-23
Cincinnati, OH
clubs:
| I have to agree that the core issue here is that the two companies are competing in the same industry. If they were different industries, the difference in the name would be completely negligible, simply because if you're looking for a car, you wouldn't be fooled into buying VoIP service. But they are both competing for the same customers, if you're looking for VoIP service, it can easily be argued that someone looking for Vonage might end up with CallVantage with the belief that "It's what I was looking for, I just got the name mixed up."
I do a lot of usability testing when I'm developing software, things that seem to be distinct differences end up confusing people in practice. For a practical example, more than half of the people using one of my game interfaces were frequently confused by the "Help" button and the "Customer Support" button. It doesn't seem like a big issue to tech-savvy folk, but it is a significant issue when the user in question isn't (and has no desire to be) tech-savvy. People who aren't tech-savvy don't draw as fine a line as we do. "Vonage/Vantage, whatever... the internet phone thingy."
From tech support experience in the past, there's plenty of times I've talked to customers who don't draw a distinction between their monitor, tower, modem, and router. They're all just 'The Box'. And these are the same people who can be tricked.
The name also starts a logical progression towards confusion. Sure you officially name it "CallVantage", and somewhere down the road you start running commercials that say "Get the Vantage!" dropping the "Call" part of it. | |
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Maybe TeleVantage Should Sue?