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2 Years of Prison for Downloading Movies?
New German law suggests it...
A new law passed in Germany suggests jail-time of up to two years for "casual" downloaders of pirated film or music (private-use), notes Techdirt. One of the defenders of the new law states: "There should be no legal distinction between stealing chewing gum from a shop and performing an illegal download."
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sirsloop
Premium Member
join:2004-02-18
New York, NY

sirsloop

Premium Member

jails full

Hope they start building jails now!
RandallFlagg6
The Last Gunslinger Of Rational Thought
join:2002-06-09
Renton, WA

1 edit

RandallFlagg6

Member

Re: jails full

Where, O where art thou, Taylor Troll, in this our darkest hour, when we need you the most?

Pirate515
Premium Member
join:2001-01-22
Brooklyn, NY

Pirate515

Premium Member

Re: jails full

said by RandallFlagg6:

Where, O where art thou, Taylor Troll, in this our darkest hour, when we need you the most?
Comcast has robbed him of his precious Taylor name and replaced it with something really odd. Don't worry, he has already posted in this very thread, you can sniff him out if you put your mind to it.
53059959 (banned)
Temp banned from BBR more then anyone
join:2002-10-02
PwnZone

1 edit

53059959 (banned) to sirsloop

Member

to sirsloop
thats a shame. I get geat speeds downloading movies on bittorrent from people in germany

edit: found taylor01, hes now known as hsd1.mi.comcast.net. haha what a jobturkey.

remind me to download a kraftwerk album.

FFH5
Premium Member
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ

1 recommendation

FFH5

Premium Member

Idea is good but not workable

The idea that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but thieves is the correct one. But in the EU and in Germany they rarely even put regular thieves in prison. Why would anyone think that they will actually enforce this law and send people to jail for violating it. It is nothing but another empty threat from the weak-kneed EU justice system.

Ignite
Premium Member
join:2004-03-18
UK

3 edits

1 recommendation

Ignite

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

Why did I know I'd find 'Join Red Room Forum' in your signature

I'm sure you know more than I do about the EU, obviously. You're no doubt an expert in the legal comings and goings of the European Union.

Perhaps we should all stick with your own home state and carry on with capital punishment.

Hell let's go back to corporal punishment while we're at it. I would point out that this is Germany making this law and nothing to do with the EU, however I'll leave you on your anti-EU rant just reminding you that EU law doesn't play any part in the criminal laws. Each member state decides their own penalties for crimes.

There are plenty of alternatives to jail time, it's just a case of whether you can be bothered to look for them. Far easier to throw people in the slammer and possibly kill them, right? Still if that's where you like your taxes to go that's your prerogative.

Actually never mind, a swift look through your blog says all really, you see the EU purely as a competitor to the US and would clearly welcome anything that caused issues within the EU.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by Ignite:

Why did I know I'd find 'Join Red Room Forum' in your signature

I'm sure you know more than I do about the EU, obviously. You're no doubt an expert in the legal comings and goings of the European Union.

Perhaps we should all stick with your own home state and carry on with capital punishment.

Hell let's go back to corporal punishment while we're at it. I would point out that this is Germany making this law and nothing to do with the EU, however I'll leave you on your anti-EU rant just reminding you that EU law doesn't play any part in the criminal laws. Each member state decides their own penalties for crimes.

There are plenty of alternatives to jail time, it's just a case of whether you can be bothered to look for them. Far easier to throw people in the slammer and possibly kill them, right? Still if that's where you like your taxes to go that's your prerogative.

Actually never mind, a swift look through your blog says all really, you see the EU purely as a competitor to the US and would clearly welcome anything that caused issues within the EU.
1. Your stated country of origin is *NOT* in the EU; however, Germany is.

2. You gave no defense of EU justice practices, and you said nothing to refute anything he said. In fact, you validated it somewhat by praising alternatives to jail that the EU typically employs.

When soverign nations make laws that mandate prison time, they need to stick to it. European nations have proven time and again that they're unwilling to stick to that, and the reasons for which may be many and varied. Their "alternatives" need to be written into law, and not left to inference by laymen.

Snickerdo3
Premium Member
join:2001-02-28
Niagara Falls, ON

Snickerdo3

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by yock:

1. Your stated country of origin is *NOT* in the EU; however, Germany is.
Um, the United Kingdom is very much part of the European Union. You are wrong, end of story. Better luck next time.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by Snickerdo3:
said by yock:

1. Your stated country of origin is *NOT* in the EU; however, Germany is.
Um, the United Kingdom is very much part of the European Union. You are wrong, end of story. Better luck next time.
What then to my other statement?

Snickerdo3
Premium Member
join:2001-02-28
Niagara Falls, ON

Snickerdo3

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by yock:

What then to my other statement?
How can I take a word of yours seriously when you don't even know what nations are EU member states? Your knowledge of the EU, obviously, is next to non-existent.

Chicago_DSL6
join:2003-08-04
South Elgin, IL

Chicago_DSL6 to yock

Member

to yock
How about only Americans know everythng, even better, Americans are always right.

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

kamm to yock

Member

to yock
said by yock:

said by Snickerdo3:
said by yock:

1. Your stated country of origin is *NOT* in the EU; however, Germany is.
Um, the United Kingdom is very much part of the European Union. You are wrong, end of story. Better luck next time.
What then to my other statement?
MUhahahaha, I missed this part.

So yock, let me count: no legal knowledge, no basic geo/political knowledge, as it turned out even your memory is failing you (see your Canadian blow) - don't you think you should at least post something original, posed as a *question* instead of these fully ignorant jibjab?
Shark_615
join:2006-01-17
Pickering, ON

Shark_615 to Snickerdo3

Member

to Snickerdo3
Is that why the UK uses the Euro.....?

LinuxJunkie
join:2005-01-19
Cyberspace

LinuxJunkie

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

Uh, they don't use the Euro you fool. Jesus Christ, all you people act like you're so God damn smart and can't even take TWO SECONDS to do some research and find out the right answer -- and yet you people have the BALLS to say Americans are pompous and arrogant?

»www.cia.gov/cia/publicat ··· 065.html

If you go and look at that page, you'll find that the UK still uses the Pound as their currency. Again, it's pretty lame and stupid that you people are posting your "facts" online and can't even figure out how to do a simple search to see if you're correct or not.
Expand your moderator at work

sybille
Not only "just visiting"
Premium Member
join:2004-04-06
France

sybille to yock

Premium Member

to yock
said by yock:

1. Your stated country of origin is *NOT* in the EU; however, Germany is.
Although I've nothing to add about the major theme (the new German law) or the minor theme (justice in the EU), I do think it's worth mentioning that the UK certainly is a member of the European Community:

»www.eu2005.gov.uk/servle ··· 79843225
»www.eu2005.gov.uk/servle ··· 80257734

It's true that euros have not been adopted in the UK, though.

Just passing through...

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

Thanks, sybille See Profile. I certainly stand corrected.

That still leaves my other point open the poster, though.

Snickerdo3
Premium Member
join:2001-02-28
Niagara Falls, ON

1 recommendation

Snickerdo3

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by yock:

That still leaves my other point open the poster, though.
I disagree. How can you comment about EU politics when you don't even know what the EU is? Better read a book before making comments about stuff you have no knowledge of.
noone1
join:2004-06-04
Nashua, NH

noone1

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by Snickerdo3:

said by yock:

That still leaves my other point open the poster, though.
I disagree. How can you comment about EU politics when you don't even know what the EU is? Better read a book before making comments about stuff you have no knowledge of.
So, in the course of the debate, one side has a certain point that was wrong, saw that it was wrong, agrees that it is wrong and this then invalidates the entirety of any further discourse? I think it was the creationists who used a similar argument.

Snickerdo3
Premium Member
join:2001-02-28
Niagara Falls, ON

Snickerdo3

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by noone1:

So, in the course of the debate, one side has a certain point that was wrong, saw that it was wrong, agrees that it is wrong and this then invalidates the entirety of any further discourse? I think it was the creationists who used a similar argument.
I think most would agree that if you're going to go around bashing and criticizing a group such as the EU, you would also need to have knowledge of what the EU is. The poster clearly demonstrated that they do not know what the EU is, therefore I (and everyone here) should question the comments posted as not being based on fact, since they did not have the correct facts to begin with.

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

kamm to noone1

Member

to noone1
said by noone1:

said by Snickerdo3:

said by yock:

That still leaves my other point open the poster, though.
I disagree. How can you comment about EU politics when you don't even know what the EU is? Better read a book before making comments about stuff you have no knowledge of.
So, in the course of the debate, one side has a certain point that was wrong, saw that it was wrong, agrees that it is wrong and this then invalidates the entirety of any further discourse? I think it was the creationists who used a similar argument.
As I wrote above - I guess still held by the system -, in 4 cases out of 5 he's flat-out wrong, so he's points are anything but well-prepared...

barnett25
join:2004-01-26
Huntington, WV

4 recommendations

barnett25 to FFH5

Member

to FFH5
Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.

dadkins
Can you do Blu?
MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA

dadkins

MVM

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by barnett25:

Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.
THANK YOU!

rothan
Premium Member
join:2000-11-07
Rowley, MA

rothan to barnett25

Premium Member

to barnett25
said by barnett25:

Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.
I dunno, I think I'd be more willing to buy stuff related to a movie if i had seen it through legal or illegal means and liked it.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

1 recommendation

yock to barnett25

Premium Member

to barnett25
said by barnett25:

Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.
Not accurate. Copyright infringement is still a realized loss of income, as you obtained their material without payment. Split hairs all you want, it's still a realized loss of income. It makes *ABSOLUTELY* no difference whether or not you would have purchased the music, since you *DID* in fact obtain it. You've merely spared them the loss of inventory.

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

kamm

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by yock:

said by barnett25:

Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.
Not accurate. Copyright infringement is still a realized loss of income, as you obtained their material without payment. Split hairs all you want, it's still a realized loss of income. It makes *ABSOLUTELY* no difference whether or not you would have purchased the music, since you *DID* in fact obtain it. You've merely spared them the loss of inventory.
No, it's BS. This is the kind of exaggerated and distorted explanation the MPAA and RIAA want to force us to eat it - we won't.

No matter how hard you try to split hairs 'backwards' to make this case up, it's still horsestuff, nothing else.
There wasn't anything stolen, period. Illegal copy? Yes. Loss of income? No. It's impossible to ever prove it.

FYI: it's not an accident the MPAA/RIAA @ssholes *never* opt for real trials. They won't be able to make their case, it's pretty obvious - the only thing they could do is to extend the case as long as possible, solely to send the defendant(s) to bankrupcy.

wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY

1 recommendation

wifi4milez

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by kamm:
said by yock:
said by barnett25:

Stealing=Owner loses something.
Copyright infringer=Possible loss of income (but not guaranteed)

Both are bad. But they are not the same.
Not accurate. Copyright infringement is still a realized loss of income, as you obtained their material without payment. Split hairs all you want, it's still a realized loss of income. It makes *ABSOLUTELY* no difference whether or not you would have purchased the music, since you *DID* in fact obtain it. You've merely spared them the loss of inventory.
No, it's BS. This is the kind of exaggerated and distorted explanation the MPAA and RIAA want to force us to eat it - we won't.

No matter how hard you try to split hairs 'backwards' to make this case up, it's still horsestuff, nothing else.
There wasn't anything stolen, period. Illegal copy? Yes. Loss of income? No. It's impossible to ever prove it.

FYI: it's not an accident the MPAA/RIAA @ssholes *never* opt for real trials. They won't be able to make their case, it's pretty obvious - the only thing they could do is to extend the case as long as possible, solely to send the defendant(s) to bankrupcy.
Thats funny. I have a strong feeling that if YOU created something intended for retail sale, and it was taken without compensation, that YOU would then consider it stealing. You are only lying to yourself if you say otherwise......

barnett25
join:2004-01-26
Huntington, WV

1 recommendation

barnett25

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by wifi4milez:

Thats funny. I have a strong feeling that if YOU created something intended for retail sale, and it was taken without compensation, that YOU would then consider it stealing. You are only lying to yourself if you say otherwise......
I don't know about him, but I know I wouldn't consider it stealing, I would consider it copyright infringement and treat it as such.

yock
TFTC
Premium Member
join:2000-11-21
Miamisburg, OH

yock

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by barnett25:
said by wifi4milez:

Thats funny. I have a strong feeling that if YOU created something intended for retail sale, and it was taken without compensation, that YOU would then consider it stealing. You are only lying to yourself if you say otherwise......
I don't know about him, but I know I wouldn't consider it stealing, I would consider it copyright infringement and treat it as such.
And it's being treated properly by the RIAA, through civil litigation. The problem is many people love to make the distinction between theft and CI, but they dodge the justification issue. Both are illegal, just one is punishable in civil courts and the other in criminal courts.

I think you'll find that eventually these CI claims will turn into theft, either by judicial edict or through modification of the license granted to the user through the purchase of music. It will be criminalized sooner or later.

Chicago_DSL6
join:2003-08-04
South Elgin, IL

Chicago_DSL6

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

Don't think too hard, you might just be right there considering your knowledge on this topic seems to be totally credible and 100% accurate ...

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

kamm to wifi4milez

Member

to wifi4milez
said by wifi4milez:

Thats funny. I have a strong feeling that if YOU created something intended for retail sale, and it was taken without compensation, that YOU would then consider it stealing.
As long as it's a non-licensed copying, it's not. It's copyright infringment etc but it is not stealing.
You are only lying to yourself if you say otherwise......
FYI: you are only embarrassing yourself when you are posting such idiocies like this...

•••••••••••

LilYoda
Feline with squirel personality disorder
Premium Member
join:2004-09-02
Mountains

LilYoda to wifi4milez

Premium Member

to wifi4milez
It's all a matter of wether you can consider potential income as an asset that can be stolen.

If you steal a CD in a store, then there is a definite proven loss in income, since that CD you stole is no longer available for purchase by someone else. Now if you rent that CD and make a copy for yourself, and return it to blockbuster, then there is no theft.

It's also a crime (or felony/misdemeanor, call it whatever you want), but you don't deprive neither the provider, not the other customers of an asset. To me that doesn't sound as a theft.

Not sure if it would indeed stand in court if this was tried for a theft/robbery charge... Has there been cases where theft of a service has been tried as theft and won by the prosecution? In any area of business, not limited to this current subject...
NGOwner
join:2000-11-21
Leawood, KS

NGOwner

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by LilYoda:

Not sure if it would indeed stand in court if this was tried for a theft/robbery charge... Has there been cases where theft of a service has been tried as theft and won by the prosecution? In any area of business, not limited to this current subject...
Cable service?

[NG]Owner

LilYoda
Feline with squirel personality disorder
Premium Member
join:2004-09-02
Mountains

LilYoda

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

Not sure if it was indeed charged as "theft", or if a new crime category was created for it.

EUS
Kill cancer
Premium Member
join:2002-09-10
canada

EUS to barnett25

Premium Member

to barnett25
If i d-load something that i have not paid for, and know is not freeware/shareware, then it is stealing. It is (maybe) a loss of income to the co that owns the property, etc.
It is not however a loss of a sale, as had i not d-loaded it, that doesn't mean i would have made the purchase.

I wonder if these entertainment companies carry these "pirate" losses in their books, and expense them? If they do not carry these projected piracy losses, then it cannot be a loss of income to the co, and they should stop whining about pirated material.

JLevinworth
James Levinworth
Premium Member
join:2004-11-21
Muddy Field

JLevinworth

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by EUS:

"It is not however a loss of a sale, as had i not d-loaded it, that doesn't mean i would have made the purchase.
I honestly don't understand that logic (and you're not the only one here using it). Basically, that's saying that if you were caught for taking something without paying for it, your defence would be, "If I had to buy it and spend my own money, I wouldn't have taken it.. therefore I didn't steal it."

EUS
Kill cancer
Premium Member
join:2002-09-10
canada

EUS

Premium Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

loss of income, yes, loss of a sale maybe not.
...means that in MD&A they should stop saying that piracy is eating into sales. Piracy is eating into income, not necessarilly sales, if they are deferring charges for said piracy.
And i also did not say it wasn't wrong, it is wrong.
It is theft, infringing copywrites (US), whatever you want to call it.

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

1 edit

kamm to FFH5

Member

to FFH5
said by FFH5:

The idea that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but thieves is the correct one. But in the EU and in Germany they rarely even put regular thieves in prison. Why would anyone think that they will actually enforce this law and send people to jail for violating it. It is nothing but another empty threat from the weak-kneed EU justice system.
Your typical anti-EU, anti-customer but pro-corporate/US blurb is full of BS - why am I not surprised...?
And, once again, business is usual, full of BS.

FYI: no, they are not thieves. There's nothing been stolen, pal.
Try to grasp the difference, even if your bosses gave you this line for today...

Omega
Premium Member
join:2002-07-30
Golden, CO

1 recommendation

Omega to FFH5

Premium Member

to FFH5
said by FFH5:

The idea that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but thieves is the correct one.
No its not.

The correct idea is that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but music and video copyright infringers.

Now if those infringers started selling those copyrighted works, then that is a whole different story.

wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY

2 recommendations

wifi4milez

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

I disagree. I consider taking anything without paying for it stealing. Just because its easier to get pirated software and music/video files doesnt make it any different.

Chicago_DSL6
join:2003-08-04
South Elgin, IL

Chicago_DSL6

Member

Re: Idea is good but not workable

said by wifi4milez:

I disagree. I consider taking anything without paying for it stealing. Just because its easier to get pirated software and music/video files doesnt make it any different.
I would consider it theft ONLY if I managed to hack iTunes and download music without paying. P2P sharing is completely different. Stop trying to justify P2P file sharing as stealing. It may be a crime for copyright infringement, but as other posters have already stated numerous times, it is NOT theft. No one went in somewhere and took something from any place which had any cost or price associated with it, they took files from a P2P network where there was no price associated with the download, that means there was no sale of the product therefore there was no "theft of services".

I love it, now that everyone has the internet, they have become more knowledgable than doctors, lawyers, politicians...
jebba2005
join:2005-01-13
Portland, ME

1 edit

jebba2005 to FFH5

Member

to FFH5
you (junkmail) really get em worked up with your posts.
I disagree with you though.

•••
nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD

nasadude to FFH5

Member

to FFH5
said by FFH5:

The idea that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but thieves is the correct one. ....
downloading is not theft - it is copyright infringement. Not the same.

of course, since there are powerful lobbies out to criminalize any use of content other than what the industry says is OK (despite the law), penalties for infringement are higher than most other types of REAL CRIME.

you could probably accidentally kill someone with a car and get less than two years in jail.

••••••••••••••••••••

envoid
join:2002-12-21
Duluth, GA

envoid to FFH5

Member

to FFH5
said by FFH5:

The idea that music and video copyright infringers are nothing but thieves is the correct one.
Agree, but, just because someone downloaded the movie or music does not necessarily make it copyright infringement (aka illegal). A lot of people like to forget this. It's called Fair Use Rights (at least here in the US). I bought the DVD or CD and would like a different physical version of the same content for use on another device. But, converting the DVD is illegal as I'd have to bypass the encryption (thanks DMCA), so I let someone else do it. By downloading the movie when someone else decrypted it allows me to bypass the DMCA while Fair Use Rights allows me to use the same content on a different device. It's a terrible shame that it needs to come to this, but the **AA's are looking to charge you for every version they can, and by making conversions (and now apparently just downloading in general) illegal they force you into it. It'd be nice to see some lawmakers stand up for our (US) Fair Use Rights and forget about all that money for once. But who forgets about money?
justinw76
join:2004-08-11

1 recommendation

justinw76

Member

Is it really stolen?

If you steal chewing gum, noone else can use it. When you download something the owner still has posession of the original 'product'. Hence it is not stolen. This is madness.

••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••••

Noah Vail
Oh God please no.
Premium Member
join:2004-12-10
SouthAmerica

Noah Vail

Premium Member

Can you say.....

....bought and paid for?

With all the serious problems Germany has to deal with, (Huge Romanian illegal immigration, 14%-22% unemployment, Troops in Sudan, Unions out of control....) THIS is where the House dedicates it's time?

We've watched the MPAA buy Orrin Hatch and numerous democrats;
watched the RIAA Bribing funding Russian officials in efforts to shutter allofmp3.com and related sites;...
...long enough to know how the entertainment industry works.

It's equally fun to watch the American press consistently ignore or under-report the daily reports of collusion and payola that our Beloved Music Leaders indulge in at our expense.

You know, the same stuff we would be in jail for if we were to indulge?

Is bribery and extortion really a working part of capitalism? I forget.

NV
feverfive
join:2005-06-16
Iowa

feverfive

Member

Re: Can you say.....

I was thinking the same thing.... Strange that they are considering jail time for this when, if I recall correctly, the guy that stabbed tennis player Monica Seles, while she was on the sideline during a change-over (DURING a match), saw no jail time...

viperpa33s
Why Me?
Premium Member
join:2002-12-20
Bradenton, FL

viperpa33s

Premium Member

Technically

Downloading music is stealing and no excuse for it but technically.....

Then we should go after the people who buy Cd's and give or lend it to there friends, same thing. The friend didn't pay for it. Say if that friend gave the cd to another friend. Technically they should all go to jail under the DMCA.

The only reason they can go after a downloader is cause they can easily be caught but lending or giving away a actual cd to a friend is still considered stealing.

••••••
GhostDoggy
join:2005-05-11
Duluth, GA

GhostDoggy

Member

Chewing gum get's two-years in the slammer?

Downloading a reduced resolution priated copy for casual viewing seems to get the penalty had one rented the movie and made a perfect copy instead. This will only serve to get groups to rent a single copy of a movie and replicate it offline.

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

pnh102

Premium Member

Seems a bit harsh

Throwing someone in prison for 2 years seems a bit harsh in such a socially liberal place like Germany. What about a fine instead? Illegally parking a car poses more of a danger to society than downloading movies online!

I've always wondered... if enough people paid enough politicians enough money to make murder legal, would murder become legal?

•••

cableties
Premium Member
join:2005-01-27

cableties

Premium Member

This goes wayyyyyy back in time...

"Thou Shall Not Steal"

They said this for a reason. Someone was stealing. Just cut off their fingers (oh, that's India and Sudan).

Theft is theft.

The internet is communism and everyone thinks that a copy isn't a big deal. Wrong. Folks think fonts are ok to steal. They are not unless public domain. And even then, there may be stipulations.

Seriously, I think that the "free ride" is over. Information is being restricted (Google...), and piracy mus stop. Free market doesn't mean theft.

Wow, waht did they put in my coffee?

(This text is copyrighted)

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cableman0327
join:2004-10-10
Westminster, MD

cableman0327

Member

Downloading Movies?

I guess if i lend my car to my neighbor thats steeling, since he didnt pay Ford, oh and if i lend my tools to someone, that steeling too since they didnt pay craftsman, and ALL those yards sales, who dont pay tax's or copyrights on some items, This Country and now the world has gone to hell...Look at the items people download today, its the 80's we want..todays crap sucks..who would pay for something thats crap...Instead of wearying about what I'm watching or listen to....Put your effort's into, catching the murders & crooked House of Representors

kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY

kamm

Member

Germany is simply ridiculous...

..., together their completely out of touch copyright laws - they go against the whole EU, licking the corporate asses of MPAA/RIAA/etc. The German DMCA is actually much worst than our clearly unconstitutional US DMCA.
It's a rare but classic example for stupid & stubborn Prussian approach.

TitoXx
Premium Member
join:2003-03-19
Sterling Heights, MI

TitoXx

Premium Member

Re: Germany is simply ridiculous...

Yea some Laws they have might be Strange, but nobody really enforces those laws to the full extent.And thats what I like about Germany or the EU System.You'd probably have choice of working off your penalty instead of going to Jail.

superht1
join:2001-02-22
Kennesaw, GA

superht1

Member

Re: Germany is simply ridiculous...

HUH? You think our opinion really matter all that much anymore? What you say are either heavily disagreed or ignored.

Censorship is so overly used that I think we're just a bunch of sheep being led to the slaughter. Do we need someone to babysit us grownups? This is degrading...

The internet is a free speech tool for the public anyone who get in between us is a fool.

odreian615
join:2006-01-18
Chicago, IL

odreian615

Member

Will they target schools next

I rememeber schools use to show movies to students k-12 isnt that illegal cause its a public showing

tklown
join:2000-09-17
Sayreville, NJ

1 edit

tklown

Member

the truth

The fact is that it ISN'T stealing. Stealing means one party gains, while another loses. Most of what people download they wouldn't be buying anyway, it's just a stupid justification for the the reason that people aren't paying for overpriced garbage. As for music, the big record labels are the thieves. Thieving both the arists and the people

superht1
join:2001-02-22
Kennesaw, GA

superht1

Member

Re: the truth

held by system
^^^ it only takes a trigger word for this to happen then your post is dumped in the trash bin.
WTF is our free speech? America, the land of the peons?

nobody cares
@ColState.EDU

nobody cares

Anon

p2p untill your hearts content!

RIAA & MPAA = Nazi

superht1
join:2001-02-22
Kennesaw, GA

1 edit

superht1

Member

Re: p2p untill your hearts content!

Post withdrawn due to bad censorship.

V For V
@sympatico.ca

V For V

Anon

Re

That's what happens when u elect a pro big buisness conservative governement.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Canada was the next country to make a law like this with the new Harper governement.

Help the strong and crush the weak , that's the mentality.

judgmentday
@comcast.net

judgmentday

Anon

Pirates are idiots

Trying to justify stealing is like pissin in the wind. It ain't very smart, but then again Pirates have proven to be idiots so it's no surprise they would try to justify theft. Piracy is definitely theft of goods or services without payment as has been upheld by courts worldwide so now it's time for the Pirates to pay for their crimes. If you combine the two years prison sentence with a $10,000 fine per copy/title, that should send a clear message to the dumbazz Pirates.

superht1
join:2001-02-22
Kennesaw, GA

1 edit

superht1

Member

Re: Pirates are idiots

Post withdrawn due to bad censorship.
iSEPIC
join:2001-04-17
Las Vegas, NV

1 recommendation

iSEPIC to judgmentday

Member

to judgmentday
You know, It's not that I'm FOR Piracy, but I really am AGAINST people like you. Especially if they ever make it to a high office (and they do). You see, you are so blatenly black and white on this, you don't see the forest for the trees. How would you like it if I brought you to justice for taking the same route home every day, just because I copyrighted the ideal? Or how would you like it if I sued you in a court of law for downloading the images you just downloaded onto your computer, e.g. the "broad band reports" logo, etc. You see, there are instances where this isn't just black and white. And if you think, just beause there are high level folks who are in power, that can allow corporations to protect their money, but then don't protect the average citizen, you're in for a rude awakening sometime soon.

This 2 year sentance for this petty petty cime wont last long, and if it does, the folks in power, won't be in power much longer - nuff said
Cytomax
join:2004-09-03
Miami, FL

Cytomax

Member

Downloading is NOT the same as stealing chewing gun!

When will people understand that downloading is NOT the same as PHYSICALLY stealing something away from someone. Stealing chewing gum would result in the PHYSICAL loss of the chewing gum from the original owner. When you download the owner does not PHYSICALLY lose anything. It is not STOLEN it is COPIED. This is copyright infringement that is all... i am not saying i am for or against i just hate it when i a lawyer says the 2 are equal because it is not a valid comparison...
Eddie

superht1
join:2001-02-22
Kennesaw, GA

1 edit

superht1

Member

Re: Downloading is NOT the same as stealing chewing gun!

My post was held due to censorship. Now that's what I call BS.
superht1

1 edit

superht1 to Cytomax

Member

to Cytomax
Oh they know that but they just want to makeup some BS to prosecute people. It's evil!!! It's dumb.

dadkins
Can you do Blu?
MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA

1 edit

dadkins

MVM

Uh, yeah...

Click for full size
#1
Click for full size
#2
Click for full size
#3
Click for full size
See pic #1 A MP3 and a folder.
See pic #2 Inside that folder, a copy of the original MP3.
See pic #3 The original folder and MP3 minus the copied MP3 & folder.

The original MP3 is still intact and playable. The copy is now elsewhere, but I have the original still in its folder.

Nothing was stolen.
Something was copied and moved.
I was not denied the use of the original at any time.
Nothing ever physically happened to the original.
Nothing was stolen.

It was copied and moved, nothing more.
This is not theft. It is copying.
Hence the term Copyright Infringement.

Now, if something happens to my BOC CD(I step on it, sit on it, it gets stolen, whatever), I simply point any one of my burning apps at a folder on my HDD and burn a new CD.
It will be an MP3 CD, and not a CDDA CD, so it's not even an exact copy.

But, I do have the CDDA files available, and I *CAN* burn a CD that is an exact copy.

All of the above can be done with DVDs just as easily.

None of the above can be considered theft/stealing.
To hear some of you here(and the xxAAs), what I have done on my laptop is illegal. Bullshit!

If I make *ANY* of these files available for someone to download, that is Copyright Infringement.
Copyright Infringement is illegal, but it is not stealing!

None of the downloaders would be able to deny me use of the files I have. They are merely making copies.

EDIT: This is a setting in RealPlayer Preferences(one of MANY applications I have at my disposal).
If I PLAY a CD, by the time it is done with the first song, the entire CD is ripped to a folder of my choosing - in whatever format I wish!

This does not detract from CloneCD/CloneDVD, Alcohol, SonicStage, Mastering Studio, DVD Copy 4, DVD Shrink, Click to DVD, Drag'n Drop CD+DVD, etc...

G_Poobah
join:2004-01-17
Schenectady, NY

1 recommendation

G_Poobah

Member

The moral of this story?

Computer literate people = Bad for **AA's.

The rise of the educated customer spells the beginning of the end for the **AA monopolies, much like the rise of the printing press spelled the end of the catholic church monopoly on religion. No longer at the 'laws of god' passed to the people through the mouths of the **AA's (or the priesthood either), instead the customer gets to choose what they feel is most appropriate. Naturally, both industries are fighting back, the church launching an Inquisition, where they falsely accuse the innocent to raise money, and the **AA's doing the same thing with bought politicians and lawyers.

»people.csail.mit.edu/pau ··· ipt.html

"In the early years of the 21st century, to combat the rising tide of computer knowledge, the great Orrin Hatch gave the Homeland Security department of the US leave to move without let or hindrance throught the world, in a reign of violence, terror and torture that makes a smashing film (which of course, noone could watch due to DRM) This was the MPAA Inquisition..."
Nick13
join:2003-01-21
Bronx, NY

2 edits

Nick13

Member

Confusions...

Look, it's really simple. 95% of new movies are trash - you all know that. With today's communication technologies (TV, Internet, News Paper's reviews, Radio and other means) we all know whether we want to see the movie even before it came out. At least it's always clear to me and everyone I know. I hope you guys in the same league. Now, even if you downloaded this movie, just out of curiosity, zip through it and then delete it, WHAT DID THEY LOSE? You never planned to see it anyway in the first place! You're not their costumer and never intended to be. So, what's their loss? They're full of sh*t!

Take two: Lets say that %5 of them are worth to see. You heard, the movie should be real good. We all know that long time before it's out. (Read above). Most people even if they downloaded it - do not watch it. They want to enjoy real video/audio quality in the cinema. Others just can't go because of the many reasons (kids, health, etc..). So, again Studios didn't really lose anything!

If you think you can argue the fact that Studios are full of sh*t, then first explain, why good movie makes a cool BILLION in first 12 month no matter what? And it's at record high! What happened to piracy here? And shitty movie blames pirates and stinks any way. Do you see the point? They just cry in order to push lawmakers to create better environment for them and hope to benefit from it, that's simple.

Same story with the software makers. They think if you wouldn't be able to download "Photoshop" from warez - you will run to them and pay cool $700! So, they report it as loss. What a stupidity (or may be smart pants?). If you can't get it for free, you just leave it alone, so they get nothing no matter what! Only Pros, who makes money on it, would buy it, and that's what they do anyway. All their statements are false! At least %95 of them. I already seen researches that proved this, but of course, they don’t want to hear about them. And meanwhile they make more and more money every year! Just look at their income, it’s insane! Don’t you see they’re manipulating with our minds? Lame, very lame. Screw them!

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XiNCOM_Andre
join:2004-07-09
Hubbard, OR

1 recommendation

XiNCOM_Andre

Member

take 2

The concept of downloading=stealing comes from college papers, you copy a writers work and present it as your own... Benefiting (or getting screwed if caught) from it. Now, we are benefiting from this so called "theft" by obtaining entertainment value. I see a fine line between the above but unfortunately they have been merged together by overzealous artists/actors who feel they are entitled to compensation every single time their work gets viewed or listened to. Obviously if it's trash then people feel they wasted their money, lesson learned, download from before buying.

How about a return policy on music CDs and DVDs?
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