$7000 Fine for Sharing 'WordPress For Dummies' Rare Default Judgement For Settlement Shakedown Publisher E-Book publisher John Wiley & Sons (famous for their "for Dummies" book line) has been one of several outfits engaged in "settlement-o-matic" copyright efforts, tracking users on BitTorrent, demanding user identities from ISPs, and then scaring users into settling outside of court. Verizon recently stood up to and beat John Wiley & Sons, declaring that the company was operating a shakedown racket designed to "harass" customers. In a rare default judgement however, one user in Poughkeepsie, New York has been ordered to pay $7,000 for sharing a copy of "WordPress All-in-One For Dummies" on BitTorrent (Wiley was seeking $150,000). The publisher has filed a dozen mass BitTorrent lawsuits involving a few hundred John Doe defendants in total, and in this particular case the user in question did not respond.
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  RobIn Deo speramus.Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:3 | New Book: Suing for Dummies Who even owns a legit copy of WordPress for Dummies? | |
|  |  ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 | Re: New Book: Suing for Dummies For $7000, they better now own the publishing rights. | |
| | | | | Re: New Book: Suing for Dummies This will have absolutely zero impact on file sharing. | |
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| | Wiley & Sons and Dummies Books I will buy no more! Well if that is how they are going to act then I have purchased my last Wiley and Dummies books! This insanity needs to stop and the best way to stop them is to hit them were it hurts. If we all do this and they see their sales take a dive, maybe they might just wake-up. | |
| | | | Re: Wiley & Sons and Dummies Books I will buy no more! said by FormerCust :Well if that is how they are going to act then I have purchased my last Wiley and Dummies books! This insanity needs to stop and the best way to stop them is to hit them were it hurts. If we all do this and they see their sales take a dive, maybe they might just wake-up.
But decreased sales means more piracy! You're only hurting yourself by not buying a copy for yourself and each of your relatives! | |
| | Reviews:
 ·Comcast
| said by FormerCust :Well if that is how they are going to act then I have purchased my last Wiley and Dummies books! This insanity needs to stop and the best way to stop them is to hit them were it hurts. If we all do this and they see their sales take a dive, maybe they might just wake-up.
I'm going to burn my DOS 6.2 For Dummies straight away 
Dave | |
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 skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium
join:2012-01-26
AA169|170
kudos:2
·Cox HSI
 ·Clear Wireless
| He deserves it There is zero excuse for pirating and then distributing something you can easily get for $4 used on Amazon including shipping. | |
| |  elios
join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO | Re: He deserves it or for free at your local Library >.> | |
| | | | There's zero excuse for the CEO's to rip off companies, too, but most of them only get a slap on the hand. What's the diff?
Monkee see, Monkey do. | |
| | |  tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it said by Hazeleyze:There's zero excuse for the CEO's to rip off companies, too Without knowing what specific case/CEO you are talking about it is impossibe to compare, but I'm pretty sure the law isn't based on "well somebody else got away with something else, so everyone goes free"
This appears to be a reasonable settlement for this single case of infringement.
It is a little bizarre that people would spend the time stealing theses titles, especially since their intent was to empower ordinary citizens to learn various skills, without taking the "OFFICAL" high-priced training classes. | |
| | | | | | Re: He deserves it said by tshirt:said by Hazeleyze:There's zero excuse for the CEO's to rip off companies, too Without knowing what specific case/CEO you are talking about it is impossibe to compare, but I'm pretty sure the law isn't based on "well somebody else got away with something else, so everyone goes free" More like, "well everybody else got away with something else, so someone should go free" | |
| | | | | | | | | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it so one CEO is being paid excessively by the board of directors of the organization, and you take that to mean everyone should be allowed to steal/infringe on the works of a publishing house?
How about you protest at Goodwill instead? perhaps spread charity to the disadvantaged through other means?
your reponse is instead that he ripped someone else off, so you should too?
There was at least 1 murder in LA in the last 29 hours (300+ per year), does that make murder legit everywhere now?
At some point for humanity to survive we have to work together/trust/trade/function with groups larger than your local gang/ neighborhood/town/city/state.
when trust breaks down, laws and enforcers fill the gap. Pirates are the common man's worst enemy, because their greedy, self serving actions encourge stronger laws, bigger enforcers, less common man friendly policies.
The same greed they complain about at the top, would be plainly visible if they looked in the mirror. | |
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| | | | | | | said by Hazeleyze:There's zero excuse for the CEO's to rip off companies, too, but most of them only get a slap on the hand. What's the diff?
Monkee see, Monkey do.
This has nothing to do with the original topic, and is a pretty lame excuse for stealing.
That's like saying it's OK to rob a bank because that guy is raping a woman. | |
| | | Reviews:
·Air Advantage
 ·HughesNet Satell..
| said by Hazeleyze:There's zero excuse for the CEO's to rip off companies, too, but most of them only get a slap on the hand. What's the diff?
Monkee see, Monkey do.
2 wrongs don't make a right. If you're going to pirate, you better be prepared to suffer the consequences if you get caught. | |
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| elios
join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO | or for free at your local Library >.> | |
| | | | | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it but I wonder with all the attention and press, why one of the "innocent" hasn't filed a countersuit against the trolls either as an individual or a group of individuals as a class action.
A good case could lead to fines and or large judgements, courts tend to look poorly on anyone who abuses the process.
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| | | |  NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:9
 ·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: He deserves it If I had the choice of paying out $3,000 to settle vs. $7,500 to fight, with little hope of recouping the $7,500 when I prevailed, I wonder which would be the economically wiser course of action?
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
| | | | | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it if it was a good case you likely could recoup far more than it cost, I'm not saying everyone who proclaims themselves innocent or even that (small IMHO)percentage that actually COULD not have done it (connected to wrong IP, service was otherwise interupted, whatever) will choose to fight.
BUT it seems to me with all the cases pursued, and all rightious talk from self proclaimed pirates anixous to put a stop to this, someone (or two) would have banded 20-30 innocents together to go to a court and point out that the percentage of error in the process was too high and the method of selection so poor that the actions were intentional and uncaring as to the actual infringement thereby invovling the court in a blackmail for profit.
Normally with the amount a potential settlement on something like this would have the ambulance chasers and class action attorneys out in droves, shaking the bushes, looking for the perfect test case.
Even the ACLU and other public spririted "for the law and constitution" groups haven't made a lot of effort to defend or attack this practice.
You would think if the EFF could find an iron clad test case (of which there should be many if the process is so tainted as you claim) hasn't been very vocal.
MOST of the news KARL has reported in recent months has been the ISP's (usually NOT on Karl's good guy list) fighting to liberalize the program, mostly to avoid uncompanstaed costs, potential liability for errors, and actually having to dump ignorant but innocent customers. | |
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| | | | NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:9 Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: He deserves it said by Linklist:Stealing it is wrong and the creep who did it deserved what he got.
From the linked article:
quote:
“Judgement shall be entered in favor of Wiley and against Carpenter for damages in the amount of $7,000, representing $5,000 in statutory damages pursuant to 17 U.S.C 504 (c) for Carpenter’s infringement of Wiley’s copyright, and $2,000 in statutory damages pursuant to 17 U.S.C 504 (c) for Carpenter’s counterfeiting of Wiley’s Trademarks,” Judge Pauley writes.
Copyright infringement and counterfeiting; civil judgment, not criminal conviction. No mention at all about "stealing"!
Also see Mr Matt  's response concerning service of subpoenas.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
| | | | | | | | |  RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | Re: He deserves it said by Mr Matt:One prick looking for money continued to call and leave a message in my voice mail box every day asking me to call them back.
I know how you feel. I have lived in my current location for the past 30 years and (aside from having my areacode changed once) have had the same phone number. I live in building with a number of apartments. For the past 2 or 3 years I periodically have received phone calls from a collection company looking for someone. I assume they got my phone number from a reverse phone directory using my address (which the other person gave at some point and which belonged to someone else in my building where he was staying) although it is listed there in my name. I assume that they did not bother looking at any of the other names. I gave up returning the calls since they do not take my word that I do not know the person, and I now just ignore them when I find them on my answering machine. | |
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1 edit | Semantics, shut up already with that crap. We'll call it stealing if we wish. The guy is getting what he deserves, and I hope you get served next. | |
| | | | | DesdinovaPremium
join:2003-01-26
Gaithersburg, MD | Re: He deserves it Not trying to pick a fight here but semantics is what the law is all about. That's why when one person kills another they can be charged with homicide (justified or accidental killing), manslaughter (unlawful killings without malice or intent), or murder (first or second degree)...and that's just keeping things simple for this post.
What's the difference between all those descriptions? Semantics; at the end of the day, you killed someone and the court chooses which noise (word) to categorize that action. So yeah, semantics are pretty critical and can mean the difference between a verdict of Not Guilty or the death penalty. | |
| | | | | |  camaro92Question everythingPremium
join:2008-04-05
Westfield, MA
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it Like people have said in here copyright is civil, killings are on a way different scale.
But it is still the same process it comes down to proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you were sharing that file movie whatever at this time date whatever. And I will argue this till the end of time a IP ADDRESS IS NOT A PERSON, you can't charge a IP plain and simple. | |
| | | | | | | NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:9 Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: He deserves it said by camaro92:But it is still the same process it comes down to proving beyond a reasonable doubt that you were sharing that file movie whatever at this time date whatever.
"Beyond a reasonable doubt" is the standard for criminal process (which is possible under copyright law).
Civil process only requires, "a preponderance of evidence".
Guess why MAFIAA prefers civil law to criminal law? Easier to prevail.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
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| | | | NormanSPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
kudos:9 Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| If you call a dog's tail a, "leg", how many legs would a dog have?
If you call a turd a, "rose", would it no longer stink?
"Semantics" indeed!
The guy is getting what he deserves, and I hope you get served next.
BTW, I do also hope to be served; inasmuch as I have never traded in MAFIAA goods at all, I wouldn't mind being "that" test case!
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
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| | | | said by Linklist:said by skeechan:There is zero excuse for pirating and then distributing something you can easily get for $4 used on Amazon including shipping.
I agree. No excuses here. Can buy the book cheaply and many, many places. Stealing it is wrong and the creep who did it deserved what he got. It was a default judgment. So he really should have responded to it. Anyhow your type of talk is why innocent people get taken to the cleaner due to their poverty and lower statuses.
What I find really hilarious is that you guys say he should have bought a used copy for a few bucks. Problem is that companies feel that's stealing too!
»slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=298···40668057
Companies exist to serve the public. The profit motive is only a guide.
Just because the social contract isn't written down does not mean it doesn't exist. Many people appear to have forgotten this. Not only are many big companies not serving the public well, they are marginalizing and robbing their own shareholders through huge executive compensation packages, and poor planning that spends their good reputations, their accumulated resources, and their very futures to boost immediate profits and executive bonuses. What kind of idiotic thinking leads to decisions to waste money on huge disinformation campaigns, as Big Oil did when trying to deny Climate Change, and Big Tobacco did when trying to claim nicotine was not addictive? There isn't a single big bank or telecoms company that has a good reputation. The biggest of the entertainment industry have thoroughly dirtied themselves by waging a highhanded, mean spirited, sanctimonious, bullying terror campaign against the entire world, calling us all evil thieving pirates. Many of these executives are parasites, psychopaths, and megalomaniacs, not leaders.
--
"You're not supposed to be so blind with patriotism that you can't face reality. Wrong is wrong, no matter who says it."-Malcolm X
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| | | | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: He deserves it said by Warez_Zealot: Many of these executives are parasites, psychopaths, and megalomaniacs, not leaders.
So no need for you to act like them.
If you want the "social contract" to make things better, the first step is to act like you would hope they would, and seek legal means to punish any misdeeds. | |
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| CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| True, but then I would also say there is zero harm in pirating and then distributing something you can easily get for $4 used on Amazon including shipping. (or free at your local library)
--
"I've been Romney-boated.... Somebody who will lie to you to get to be president, will lie to you when they are president." Newt Gingrich | |
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See 8 replies to this post |
| | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: Was the user properly served a subpoena! The server must sign the afidavit on the back and retain the original supoena.
By doing so he attests to the court that he has personally identified and proper served the person(s) named.
Should a error be made the court can take action against the server, his firm (often a third party service), and the party who requested the supoena (usually a lawyer, on behalf of a client)
since a service error calls into question ALL evidence submitted by that party, it is a very serious mistake. (probably damaged or end of case, and will reflect on future services buy that individual)
"Process Servers, like other professionals such as lawyers, accountants, architects and doctors, have an exposure to liability for the services they perform. In the case of Process Servers, state statutes uniformly affirm that a Process Server has unlimited financial liability to the public harmed by an error or omission committed by him or her ; OR in the case of the use of a subcontractor, the Agency from which the service order originated."
The system isn't perfect but it does permit highly punitive actions for errors. | |
| | tkdslr
join:2004-04-24
Pompano Beach, FL Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
·Speakeasy
| The only Robert Carpenter I found listed in Poughkeepsie, New York, is a 66 year old !!
I really doubt a person that old even knows what "BIT TORRENT" is. I also doubt he willingly torrent-ed "Wordpress for dummies".
He is probably just another victim of an unsecured/poorly secured Wi-Fi access point OR his PC has been hacked/taken over. Most senior citizens are clueless about these back door Trojans until their PC slows down to a crawl.
Lastly, one should also consider that the ISP and/or Plaintiff may have ms-identified the IP address/Exact time of torrent packets with relation to this particular customer. Note: In this age of IP-address reuse and DHCP, exact time matching requires significant quality control efforts on both the ISP and Plaintiff to insure sufficient legal accuracy. | |
| | | tshirtPremium,MVM
join:2004-07-11
Snohomish, WA
kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: Was the user properly served a subpoena! said by tkdslr:... I really doubt a person that old even knows what "BIT TORRENT" is.
You might be suprised what us old folks know, the internet wasn't born yesterday. | |
|
 HarddriveProud American and Infidel since 1968.Premium
join:2000-09-20
Phone Room
kudos:2 | Fine or judgement? Title says it was a $7000 fine. Then it says a judgement. Did the $7000 go to the Court as a fine or the plaintiff as a judgement? | |
| |  GooberPremium
join:2000-12-17
Naperville, IL
kudos:5 | Re: Fine or judgement? The title seems to be a characterization of the actual events. Default judgement is the true outcome.
--
No more corruption, lying and unremitting stupidity. Impeach the clueless socialist Obama now. | |
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CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| A possible new book deal. I wonder if Wiley & Sons would be interested in my new books:
"Beating Greedy Publishers in Copyright Court for Dummies"
or
"Adapting Your Business Model to the 21st Century for Dummies"
--
"I've been Romney-boated.... Somebody who will lie to you to get to be president, will lie to you when they are president." Newt Gingrich | |
| | | Is your work so defend it I do agree asking for the amount is a bit too much or to shake down folks but to let other make money out your hard earn work without getting any compensation is wrong. No matter if you agree or disagree no one in here would love to get their work pirated and not even get a single cent. If you do like the idea then i might see you living in the streets. | |
| | | Google has an easier time finding it for you... They need have no business suing bit torrent users when a common google search can find thousands of copies of their book, all available for easy downloading:
»www.google.com/search?hl=en&as_q···type=pdf
Just sayin... | |
| | | These people... ... are the same ones who tried (unsuccessfully, as we know) a little over a hundred years ago to make selling *or even giving away) used books, illegal. They will no doubt argue about applicability, or their lawyers will, since that's what they do. But you know better, don't you? | |
| | | Copyright infringement is not theft or piracy Downloading or sharing a book online is not theft. Nothing has been stolen. Nor is it piracy for the same reason.The sellers of content call it these names in order create a mind set. By perverting language in this way they hope we wont notice that these are simply acts of copyright infringement. Put in the correct terms nobody is going to get exited about this civil issue. | |
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I disagree. The copyright trolls don't care if they are actually serving the person that downloaded the copyrighted material. Send the victims a demand letters and watch the money roll in. That is the diabolical part about Settel-O-Matic. Innocent subscribers can be forced to incur significant expenses to assert their innocence. That is the copyright tolls modus opreandi or as the police refer to a criminals, MO or method of operation. Send someone a subpoena and expect them to pay guilty or not. I would not be so cynical if it were not a fact that in one article a company received a demand letter from a copyright troll asserting that a printers public IP address was downloading copyrighted material. 
Re: He deserves it
The big problem is settle-o-matic requiring a expensive response by a lawyer if the person named in a subpoena was not the person who downloaded the book. Several years ago a process server from Palm Beach County served me a subpoena at about 5AM, for my next door neighbor related to a civil suit. The process server was so stupid that they did not match the address over my garage with the address on the envelope and delivered it to the wrong address. He handed me an envelope and stated you are served and walked away. By the time I read the name on the envelope the process server was gone.