page: 1 · 2  |
 
nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA | I'm Guessing That the Minneapolis news outlet blamed VoIP with no details because they didn't want to pile on the MySpace train.
-tom | |
|  | 
technick
Premium
join:2000-12-16
Loganville, GA
| Re: I'm Guessing Give it time tom... give it time... before you know it, myspace, music piracy (Everybody knows that the computer he went to save was full of pirated mp3s), movie piracy, linux, unix, vonage, marilyn manson and beavis and butthead will be blamed for this fire.
--
"Our greatest glory consists not in never falling, but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius
Bellsouth Free Since 10/05 - To Hell With Bellsouth
Advocatus Diaboli | |
| | |
nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA
 ·Cox HSI
 ·Speakeasy
| Re: I'm Guessing said by technick  :Give it time tom... give it time... before you know it, myspace, music piracy (Everybody knows that the computer he went to save was full of pirated mp3s), movie piracy, linux, unix, vonage, marilyn manson and beavis and butthead will be blamed for this fire. Heh... No one noticed the fire because they were all out on MySpace hookups. When it was noticed, they couldn't figure out the E911. Once they figured out the E911, the call quality was low because the local telco hadn't been paid the QoS for the VoIP data, so the dispatcher had a hard time taking the call. The QoS would have been immaterial, except that all the linux dweebs were running bittorrents to share pirated Marilyn Manson music and Beavis and Butthead movies and were sucking up all the telco's bandwidth.
-tom
--
"Some people have morals, standards and ideals about quality, but I'm an American: I couldn't care less." --Tony Pierce (paraphrased) | |
| | | | shashinka
join:2000-09-16
West Boylston, MA
| Re: I'm Guessing If that is the case then I think we need to push for legislation that requires all internet providers to guarantee traffic to all voice communications through any IP PSTN provider that has 911 capabilities (not skype). Example, sunrocket, vonage, packet8, etc. Hey if they are going to require that these companies have 911 available then ISPs must be required to not hamper and maybe even prioritize voice calls in case of emergencies! damnit. | |
| | | | | 
AnonName
@kaballero.com
| Re: I'm Guessing If that is the case then I think we need to push for legislation that requires all internet providers to guarantee traffic to all voice communications through any IP PSTN provider that has 911 capabilities (not skype). Example, sunrocket, vonage, packet8, etc. Hey if they are going to require that these companies have 911 available then ISPs must be required to not hamper and maybe even prioritize voice calls in case of emergencies! damnit.
Sir, you are a genius. Everyone note that you saw this suggestion here, first.
I should add I am **NOT** kidding, or being sarcastic.
The ISPs should be **REQUIRED** by law to forward VOIP traffic **FIRST** because the VOIP carriers are **REQUIRED** by law to provide E911. Since you can't know if a call is E911 related without "intercepting" it's contents, and nobody should "intercept" peoples calls the only option left is to prioratize VOIP traffic above all other traffic.
No, I am not joking.
| |
| | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: I'm Guessing Since VoIP is not classified as "phone service" by the FCC yet, it's not going to happen right now.
Further, I disagree with you. there should not be any legislation requiring QoS on voice traffic. The internet is and has already been classified as an "informational service" recently. Until that changes, then voice traveling over the internet is not a priority - I happen to agree with that.
You want reliable phone service and 911 calls to go through? GET A PHONE! VoIP isn't phone, it's a toy right now. If you want to gamble with your life and safety over an approx. $10 - $15 savings, that's your choice. (I am only talking about a basic stripped phone line, dial tone only) You want to buy VoIP for an unlimited calling plan? Fine... but you want reliability? Go with what's been proven.
I COMPLETELY understand with your argument for priority packets for voice calls, however, the day the internet becomes, primarily, a phone company, we are right back to step one. We HAVE a phone network in this country already.
Cable and Phone both are building private VoIP systems. They are puitting some real money into the infrustructure. I will give them a little more of a chance with VoIP before I would all these little low budget start ups trying to be a phone company.
And for the record, the call went through - that's not the issue. He claims that "vonage put him on hold" - that's plain B.S.
Having Vonage as a secondary option to my Comcast Digital Switched Network Powered Telephone here in the Twin Cities, and having tested my 911 service here, vonage didn't put him on hold. His call, like mine, was routed to the local police department's dispatch line. It sounds like he got put on hold at the local police dispatch. (Usually the non-emergency line) There is MUCH more to the story here that KSTP reported so far. I've watched the story this morning, this afternoon, tonight, and on the web, and CH5 still doesn't really know what's going on. | |
| | | | 
cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27 | Don't forget that they didn't pay the fire department their fee to assist in putting out fires. The failure to contribute to the Association's Firemen's Service Fund shows empty.;) | |
| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| The music, that you are stating was pirated MP3's, was his 'life's work of music in which he created' as he is a self made composer - which is why he wanted to save the computer. It was his life.
You speak of something you don't know the facts of and sound like a fool. Feel better now?
Personally, I hope he looses his case as do many others that go with vonage to save circa $10.00 on their phone bill. I hope he enjoyed that $10.00 savings per month because he now has NOTHING left. Great savings huh!?
Isn't there enough in the news about the shortfalls of VoIP service?
Seriously, who here is willing to put their life in the hands of a 3rd party VoIP solution to save a buck? Who here is willing to risk an ambulance not arriving in time? Fire, police? any emergency service just to save a few bucks?
Sure, in the end, you can sue someone, and most likely loose - possibly win, or have to rebuild, but what is a life is lost? Is it still worth it? Would someone feel better that their story made VoIP better in the long run? At what expense? A life of a loved one or even your own? The loss of you home and all your posessions and memories?
There is no secret that VoIP has issues, mostly the 3rd party like Vonage and ATT CV, or Packet8,... why risk it? It's not worth it. | |
| | gamer999
join:2004-10-27
Richardson, TX | i have to wonder if this guy had a cell phone cause if it was me and vonage put me on hold i would have gone to the cell phone instead of just sitting there like a deer in the headlights while the house goes down. | |
| 
Chris 313
Come get some
Premium
join:2004-07-18
Houma, LA
clubs: | Bunk! No tech details and they blame Vonage? This is another case of using a backup POTS line with just 911 on it. | |
| 
Tarheels Fan
Premium
join:2006-01-05
·Embarq
1 edit | Vonage didn't put him on hold... The article states that the fire victim said vonage put him on hold. It is to my understanding that a call placed to 911, will forward the call to your Public Safety Dispatch Center, not a vonage call center. Now I know if the operators at the Dispatch center are on the phone with 911 calls, and a call comes in on a none-911 line, you will be put on hold. That is probably what happened in this case. His public safety dept put him on hold. | |
| | travelguy
join:1999-09-03
Santa Fe, NM
| Re: Vonage didn't put him on hold... Vonage has two ways of dealing with 911 calls. If they can, they provide a direct connection to the PSAP, either through standard 911 ports, or to an administrative number.
If Vonage can't get a direct connection or can't match the address with a PSAP, Vonage takes the 911 call at a national 911 center and places an emergency call on behalf of the caller.
I know I was flooded with all sorts of email and letters from Vonage explaining the process. It took about 3 weeks from sigining to get my direct connection working.
Given that our local PSAP is something of a joke, I know the correct 7 digit numbers to call direct to the dispatchers. Unfortunately, there are enough people like the subject of the story that require babysitting (he ran back into the burning house to get his computer music collection????) that I'm sure the politicos will continue to make a big deal of stuff like this. | |
| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: Vonage didn't put him on hold... The Twin Cities area has calls routed directly to the local PSAP. | |
| | | | | shashinka
join:2000-09-16
West Boylston, MA | Re: Vonage didn't put him on hold... Did you save with Geico? | |
| | | | 
hayabusa3303
Over 200 mph
Premium
join:2005-06-29
clubs: | Re: Vonage didn't put him on hold... so much for the free rate quote..  :D:D:D | |
| | | | 
bobc2112
join:2004-01-04
Middletown, NJ | Kidding aside, Geico did OK by me monetarily, just wasn't real thrilled with my claims handler. She was kind of disorganized... I love my new truck, and feel good about 911 and vonage to boot! | |
| jmuskratt
join:2000-11-21
New Orleans, LA
| What?! "Another complication is that Internet phone companies have their own emergency call centers that attempt to redirect calls to the correct 911 center. This process can cause delays in reaching emergency services."
Um, since when has Vonage: a) taken 911 calls; and b) put people on hold? | |
| | Foxbat121
join:2001-04-25
Herndon, VA
| Re: What?! said by jmuskratt :"Another complication is that Internet phone companies have their own emergency call centers that attempt to redirect calls to the correct 911 center. This process can cause delays in reaching emergency services." Um, since when has Vonage: a) taken 911 calls; and b) put people on hold? Since day one. Vonage got sued for this exact reason multiple times. | |
| | | briartech
join:2005-12-23
Stamping Ground, KY | Re: What?! proof please | |
| | | | keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
 ·Teliax VOIP
 ·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| Re: What?! I accidentally called 911 twice.
It was because we connect Vonage to our business phone system and dial 9 to get an outside line. I accidentally diale 9,118 so it took it as 911.
Anyway, the first time I asked who exactly I had reached and they said the 911 dispatch center. I said what county and they said that they were the Vonage dispatch center. I wanted to clarify so I asked if it was Vonage and they said yes.
They still had to route the call out to a real emergency center so they did not let me hang up. Asked my address and (did not put me on hold) but connected me to the county PSAP I was in. The whole process, including me asking so many questions, was about 3 minutes.
Not really proof of much, just my story. | |
| gatzdon
join:2002-10-25
Lake Zurich, IL
| Seems like there is more to the story So the guy went back in the house twice to retrieve personal items, despite the fact that it was a "five-alarm blaze" and police/firemen arrived already.
Sounds to me like there was a lot more to the story.
By the time fire crews arrived, the fire had become a five-alarm blaze. The house was a total loss, but no one was injured.
However, Veltkamp twice entered the burning home to remove a personal computer with music he had created over many years.
"When I was ordered out of the building, I didn't want to comply with that,” Veltkamp said.
Fire crews convinced him to leave, but he later re-entered the home – followed by police.
"They chased me in, saying they were going to taze me if I didn't come out,” Veltkamp said.
He then ran from police through the house, and escaped out of the basement. --
$100 placed at 7 percent interest compounded quarterlyfor 200 years will increase to more than $100,000,000 --by which time it will be worth nothing.- Lazarus Long | |
| | mwf
join:2000-11-26
Granite Quarry, NC | Re: Seems like there is more to the story This guy was this | | close to winning a Darwin award this year, unfortunately he loses points for living. | |
| 
dispatcher21
join:2004-01-22
united state
2 edits | VoIP Call Center The call center they are referring to is called Northern Comm out of Canada. VoIP providers can have 911 calls routed to them and they in turn route it to the appropriate call center in the states. Why Canada? That is the only one online at this time but plans are in place for a US center. But I dont know why the first was made in Canada. It is in Quebec and manned by trained 911 dispatchers, though being a private company ($$), I dont know how thier training is compared to us govment types. And no, 911 is not a joke in my town. | |
| rileyjam514
There You Go Again...
join:2005-06-26
Kearny, NJ
| Gotta love the media... Blame everyone but the idiot.
To the moron who RAN INTO THE BURNING BUILDING, you deserve what you got.
To those who want to blame Vonage or VoIP service for any loss, tell me how well the phone companies have done with their wireless 911 services.
--
Abortion is murder, Reagan was a hero, Clinton was a sleazeball, Iraq is much better off without Saddam, and the telcos are not trustworthy with American tax dollars. There! I've managed to offend a significant portion of BBR! | |
| | 
Matt
Take me down to the paradise city
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: Gotta love the media... said by rileyjam514 :Blame everyone but the idiot. To the moron who RAN INTO THE BURNING BUILDING, you deserve what you got. To those who want to blame Vonage or VoIP service for any loss, tell me how well the phone companies have done with their wireless 911 services. How did running into the already burning house have anything to do with being put on hold with Vonage?
So he deserved his house burning down, because he ran into it AFTER it was already on fire?
Yes he may have been an idiot for doing that, but that has nothing to do with this article at all. | |
| | | rileyjam514
There You Go Again...
join:2005-06-26
Kearny, NJ | Re: Gotta love the media... I'm saying if he got hurt as a result of this incident, he deserves what he gets. | |
| | | 
phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Winter Park, FL
·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | What I want to know is why his house caught on fire in the first place. If his Vonage Adapter (like the RT31P2) got hot and caught fire, then I could see him sueing. What did he do, sit there while the fire was flaming, on the phone with 911. If it could have been controlled fast enough to be saved, he could have put it out. Uncontrollable fires are ones where you wouldn't want to be in the house to make a call, none the less over a electricity dependant medium. What if he was using a cordless phone, and the power cut off, would he sue the power company because the blaze burned his power wire?? This is so stupid. His choice, his house, not Vonages problem. | |
| 
Chiyo
Save Me Konata-Chan
Premium
join:2003-02-20
Minneapolis, MN
clubs:
·Comcast
| wasn't mentioned on the news last night I've had to call the police a few times and I've never had any issues with Vonage. For months I got piles of e-mail saying " HERE IS HOW TO START YOUR 911 service, even though I had set it up. These people think its plug it in I get a dial tone I dont' have to do anything else.
F'ning moron, last night on the news they didn't say a word about vonage and the same quotes were used on the newcast as in the report online :\ makes you wonder.
--
"Sure there have been injuries and deaths in boxing - but none of them serious."- Alan Minter, Boxer"I get to go to lots of overseas places, like Canada."- Britney Spears, Pop Singer | |
| 
Dogbert
Premium
join:2002-03-28
Brookings, SD | Website Story When I went to read the story on their website there was a Google Ad for Vonage phone service at the bottom of the article. Talk about placement!  | |
| 
ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | The guy is so reliable anyways.... Self admittedly denies police orders...so his story is to be trusted why?
--
Make a Difference-Join Team Helix! | |
| | 
Rambo76098
join:2003-02-21
Pataskala, OH
| Re: The guy is so reliable anyways.... Exactly. He denied himself any credibility when he was stupid enough to first, run back into a house on fire, and second, run from the police. He deserves what he got, and whatever reason he wants to sue Vonage for, should be ignored and thrown out on account of his stupidity, and therefore, the large chance that he did not set something up correctly. | |
| | |
ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | Re: The guy is so reliable anyways.... Exactly..... | |
| | |
ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs: | Re: What caused the fire? Exactly. It does seem like someone is a bit suspect in this story, but it would be an easy case for him to try to make a stink and blame some of his stupidity on Vonage.
--
Make a Difference-Join Team Helix! | |
| | 
sirsloop
Premium
join:2004-02-18
New York, NY | MY HERO! This dude seriously have his priorities in order!! He's my hero for saving his box! AT GUN POINT NO LESS! | |
| NetDroid2
join:2004-08-16
Excelsior, MN
| uhhhhh... Maybe its just me but if your in a burning house trying to call for help you have more problems then you know!!
Isn't the first thing your to do is get the heck out and call for help on your CELL PHONE or neighbors phone?
Here is the same story except it does not look like they got an interview.
»www.kare11.com/news/news_article···d=119400 | |
| | 
furlonium
Computer Over? Virus equals Very Yes?
join:2002-05-08
Bethlehem, PA | Cell phones for emergencies I don't think most people are aware that as long as you have a charged cell phone, and have signal, you can make a 911 call on it. It doesn't even need to have active service. | |
| nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD | give em a break cut them some slack - it's Minnesota | |
| | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Re: give em a break Excuse me?!
More good comes out of Minnesota than you know bud.
Minnesota is not some sort of cow-town. That's probably backed up with the amount of Corporation's Workd Head Quarters that reside here and the amount of technology that comes from this state.
Minnesota offers and has more than many other states combined! | |
| 
Greg_Z
Premium
join:2001-08-08
Springfield, IL
·Comcast
2 edits | National Poison Center number Actually there is a thread over at Vonage-Forums.com that someone tried to call the National Poison Center number 800-222-1222, and it did not even go through. Another person dialed it from Maine, and it routed to NJ. I would say that there is still some work to be done, but most by the CLEC, not VoIP providers.
--
One man's customer loyalty is another man's misguided arrogance.
Another Tech forum site
Get your own Tekwear | |
| 
insomniac84
join:2002-01-03
Schererville, IN | Vonage has the evidence and they should fight back Vonage knows exactly what happened and if the evidence shows nothing went wrong they should sue this guy for blaming their service. Personally until vonage refutes what this guy is saying, you really can't do anything buy blame vonage. | |
| plattypus1
join:2005-04-08
Riverside, CA
·Charter Pipeline
| Everyone should know... Everyone should know the direct-dial number of their local public safety call center, ESPECIALLY if they rely on a non-standard telephony solution. I use my cell phone as my primary phone, and I have the direct dial number programmed and on speed dial. I've only had to use it once, for a telephone pole fire nearby, but it does work. | |
| | claudeo
join:2000-02-23
Redmond, WA
| Re: Everyone should know... said by plattypus1 :Everyone should know the direct-dial number of their local public safety call center, Ok, how about a refresher on how to find it.
As for me, I run 2 lines and good old fashioned phones along with the newfangled stuff. Been working with computers for 25 years, I know better. | |
| | | keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| Re: Everyone should know... Good point.
It was very difficult for me to actually get that number.
You look in the phone book and for 24 hour number all that is listed is 911, nothing else.
I called the police and they did not know it, I was then transferred 8 times before someone finally had the number.
I did not need it for 911, I needed it for my alarm company.
I trust Vonage 911 and if all else fails I have plenty of cell phones around. | |
|
phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Winter Park, FL
·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | Is Vonage going broke??? »www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/···zs-1.htm
Looks like Vonage is spending a little TOO much on those corny commercials. It also looks like Mr. Citron's history might also hurt the companies pockets and plans for future lines of credit. And with the impending FCC fines that are soon to come for them not fully being able to comply with E-911 in all states are going to hurt them, as well as possibly causing them to raise rates. There is a bunch of info in this document, but it's worth reading, especially since they are considering going public with their stocks to gain money for "advertising". It says they spent $300+ million on their advertising campaigns. | |
| | keyboard5684
join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
| Re: Is Vonage going broke??? My local ILEC cannot comply with E-911.
It has been a problem and debate for years.
If you call from a Verizon phone line (911) they do not even know your phone number.
I think the advertising makes sense.
They need to get the word out and build numbers, now that they are ready to.
In business you spend money to make it later.
A loss or being in debt does not indicate a company failure. | |
| | |
phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Winter Park, FL
·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: Is Vonage going broke??? said by keyboard5684 :My local ILEC cannot comply with E-911. It has been a problem and debate for years. If you call from a Verizon phone line (911) they do not even know your phone number. I think the advertising makes sense. They need to get the word out and build numbers, now that they are ready to. In business you spend money to make it later. A loss or being in debt does not indicate a company failure. Yeah, agreed, but have you completely read the prospectus? Read ALL or as much as you can. They are really fighting hard to keep above water. I read that prospectus, and thought to myself that they could have done better with themselves. As a former customer, they did not try very hard to find the returned adapter I sent them, and it's probably because they reused the darn thing and claimed they received an empty box. Oh well, thats what I get for sending it back with their un-insured labels they give you. Ended up costing me $150 in the end. They still have a debt from me to this day. I signed up in September 2003, and canceled/disco'd in April or May of 2005. They should have treated me like gold, judging I was there practically from day one. No worries though, much happier with my new provider, and they allow Asterisk for cheap, so whatever... | |
|
mike027
@comcast.net
| Vonage and 911 I have heard stories of E911 calls via POTS lines to major call centers being placed on hold for many minutes. I am inclined to believe that the local police / fire dispatch is responsible for the delay, especially if the call was routed to a non-emergency number. Vonage, by the way, now provides E911 to over 50% of its customers. My service was just converted in the last couple of weeks. Everyone using VoIP should still have a backup for emergencies, such as a POTS line or cell phone, unless the VoIP carrier has E911 with the calls routed directly to the local public safety answering point and a UPS has been installed so that the broadband connection is not lost in the event of a local power outage. | |
| | | |
|
|
Vonage Blamed for Slow Fire Response
·
(topic offline) VOIP