 
royalpalm
join:2000-12-01
usa | awesome evolving technology is beautiful:) | |
|
 | 
TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
 ·Comcast
| Re: awesome said by royalpalm  :evolving technology is beautiful:) Looks like Verizon has a good plan in place. Now they just have to keep rolling out their platform to all the major housing concentrations in their territory.
--
--
Join Red Room Forum
My Web Page | |
|
| | 
AMDUSER
Premium
join:2003-05-28
Earth
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: awesome said by TK Junk Mail :said by royalpalm :evolving technology is beautiful:) ".. Now they just have to keep rolling out their platform to all the major housing concentrations in their territory. It will be nice when this becomes available in exGTE parts of WI. | |
|
| 
sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT
| um, yes it is beautiful.
But the fact that it is a PON is not so beautiful.
(PON = shared system. they use optical splitters and everyone uses one fiber)
why couldn't they have spent the $$$ and pulled fiber from CO to each customer? | |
|
| | 
DaSneaky1D
one wall to block them all
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-29
The Lou
·Charter Pipeline
| Re: awesome said by sweintz :um, yes it is beautiful. But the fact that it is a PON is not so beautiful. (PON = shared system. they use optical splitters and everyone uses one fiber) why couldn't they have spent the $$$ and pulled fiber from CO to each customer? Because this solution works for the price point they are staying under.
My goodness, people can find ways to complain about anything...and not want to spend a dime out their own pocket to pay for it.
--
:: my trivial ramblings :: | |
|
| | compton
join:2002-02-08
Brooklyn, NY
| said by sweintz :um, yes it is beautiful. But the fact that it is a PON is not so beautiful. (PON = shared system. they use optical splitters and everyone uses one fiber) why couldn't they have spent the $$$ and pulled fiber from CO to each customer? PON = shared system. That's probably the only way they can get fiber to multiple dwelling buildings. | |
|
| | | 
dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: awesome said by compton :said by sweintz :um, yes it is beautiful. But the fact that it is a PON is not so beautiful. (PON = shared system. they use optical splitters and everyone uses one fiber) why couldn't they have spent the $$$ and pulled fiber from CO to each customer? PON = shared system. That's probably the only way they can get fiber to multiple dwelling buildings. they aren't doing multiple dwelling units(yet). meaning apartments/condos
--
You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
|
| | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT
| Imagine 50,000 strands of fiber running into a central office. Imagine that fiber bank gets cut during a street project.... even with mass fusion splicers, you may see your service again in about a month if you are lucky.... my point is that it is not practical for everyone to get a strand of fiber all the way back to the equipment. GPON can give a shared 2.4 Gbps down and 1.2 Gbps up per 32 customers. That is a GUARANTEED 75mb per customer.... GPON ain't so bad... However, Verizon's BPON at 622Mb down, 155 Mb up only guarantees 19Mbps... quite sad seeing ADSL2+ is more than double that... | |
|
| | |
sweintz
Premium
join:2002-03-01
Hamden, CT
| Re: awesome said by bbskeptic :Imagine 50,000 strands of fiber running into a central office. That's what they do with copper now already.... I understand it's expensive to redo the xact same with fiber, but...
as far as WD multiplexing goes, assuming 32 channels, that's still only 32 cusomers on a fiber before someone has to share bandwidth. I was under the impression it was way more than 32 cusomers to a fiber... | |
|
| | srobmw
join:2005-10-01
New Windsor, NY
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Doesn't matter. It's just a way of multiplexing. They will be able to offer as much bandwidth as they want. The bandwidths that are being offered are after the splitter. Not before. It is absolutely the same as if one fiber was dedicated all the way from the C.O.. It just requires a broader band signal leaving the office.(In this case by a factor of 32)
And as for your comment about spending the $$$. Are you kidding me? | |
|
| | | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT
| Re: awesome said by srobmw :Doesn't matter. It's just a way of multiplexing. They will be able to offer as much bandwidth as they want. The bandwidths that are being offered are after the splitter. Not before. It is absolutely the same as if one fiber was dedicated all the way from the C.O.. It just requires a broader band signal leaving the office.(In this case by a factor of 32) And as for your comment about spending the $$$. Are you kidding me? Where do you get your information? Do you have any clue how BPON ITU G.983 works....? | |
|
| | | | srobmw
join:2005-10-01
New Windsor, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: awesome The point is you have an unlimited pipe at your disposal. If future network upgrades are only dependant on upgraded PON cards and ONT's to higher transmission rates you are at a huge advantage over any other company transmitting over any other medium. Not to mention today's technology allows you to use at least 32 different wavelengths at a time, if not more.
But what do I know, I only do this shit for a living. Lol. | |
|
| | | | | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT | Re: awesome who does PON with 32 wavelengths...genious...? | |
|
| | | | | | srobmw
join:2005-10-01
New Windsor, NY
edit:
December 13th, @04:26PM
| Re: awesome This is totally lost on you. Later
P.S. Stick your sarcasm somewhere. | |
|
|
|
TK Junk Mail
Go ahead, make my day
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Margate City, NJ
clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Sounds good...but said by Logan 5 :What about those in rural areas or who are unable to otherwise take advantage of this?? All these "Speeds 'N Feeds" look impressive on paper, but when sub 56k dialup is not an option, Satellite unreliable and Cellular Broadband too cost prohibitive....what then? Move.
--
--
Join Red Room Forum
My Web Page | |
|
| | mischaej
Premium
join:2004-01-24
Richardson, TX
clubs:
| Re: Sounds good...but Heh, exactly. I can feel for those who care to move out to the sticks to get away from the suburbs/cities, but wanting Verizon to spend 10s of thousands of dollars in labor and equipment costs to get like a handful of subscribers is awful. Who ends up paying for it? Me with my bills and the associated taxes.
--
Damn you FCC! | |
|
| | | 
ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | Re: Sounds good...but It beats living in Texas. | |
|
| | | | mischaej
Premium
join:2004-01-24
Richardson, TX
clubs: | Re: Sounds good...but hehe, it's not that bad. And I'm from the north too! (Maryland)
--
Damn you FCC! | |
|
| | |
| | | 
richardpor
Fur it up
join:2003-04-19
Portland, OR | Re: Sounds good...but If I was a betting man, I would wager one would the same rural towns without broadband in Japan. I can not see some Japanese outfit laying fiber to some small village or rice farm outside Nagano or Sadoshima. | |
|
| | 
Blasterbator
Sent By Grocery Clerks
join:2001-02-20
Jackson, MS |
move
Tell that to the people that are being red-lined 
--
"If PCs are hard, then Macs are flaccid" -bb | |
|
| | | 
Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY | Re: Sounds good...but Who is being redlined? What areas are being redlined? | |
|
| | | | |
| 
Logan 5
Dungeon Runners - Come get your Bling on
Premium,MVM
join:2001-05-25
The WasteLAN
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Meh.... It's SO easy for those who have the ability to take advantage of this to look down their noses at those who can't...
I also mentioned about those who are otherwise unable to take advantage of this which has nothing to do at all with "living in the sticks".
What makes ANYONE think that all metropolitian areas will have FIOS any decade soon??
I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, in a city of over 350,000 residents. There are 2 CO's in my town. One I am too far away from and the other will only get me 1.5/384 aDSL service because even though my DSL line has been tested out at being able to reliably handle the 3mbps tier, SBC refuses to give me faster service saying that "I am too far away", and they have abandonded their plans of putting a RT in my area (Project Pronto) instead opting for adsl/fiber IPTV with Project Lightspeed.
I should not have to resort to paying for dialup just to keep my email address that I've had since 1999, cancelling my service and going with another provider who can hopefully get me something faster. I do NOT live in a rural or unincorporated area but am caught in the middle of Corporate Greed and as a result, am getting a screwjob... I have the money to afford faster, I WANT faster, but at the same time I do not think I am being unreasonable in wanting SBC to give it to me.
So again, all the Optimum Online's, Verizon's and everyone else scrambling to roll out fiber doen't really mean much to people like me who will likely never be able to take advantage of it anyway.
Must be nice for those who can eh?  | |
|
| | 
vpoko
Premium
join:2003-07-03
Jamaica Plain, MA
·Comcast
| Re: Sounds good...but said by Logan 5 :Meh.... It's SO easy for those who have the ability to take advantage of this to look down their noses at those who can't... I also mentioned about those who are otherwise unable to take advantage of this which has nothing to do at all with "living in the sticks". What makes ANYONE think that all metropolitian areas will have FIOS any decade soon?? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, in a city of over 350,000 residents. There are 2 CO's in my town. One I am too far away from and the other will only get me 1.5/384 aDSL service because even though my DSL line has been tested out at being able to reliably handle the 3mbps tier, SBC refuses to give me faster service saying that "I am too far away", and they have abandonded their plans of putting a RT in my area (Project Pronto) instead opting for adsl/fiber IPTV with Project Lightspeed. I should not have to resort to paying for dialup just to keep my email address that I've had since 1999, cancelling my service and going with another provider who can hopefully get me something faster. I do NOT live in a rural or unincorporated area but am caught in the middle of Corporate Greed and as a result, am getting a screwjob... I have the money to afford faster, I WANT faster, but at the same time I do not think I am being unreasonable in wanting SBC to give it to me. So again, all the Optimum Online's, Verizon's and everyone else scrambling to roll out fiber doen't really mean much to people like me who will likely never be able to take advantage of it anyway. Must be nice for those who can eh? So are you saying that Verizon should bite the bullet and spend trillions of dollars to wire the entire country at once? | |
|
| | |
Logan 5
Dungeon Runners - Come get your Bling on
Premium,MVM
join:2001-05-25
The WasteLAN
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: Sounds good...but said by vpoko :So are you saying that Verizon should bite the bullet and spend trillions of dollars to wire the entire country at once? No, not at all. I am not asking for the whole country to be wired up for fiber just so I can have access to it. I am saying that instead of rolling out services that only a small percentage of the installed userbase will be able to initially utilize, why not instead give those in situations like myself, the ability to get something better first.
I want SBC to finish the original buildout of RT's that were promised under the name of Project Pronto before my DSL rates are raised to subsidize their "Project Lightspeed" IPTV so I can get a faster DSL connection instead of SBC deciding that people in my situation can "take it or leave it" and are forced to pay for something we'll never be able to use. It would be a helluva lot cheaper for SBC to implement a few dozen more RT's then rolling out the fiber that I won't be able to get anyway. At least with the RT's I'd likely see some benefit and SBC can make MORE money from the existing users first rather then wooing shareholders/investors with grandiose promises for the future. | |
|
| | Zorglub
join:2000-11-18
Fremont, CA
| Japan gets fast broadband access because of 1) high population density and 2) unbundling which forces the incumbent to compete with the newcomers.
In the US, we have large areas with high population density but the FCC all but killed unbundling... | |
|
| | 
aztecnology
The Autumn wind is a Raider
join:2003-02-12
Murrieta, CA
| said by Logan 5 :Meh.... It's SO easy for those who have the ability to take advantage of this to look down their noses at those who can't... I also mentioned about those who are otherwise unable to take advantage of this which has nothing to do at all with "living in the sticks". What makes ANYONE think that all metropolitian areas will have FIOS any decade soon?? I live in the San Francisco Bay Area, in a city of over 350,000 residents. There are 2 CO's in my town. One I am too far away from and the other will only get me 1.5/384 aDSL service because even though my DSL line has been tested out at being able to reliably handle the 3mbps tier, SBC refuses to give me faster service saying that "I am too far away", and they have abandonded their plans of putting a RT in my area (Project Pronto) instead opting for adsl/fiber IPTV with Project Lightspeed. I should not have to resort to paying for dialup just to keep my email address that I've had since 1999, cancelling my service and going with another provider who can hopefully get me something faster. I do NOT live in a rural or unincorporated area but am caught in the middle of Corporate Greed and as a result, am getting a screwjob... I have the money to afford faster, I WANT faster, but at the same time I do not think I am being unreasonable in wanting SBC to give it to me. So again, all the Optimum Online's, Verizon's and everyone else scrambling to roll out fiber doen't really mean much to people like me who will likely never be able to take advantage of it anyway. Must be nice for those who can eh? Well, you don't live in Verizon territory so you'll never see FIOS. You'll have to wait until AT&T rolls out lightspeed in the city, which they eventually will... and San Fran has at least 8 CO's that I'm aware of, probably more...
--
.:|:.Tell a man there are 300 billion stars in the universe and he'll believe you. Tell him a bench has wet paint on it and he'll have to touch it to be sure. .:|:. | |
|
| | |
Logan 5
Dungeon Runners - Come get your Bling on
Premium,MVM
join:2001-05-25
The WasteLAN
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: Sounds good...but said by aztecnology :Well, you don't live in Verizon territory so you'll never see FIOS. You'll have to wait until AT&T rolls out lightspeed in the city, which they eventually will... and San Fran has at least 8 CO's that I'm aware of, probably more... Never said I live *IN* San Francisco, just that I lived in the San Francisco Bay area. SF has over 2,000,000 residents. My town has only 350,000 and yes....only 2 CO's.
Yea, I know that "Project Lightspeed" will cure all the ills of mankind but if SBC won't even give me better then basic aDSL service, I hold zero hope of ever being able to use their 'next gen' offering(s). | |
|
| | | | 
tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Kansas City, MO
clubs:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Sounds good...but said by Logan 5 :said by aztecnology :Well, you don't live in Verizon territory so you'll never see FIOS. You'll have to wait until AT&T rolls out lightspeed in the city, which they eventually will... and San Fran has at least 8 CO's that I'm aware of, probably more... Never said I live *IN* San Francisco, just that I lived in the San Francisco Bay area. SF has over 2,000,000 residents. My town has only 350,000 and yes....only 2 CO's. Yea, I know that "Project Lightspeed" will cure all the ills of mankind but if SBC won't even give me better then basic aDSL service, I hold zero hope of ever being able to use their 'next gen' offering(s). SBC/ATT has to make a decision. Waste money on expanding an outdated technology, knowing full well that they'll just tear it up 3 years down the road, or shift the focus to the new technology, and use that as the new base like ADSL was 8 years ago. If you want both, then your feels will be increased to pay for both, but in the end, even though lightspeed is probably a waste of money, it's better than building out more ADSL connections. Can you not get cable?
--
|-In a fascist government, National Security ALWAYS overrides Personal Freedoms.-| |- »www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtml -| | |
|
| 
tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by Logan 5 :What about those in rural areas or who are unable to otherwise take advantage of this??? Over the long run FIOS should facilitate delivering high speed Internet to rural areas. Current PON is spec'ed to 20 Km, GPON goes out to 60.
Once Verizon has wired up the more densely populated areas rural America should not be too far behind.
Most likely fiber will be a transforming event like other technology that dramatically improved performance or reduce cost.
/Tom | |
|
vz_guy
@verizon.com
| article corrections I assume the author meant Herndon, VA, not Hampton Roads.
Also, do they even proof these articles?
"In the near term, that means offering FiOS TV services that start with basic analog radio frequency (RF) channels — which other telcos using IPTV cannot providing — as will as IPTV-based video-on-demand (VOD) options,..."
as will as???
cannot providing???
Jeez. | |
|
|
See 6 replies to this post |
|
Iridium
Premium
join:2003-04-02
Los Angeles, CA | So you need to pay those prices in addition to regular fiber service? | |
|
TellMeMoreLies
@comcast.net
| Empty Promises From A Gutless Company! I just stopped in to BASH Verizon for not being able to deploy any network services in the dense suburbs of Los Angeles County! I think they're hoping to lure investors with all this bullshit! These losers can't even handle their existing DSL network! | |
|
| 
Dagda1175
join:2001-06-17
Goleta, CA | Re: Empty Promises From A Gutless Company! Um.....what?
»/gmaps/fios | |
|
| |
TellMeMoreLies
@comcast.net
| Re: Empty Promises From A Gutless Company! ....Verizon can't deliver jack shit! Their measly DSL setup can't handle 30% of their own customers,leaving most without a broadband option. I don't think people are going to chuck their satellite dishes ,and stomp their cable modems for fios! ATT totally botched everything up and so will their cousins over at verizon!
| |
|
| | |
The Answer Guy
@uu.net | Re: Empty Promises From A Gutless Company! Actually, Verizon has over 80% of it's customer qualified for DSL. | |
|
| | | | |
bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT
| BPON - 100Mbp/s = Bull Verizon's ATM based BPON has a 622down 155up max per PON port. Each PON port can support 32 customers. To get 100mb/s, they could only place six customers on a PON port... that will never, never, never happen... Their video offering is an 1550nm RF overlay on fiber using EDFA's.... what does that give you??.... the same exact thing you get from digital cable. Until they go GPON, they do not have enough IP bandwidth to do IPTV.... DSL had been around for long,long time before Verizon deployed it, but somehow that was state of the art once they had it... same with fiber PON... BPON has been around for a long time... now that they have it, it's the greatest thing since sliced bread... Think of the sick amount of money they have wasted on BPON gear, only to move to GPON in '06... you the cosumer will pay for it once the price wars are over and the Bell monopoly can go back to raping us for service... | |
|
| 
smajchrz
join:2003-10-11
Chantilly, VA
| Re: BPON - 100Mbp/s = Bull They are not suggesting 100mb/s per customer. The quote states "The current ATM-based PON can deliver up to 100 MB/s of capacity." That is 100MB/s total capacity of the node not to a single customer. Remember mb = megabit and MB = megabyte. So knowing that there are 8 bits in a byte..
622mb/s down + 155mb/s up = 777mb/s capacity of the node
777mb / 8 bits = 97.125MB/s which is close enough to 100MB/s for conversational purposes. | |
|
| | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT
| Re: BPON - 100Mbp/s = Bull I assure you that's not what they meant...
“GPON will offer us 10 times as much capacity as we have now,” he said. The current ATM-based PON can deliver up to 100 MB/s of capacity.
That is the article quote... dead wrong... no version of GPON is 10 times capacity of BPON... spin spin spin | |
|
| | |
tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: BPON - 100Mbp/s = Bull said by bbskeptic :That is the article quote... dead wrong... no version of GPON is 10 times capacity of BPON... spin spin spin
BPON is 622/155 carried over ATM yielding useful "IP payload" of 560/140. GPON has two flavors 1.2/622 and 2.4/1.2Gbps. GPON does away with ATM eliminating the so called cell tax. Assuming Verizon is talking about 2.4 download is increased by factor of 4.2x. Upload a more dramatic 8.5.
So while there was some poetic license is was not quite as bad as it seems.
As far a delivering 100 Mbps that is not unreasonable. Data tends to be very bursty, no ISP offer non-blocking network. BPON delivers 17.5 Mbps with a 1:32 split, GPON 75. Not to shabby in my book.
GPON will make HDTV video on demand (VoD) feasible.
/Tom | |
|
| | |
smajchrz
join:2003-10-11
Chantilly, VA
| Actually I think it is what they meant and I think I demonstrated that above.
As to the issue of GPON being 10x faster, that does seem off base and I think tschmidt had a good answer to that. However, this was not in your original post and is really independent of the your original statement about the capacity of BPON. | |
|
|
ropeguru
Premium
join:2001-01-25
Hollywood, FL
clubs:
| Whatever...... I am in Vrizon territory and still cannot even get DSL. By the time they get around to us in the lower income brackets, they will be out of money, slowing deployment and charging waaaaay more for the service than they are now.
Give me something I can actually use for once... All these lame tech stories do no good if they do not get it to me...
--
FWD#: 223611 | |
|
royalpalm
join:2000-12-01
usa
| lay out here is the lay out of the PON provided by someone about a month ago on the fios forum.... | |
|
| 
rawgerz
In Debt we trust
Premium
join:2004-10-03
Grove City, PA | Re: lay out Verizon communications Proprietary and Confidential, For use within Verizon communications Only
--
"Hows your French toast?" "Smelly and ungrateful, but this AMERICAN toast is great!" | |
|
| | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT | Re: lay out What is proprietary about the ITU G.983 spec.... ? That's all that diagram explains... | |
|
| | 
verolom
join:2002-03-23
Eatontown, NJ | It doesn't say they are actually using it, it is just citing a standard. Nevertheless amusing  | |
|
speedisdaship
| Gimme more speed! I could use more speed, with Cablevision breathing down their neck with 15 megabits, if they don't ramp up speeds soon, they might be left in the dust, as for some with triple play for $100, they get 15/2, for $15 more they get 30/2... for 3 services. Verizon's 2 services are $100-120 already! and probably $40 more for video! some would say, why bother if OOL is good enough, oh well. | |
|
|
a
@198.164.x.x | Re: Gimme more speed! ROFLMAO 30/2 yeah right they can't even give you 1mbit upload without capping. Trust me Verizon's network will have less problems. | |
|
nomoredhl
@70.104.x.x
| No more dhl Look at this! I called the FIOS customer service line:
1888-553-1555. Customer service is NO LONGER 24/7/365!!
M-F 8AM TO 6PM. Oh well, I guess if yo have a problem, its not their problem on weekends or after business hours. This seems like Verizon is doing MORE and MORE to shoot themselves in the foot with the fiber rollout by cutting back on support! | |
|
|
royalpalm
join:2000-12-01
usa
edit:
December 12th, @11:12PM
| Re: No more dhl The technical service center is not fully operational yet. The center here in syracuse needs to hire about 50 more people to become 24/7. Some of the people who test for the position are not very bright to say the least. | |
|
| | bbskeptic
join:2005-09-12
Burlington, VT | Re: No more dhl Some of the people who pass the test aren't very bright.... | |
|
mdembski
join:2001-04-04
Washington, DC
 ·ViaTalk
·Speakeasy
·Verizon Online DSL
| cutting back on dsl In the mean time, it appears Verizon is cutting back of the availablity of DSL in established areas. A friend was unable to get a 2nd DSL line when their office expanded and a neighbor 2 doors from me was told from Verizon that dsl was not available (they are 2 doors closer to the CO). The new technology is great, butit appears they are cutting support for dsl in areas where fios is not even available. | |
|
|
|
|
The Guts Behind Fios
Sounds good...but
·
·
·
