Fios, Lightspeed 'Crippled Networks'Bruce Kushnick laments state of the broadband union ( old news - 02:00PM Tuesday Jun 13 2006) tags: dsl · coverage · businessBell critic Bruce Kushnick pens a piece on the state of the broadband union that discusses franchise agreements, next-gen telco broadband, new broadband laws, and more. Kushnick argues that the current networks America has been given are inferior products, and that the promises of broad next-gen deployments are largely smokescreens being used to curry favor with regulators considering merger approvals. He's particularly unimpressed with AT&T's "Project Lightspeed", which will use existing copper to offer consumers only 6Mbps post-upgrade. "Verizon and SBC made their latest deployment announcements as part of their push to merge with MCI and AT&T, respectively. The companies promised to wire more homes only to curry favor, so that the FCC would approve the mergers. Therefore, these stated deployments may have already fulfilled their job.
Let us stress --- There is absolutely no guarantee that any of these services will be available, much less offered en mass. Indeed, SBC is still in testing stages as of mid-June 2006, and it is very doubtful they will achieve their announced deployments to 18 million homes by 2007 (changed to "19 million in 2008" as of June 2006.) Verizon also claims that delays in local franchise negotiations may also slow down deployment and that it might leave them behind schedule." More detail is available here.
Related:- Verizon: Copper's Death Greatly Exaggerated
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- Comcast Struggles With Subscriber Additions
- Windstream Passes 1 Million Broadband Customers
- Stuck In Broadband No Man's Land
- Verizon Continues Proud History Of Denial
- AT&T Announces U-Verse Enhancements
- Will Regulators Repeat Fairpoint Mistakes With Frontier?
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rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL
| I agree Project Lightspeed is a JOKE! Even Luke Skywalker agrees.
FIOS isn't going to stay that cheap for long with $100 billion on the line.
Cell and VOIP is killing off the RBOCs.
I'm all for FULL net neutrality. Anything else is ridiculous.
Rachel | |
|  | 
NowVOIP
In the beginning there was POTS
join:2006-03-05
Round Lake, IL
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| Re: I agree Net Neutrality? Ha! And excatly what does net Neutraility get us? A fast lane we have to pay more for? As people in the slow lane suffer, because they can't get anything faster? Net neutrality doesn't solve anything. If anything it creates more problems.
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The revolution will be televised! | |
| | | chemaupr
join:2005-06-06
Alexandria, VA | Re: I agree What are you talking about!!! There is no two lanes in the Net Neutrality, is all the same,is what we enjoy today.
You are watching to many telecom commercials and getting confused, it seem that their campaing is working! | |
| | | 
twoissues
@verizon.net
| Don't confuse the two issues... you can't make net-neutrality a universal service fund mandate upon telcos. On the other hand, you can't allow telcos to shake-down would-be content resellers for the broadband interconnect (peering). If content providers share costs of interconnect- that is acceptable, however if these arrangement can't be made amicably, well you have issues of fairness arise where a content provider could be shut out of a network (or not be allowed enough bandwidth to run their business), and customers lose faith in the isp as well (affecting both pricing and marketshare, ie 100 megabits to nowhere fast) so it really would be a lose-lose situation.
Content provider NEED to build/rent/lease their own fiber farms to reasonable interconnect as bandwidth transmission still costs "REAL MONEY" and there are NO ARPA-NET national science foundation superfunds supporting the infrastructure anymore, only the framework upon which it was handed over to isps.
If there were billions in investment and we say went through a fiber buildout boom and bust, these facilities could be scooped up for pennies on the dollar out of bankrupcy (hint-hint, cough cough, emm see eye) then there would be plenty of resources to 'go round' as the fibers can do a much better job than your dad's fiber network of 15 years ago. (40-120 gigabits per fibre channel symmetric).
BTW, telcos seem to own too much of the nation's fiber, and we need NEW 3rd party investment in 2007 ipv6 fiber deployments and signaling. Otherwise we will see sub-adequate bottlenecks on parts of the internet which max out and get oversold for the demand on content. | |
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Blasterbator
Sent By Grocery Clerks
join:2001-02-20
Jackson, MS | Re: I agree "Net Neutrality" is nothing more than pointless competition stifling, government regulation.
Let the telco's dig their own hole with their "two tiered Internet" bologna in a truly competitive market. | |
| | | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA
·Verizon FIOS
| Ummm, net-neutrality is the abscence of a paid for fast and slow lane. You've got it backwards.
Presently there is no net-neutrality and the service providers can "try" to charge whatever they want to content providers they don't serve.
If there were competition in the industry that strategy would put them right out of business.. but since there isn't, we need a law. | |
| | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| said by rachelsfx  :Project Lightspeed is a JOKE! Even Luke Skywalker agrees. FIOS isn't going to stay that cheap for long with $100 billion on the line. Cell and VOIP is killing off the RBOCs. I'm all for FULL net neutrality. Anything else is ridiculous. Rachel You might want to hold off on calling Lightspeed a joke. If it becomes available as rapidly as ATT claims, I dont think the cable companies will be laughing at all. I have had the service for about a month now and it is quite competitive package to local cable offerings. It does quite a few things better than cable. | |
| | | pabster
join:2001-12-09
Waterloo, IA
 ·Mediacom
| Re: I agree Well, the truth hurts, doesn't it?
Cable blows away AT&T (and other DSL competitiors') offerings. Here I get 10Mbps service for less than I could get 6Mbps DSL (IF I could get it.)
Project Lightspeed IS a joke. AT&T opining that 6Mbps is sufficient for the services of the future shows just how fucking clueless these executives really are. | |
| | | | TheGhost
Premium
join:2003-01-03
Lake Forest, IL
clubs:
·AT&T U-Verse
·Comcast
| Re: I agree said by pabster :Well, the truth hurts, doesn't it? Cable blows away AT&T (and other DSL competitiors') offerings. Here I get 10Mbps service for less than I could get 6Mbps DSL (IF I could get it.) Project Lightspeed IS a joke. AT&T opining that 6Mbps is sufficient for the services of the future shows just how fucking clueless these executives really are. Again, it depends on your area. Here I pay more per month for cable and have less upload speed. Here 6MB/384K cable is $43 w/TV and $60 w/o TV while 6MB/768K at&t ADSL is $28 plus phone line for first year, $40 after, or whatever latest 1yr contract is at.
We already have a land line and are looking at Satellite, so DSL would be cheaper for a better upload speed. Better upload is another part of the reason we will be switching (corporate file transfer - I don't do P2P). Download is most likely only going to be around 5+MB due to overhead, but still close.
Cable does not "blow away" DSL in many areas, and for some folks the cheaper prices are preferred to the higher potential speeds (for download, upload is less). | |
| | | | | pabster
join:2001-12-09
Waterloo, IA
·Mediacom
| Re: I agree I disagree, again. I'll venture to guess in almost every market cable offers higher maximum speeds than DSL. When was the last time you saw 10Mbps+ DSL? (Note that in many areas cable is at 15Mbps+ now to compete with FiOS.) DSL is often stuck at 3Mbps or less. Only a select few are at the 5-6 range.
The fact is AT&T are a bunch of corporate stooges living in the past. The fact that they believe 6Mbps is 'sufficient' for next-generation offerings is but a mere example.
The telcos really don't have a choice here. Verizon decided to bite the bullet and cost with FiOS, and it's turned out well. AT&T's "Project Lightspeed" is a far, far less ambitious effort. If they really cap off the 'net at 6Mbps and use the rest for video and what-not, it's gonna flop. | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: I agree said by pabster :The telcos really don't have a choice here. Verizon decided to bite the bullet and cost with FiOS, and it's turned out well. Actually FIOS is not doing that well. In areas that FIOS has been available for one year only 17% have signed up. Broadband is not that big a deal to most people. Hard to believe isn't it. The people are going to lose their internet to big money, big money always wins. | |
| | | | | | | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
| Re: I agree said by batterup :said by pabster :The telcos really don't have a choice here. Verizon decided to bite the bullet and cost with FiOS, and it's turned out well. Actually FIOS is not doing that well. In areas that FIOS has been available for one year only 17% have signed up. Broadband is not that big a deal to most people. Hard to believe isn't it. The people are going to lose their internet to big money, big money always wins. to you not a big deal... hmm ever thought about going back to dialup cause broadband isn't so useful to ya???
 | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: I agree said by attsbcisgay :said by batterup :said by pabster :The telcos really don't have a choice here. Verizon decided to bite the bullet and cost with FiOS, and it's turned out well. Actually FIOS is not doing that well. In areas that FIOS has been available for one year only 17% have signed up. Broadband is not that big a deal to most people. Hard to believe isn't it. The people are going to lose their internet to big money, big money always wins. to you not a big deal... hmm ever thought about going back to dialup cause broadband isn't so useful to ya??? Put on your glasses and read my post again. 83% of the people that had the ability to get FIOS for over a year did not do so. I can't get FIOS. If you only live in your small world of Broadband Reports you will not get the big picture. To run a business and be able to pay dividends to widows and orphans Verizon has to see the big picture. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by pabster :Well, the truth hurts, doesn't it? Cable blows away AT&T (and other DSL competitiors') offerings. Here I get 10Mbps service for less than I could get 6Mbps DSL (IF I could get it.) Project Lightspeed IS a joke. AT&T opining that 6Mbps is sufficient for the services of the future shows just how fucking clueless these executives really are. And no PPPoE with cable.
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
| | | | | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| Re: I agree said by dvd536 :said by pabster :Well, the truth hurts, doesn't it? Cable blows away AT&T (and other DSL competitiors') offerings. Here I get 10Mbps service for less than I could get 6Mbps DSL (IF I could get it.) Project Lightspeed IS a joke. AT&T opining that 6Mbps is sufficient for the services of the future shows just how fucking clueless these executives really are. And no PPPoE with cable. No PPPoE on lightspeed either. | |
| | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| said by cwh :said by rachelsfx :Project Lightspeed is a JOKE! Even Luke Skywalker agrees. FIOS isn't going to stay that cheap for long with $100 billion on the line. Cell and VOIP is killing off the RBOCs. I'm all for FULL net neutrality. Anything else is ridiculous. Rachel You might want to hold off on calling Lightspeed a joke. If it becomes available as rapidly as ATT claims, I dont think the cable companies will be laughing at all. I have had the service for about a month now and it is quite competitive package to local cable offerings. It does quite a few things better than cable. How have you had it for two months now? You a beta tester? I thought it was just recently released.
Also, when people say that "it does quite a few things better than cable", you often get more creidt when you explain that. In other words, you post is like a menu with good pictures on it,.. make you desire the food but doesn't satify the appetite until the food arrives...
So let's hear about the things that make light speed good. | |
| | | | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| Re: I agree said by fiberguy : How have you had it for two months now? You a beta tester? I thought it was just recently released.
Also, when people say that "it does quite a few things better than cable", you often get more creidt when you explain that. In other words, you post is like a menu with good pictures on it,.. make you desire the food but doesn't satify the appetite until the food arrives...
So let's hear about the things that make light speed good.
I have had the service about a month now, not two. I live in one of the trial neighborhoods in san antonio.
Things I like.
1. Instant channel changing.
2. PIP when browsing channels.
3. PIP on favorites list.
4. 3 settop dvr boxes as part of the package.
5. Settop UI is huge improvemnt over current cable offerings.
6. So far the customer support has been good.
7. My broadband connection is fast and not suffering packetloss. Road runner apparently is suffering in this area.
8. Options for usable bandwidth tiers. 1.5/1 is the lowest tier. RRlite is 384/384.
9. Residentual gateway with built in firewall w/statefull packet inspection. My rt314 got retired after 6 years of service after the RG got plugged in.
10. The install technicians did the interal wiring changes right. Everything is properly mounted and bundled up nicely.
Things I have had problems with.
1. Some of the kids cartoons display compression artifacts at times. Should be easily fixed by adjusting the compression paremeters. A stream of these cartoons could not take up much space to begin with.
2. No dual tuner on the current settop boxes. No HD. New settop boxes will be available in a few months to replace these. For now, not a big deal.
3. Occasional dropping of packets causing frame errors. It is not frequent enough to be a problem and it happened on digital cable as well. | |
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rachelsfx
join:2004-09-27
Pensacola, FL
| Re: I agree Well, a beta tester is going to get all that pretty cheap for free advertising and word of mouth.
It is funny the Death Star can't relay cartons right, has no HD, and, sure, customer support is going to be good with a handful of users. Like you stated, bandwidth problems already because too much compression.
FIOS customers report how many problems? Almost none. | |
| | | | | | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| Re: I agree said by rachelsfx :Well, a beta tester is going to get all that pretty cheap for free advertising and word of mouth. It is funny the Death Star can't relay cartons right, has no HD, and, sure, customer support is going to be good with a handful of users. Like you stated, bandwidth problems already because too much compression. FIOS customers report how many problems? Almost none. Well as soon fios is available here.
Until then, I am quite quite glad there are more options available to consumers. My guess is you will enjoy the competition as well, even if you deem it inferior to cirrent options. | |
| | GhostDoggy
join:2005-05-11
Duluth, GA | Its more of a Project Limpspeed, where AT&T will continue to limp along. | |
| 
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Sounds Like a Whiner The telegraph companies could be giving away fiber access to poor people for the rest of eternity and this guy will find a way to whine about it. It really gets old after awhile, especially when you see the Bells trying to deploy this service as fast as they can while still running into roadblock after roadblock after roadblock.
The only thing that seems to be standing between the USA and what this guy thinks is "good" broadband is the government itself. Every town that Verizon has to cater to in order to get a franchise agreement is just another roadblock to the deployment of this service. Likewise, any town that decides to get in the way of AT&T's Project Lightspeed deployments is also guilty of holding back progress. Get the government out of the way, and you will see technology progress.
--
Tancredo 2008! | |
| | 
Minister
join:2002-01-02
Fleeting
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner You drink too much telco Kool-Aid.
quote:
Likewise, any town that decides to get in the way of AT&T's Project Lightspeed deployments is also guilty of holding back progress. Get the people out of the way, and you will see technology progress.
I fixed your quote for you. | |
| | | 
JakCrow
join:2001-12-06
Palo Alto, CA
·DSL EXTREME
1 edit | Re: Sounds Like a Whiner Funny how some people think the telcos are all for "technology progress", yet do nothing to shore up their own lagging internal bandwidth for their current customer base, and game the market against competition. The whole "innovation" argument is transparent. Give it up already. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by JakCrow :The whole "innovation" argument is transparent. Give it up already. Then why spend the billions needed to build out this service in the first place? Is that not innovation and progress?
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Tancredo 2008! | |
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tsu9
join:2001-08-17
Wheeling, IL | Re: Sounds Like a Whiner Progress, yes. | |
| | | | | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA | Telco's and cable companies (as they exist today) have never innovated anything. It's either given to them, bought, or stolen. Every bit of innovation was spun off long ago. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by Ahrenl :Telco's and cable companies (as they exist today) have never innovated anything. It's either given to them, bought, or stolen. Every bit of innovation was spun off long ago. As if any other company is totally angelic. The bottom line remains this. You want fiber based internet or not? Unless you roll it yourself, Fios or Lightspeed will be your only option. As long as the government stops Verizon and AT&T from deploying it, you won't get it.
End of story.
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Tancredo 2008! | |
| | | | | | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| said by Ahrenl :Telco's and cable companies (as they exist today) have never innovated anything. It's either given to them, bought, or stolen. Every bit of innovation was spun off long ago. Spun off from what? Given to them by whom? How about some meat to go with them potatos?
And for the record, telephone has bell labs where much of the technology came from. Cable has cable labs and other groups that work on things.
Telephone in the last few years, have brought us caller ID and a few calling features. Call them innovation, I call them more to sell to your home line. They haven't done alot to detatch you from your home like voip does.
Cable, if you haven't seen any innovation, then I am sorry because you arne't looking too hard.
I have to give both industries credit that they have both moved forward in the last 10 years. Only, my biggest issue is that phone, the staple and backbone of this country, has not done as much growing as cable has, and certainly has had more opportunity to do so - but chose not to. | |
| | | | | | | achuchma
join:2001-04-11
Tampa, FL
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by fiberguy :I have to give both industries credit that they have both moved forward in the last 10 years. Only, my biggest issue is that phone, the staple and backbone of this country, has not done as much growing as cable has, and certainly has had more opportunity to do so - but chose not to. The telephone companies are constantly making improvements and new innovations, the only problem is that it's not right at the phone jack, so most people are clueless...
Most of the improvements have been inside the network with new switching technologies, faster transport rates, smarter redundancy functions, PIP, and so forth. The problem is that because it is not something right there in the house, then nothing is happening.
As for FIOS and Lightspeed, people are just impatient. Rome was not built in a day, but in today's "instant gratification" mindset, 100% deployment is expected from day 1.
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Bring back chicken and potato chips - Vote Perot! | |
| | | | | | | | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
|  Re: Sounds Like a Whiner
said by achuchma :said by fiberguy :I have to give both industries credit that they have both moved forward in the last 10 years. Only, my biggest issue is that phone, the staple and backbone of this country, has not done as much growing as cable has, and certainly has had more opportunity to do so - but chose not to. The telephone companies are constantly making improvements and new innovations, the only problem is that it's not right at the phone jack, so most people are clueless... Most of the improvements have been inside the network with new switching technologies, faster transport rates, smarter redundancy functions, PIP, and so forth. The problem is that because it is not something right there in the house, then nothing is happening. As for FIOS and Lightspeed, people are just impatient. Rome was not built in a day, but in today's "instant gratification" mindset, 100% deployment is expected from day 1. Their are two kinds of people in this world
1. Those that are serious and get things done on schedule
2. Those that are carefree and wants to take all the time in the world
which kind are you? | |
| | | | | | | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by achuchma :said by fiberguy :I have to give both industries credit that they have both moved forward in the last 10 years. Only, my biggest issue is that phone, the staple and backbone of this country, has not done as much growing as cable has, and certainly has had more opportunity to do so - but chose not to. The telephone companies are constantly making improvements and new innovations, the only problem is that it's not right at the phone jack, so most people are clueless... Most of the improvements have been inside the network with new switching technologies, faster transport rates, smarter redundancy functions, PIP, and so forth. The problem is that because it is not something right there in the house, then nothing is happening. As for FIOS and Lightspeed, people are just impatient. Rome was not built in a day, but in today's "instant gratification" mindset, 100% deployment is expected from day 1. So basically the only upgrades they have done is what we never see? how is that suppsoed to help us? | |
| | | | | | | | | achuchma
join:2001-04-11
Tampa, FL
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by patcat88 :So basically the only upgrades they have done is what we never see? how is that suppsoed to help us? Does it have to be a tangible object in your hands to believe that it will actually be a benefit to you?
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Bring back chicken and potato chips - Vote Perot! | |
| | | | | | | | | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by achuchma :said by patcat88 :So basically the only upgrades they have done is what we never see? how is that suppsoed to help us? Does it have to be a tangible object in your hands to believe that it will actually be a benefit to you? It has to be be something i can order or see, the only upgrades the telcos do is to cheapen it for them to operate, not our service; 10c a min long distence existed in 1996 from att, prices havnt gone down. Where is residential consumer ISDN? | |
| | | | | | | | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA
·Verizon FIOS
| said by achuchma :The telephone companies are constantly making improvements and new innovations, the only problem is that it's not right at the phone jack, so most people are clueless... Most of the improvements have been inside the network with new switching technologies, faster transport rates, smarter redundancy functions, PIP, and so forth. The problem is that because it is not something right there in the house, then nothing is happening. As for FIOS and Lightspeed, people are just impatient. Rome was not built in a day, but in today's "instant gratification" mindset, 100% deployment is expected from day 1. They may be upgrading but they are not innovating. Innovations are being done by smaller companies that don't demand guaranteed profit, and had to work for their capital, instead of just sticking out their hand and threatening to allow all their non-duplicatable assets to fall to disrepair (while they simultaneously buy back stock and pay dividends) | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by Ahrenl : They may be upgrading but they are not innovating. Innovations are being done by smaller companies that don't demand guaranteed profit, Who is guaranteeing Verizon a profit? You people post things that just aren't so. Keep screwing around with FIOS and it won't happen. FIOS is a bad idea anyway as a Nation Wide Wireless Network has been purposed. | |
| | | | | | | | | | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by batterup :Who is guaranteeing Verizon a profit? You people post things that just aren't so. Keep screwing around with FIOS and it won't happen. FIOS is a bad idea anyway as a Nation Wide Wireless Network has been purposed. Verizon has included a guaranteed profit clause in each round of government regulation that have lobbied. It was just recently mentioned, although I can't find where now, here's a thread where it is mentioned again. I'd look around for the original source, but you'll probably never read this anyway.. | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Sounds Like a Whiner said by Ahrenl :said by batterup :Who is guaranteeing Verizon a profit? You people post things that just aren't so. Keep screwing around with FIOS and it won't happen. FIOS is a bad idea anyway as a Nation Wide Wireless Network has been purposed. Verizon has included a guaranteed profit clause in each round of government regulation that have lobbied. It was just recently mentioned, although I can't find where now, here's a thread where it is mentioned again. I'd look around for the original source, but you'll probably never read this anyway.. That thread points to a group run by CLEC and ISP. They can't back up what they say because they are liars. I researched there lies about broadband in Korea and it is total BS.
Everyone parrots their lies but I know the truth, you know the lies. | |
| | | | | | | | | | Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA | Re: Sounds Like a Whiner Of Course. Except the story wasn't what stated it. It was people backing up the industry, and I've found many others who will attest to this too.
You can keep your truth, I'll stick with reality. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| said by Minister :You drink too much telco Kool-Aid. And if we do things Bruce's way, we'd have stayed on dialup. Heck, with all that whining, would we even have phone service to begin with?
Everything in this article is wrong... FIOS does not cost $200 a month, the top speed of DSL is not 768K. He deliberately confuses the issues of 1. ISPs wanting to create avenues for their own premium content and 2. ISPs wanting to charge content providers. He claims that Bells aren't spending any money to build out fiber service when this is not the case... where's all that money? What does he think pays for those companies to install this service? Pixie dust?
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Tancredo 2008! | |
| | |
batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by Minister :You drink too much telco Kool-Aid. quote:
Likewise, any town that decides to get in the way of AT&T's Project Lightspeed deployments is also guilty of holding back progress. Get the people out of the way, and you will see technology progress.
I fixed your quote for you. You must be joking. You don't thing politicians represent the PEOPLE do you? Politicians represent special interest wile they pander the the people. | |
| | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| said by pnh102 :... Get the government out of the way, and you will see technology progress. Please remember your statement in a few years when the U.S. is further behind the rest of the world.
My prediction is that the U.S. will progress minimally in the next few years, if at all.
Unfortunately, with the government all but out of the way, we will see exactly what ZERO regulation of the ILECs gets us. | |
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See 17 replies to this post | |
| | | | | jdir
join:2001-05-04
Santa Clara, CA | In the good ol days Do people complaint about running copper cable to everyone ? when a holler or a walk down the store would do just as fine? | |
| alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
|  Key Word is 'Crippled Networks'
| |
| |
See 6 replies to this post | |
Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs:
| In fairness to Verizon They certainly are the ones trying to practice what they've been preaching.
Their delays, if any, are legitimate and caused by their following the existing franchise laws as they exist today.
KUDO's to them..for doing things right.
AT&T..on the other hand...
is a whole different story entirely.
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The life you help save just might be your own Team Discovery | |
| 
WileEC
mindtaker, macky cat, etc.
join:2002-02-07
Yonkers, NY
·Verizon FIOS
| He says FiOS is crippled... He says FiOS is crippled. But he makes no argument other than noting the price/transfer rate to back that up (and he completely fails to mention that FiOS 30/5 is available in some markets for $54.95 mo, which is what I pay). He seems like a liberal scaremongering crybaby to me. TeleTruth? yeah, that's a reliable source for information.
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Rick
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-06
Waterbury, CT
clubs:
| Re: He says FiOS is crippled... Many of his comments re: verizon are unfair and untrue.
If FIOS isn't going to make this guy happy..nothing will.
Verizon's fios availability map here at BBR shows they're moving ahead quickly with this.
Link to The map can be found in the verizon fios forum.
The prices for the level of service one gets is generally awesome..and it's a real competitive force against cable.
AT&T might as well compete against aol dialup for what their plans seem to involve.
Lightspeed is nothing more than static electricity IMHO.
Except when it really hits home, they might be in for the shock of their lives.
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| | | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| Re: He says FiOS is crippled... said by Rick :Many of his comments re: verizon are unfair and untrue. If FIOS isn't going to make this guy happy..nothing will. Verizon's fios availability map here at BBR shows they're moving ahead quickly with this. Link to The map can be found in the verizon fios forum. The prices for the level of service one gets is generally awesome..and it's a real competitive force against cable. AT&T might as well compete against aol dialup for what their plans seem to involve. Lightspeed is nothing more than static electricity IMHO. Except when it really hits home, they might be in for the shock of their lives. Dont worry, when lightspeed becomes generaly available I have little doubt we will be reading articles about cablecos losing customers to ATT. They are already offering deep discounts here to keep customer off lightspeed. | |
| | | | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
| Re: He says FiOS is crippled... said by cwh :said by Rick :Many of his comments re: verizon are unfair and untrue. If FIOS isn't going to make this guy happy..nothing will. Verizon's fios availability map here at BBR shows they're moving ahead quickly with this. Link to The map can be found in the verizon fios forum. The prices for the level of service one gets is generally awesome..and it's a real competitive force against cable. AT&T might as well compete against aol dialup for what their plans seem to involve. Lightspeed is nothing more than static electricity IMHO. Except when it really hits home, they might be in for the shock of their lives. Dont worry, when lightspeed becomes generaly available I have little doubt we will be reading articles about cablecos losing customers to ATT. They are already offering deep discounts here to keep customer off lightspeed. only 25 percent can get 6.0 on att/sbc dsl service
30 for 1.5mbps or less
and 45 percent at 3.0 or usually 2.5mbps
so much overhead crap its ridiculous
6.0 is not 6.0 its 5.0!
3.0 is 2.5!
1.5 is 1.275!!!
ridiculous!!!!!!!
where is the extra overhead overprovision so we get what is advertised???
1.5 should be 1.75 at least
3.0 should be 3500kbps
and 6.0 7000kbps
oh nevermind you don't understand 15 percent overhead cap or encapsulation?????????? | |
| majortom1981
join:2004-08-26
Lindenhurst, NY | lol The franchise agreements only affect video.
Why do people keep saying thats what the delay is with verizon ?
They can put up the lines but they wont be able to have video through them. | |
| | cwh
join:2006-05-14
San Antonio, TX
| Re: lol said by majortom1981 :The franchise agreements only affect video. Why do people keep saying thats what the delay is with verizon ? They can put up the lines but they wont be able to have video through them. There is no point in putting down fiber if you cant deploy video. | |
| | | Zorglub
join:2000-11-18
Fremont, CA
| Unbundling was the real solution Getting others to use the last mile of copper to provide some kind of competition. It worked wonders in Europe and Japan, where they went from being also ran to having choices that we can only dream of.
Basically, what our market is coming to is a cozy duopoly between cable and the telcos. So much for the competition that the 96 law was supposed to bring about... 
I'll be waiting for fiber, but I know that we'll get screwed. | |
| majortom1981
join:2004-08-26
Lindenhurst, NY
| no excuse Then why did they originally put phone lines if they couldnt deploy video over them ?
Verizon is a phone company. They would still use the fiber for the phone service and data service.
They are using the franchise agreements as an excuse so they dont have to wire everything . | |
| | TheGhost
Premium
join:2003-01-03
Lake Forest, IL
clubs:
·AT&T U-Verse
·Comcast
| Re: no excuse said by majortom1981 :Then why did they originally put phone lines if they couldnt deploy video over them ? Verizon is a phone company. They would still use the fiber for the phone service and data service. They are using the franchise agreements as an excuse so they dont have to wire everything . Issue is that Comcast and the rest of the CableCos are getting a pass on phone regulation. Comcast is deploying phone w/o the regulation that phone companies are facing. | |
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jhboricua
ExMod 2000-01
join:2000-06-06
Minneapolis, MN
clubs:
| Re: no excuse said by TheGhost :Issue is that Comcast and the rest of the CableCos are getting a pass on phone regulation. Comcast is deploying phone w/o the regulation that phone companies are facing. But they are deploying them to everyone they serve, not a select few upscale customers, which is what the ILECs wants to do with their fiber deployments.
Besides, Comcast or the other cable co. didn't built their networks backed by billions upon billions of government tax subsidies, guaranteed profits and monopoly status. That's were most of the regulation comes from.
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Jose A. Hernandez * IT Technician * MPLS, Minnesota, USA * My website: Zerochill | |
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odreian615
join:2006-01-18
Chicago, IL | He'll fit right in (Bruce Kushnick) on here everyone knows BBR is Anti-telco | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
2 edits | Many openions. Not many facts though.
I'll bet those of you that are old enough also screamed for the brake up of the the Bell System. How many of you bought the MCI/Worldcom BS
Just a little digging shows Bruce Kushnick to be a stooge for 25 companies that leech from other companies. He is a stooge for CLEC and ISPs. He doesn't give a crap about kids having enough bandwidth to down load porn and play games. Look at some of the BS he posts. FIOS costs $199 then he uses a convoluted formula to measure cost per bit. It is Bull Bit.
People fell for MCI's B.S. now they are falling foe this clown's B.S. | |
| The Gizmo
join:2002-03-12
Pearland, TX | Broadband Progress I pay almost 100 bucks a month for 128kbit ISDN as I have ZERO broadband options, and don't live out in the boonies. While my neighbors can get cable broadband.
If anyone is getting screwed here, it's me. | |
| | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
| Re: Broadband Progresssaid by The Gizmo :I pay almost 100 bucks a month for 128kbit ISDN as I have ZERO broadband options, and don't live out in the boonies. While my neighbors can get cable broadband. If anyone is getting screwed here, it's me. YOU'RE not getting what you paid for you're paying more then what broadband should cost to ya.
FYI ISDN IS OBSOLETE... IT'S LIKE EXPENSIVE DIALUP...
ENJOY IT WHILE YOU CAN CAUSE IT'S ALREADY LONG CEASE TO EXIST | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by The Gizmo :I pay almost 100 bucks a month for 128kbit ISDN as I have ZERO broadband options, and don't live out in the boonies. While my neighbors can get cable broadband. If anyone is getting screwed here, it's me. Why can your neighbors get cable and you can't? Write to the government and force the cable company to build out like everyone wants the Telephone Companies to do.
Did you look into Satellite broadband? | |
| | The Gizmo
join:2002-03-12
Pearland, TX
| said by kakleng :
YOU'RE not getting what you paid for you're paying more then what broadband should cost to ya.
FYI ISDN IS OBSOLETE... IT'S LIKE EXPENSIVE DIALUP...
ENJOY IT WHILE YOU CAN CAUSE IT'S ALREADY LONG CEASE TO EXIST
I know exactly what ISDN is. I've had it for six years, and after six years of ISDN, you tend to become an expert at it, that and Cisco routers. ISDN may be slow bandwidth wise and a very mature technology (30+ years), but it's not going away (check out the ISDN forums on this site). T1 (PRI circuit) uses ISDN technology, T1 and ISDN are the same, except T1 has 23 64kbit channels. As ISDN has 2 64kbit channels and costs a lot less.
ISDN is like expensive dialup, but it's better than dialup in the sense it's faster in every way, only takes 1 second (or less) to connect to your ISP, it's Digital (so your ping is a lot better). 56k dialup is slow in every way, and you're lucky to get anywhere close to the maximum 53k or so speed (it's impossible to get 56k on 56k since the FCC limits the maximum speed on analog phone lines to 53k). Long ago when I had 56k dialup, I got 24k connections if I was LUCKY. The phone company could get SDSL out since it can be repeated, unlike ADSL. But they choose not to.
said by batterup :
Why can your neighbors get cable and you can't? Write to the government and force the cable company to build out like everyone wants the Telephone Companies to do.
Did you look into Satellite broadband?
Well Satellite isn't an option for me because I use the services that it's not good for: video streaming, audio streaming, etc. The response time on satellite is 500ms at best, which is unacceptable for me. I've looked into wireless and it worked great, sometimes, it had a nice ping and nice transfer rates when it was working good. Unfortunately it used the 2.4ghz band which every wireless device in north america uses as well. So it was prone to packetless at daytime when everyone's up and about, worked good at night though.
As for the cable issue, I have a different cable company than my neighbors which have Time Warner (Road Runner). Road Runner has like a rule, that if they provide service in your area, they make an effort to also include digital tv and broadband. My cable company has no such rule, all they provide is analog cable from 20 years ago. They haven't upgraded or have done a single thing to their cable services in 20 years (or however long cable has been around). It's still the same overpriced, no new channels analog-bull they provided when cable was first introduced. They even forgot they service my area, everytime I call them I get a random response to as whether they service my area when I know they do.
I've looked into every type of broadband on the face of the planet, I don't think there's any hope. I'd have more hope if I was out in the boonies as most likely the companies assume I can get broadband in my area (obviously I can't) and therefore do nothing new to my area. My only hope is a new service in Houston, Tx. reaching out to my area called Fision (FTTH) which provides a minimum guaranteed bandwidth of 10/10 mbits and it's unlimited. That'd be a nice upgrade from ISDN for 6 years, but something tells me I'll be an arm's length out of reach like everything else. | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Bruce Kushnick should be called Telelie.The South Korean government built the back bone at a cost of 24 Billion. For the US government to do the same would cost 167 Billion. The odds of that happening are 0.
The South Korean government does not regulate the industry.
South Korea gave low interest loans of 77 million in two years to build the network. The US would have to loan 597 million.
The average speed is 8 mgb with a top speed of 20 mgb.
With cut throat competition all the major providers of broadband service in South Korea are struggling. The biggest failure has been Korea Thrunet, the country’s third-largest broadband supplier, which filed for bankruptcy last year and remains unsold.
Now you know that Bruce Kushnick and his Teletruth is a liar and stooge for CLEC and ISPs.
»news.com.com/South+Korea+leads+t···393.html | |
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