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 | | | Re: Choppy VOIP? I asume choppy VOIP is like talking to a fast food attendant at the dirve thru menu stand,..
'Hell* *ir...M** I *ake **ur or***?'
'Yea - I'll have a cheeseburger and fries.'
'C**ld y** re**at that ple**e? You want a **ee**bu*** a** *ries?'
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| |  NickPurveyor of common sensePremium,VIP,MVM
join:2000-10-29
Smithtown, NY | Re: Choppy VOIP? Even if one does their own QoS locally any respectable ISP will ignore the QoS information on the core level.
That is...Vonage voice packets from Vonage customer going over Cox or Time Warner will not be treated any differently through their routers than say a data packet.
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Stupidity, like hydrogen, is one of the basic building blocks of the Universe.
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| | |  digiblurGot Sipura?Premium
join:2002-06-03
Louisiana
 ·Cox HSI
| Re: Choppy VOIP? said by Nick:
Even if one does their own QoS locally any respectable ISP will ignore the QoS information on the core level.
That is...Vonage voice packets from Vonage customer going over Cox or Time Warner will not be treated any differently through their routers than say a data packet.
You are correct but if you throttle back bandwidth hogs on your local LAN things work great. Trust me...I've been there.
Before the "in-house" bandwidth management I could never flood the upstream(IE:uploading large emails with attachments) and talk on the VOIP at the same time. Now with the bandwidth managemnet I can flood the upstream and downstream at the same time. The VOIP never misses a beat and also the full time snappy web browsing is nice too during the "floods". | |
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|  Vamp5c077Premium
join:2003-01-28
MD
kudos:1
1 edit | Isn't the problem with VoIp the fact that ISP's still give crappy upstream speeds? and if connection is being heavily used (the upstream) then it will crap out??
just another reason why I think the upstream should be the same as the down, also that way you could have really high quality, high frame rate, and high res. video conferences (super web cams).
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:: My current desktop :: | |
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| | digiblurGot Sipura?Premium
join:2002-06-03
Louisiana Reviews:
·Cox HSI
| Re: Choppy VOIP? said by Vamp:
Isn't the problem with VoIp the fact that ISP's still give crappy upstream speeds? and if connection is being heavily used (the upstream) then it will crap out??
just another reason why I think the upstream should be the same as the down, also that way you could have really high quality, high frame rate, and high res. video conferences (super web cams).
AFAIK, the highest Vonage codec is 90kbps and the Packet8 codec is somewhere around 32kbps. Packet8 is even usable on dialup. | |
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| | NickPurveyor of common sensePremium,VIP,MVM
join:2000-10-29
Smithtown, NY | said by Vamp:
Isn't the problem with VoIp the fact that ISP's still give crappy upstream speeds? and if connection is being heavily used (the upstream) then it will crap out??
Yes and no...
Speaking from the Cable world, with DOCSIS 1.1 or 2.0 you can separate the streams so you can tell them apart. So, if I'm PsyCable and I give you a cable modem & VoIP service, then I can give you 1 stream that has nothing to do with what your cable package speeds are and provide a better QoS for your VoIP streams. An average phone call with the G.711 codec at 20ms uses up about 100kpbs so if I'm in DOCSIS 1.1 world and I give you a cable modem package of 64/64 (not that it would ever happen) and give you VoIP access then you'll have 1 stream id that's specifically for VoIP and two for your modem..one upstream, one downstream. They will not interfere with each other even if you max both out.
But that's of course if PsyCable is your VoIP & high speed data provider.
If I'm PsyCable and you get Vonage, I will not separate these streams for you so if you're uploading a huge file and talking on the phone you will have problems.
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| | | | said by Vamp:
just another reason why I think the upstream should be the same as the down
I think someone should give me a machine that turns dirt into gold, but it turns out it's not that easy.
There's a reason providers don't provide symmetrical connections (unless you pay for them). The fact is that, at currents rates and standards, a symmetrical connection is not possible. If they could do it for regular cheap residential connections, don't you think they would do it?
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A good idea expressed in a poor manner is a bad idea. | |
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| Vamp5c077Premium
join:2003-01-28
MD
kudos:1 | yeah but what I was referring to is when the upstream is being maxed, packets slow down (latency gets higher) and for those on only 128kbps upload it would be easy to max it.
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:: My current desktop :: | |
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| | NickPurveyor of common sensePremium,VIP,MVM
join:2000-10-29
Smithtown, NY | Re: Choppy VOIP? said by Vamp:
packets slow down (latency gets higher)
Packets do not slow down...There are no speed limits  No school zones...
If latency increases it's because the routing changes. I'm not strong on routing theories yet...
--
Stupidity, like hydrogen, is one of the basic building blocks of the Universe.
I'm re-moo-ing!!!
My Gallery * My Journal | |
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| Vamp5c077Premium
join:2003-01-28
MD
kudos:1 | if an upstream channel is being maxed then the latency will go high ..ive tested it on 2 isps, 1 with 128kbps of up and 1 with 256k .. when they are being maxed the ping to the first hop goes from 10ms (not uploading) to 300+ ms (uploading, maxed)
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:: My current desktop :: | |
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| | NickPurveyor of common sensePremium,VIP,MVM
join:2000-10-29
Smithtown, NY | Re: Choppy VOIP? That's not because packets slow down, that's because the router drops your packets and they have to be retransmitted. | |
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| | |  Morac
join:2001-08-30
Riverside, NJ
kudos:1
·Comcast
| Re: Choppy VOIP? More likely the upstream packets are getting "backed up" in the upstream queue. These packets include ACKS to incoming packets. In this case the ping time is including the time the ping was stuck in the outgoing queue. This occurs even without a router.
If the packets were being dropped by the router, the pings would time out.
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"snmp: the standard e-mail protocol on the Internet" - LinkSys user manual (page 17) | |
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Reviews:
·Armstrong Zoom ..
| FreeBSD IPFW FreeBSD with its INCLUDED firewall works fine. This MonoWall thing seems pointless when FreeBSD already comes with a much more robust feature set.
For those interested, Vonage the IPFW FreeBSD way...
#VOIP IN
ipfw queue 60 config weight 100 pipe 1
ipfw pipe 1 config bw 5000kbit/s
#VOIP OUT
ipfw queue 61 config weight 100 pipe 2
ipfw pipe 2 config bw 2000kbit/s
ipfw add 10105 queue 60 udp from any 10000-20000 to any via wi0 in
ipfw add 10110 queue 60 udp from any 5060 to any via wi0 in
ipfw add 10120 queue 60 udp from any 123 to any via wi0 in
ipfw add 10130 queue 60 udp from any 5061 to any via wi0 in
ipfw add 10140 queue 60 udp from any 69 to any via wi0 in
ipfw add 10205 queue 61 udp from any to any 10000-20000 via wi0 out
ipfw add 10210 queue 61 udp from any to any 5060 via wi0 out
ipfw add 10220 queue 61 udp from any to any 123 via wi0 out
ipfw add 10230 queue 61 udp from any to any 5061 via wi0 out
ipfw add 10240 queue 61 udp from any to any 69 via wi0 out
ipfw queue 71 config weight 2 pipe 1
ipfw add 12001 queue 71 ip from any to any via wi0 in
ipfw queue 72 config weight 2 pipe 2
ipfw add 12002 queue 72 ip from any to any via wi0 out | |
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| petrus
join:2002-01-09
Atlanta, GA | Packet8 I use the Packet8 service. The only problem I have is when both parties in a conversation speak at the same time, the line seems to "drop out a bit". It is very slight but noticeable to me. Would this "bandwidth management" solve this? | |
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| | digiblurGot Sipura?Premium
join:2002-06-03
Louisiana Reviews:
·Cox HSI
| Re: Packet8 said by petrus:
I use the Packet8 service. The only problem I have is when both parties in a conversation speak at the same time, the line seems to "drop out a bit". It is very slight but noticeable to me. Would this "bandwidth management" solve this?
I've never experienced this with my service. So I'm not sure if it would help your problem. | |
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| revuney
join:2003-03-22
Somerville, MA | Re: FreeBSD IPFW You do realize that m0n0 is based on FreeBSD, right?
And that it does fit the need for someone who just wants to run it on a simple embedded box (Like say, a Soekris box, running off of a CF card?)
In many cases, people don't always need a full distribution of a *nix when all they need is basic Nat/Router functions and some traffic shaping thrown in. And that's why m0n0 is good.
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Statistics show that grammatically correct posts get a 33% higher response rate. So use the spellcheck, you dorks. | |
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| | Reviews:
·Armstrong Zoom ..
| Re: FreeBSD IPFW Nope, I did not realize that. I looked at it briefly and thought it was more of an independant "package" that needed a FreeBSD full install.
There is a way to build a FreeBSD firewall/NAT router and you can use my above IPFW "script" but it requires some skill. I am sure there is a downloadable ISO image (or I should just make one). You then need no hardrive and just boot up the CD in a regular PC. »freebie.miraclenet.co.th/server/fwCD/
I will have to look around, I am sure others have made ISO images for people to just use. | |
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| | Edge Router ... I would think that this is the reason why AT&T's CallVantage requires their router to be at the very edge of your LAN, which is to insure a QoS via prioritizing or reserving bandwidth. Unless this feature is already on your router, then anything beyond your VoIP router and before your NID (cable or telco demarc) will compete for 100% of the bandwidth. | |
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| | | Re: Edge Router ... The Voice device provided by Vonage also does some QoS prioritization if you place it at the edge of your lan in front of all other devices except the router. | |
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| | | | Re: Edge Router ... Vonage's adapter provides some QOS, but is not very stable as a router. Most users recommend putting it behind a router. Hopefully AT&T's will be better.
M0n0wall is available as a 5mb bootable iso CD image. Download & burn it on your windows computer with nero or roxio, toss it and a blank floppy into and old PC and boot.
It has built in drivers for most network cards and was VERY EASY to set up.
You don't need a hard drive, you don't need to understand scripts, you don't need to spend an hour doing a full install, you don't need a Soekris box an old PC will do fine (Soekris is cool though), It does not require the typing of any linux commands ever, and you absolutely don't need to understand keyboard5684's post (thanks anyway). | |
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| |  how to make packet8 on optimum online NEVER choppy
If you have ever run any p2p applications, you are most likely capped. Try to keep your upload streams to a 10 to 20 kbps limit to avoid problems.
A cap on Optimum Online means you are throttled to 150kbps instead of 1mbps. It makes a tremendous difference, but your download speed is unmetered and still high - so you probably wouldn't even notice with casual surfing and p2p downloading.
Cheers,
Rajan
»www.fobiopatel.com | |
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