 vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD | Who to use? Microsoft doesnt detect, now lavasoft? Who is left? Spybot Search and Destroy? | |
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 | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28 | Re: Who to use?
Microsoft doesn't detect WhenU? Since "when" ?
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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| | vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD
| Re: Who to use? said by B  :Microsoft doesn't detect WhenU? Since "when" ? -- B No not whenu but some other spyware applications, I thought I read?? (I just saw some comments on it this morning.)
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I tie a rope around my penis and jump from a tree, don't you wanna grow up to be just like me!!!! | |
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Grail Knight
Who Dares Wins
Premium
join:2003-05-31
Erie, PA
 ·Verizon Online DSL
1 edit | Re: Who to use? Spybot and MS Giant to name a few Not all Anti-Spyware apps have identical definitions so some will detect things others leave out. The real issue as I said before on Judgment Day as I like to call it was about Credibility and Integrity which was tossed out the door.
Lavasoft failed to inform users that they removed certain spyware vendors from their detection list then gave canned responses you normally only hear from some ISPs. By appearances they toyed with their own forum trying to make things disappear and then blamed it on their update procedure. Some questions remain to be answered over there.
IMHO their credibility is destroyed and as far as I am concerned and if they did it once who is to say they will not do it again.
All they are doing now is trying to get back their Steak and Potatoes instead of having PB & Js. The masses have spoken here at DSLR and else where to get Lavasoft to change their tune. Had thousands said nothing do you think they would have said, "We made a mistake with some signatures being omitted and plan to fix that problem shortly?". They got busted and were not even up and up about it.
I feel sorry for their moderators who got hammered with questions yet were rendered impotent by lack of information from Lavasoft and only could C&P what Lavasoft posted. | |
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| | Arthur96
join:2000-12-17
Salem, NH
| Speaking of microsoft (this is just an FYI not a flame here) MSN just started giving out a branded version of Spy Sweeper to its members for free. A step in the right direction if you ask me and a good going to MSN.
"INTRODUCING WEBROOT SPY SWEEPER FOR MSN DIAL-UP*
If you spend a lot of time on the Internet, you've probably heard of spyware.
Spyware is software that gets into your computer through innocent-looking e-mail, and can radically disrupt your computing experience, take up valuable computer resources or monitor your computer's activity. Some spyware is even designed to dig up your personal information, such as your social security or credit card numbers.
Now you can help protect your computer from spyware download Webroot® Spy SweeperTM for MSN® Dial-up. Spy Sweeper for MSN Dial-up detects and removes many unwanted spyware programs, and is included at no extra cost with your MSN Dial-up subscription. That's a $29.95 value available at no additional charge to our members." | |
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| | | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28 | Re: Who to use?
Well that's interesting. They could have waited a few weeks and saved the trouble. I wonder if MSN Dial-Up staff even knew about the GIANT deal.
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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| | | | Arthur96
join:2000-12-17
Salem, NH | Re: Who to use? well i think that Giant will be more like the windows intergrated ani spy software but either way its a good thing | |
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| | | | | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
| Re: Who to use?Sure. All indications are that the MS/Giant product performs significantly better than SpySweeper, but it's nice to have both. For those 4 or 5 people on MSN dial-up, at least. 
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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Slidetbone
Mazin Go
Premium
join:2002-11-10
Land O Lakes, FL
| I uninstalled AdAware because I do not condone spyware. I don't know what stunt these spyware companies are pulling. It seems like they are lobbying the government and the software manufacturers with tons of cash and possibly kickbacks to make them think they are legit, but when companies like Lavasoft pull a stunt like this, that put up a red flag.
Sure it's free to use but what is to say that Claria, Gain and others may use these same tactics. Screw that!
If it is a spyware remover, it should stay that way. If they want to do this, then they must use a disclaimer or say what it will not detect and the real reasons why.
When Lavasoft decides to give the real explanation as to why they dropped WhenU from their definitions and not the million dollar worded one, then I will think about reinstalling their program. | |
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| | | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28 | Re: Who to use?
Lying troll.
-- B | |
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ieolus
Support The Clecs
join:2001-06-19
Duluth, GA | Since when are legit Media sites Republican or Democrat?
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"Speak for yourself "Chadmaster" - lesopp | |
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Shack
join:2002-01-17
Bloomington, IN
 ·Insight Communicat..
| This is why I do and will continue to use mutliple providers of spyware protection. Remove and never use the free version if you want, I will keep it since it costs me nothing and provides them nothing. I don't trust anyone of them, so I will use al I can mostly for free, but when I find one I chose to pay for I will, was about to buy giant when MS bought it. I run the free MS, until I find a good reason not to. | |
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| 
Tech-2005
@pacbell.n | Looks like you could say that Lavasoft had pulled a "180 solution" on this one...hehehehe! | |
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Exitium
@219.95.x.x
| Just use McAfee SecurityCenter / AntiSpyware. It detects all of these spywares and the definitions are updated on a daily basis. It even detects GameSpy Arcade and WhenU software as AdWare and SpyWare. To my knowledge, neither Spybot S&D nor AdAware detect GameSpy Arcade as adware, even though it is. | |
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Omega_41
join:2001-03-24
Huntsville, AL | Power to the People I am proud to be apart of a great team!! When DSLR talks the world listens!!:D | |
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B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
| That was YESTERDAY
I know we're talking different time zones and all, but "later on today" was YESTERDAY.
They've still made no clear official explanation, let alone simply apologized for a clear screw-up on their part.
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
3 edits | Re: That was YESTERDAY Maybe it's just super-hard work for the attorneys to get the story straight without angering WhenU! | |
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DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey | Its just customer appeasement Their plan is to let us have this one, and the next bunch of spyware they will pretend to not notice, because they have been paid off, or whatever. | |
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| vic102482
Premium
join:2002-04-30
Upper Marlboro, MD
| Re: Its just customer appeasement said by DaveNJ :Their plan is to let us have this one, and the next bunch of spyware they will pretend to not notice, because they have been paid off, or whatever. Yeah I just infected my machine, lastest update from adaware caaught something like 80 cleaned it, and AFTER that MSFT found 200 or something like that. I dont know who is pulling what but MSFT definatly comes out on top in this one.
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I tie a rope around my penis and jump from a tree, don't you wanna grow up to be just like me!!!! | |
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JPCass
join:2001-01-23
Denver, CO
| How about two tiers of criteria? I wouldn't mind if spyware detection software had two classes of software - one for blatant spyware, and the other that would keep a user informed about all the third-party "phone home" apps that can get installed in the process of web browsing, such as RealPlayer. And yes, that might have to include MS' Media Player as well, and would be particularly useful if it gave the status of the various settings that can be chosen to increase or reduce the information that the more mainstream programs send back to their home servers.
This would mean that applications wouldn't slip off the radar entirely, there would just be argument about which class they fell in to. Would that be helpful, or would it just give the anti-spyware vendors more wiggle room to downgrade true spyware apps to a secondary category that seemed more benign? | |
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orion940
Paralyzed By Confusion
Premium
join:2001-12-23
Windsor, CT
·AT&T Yahoo
| Credibilty It turns into credibilty. I uninstalled Lavasoft and have no intention of installing it again. They lost credibility with me, with the inclusion in the first place and the deletion of the post in the user forum.
M$ is lackluster, credibility there is weak as well. They change positions more than I change undies (every day).
O. | |
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Goldman
join:2002-06-21
Maumelle, AR
| Lack of integrity Lavasoft doesn't have the integrity to tell the truth about what happened.
If, just like CA, they needed to take defs out temporarily, then they should say so. Instead they stonewall, remove threads in their forums then blame the removal on "merging" problems, and totally ignore customers questions. How can we trust this company again? I came back after they left us with no updates for several months, a few years back, but this is it for me.
Uninstalled. | |
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k_o
Que Hora Es?
Premium
join:2002-12-05
Lakeport, CA
clubs:
| sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye I am just now catching up on the lastest installments of this debacle. I was really hoping AA would do the right thing, behave with some dignity, and treat thier customers with respect.
Has their "business model" changed? I think this is also linked to the changed of AA to a yearly subscription service.
I can't believe the reply from aa was so....weak.
Spelling errors? Gimme a dead horse...
--
DC Cruncher for Teams ECO & Starfire * MoveOn * MysteryLake.com hosted by gottadeal.com | |
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Wills
join:2001-01-03
Port Charlotte, FL | Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye My question is how many of you that are swearing off Ad-Aware actually paid for it to begin with?
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I have a shaved head, a goatee, and tatoos. Don't you realize the rules don't apply to me. | |
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koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye Why is it everyone on this planet determines that the deciding factor when it comes to ANY disagreement IS MONEY.
Person A: omg dd u pay 4 it??
Person B: lolkololozz no g0t l33t w4r3z 0n IRC d00dz
Person A: lololo
Person B: kekekekeke
Person A: gg next map
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Making life hard for others since 1977. | |
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SmashClam
@gatech.edu
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye Why is it everyone on this planet determines that the deciding factor when it comes to ANY disagreement IS MONEY.
EVERYONE does not. However, in this situation, the question of money is appropriate. Lavasoft could care less if you stop using the free version of their software. They may have lost "possible potential business", if one day you may have purchased the registered version, but they can't put "possible potential business" on the balance sheet. You have not affected their revenue by stopping use of their free software - so take your bitching elsewhere. | |
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| | | | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye
Are you really so naive as to think that users of free software don't have an ENORMOUS impact on what businesses and corporations and other users PURCHASE?
Do the words "ZoneAlarm" mean anything to you? How about "Microsoft Office" (which achieved popularity through widespread copyright infringement)?
Do you think ANYONE would have been purchasing Ad-Aware all this time if Lavasoft had not made the software known and established so much good will by giving away a free, effective product?
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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| | | JPCass
join:2001-01-23
Denver, CO
| said by koitsu :Why is it everyone on this planet determines that the deciding factor when it comes to ANY disagreement IS MONEY. Here, we're talking about software and services that come from companies, and generally speaking, companies exist to seek profit - or at least pay their bills and employees - so money is their motivator. There either have to be enough paying customers, or some other source of income.
Even non-profits need a source of income to pay their bills, and volunteers need some source of income to allow them the luxury of volunteering.
When it comes to individual customers, those who don't pay are, to some extent, riding on the coattails of those who do pay, and so those who do pay are apt to be resentful of "freeloaders". If nobody paid to begin with, most products wouldn't even exist to be pirated. | |
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Wills
join:2001-01-03
Port Charlotte, FL
| My point is all of you dropping Lavasoft aren't doing a damn thing to them when you're running their free version.
I'd honestly be happy to be rid of you freeloaders because you're obviously not paying my bills or helping me write my software in any way, shape or form.
And there was no discussion on whether their pay version still detected WhenU...
--
I have a shaved head, a goatee, and tatoos. Don't you realize the rules don't apply to me. | |
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| | | | B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye First, I wasn't replying to you, but...
said by Wills :My point is all of you dropping Lavasoft aren't doing a damn thing to them when you're running their free version. Except that (a) we don't know what percentage of the dropping complainers are paid users, and you're simply assuming that any complainers are running the free version (in fact the most vocal folks seem to be those who have recommended and installed PAID versions for paying clients), and (b) I think those users DO have an impact regardless -- as noted above, and as evidenced by Lavasoft's hasty retreat!
I'd honestly be happy to be rid of you freeloaders because you're obviously not paying my bills or helping me write my software in any way, shape or form. Do you work for Lavasoft? If so, then please disclose as much in your post. If not, then what the heck are you talking about?
And there was no discussion on whether their pay version still detected WhenU... Yes there was; every post applied to both versions, because the detection database, as far as I know, is IDENTICAL.
People weren't fixated on which program and which interface and which frickin' business model version applied (the 'free' version OF COURSE has a business model and impacts on the company!). We have been discussing what the company removed from its published databases.
By the way, I don't use Ad-Aware, so I'm not one of the "freeloaders" you trollishly deride.
-- B
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In a realm outside causality and function | |
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techboi
| como se dice "25 million firefox downloads," troll?
I'm sure you'd be 'honestly happy,' but only because you've not a clue. Being able to claim "10 million users" > "we have 3000 paying customers ggbbq," and what you haven't thought ahead to is "dropping adaware" == "picking up something else."
They haven't lost a current guaranteed income, they've lost userbase, credibility, reputation, the support of a knowlegeable (and vocal ) community, and their competition has gained all these things; plus converts to a new system seem to be more likely to register and pay for it (i'd like more hard info on this).
The fact remains that every software company on this planet has been aware for quite some time that, like any good drug dealer knows, giving it away for free in limited quantities is what brings back the paying customers. Hello?
Geh. engage brain first, then fingers. | |
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Grail Knight
Who Dares Wins
Premium
join:2003-05-31
Erie, PA | It is not about money it is about removing things behind the users backs without notification. | |
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koitsu
Premium
join:2002-07-16
Mountain View, CA
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye Yes, I agree with you completely Grail Knight. My point was specifically directed at Wills, who said:
My question is how many of you that are swearing off Ad-Aware actually paid for it to begin with? --
Making life hard for others since 1977. | |
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k_o
Que Hora Es?
Premium
join:2002-12-05
Lakeport, CA
clubs:
| Re: sigh. AA, we hardly knew ye said by koitsu :Yes, I agree with you completely Grail Knight. My point was specifically directed at Wills, who said: My question is how many of you that are swearing off Ad-Aware actually paid for it to begin with? I paid for it, and as I have said elsewhere, I doubt I will renew my subsription.
I haven't heard much regarding the change of our licenses to yearly subsription.
I was taken by surprise by that one.
I wouldn't of known unless I revisited the EULA during the early part of this.
I don't think I would of paid, if it was going to be $40 (i think is was about that much) each year.
AA is still on my PC, and I still run it.
Like many of the people here, I use a multiple of tools.
A2 is coming along with some really cool features.
I was proud to donate to Spybot in the past.
I will encourage others to as well. This is America.
We vote with our wallets.
--
DC Cruncher for Teams ECO & Starfire * MoveOn * MysteryLake.com hosted by gottadeal.com | |
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| JPCass
join:2001-01-23
Denver, CO
| Re: Adware or Spyware ?? - detect both? Good point.
As I suggested in my earlier post How about two tiers of criteria?, there might be some benefit to breaking malware down into categories, perhaps even more than two. That way, if a company for whatever reason dropped off the list of most-threatening Spyware, they would just be moved to the list of Adware - or however it might be categorized - and handled appropriately. | |
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| averagedude
join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ | You make to much sence, so it will never happen. | |
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Combat Chuck
Too Many Cannibals
Premium
join:2001-11-29
Erie, PA
| said by LiamJunket :The problem these so-called anti-spyware tools and their companies have is to define what they are. Are they strictly anti-spyware or are they also anti-adware? I think part of the problem is no one can define what exactly is adware and what is spyware and what the difference is.
I can define it, spyware is adware without consent; but there are a number of people active in the anti-spyware community that have decided that they don't want to have their software subsidized by ads wether they consent or not, and that no one else should be allowed to either; and it's in these peoples best interest that the definition remains muddied so that they can vilify companies that try to be legitimate. It doesn't help any when you start to bring antivirus functions into the mix.
These company needs to sit down and come up with a list of behaviors that constitute "malware" their software should detect, and how the "malware" should be presented (ie:spyware, adware, virus); then they need to stick with it, and clearly explain when and why changes to the criteria are made. As it is decisions as to what is and isn't included seem to be determined by a combination of some loose guidelines (I mean come on, it's a freaking scoring system, can the software only %35 phone home without consent) and the perceived PR level of the company that makes the malware.
IMNSHO, it's even worse that that Lavasoft has caved to the other side as well now, because it shows that there absolutely is no set standard for them.
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sprry; I kust gpt s new leubprd////////keyboard | |
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Taranis
join:2001-12-06
Mount Vernon, WA
| No Explaination Lavasoft used a transparent excuse about why WhenU was dropped, saying it didn't get enough points to get on their TAC list. Excuse me, but isn't that list administered solely by Lavasoft themselves? WhenU didn't suddenly clean up their act; Lavasoft "overlooked" certain criteria under pressure from WhenU themselves. There's simply no other explaination. Lavasoft certainly doesn't have one. And given their lacluster response to the outcry over this issue, I doubt they even care.
Trying to pull the wool over their customer base in this manner is nothing less than insulting. They jumped in bed with the enemy and unexpectedly got caught. Now, they'll ride the coattails of their reputation won from users who don't know any better, until all this blows over.
I'll never buy their product because I will never support a shady business than allows boardroom and backroom dealings to compromise the standards Lavasoft themselves set.
I will, however, continue to use their product, as a red-flag that I should run a real anti-spyware app, that is robust enough and uncorrupted by greed to handle the situation without wasting my time. | |
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DHRacer
Fire Survivor
join:2000-10-10
Lake Arrowhead, CA
·Charter Pipeline
·Verizon west (ex G..
| Not just Ad-Aware? Why aren't other users pulling their hair out regarding Spybot?
Most users (at least not here) probably don't know that Spybot ignores about 4 or 5 different spyware items by default.
The fact that you can switch to advance mode and go to the ignore products list and uncheck them manually is not well publicized.
So why aren't people bashing Spybot for this? Simply because once properly informed, users can change it so it ignores nothing?
--
"No one will believe you solved this problem in one day! We've been working on it for months. Now, go act busy for a few weeks and I'll let you know when it's time to tell them." (R&D Supervisor, Minnesota Mining & Manufacturing /3M Corp.) | |
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| Hickerx2
God Bless The U.S. Military
join:2001-03-04
Franklinville, NY
| Re: Not just Ad-Aware? said by DHRacer :So why aren't people bashing Spybot for this? Actually, they are....look around....google is your friend.
However, there's a difference between a "default" ignore setting, and completely removing the detection.
I wouldn't give 2 craps if Lavasoft decided to ignore a threat by "default", but removing all detection reeks of shadiness. Their subsequent "explanation" that WhenU is not "spyware" is complete bunk and damage control. The name of the app is AdAware not "spyaware". With their explanation, they're admitting to misleading their customers. They can do whatever they want, no biggie. It's their customers they're throwing away
--
Kerry for President? Is this Saturday Night Live?....whew!....it was only a bad dream | |
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| jimmerb51
Premium
join:2004-06-25
Cleveland, OH | This is why I have tried to do my part to help support Patrick Kolla by sending $20 and 30$ the past two years.I believe his work is worth it to help us in the fight against the plague. | |
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ZOverLord
Premium
join:2003-10-20
Minneapolis, MN
1 edit | Insanity First, we still do NOT know WHAT ELSE was removed!
Second, to REMOVE ALL WhenU checks, as they did, based on a NEW release of WhenU is equal to Microsoft releasing Windows XP and then declaring that because of this new operating system that Windows 3.1,Windows 95, Windows 98, Windows NT and Windows Server is no longer an Operating System
Will somebody Pinch me PLEASE!
Still no answer from Lavasoft to my questions located here:
»www.lavasoftsupport.com/index.ph···ic=59051 | |
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Grail Knight
Who Dares Wins
Premium
join:2003-05-31
Erie, PA | Re: Insanity Good luck getting a reply.
All of their moderators for the most part are just C & P the canned responses Lavasoft is feeding them. You know that. | |
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Rally1
join:2000-06-12
Irvine, CA
 ·AT&T U-Verse
1 edit | spellaware "We ared currently working on a new definition file, that will will include WhenU. A more thourough explanation on what happend will be posted later on today."
Once they finish adding the new definitions, they can start working on a spell checking program. Normally who cares in a forum, but when you are representing a company take the time  .
Edit: Of course their English is better than my Swedish... | |
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CPM
join:2001-08-24
Miami, FL | Power of the people. The People have been heard. | |
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DarkSorcerer
Premium
join:2004-06-15
Belleview, FL
| Maybe instead of.... Running around preaching the sky is falling we should give them a chance. I mean they are RE-ADDING it, Thus, It will be detected again, I'm sujre when they removed it they didn't realize it was gonna be such a big deal, however They may or may not have been aware of the recent events of other companies being purchased. Apprently the story about their TAC to me holds up, because WhenU's downfall is ity has no way to get rid of it (The "functional" uninstaller) Which means you gotta manually delete it, But that's only worth one point on LavaSoft's Scale. Besides There's much larger spyware problems out there Lavasoft is happy to detect, before you call anyone a sellout, At least give them time to explain themselves, I didn't agree with their decision to delete WHENU nbut I did take the time to look at their TAC and See that WhenU only scores a 1 pointer, However, yes it's extreemly annoying to gets ads popping up out of nowhere, which is what it does, but it doesnt phone home, it doesnt compromise security, it's like cydoor, Both extremly irritating, but Not gonna kill your dog.
I say that we just let them explain themselves... and be happy they readded insteead of everyone burning Ad-aware on their computers, because, how many times has adaware detected something most can't? I cant count about a dozen times Ive caught about 200 more objects (These are on clients pcs) then any other | |
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toddbs98
join:2000-07-08
North Little Rock, AR
clubs:  | Re: Maybe instead of.... Where does it say anywhere in Lavasoft's statement that when-u was re-added because of pressure from DSLR readers? The only place I see that said is in Karl's "news" story. | |
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cork1958
Cork
join:2000-02-26
Fruitport, MI | I'll keep on using it right along with spybot and still debating on the ms one. | |
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ross
join:2000-08-16 | Think they'll make the same mistake next time? Like telling anyone what they're up to, that is? | |
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| KyeU
join:2003-12-31
Canada
| Re: Think they'll make the same mistake next time? said by ross :Like telling anyone what they're up to, that is? The thing that sucks is that we won't know.
We'll need someone like Eric to somehow stumble upon a missing definition.
This is what people mean by "loss of trust" in Lavasoft. | |
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Feudal15
join:2004-01-22
Jefferson, MD
|  How the hell is Spyware/Adware still legal?!?
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Adware or Spyware ?? - detect both?
