 wentlancYou Can't Fix Dumb..
join:2003-07-30
Maineville, OH | There is some sanity in the world!! That has been my exact point. Should we ban copiers because they can be used to copy copyrighted works?
puritan | |
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 | | | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! Shhhhh, don't give 'em any ideas. | |
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|  tcp1Premium
join:2000-04-17
Herndon, VA
 ·Verizon FiOS
| Puritan,
I know you say that with a bit of humor attached, but I'd bet you dollars to donuts that the answer from the RIAA or MPAA from your query could very possibly be "Yes."
At least, they'd be for a system which checks the content and restricts the copier from printing the page if it has not been deemed appropriate by the "rights holder". | |
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| |  PliotronXMy Katamari's Bigger Than Your Katamari
join:2000-05-13
Sunland, CA | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! Yes, it is no laughing matter. This "war on piracy" will escalate until legislation is introduced that will mandate that all computer hardware sold be compliant with a signature check, as well as MP3 players, CD burners, etc.. DRM legislation will be snuck in sooner or later  | |
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|  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY | said by wentlanc:
That has been my exact point. Should we ban copiers because they can be used to copy copyrighted works?
puritan
In the old Soviet Union copying machines where considered to be a very dangerous device and where guarded 24/7.
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»www.gobpl.com | |
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| |  TexasGuy49 States And TexasPremium
join:2002-12-02
Houston, TX | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! fax machines are much more dangerous | |
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| | | TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by TexasGuy:
fax machines are much more dangerous
They where in the same guarded rooms as the copy machines/
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»www.gobpl.com | |
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| | | | TexasGuy49 States And TexasPremium
join:2002-12-02
Houston, TX | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by Transmaster:
said by TexasGuy:
fax machines are much more dangerous
They where in the same guarded rooms as the copy machines/
They don't have to guard rooms now, they use computers to save every fax that goes in and out.
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-- Who drank has died, who drinks will die; is he immortal who is sober? -- | |
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| | |  WaxPhotoI AM SAMPremium
join:2004-04-08
Roanoke, IN | Office Space comes to mind... | |
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|  MarillaI Am My Own ArbiterPremium
join:2002-12-06
Belpre, OH | It's not the copying machines that should be banned... but if people start making full copies of books using them, then that USE of the machines violates copyright law.
Likewise... P2P networks and software in and of themselves are not illegal... but the use of them to illegally copy...
bleh.. nevermind.. why bother. You guys are right.. everything should be free... blah blah.. I'm done. 
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Windows, Mac, Linux, BSD - just use the right tool for the right job... end the OS Politics!
Real politics is much more interesting! www.georgewbush.com | |
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| | | | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! I'm sorry if you can't comprehend that if you weren't going to spend money on it, but would take it for free, obviously the creator loses nothing. | |
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| | | TexasGuy49 States And TexasPremium
join:2002-12-02
Houston, TX | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by insomniac84:
I'm sorry if you can't comprehend that if you weren't going to spend money on it, but would take it for free, obviously the creator loses nothing.
I guess they afraid that soon you get used so much to "sharing" because it is very CONVINIENT! No need to wait, no going to the mall, no shopping around. Click, click, download, done.
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-- Who drank has died, who drinks will die; is he immortal who is sober? -- | |
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| |  DaSneaky1Done wall to block them allPremium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
The Lou
 ·Charter
| Your claim has no merit here. And they are right, in this instance. Using a machine/program to obtain "illegal" copies of copywritten works is not wrong. Supposedly posessing those "illegal" copies is the problem.
If that was the case, then cd burners and cars would be "illegal" if someone made a copy of a song and drove the disk over a friend's house and gave the disk copy to them.
Shoot, if you really want to get into the nitty gritty, are computers "illegal" since they can be used to download GIF files? CompuServe owns the rights to that image format. I don't pay CS everytime I download a GIF file, though I have a copy of "their works" on my computer.
What if people decided to copywrite their website. Would my computer/brower be seen as "illegal" since I technically have a perfect copy of their page on my computer?
This is NOT a cut and dry issue.
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] :: my trivial ramblings :: [ | |
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| | | TexasGuy49 States And TexasPremium
join:2002-12-02
Houston, TX | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! And if you make a copy of a CD and drive it through a state border, it is a federal offence right there.
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-- Who drank has died, who drinks will die; is he immortal who is sober? -- | |
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| | |  woody7Premium
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA
2 edits | once you publish to the internet it is "presumed" to be copyrighted....you don't have to actually pay for the copyright, to collect any monetary compensation, you have to pay...if I'm not mistaken
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BlooMe | |
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| | | |  mibagent_xGo giggle the handlePremium
join:2001-03-04
Barnhart, MO | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! Change presumed to assumed. And we all know assumed is,
Assumption is the mother of all f***-ups
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Join Team helix and help find a cure. | |
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| | | | | said by DaSneaky1D:
Shoot, if you really want to get into the nitty gritty, are computers "illegal"
I personally have not read the Induce Act in its entirety, but if it is written broad enough, can you imagine the first lawsuit?
"Well the P2P program induced me to download the copyrighted work and the Microsoft XP made it easy (induced) me to download the P2P program and the Dell computer made it easy (induced) me to use the operating system and my ISP made it really fast (induced) for me to get online via the phone wires that verizon (induced) me to use while running on the power company's electricity (induced).
That list can get even longer if you want to nitpick the computer components apart (Nvidia/ATI, RAM, HDD, etc, not to mention peripherals like monitor, mouse, etc)
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Zuh? | |
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| | |  pcscdmaChocobo Chocobo Random BattlePremium
join:2004-01-14
Winterset, IA | said by DaSneaky1D:
Shoot, if you really want to get into the nitty gritty, are computers "illegal" since they can be used to download GIF files? CompuServe owns the rights to that image format. I don't pay CS everytime I download a GIF file, though I have a copy of "their works" on my computer.
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What if people decided to copywrite their website. Would my computer/brower be seen as "illegal" since I technically have a perfect copy of their page on my computer?
»www.unisys.com/about__unisys/lzw
Unisys has[had] the patents to LZW/GIF. They only charged to encode the files. They didn't charge anything to decode files. I continue to use PNG just as a protest against patents, as do many other people.
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The Intel Prescott. One step closer to 50,000 watts of clear channel power! | |
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| | | |  KoolMoeAw ManPremium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! The patent expired last year. Use GIFs at will 
KM | |
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| | | | | | said by pcscdma:
Unisys has[had] the patents to LZW/GIF. They only charged to encode the files.
So when I convert an image to GIF or create one does that mean I am violating patent laws? My guess is Unisys isn't so uptight about usage as the RIAA and MPAA. | |
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| | | | | KoolMoeAw ManPremium
join:2001-02-14
Annapolis, MD | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! It depended on the software you used to do it.
If you wrote your own software to covert images and apply the LZW compression and you did not license that compression technology from Unisys, then yes, you were in violation of the patent.
If you used someone else's software to do that, then you're kinda in violation, but ultimately the one to 'go after' would be the company that provided/wrote that software.
If you used third-party software that did license that compression scheme, then the gifs you create are fine.
Unisys WAS uptight about it - this is one of the biggest patent arguments of the past decade. It cause all sorts of geek protesting on using gifs. Unisys actively sued companies who made gif creation/conversion software without licensing.
But regardless, the patent is expired anyway, so however you wanna do it...
KM
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If Clinton lied, so did Bush.
Iraq Casualties | War Propaganda
Air America - Radio for the Rest of US! | |
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1 edit | Actually Unisys owns (well, owned since it pretty much expired everywhere) the GIF format. And even then, the only restriction on GIF was the LZW compression algorithm (nothing about decompressing so you can view).
Also, you have to realize that law can never be constructed to encompass all future events. That's why there are judges and lawyers to interpret the spirit of the law. Even still, despite what the RIAA, MPAA, and Hatch would have you believe there is still fair use rights. That is why you can download web pages and images off of the internet. As long as you do not redistribute the works as your own (plagiarism in academia, copyright infringment in legalise) or redistribute them against the wishes of the creator, that is allowed.
Everyone uses the argument that p2p downloading is the same as borrowing of a friend. Who are you really kidding. Is it that hard to admit that what you are doing is really illegal (the RIAA and MPAA handling of the situation is a completely different story). Think of it this way. Is stealing a CD from a store more illegal than downloading that album? After all the CD costs almost nothing to the store (probably less than the bandwidth used to download the album).
And the argument that you wouldn't have bought it anyways so it's alright to download is pretty weak. Yes, it is a vaild argument to disprove the outrageous monetary losses claimed by software, music, movie analysts. It's not a valid justification for downloading things you don't own (even when you do own it, I would say it's an iffy issue, since why would you need to download if you already own it? any backups or copies you can make yourself). | |
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| | | | | | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by vlovich:
Is it that hard to admit that what you are doing is really illegal (the RIAA and MPAA handling of the situation is a completely different story)?
Actually to me it is. The very purpose of copyright law was to protect the artist from exploitation. When you make money off another person's work you have to give them a share and give credit where its due. Nothing more. The only time when free distribution really becomes an issue is when it actually affects the artist's livelihood (which has yet to happen). What's different now is how copyright law is interpreted by the RIAA to use the word "distribution" on its own instead of "sales and distribution", which is what's stated in copyright law. That one grey area is what the RIAA exploits regarding the legality of sharing music.
If you want to move to a moral issue that's another story, but legally the record industry's stance is iffy at best. As for me it's all about sharing a form of art and no matter how much it's shared people will continue to pay for it. That much has been shown over the past five years of what the entertainment industries call "rampant file trading on a massive scale". If it's so massive and the sales figures look as good as they do then where's the problem? | |
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| King75King Of All And NothingPremium
join:2004-07-31
Stevensville, MD | Please books don't bring in the revenue that movies and CDs do. People would just stop reading. | |
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| | | This isn't funny..
The FBI just raided my house and took my printer/fax/copier.
What did i miss?
Oh Sen. Oran Hatch is @ it again..
Can citizens *buy* the government back? | |
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| | pcscdmaChocobo Chocobo Random BattlePremium
join:2004-01-14
Winterset, IA | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by Edward0:
Can citizens *buy* the government back?
Anarchy is gaining popularity nowadays. The citizen/law enforcement ratio is in your favor.
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The Intel Prescott. One step closer to 50,000 watts of clear channel power! | |
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| | | | | Re: There is some sanity in the world!! said by pcscdma:
Anarchy is gaining popularity nowadays. The citizen/law enforcement ratio is in your favor.
Anarchy means staying home all day and shooting anyone you don't recognize that comes close to your home. Oh, and starving. | |
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|  mrchrisOut and aroundPremium
join:2002-10-01
North Babylon, NY | MPAA is too dense to think DMCA is just an America only law | |
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| | | oh, canada! mpaa/riaa/cia miss the point. it's legal for u to make a personal copy in the u.s., they've just done an end-run by making it illegal for anyone to make/distribute the tools u would use to make the personal copy u are entitled to make with your purchase. if i already own a copy of a movie or music and want to download a copy that someone else has already made into an mp3 or divx, what business is it of theirs. i keep hoping they drag me into court on real copyright infringement charges, instead of make believe p2p infringements, so i can show them the copies i already OWN.
It's just GREED! | |
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wuy3
join:2004-08-04
North Haven, CT | good ruling "I cannot see a real difference between a library that places a photocopy machine in a room full of copyrighted material and a computer user that places a personal copy on a shared directory linked to a P2P service," argued Justice Konrad von Finckenstein.
good ruling | |
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 BonezXBasement DwellerPremium
join:2004-04-13
Canada
2 edits | just "perfect" more American companies sticking their nose into other countries. followed closely by their lawyers
RIAA, MPAA, have no power over any country other then the united states.
if they want to have power over us why not invade ? oh yea i know why they won't invade, the entire U.N. will come over here and kick their a$$.
last time i checked Russia was still pretty sore over the cold war thing. | |
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 EGeezerSummertimePremium
join:2002-08-04
Midwest
kudos:7 | The difference is ... ... MPAA and RIAA's influence on the establishment are not as pervasive in Canada as in the US.
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Gaudeamus igitur, Juvenes dum sumus | |
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wentlancYou Can't Fix Dumb..
join:2003-07-30
Maineville, OH | To be BANNED: Here is a list of things that should be outlawed becuase they could be used to infringe upon copyrights:
Pencils(colored and non)
Pens
Markers
Crayons
The Etch-a-Sketch
The digi-draw (I think that is right. I'll check later)
Copy machines
Fax Machines
Microphones
Tape recorders(audio and video)
Cameras(digital and analog)
Monitors (could be used to display copyrighted material)
Speakers
Phtographic memory
Scanners
Computers
Telephones
Paper
Human memory (could be used to recall copyrighted works)
Eyes (could be used to facilitate the memory of copyrighted works)
Speech (could be used to distribute copyrighted works)
Where does it all stop?
puritan | |
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 pipdipchip8 Megabits A SecondPremium
join:2003-12-04
Hanover, MN | Wish I lived in Canada I wish I loved in Canada. LOL. | |
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 ropeguruPremium
join:2001-01-25
Grafton, WV | Imagine this.. I am not in Canada but just got a call from Cavalier Telephone, my DSL provider, that they had to shut off my connection becuase I was housing copies of Star Trek. I have never downloaded or housed any illegal songs, movies or TV shows. I don't even have a P2P program loaded except for Bottorrent and that I only bring up to get Linux distro's and other legit software.
My rant can be found over here:
»Cavalier and the MPAA | |
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| | Simple reponse quote:
What we can be sure of, as long as people insist on using P2P and other applications in mass for reasons that are wrong someone out there will be pushing to pass laws to stop it.
My whole view at »blogs.cyberlot.net/index.php?p=12 | |
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| | | Re: Simple reponse Well this isn't about a photo copier or a p2p network but, a friend of mine lent me 2 dvds to watch last night. Kill Bill Volume 1 and Starsky and Hutch. Where does it end. These companies don't seem to be going broke. | |
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| | | | Re: Simple reponse And yesterday I went to the shooting range and shot at paper ducks with a Old fashion UZI, but some states still ban them..
A company not going broke is no excuse, Did you go broke when the kids beat you up for lunch money? You went hungry but you lived through it.. That does not make it any more or less right or wrong. | |
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| | | | | Re: Simple reponse said by cyberlot0:
And yesterday I went to the shooting range and shot at paper ducks with a Old fashion UZI, but some states still ban them.
Ducks with an UZI? There's something so cool about that.... | |
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| | | | | said by cyberlot0:
A company not going broke is no excuse
No but maybe understanding the true meaning of copyright law might. It was made for only two things: Compensate the artist when someone is making money off them and to make sure credit is given where credit is due. Nothing more. Sharing music without profit never was meant to be obstructed by copyright law. However the major record labels decided they want to make sure the only way you got access to an art form was to pay them for it. And keep that in mind. This is an art form. Not a commodity or service. If we continue to allow big business to redefine laws to suit their own ends you will definitely be seeing the loss of freedoms that we are meant to have. | |
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| | | | BonezXBasement DwellerPremium
join:2004-04-13
Canada | Re: Simple reponse one way of stopping them is putting up a no tresspassing sign, when they come for you they are tresspassing which is considered illegal, and you aren't allowed to do somthing illegal to catch someone doing somthing illegal, so that's like a real big kick in the nuts for them. | |
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 AnonProxyProxy of AnonPremium
join:2001-05-12
ß | So use a Canandian anonproxy and all your music is free. | |
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