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BellSouth: Lay Fiber, We Yank Jobs
Louisiana exec issues employment threat

More from the city of Lafayette, Louisiana, which is trying to get a triple play fiber-optic network off the ground, despite legal opposition from Cox and BellSouth (USAToday has an excellent primer on the fight). Bellsouth has now informed the city that if they move forward with the plan, they might consider pulling their Cingular Wireless call center out of Lafayette (the center employs 1,300 people). BellSouth, unlike Verizon, has no plan to deploy fiber to the home.

Update: BellSouth Louisiana President William A. Oliver appears to be backing away from the comments, according to the Daily Advertiser, while city parish President Joey Durel has issued a statement saying he believes the comments are "nothing but economic blackmail."
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merge or sellout
@bellsouth.net

merge or sellout

Anon

Extortion

Can you say extortion??

moe fuel to the fire
@optonline.net

moe fuel to the fire

Anon

Re: Extortion

That's OK, there's always sprint/nextel, t-mobile, and others that will bring jobs to the state.. so that's a bad bluff to call any Red state on...
GO FIBER GO!!!

Telcos are gonna learn sooner or later (like a certain Koren) that throwing a tantrum will get you nowhere fast, with or without nuclear weapons.
IGGY9
No Guru Just Here To Help
Premium Member
join:2001-03-30
Chatham, IL

1 recommendation

IGGY9 to merge or sellout

Premium Member

to merge or sellout
I say install the fiber. Do you know how many call centers will be knocking on their door after they get this network up and running? One good example of this was posted here in the news the other day. »If You Build it, Google Comes
yac898
join:2002-12-06
Stony Plain, AB

yac898 to merge or sellout

Member

to merge or sellout
if i understand this correctly, a GIANT telco, which had ALL of its underlying plant paid for by taxpayers, is scared of competition from a government owned consumer option? HAHAHAHAHAHA.....

BK3
join:2001-04-10
Geneva, IL

BK3

Member

Blackmail

In my opinion, this is nothing more than economic blackmail.

WeSRT4
join:2000-11-20
Mobile, AL

1 edit

WeSRT4

Member

Re: Blackmail

I smell a lawsuit coming.

Edit: You know the more I think about it, with all of Bellsouth's actions lately I'm going to dump them. C-ya BS!!!

TheMadSwede
Premium Member
join:2001-01-30
Holland, MI

TheMadSwede

Premium Member

Re: Blackmail

said by WeSRT4:

I smell a lawsuit coming.

Edit: You know the more I think about it, with all of Bellsouth's actions lately I'm going to dump them. C-ya BS!!!
The problem is that ANY company would do this. I'm thinking...gee, I'm glad I don't have BS/Cingular. But then I realized, heck, Verizon (Wireless) would do the exact same thing.

lyls
@adsl.tele.dk

lyls

Anon

Re: Blackmail

if any company would resort to blackmail then i guess the country and maybe even the western world is in a very sad state

AthlGrond
Premium Member
join:2002-04-25
Aurora, CO

AthlGrond

Premium Member

Re: Blackmail

Well since the government does the same thing all the time I guess we are all doomed.

ropeguru
Premium Member
join:2001-01-25
Mechanicsville, VA

ropeguru to BK3

Premium Member

to BK3
I was thinking the exact same thing before reading your post.

Not sure who they would take this to in order to have Bellsouth whipped, but I think I would be looking for the correct entity now that it is public.

Unregistered user

Anon

Re: Blackmail

Take it to the court of public opinion. Seriously. If they want to force a vote in Lafayette, make this threat public. Make BellSouth look like the extortionists they are.

If this thing does end up going to a vote, then those who favor muni broadband have an obligation to band together and help the people of Lafayette. Make that city a test case in the use of grassroots organizing and fundraising. It has to start somewhere.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02

Karl Bode

News Guy

Re: Blackmail

Sadly propaganda doesn't work that way.

The more they publicize Bellsouth claims that the fiber plan could result in layoffs, the more "layoffs" and "fiber plan" are discussed in concert.

"Joe" doesn't pay much attention to the conflict, but he does remember some talk of job losses. Better vote against that!

By simply injecting the possibility into the debate, you've scared off would-be voters too lazy to really dig in and understand the issue.

unregistered
@corning.com

unregistered to Unregistered user

Anon

to Unregistered user
"Re: Blackmail

Take it to the court of public opinion. Seriously. If they want to force a vote in Lafayette, make this threat public. Make BellSouth look like the extortionists they are.

If this thing does end up going to a vote, then those who favor muni broadband have an obligation to band together and help the people of Lafayette. Make that city a test case in the use of grassroots organizing and fundraising. It has to start somewhere."

That's the problem. When it goes to the public they get scared. Every person who works for cingular, their spouses and friends will vote no. Blackmail works.
haplo2112
join:2003-05-12
Charlton, MA

haplo2112 to BK3

Member

to BK3
If they followed through with it they could be sued...that was their big mistake...hell that kind of comment could be construed as a sort of economic terrorism with the patriot act.

AthlGrond
Premium Member
join:2002-04-25
Aurora, CO

AthlGrond

Premium Member

Re: Blackmail

What would they be sued for do you suppose?
haplo2112
join:2003-05-12
Charlton, MA

haplo2112

Member

Re: Blackmail

Coercion, illegal business practice, breach of contract...

AthlGrond
Premium Member
join:2002-04-25
Aurora, CO

AthlGrond

Premium Member

Re: Blackmail

said by haplo2112:

Coercion, illegal business practice, breach of contract...
Since when is Coercion illegal and what contract is breached?

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville to AthlGrond

Premium Member

to AthlGrond
said by AthlGrond:

What would they be sued for do you suppose?
Breach of contract with LEDA. Check out the article from the advocate in this (just released) BBR news item:
»Louisiana Fiber and 'Economic Blackmail'?

"The Cingular call center was opened in 2001 in a Lafayette Economic Development Authority technology park.

It is the result of about $18 million worth of concessions, LEDA President and CEO Gregg Gothreaux said Thursday.

The concessions include $10 million in state tax breaks, donation of land and the building from LEDA and discounted utilities from LUS, Gothreaux said."

packetscan
Premium Member
join:2004-10-19
Bridgeport, CT

packetscan to BK3

Premium Member

to BK3
*cough*

We as citizens need to take a stand.

--
Who are you going to pay off today?

Steve
I know your IP address

join:2001-03-10
Tustin, CA

Steve to BK3

to BK3
I believe the proper term is "extortion"

bogey7806
join:2004-03-19
Here

bogey7806

Member

Re: Blackmail

Extortion?

All it means is BellSouth adapted well to Louisiana.
tkdslr
join:2004-04-24
Pompano Beach, FL

2 recommendations

tkdslr to BK3

Member

to BK3
said by BK3:

In my opinion, this is nothing more than economic blackmail.
It's called Extortion.. a felony in most states..

I think the appropriate punishment for Bell South Inc. would be the forfeiture of all assets in the state and a lifetime ban from doing business in Louisiana.

That would put All mega corps on notice. Make an economic threat and pay the price in spades.

footballdude
Premium Member
join:2002-08-13
Imperial, MO

footballdude

Premium Member

Re: Blackmail

Saying they're going to take their ball and go home isn't extortion. OK, it is, but I don't think you can charge them with extortion in a courtroom.

King P
Don't blame me. I voted for Ron Paul
Premium Member
join:2004-11-17
Murfreesboro, TN

King P to BK3

Premium Member

to BK3
Exactly right. Isn't America great! Big Corporations control not only the Gov't, but the Media, and the Economy. Frankly, it disturbs me that some agencies aren't smacking BS (and I use that term liberally) around a little bit and telling them what's up.

Nightshade
Premium Member
join:2002-05-26
Salem, OR

Nightshade to BK3

Premium Member

to BK3
And what pray tell, will bellsouth gain from their own actions?

And all because of one city wanting to provide broadband to their own citizens when BellSouth has failed to do so.

Just pathetic, straight pathetic. Pathetic enough to make me want to dance that I do not live in BellSouth Territory.

I got Qwest to play with.:D
Kearnstd
Space Elf
Premium Member
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ

Kearnstd to BK3

Premium Member

to BK3
what i dont understand is if a company doesnt want to provide a service to people who are will and able to pay for it why do they protest a city offering something they never will.

Robert
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL

1 edit

Robert

Premium Member

Ashamed..

I'm ashamed in BellSouth. They aren't playing very fair. They had years to get their act together w/o any interference, now that other counties are tired of their crap and want something done, BellSouth screams foul. Not very nice. I hope Lafayette takes them to court and wins.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Ashamed..

These are the kinds of battles small localities have to deal with. Bellsouth shouldn't have to keep their call center there if they fear losing revenue. residents should be prepared to deal with these kinds of repercussions when they place these services in the hands of the government. What they should consider is the addition of government jobs. Will the new network require many new government employees? Will a new fiber network help attract other business and residents, and thus increased tax revenue?

They could come out very much on top by building a municipal fiber network and kicking out Bellsouth, and they wouldn't have to sacrifice jobs or tax revenue in the process.

FiberNow
@tsged.com

FiberNow

Anon

Re: Ashamed..

True, they shouldn't have to keep their call center here is they fear losing revenue. The only question I would ask is what does the Cingular Call Center have to do with fiber lines/service at all? It seems like this is just a dirty blackmail scare tactic more than anything else.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Ashamed..

said by FiberNow:

True, they shouldn't have to keep their call center here is they fear losing revenue. The only question I would ask is what does the Cingular Call Center have to do with fiber lines/service at all? It seems like this is just a dirty blackmail scare tactic more than anything else.
It has everything to do with the class of the worker. A tech-savvy worker will no doubt gravitate to the exciting new jobs created in fiber optic network installation, management, and support. That beats helping, in gross detail, a clueless cell phone user how to send a text message using only number keys. I'm sure you can imagine.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02

1 edit

Karl Bode

News Guy

Re: Ashamed..

quote:
Bellsouth shouldn't have to keep their call center there if they fear losing revenue. residents should be prepared to deal with these kinds of repercussions when they place these services in the hands of the government.
And where you see it in the hands of government, when it's small-town government, I see it in the hands of people.

It's a scare tactic, nothing more. Don't buy into their rhetoric. Threatening to fire people from a wireless division if you create fiber competition is utterly classless. They're going nowhere.

If there is money to be made in an area, it will be served, regardless of whether or not one city runs fiber to a few thousand homes.

Perhaps it forces Bellsouth to upgrade their paltry network upgrade plans and consider fiber instead of scattered ADSL2+.

BellSouth isn't going to just pack up shop and run away because a muni is developed. If anything they'll be forced to improve, perhaps eliminating the NEED for the muni.

••••

ColdFiltered
join:2005-01-25
Atlanta, GA

ColdFiltered to Robert

Member

to Robert
When I first read the newsbit's title i thought that Bellsouth was talking about reducing BST labor force to offset work reduction as business is lost to Muni Broadband. Its not only expected, but normal for any business to reduce workforce upon lost work.

This, on the other hand, is blackmail. Since Cingular is a co-owned company of BST+SBC I find it hard to believe that they would get away with it since Cingular and this Muni effort are not really competing businesses.

As such, I would have much more respect had they simply said they would reduce BST workforce in the area by 50% and double to triple POTS deployment. But, in reflection I can see this as something they would NOT want to do as it would just drive customers away faster.

So, its a lose-lose situation for everyone. Curious, what was the public vote on Muni Broadband in Lafayette? Was there a poublic vote?

FiberNow
@tsged.com

FiberNow

Anon

Re: Ashamed..

There will be one now, because Bellsouth won in court. Off topic, but it seemed almost like a dirty decision. Bellsouth filed suit a day late, which the judge completely ignored. He also ruled from the bench with no recesses in a couple hours, with a whole 10 days alotted for the hearing. Anyway, the thing that worries me about a vote is that there will be alot of misinformation, and people looking at this as a money only issue, instead of weighing costs vs. benefits for the future.

jhboricua

join:2000-06-06
Minneapolis, MN

jhboricua

Re: Ashamed..

The judge didn't force a vote on this. The vote will only happen if the BS shills get enough public support for it, which they failed to do the first time.

rstrandb
Howl at the moon
Premium Member
join:2003-04-17
Albany, GA

rstrandb

Premium Member

Truth is......

they'll probably yank the call-center anyway and outsource overseas anyway. Screw them, put in the fiber.

rudnicke
Premium Member
join:2004-10-23
Rantoul, IL

rudnicke

Premium Member

Re: Truth is......

That's the whole reason I won't buy a Dell computer anymore. When I call in for support, I want someone on the other end that can understand me, and someone whom I can understand.

morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000

morbo

Member

Re: Truth is......

said by rudnicke:

That's the whole reason I won't buy a Dell computer anymore. When I call in for support, I want someone on the other end that can understand me, and someone whom I can understand.
same here.

zabes63
join:2003-04-05
Batavia, IL

zabes63

Member

This is nothing new

SBC always threatened to whack the locals if the Tri Cities project had ever moved forward. Now, we all have the benefit of knowing that they'll cut jobs regardless of what a muni does.

It was the same thing with the lawsuits against any muni that dares to go ahead and do it. We all know it was what was next in the bell's anti-mini playbook.

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville

Premium Member

How many jobs will Lafayette's network provide?

I couldn't find information about how many jobs Lafayette's network would provide. Does anyone know?

Wouldn't jobs for Lafayette's network remain local, and not be subject to corporate threats?

•••••••

masterwolfe2
Resident Redneck
join:2001-03-07
Hiawassee, GA

masterwolfe2

Member

Out-sourced already

One of the reasons I left BellSouth Fast Access (beside connection issues) was because their Tier 1 tech support is in the Phillipines. I had major problems understanding and getting myself understood when I would call in with a problem.

•••

BillRoland
Premium Member
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL

BillRoland

Premium Member

Send them on

We have a Cingular call center here, send those jobs to us!
digital k
Premium Member
join:2003-12-25

digital k

Premium Member

As a Bellsouth Customer

I am very sad to do be doing business with them. I read the story and it seems that BS and Cox cable are trying to kill this. I don't see what the big deal is , and I hope like hell Lafayette decides to go thru with it, if for no other reason than to be able to thumb their noses at greedy Bellsouth.

Sysadmin
Premium Member
join:2000-07-07
Elk Grove, CA

Sysadmin

Premium Member

Minority owner

I think the city should move right ahead and proceed with the fiber-optic network and call their bluff.

Bell South only owns 40% of Cingular. I don't think the majority owner (SBC) would think that is a cost effective move and would nix any move attempt on Bell South's part. It will take them a while to recover from the AT&T Wireless merger as well.

Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY

Transmaster

Member

You know

I'll bet you BellSouth is just looking for an excuse to close down this service center anyway, as it is a call center Bellsouth wants to outsource and what better way of doing it by blaming a city for the move. What a bunch of corporate assholes. I hope Lafayette tells BellSouth to go for a walk in a 'gator inhabited swamp. And Lafayette can call BellSouth bluff by telling them, if you close down this call center we will help to people you screw over find other work.

Drex
Beer...The other white meat.
Premium Member
join:2000-02-24
Not There

Drex

Premium Member

New Business

Wouldn't the city of Lafayette be able to benefit from this fiber network by being able to attract new businesses? They'd be able to offer them fast, reliable (we hope) connections for cheap.

•••
Drex

Drex

Premium Member

From the article

I read the USA Today article and just love this part:
quote:
It told local regulators in Lafayette that they should use the FCC's "Part 64" accounting rules, which have long been imposed on local phone companies, as a benchmark to set rules for the city. Lafayette countered that those rules would be an unnecessary burden.

Yet within days of making that argument last fall, BellSouth turned around and asked the FCC to relieve it of the Part 64 rules for its broadband services. It complained that the rules were onerous and outdated and force carriers to keep "extensive and tedious" records.
flushls
join:2004-11-02
Joyce, WA

flushls

Member

The begining of the end

This could be a tipping point in the war for the Telco's
where they might win another battle but they will lose the war.
It goes back to the old saying cutting off their nose to spite their face.
It think they should pull their call centre it would do wonders for their already tarred image.
They are already looking for an excuse to send it to India anyway.

Flushls
DSL Oberst
join:2001-11-29

DSL Oberst

Member

*shrug*

A perfectly legal and legitimate tactic. I can see the Bellsouth execs now: "Hmmm. Our call center in Lafayette is...costly. It'd be cheaper if we moved it to Tampa, Call Center Capital of the World. Ah well. Such a pity."

It can't truly be called extortion. The definition of extortion is 'Illegal use of one's official position or powers to obtain property, funds, or patronage.' Bellsouth is not really attempting to do this. Let's look at the article:

---
Oliver said a successful LUS venture could create a monopoly in the parish.

Why would BellSouth want to keep all its operations in a parish where it had no other significant business interest, Oliver asked rhetorically.

The call center, which handles customer service tasks for Cingular, could be located in "Timbuktu" and still perform the same services, Oliver said.

"Would you still keep people there?" Oliver said.

---

I cannot fault the man's logic; it is inescapable. Why put money into a community that they cannot make money from? They used the same logic at Earthlink...and to Earthlink's greater profit and increased stock values. I honestly am unable to fathom why a for-profit corporation would think otherwise.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02

Karl Bode

News Guy

Re: *shrug*

quote:
Why put money into a community that they cannot make money from?
That buys into the logic that they can't make money there. Says who?

Because 1-2,000 people sign up for fiber in a Southern city, suddenly it's a profit graveyard? Because of one small competitor?

It's one of two things (or both):

Propaganda designed to get locals tying job losses to the fiber plan.

An excuse to use as cover for a pre-made decision to send those jobs overseas.

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville to DSL Oberst

Premium Member

to DSL Oberst
Exactly, DSL Oberst See Profile. Why would BellSouth keep jobs in Lafayette, anyway? I mean, it's not like Lafayette can count on those jobs to stay regardless of whether or not they build a muni system.

BellSouth has an interest in the economic viability of BellSouth, whereas the City of Lafayette has an interest in the economic viability of the City of Lafayette.

The muni system will provide much better economic viability for Lafayette than crumbling to BellSouth's threats will.
Soundfx4
join:2005-02-08
Roanoke, VA

Soundfx4

Member

A$$hole corporations

Mother f**king Greedy Corporations. This is exactly why the USA is so far behind in technology. Sh*t heads...
bogey7806
join:2004-03-19
Here

bogey7806

Member

Re: A$$hole corporations

The US was the leader in the telecom world till sometime in the 80s.

Sure, blame it all on corporations. Whatever lie you want to believe is fine wth me.
AboutBell1
AboutBell
Premium Member
join:2004-12-13

1 edit

AboutBell1

Premium Member

The big picture

Looking at the big picture. The benefits of a public FTTH infrastructure should more than offset the loss of jobs in the long term IMHO.

Lots of high tech companies are looking for just that sort of infrastructure to set up shop. Google just announced they are thinking of setting up an office in a tiny town in Oregon partly because it's wired with a public fiber infrastructure.

It's still too early to tell if this is how things should be heading but this public information highway way of thinking is even farther ahead in Europe. Sweden is the leader. I think a large percentage of their country is wired with public fiber to the home.

It's not that new of a concept. After all, if it makes sense for the highways to be publicly owned then why not the information highways?!
jmuskratt
join:2000-11-21
New Orleans, LA

1 recommendation

jmuskratt

Member

Four letters for Bellsouth to contemplate...

RICO.

Unregistered user

Anon

Is there a pro-muni group in Lafayette?

Is there a group advocating muni broadband that's active in Lafayette? If not, there needs to be, and soon. Here's what I think needs to happen.

A group is formed and set up as a nonprofit organization.
The group establishes a Web site and prepares to take donations.
The group is publicized on muni-broadband Web sites, Slashdot, and any other news outlets that will run a story.
Donations are used to produce materials and advertisements promoting the benefits of muni broadband.

Look, we know BellSouth and Cox are gonna sink money into this, so the other side needs to do the same. You can't count on LUS to be able to spend serious cash to promote this because they probably don't have the money. Therefore, those who support this initiative need to come forward and get the ball rolling.

If a group gets organized and active in Lafayette, I'd be willing to donate. I have a PayPal account ready, and I'm not afraid to use it.

•••
yac898
join:2002-12-06
Stony Plain, AB

yac898

Member

not a dime of tax dollars

tax dollars for any non CORE govt business SHOULD NEVER be funded by taxpayers. if the government now considers telecomunications to be a core business, i would suggest that before every taxpayer has broadband, every taxpayer have healthcare, period. the argument that with the extra dollars, we could do this & that for more WILL NOT HELP THE PEOPLE that need it the "this & that" now.

hurfy
Premium Member
join:2002-08-06
Spokane, WA

hurfy

Premium Member

Re: not a dime of tax dollars

just do it

A Local Call center is currently advertising for 150 more employees in Spokane for their client CINGULAR :0

Either they have such a need that it would be impractical to pull em out down there no matter what...or....else...
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