  Rob In Deo speramus, God Bless the USA Premium join:2001-08-25 Kendall, FL
·Comcast
| Doesn't matter to me... Doesn't matter to me how they give me my connection. All I ask for is:
* Speeds that are competitively set with other providers in my area as well as meeting or exceeding the average tier plans in the country.
* Priced reasonably with the option to downgrade my service speed (AND PRICE) and upgrade my service speed (AND PRICE).
* Stable and reliable. I understand that my service can be interrupted and sometimes events outside of the control of the provider will hinder my service, but, like my telephone service, I except a stable and reliable service where my uptime exceeds my downtown by no less than 99%. This includes reasonable ping times.
Too much to ask? | |
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 |   LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06 Felton, DE | Too much to ask?
ummm...at this point yea. T-1 lines come with SLA's that gaurantee 99.999% uptime. Look how much they cost...and they ain't fast. Symmetrical yes, fast, no | |
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 |  |   Rob In Deo speramus, God Bless the USA Premium join:2001-08-25 Kendall, FL | Re: Doesn't matter to me... My DSL service by BellSouth provides me with pretty much 99% uptime. If BellSouth can do, why can't everyone else? | |
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 |  |  |   Matt Gone playing Dragon Age Origins Premium join:2003-07-20 Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: Doesn't matter to me... said by Rob :My DSL service by BellSouth provides me with pretty much 99% uptime. If BellSouth can do, why can't everyone else? Bellsouth provided me with 99% downtime. Well, not 99%, but every time it would storm it would go out throughout the storm, every couple of minutes.
Back to Cable and it's rock solid.
It's largely dependent on your area. -- I have tried to see things from your point of view, but no matter how hard I try, or what I do, I just can't get my head that far up my ass. | |
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 |  |  |   LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06 Felton, DE | lol...i agree but pretty much isnt guaranteed | |
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 |  |  |  NormanS Premium,MVM join:2001-02-14 San Jose, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Over the whole time that Pacbell was the telephone provider for this house, uptime would be close to 99%. During the last two years, while operating under the SBC umbrella, there have been only three significant outages, only one of which dragged on for more than four days.
I have not had a DSL outage, per se; but the three phone outages did degrade the DSL service.
The neighborhood is over 40 years old. How much of the plant in the neighborhood is that old is a guess; but the termination blocks for the drops look fairly new. -- Norman ~Oh Lord, why have you come ~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
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 |   Rob In Deo speramus, God Bless the USA Premium join:2001-08-25 Kendall, FL | Can't edit my post, so please exchange 'except' with 'expect' and 'downtown' with 'downtime' | |
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 |   heathcpe
join:2002-03-19 Brandon, MS
| said by Rob :This includes reasonable ping times. Too much to ask? From my experience reasonable ping times is too much to ask for when your dealing with Comcast. | |
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 |   RARPSL
join:1999-12-08 Suffern, NY
| said by Rob :Doesn't matter to me how they give me my connection. All I ask for is: * Speeds that are competitively set with other providers in my area as well as meeting or exceeding the average tier plans in the country. * Priced reasonably with the option to downgrade my service speed (AND PRICE) and upgrade my service speed (AND PRICE). * Stable and reliable. I understand that my service can be interrupted and sometimes events outside of the control of the provider will hinder my service, but, like my telephone service, I except a stable and reliable service where my uptime exceeds my downtown by no less than 99%. This includes reasonable ping times. Too much to ask? No. I would also add:
* No Speed or Download/Upload Caps. IOW: Delivery of the promised Speeds (no Up-To BS) and no Limits on How Much I can Upload/Download.
* Upload Speed should be fast enough that it does not throttle a full-speed download due to inability to send the Packet ACKs fast enough to keep the download flowing.
* If you ARE going to monitor my Bandwidth Usage, I want an accurate Monitoring Method (like that offered by Hosting Services so I can track my Usage as well as reasonable limits (ie: Set at some reasonable %-age of the 24/7 speed limit). | |
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 |   grcore New and Improved
join:2003-12-06 usa
| Can't have all three, pick two.
said by Rob :* Speeds that are competitively set with other providers in my area as well as meeting or exceeding the average tier plans in the country. * Priced reasonably with the option to downgrade my service speed (AND PRICE) and upgrade my service speed (AND PRICE). * Stable and reliable. I understand that my service can be interrupted and sometimes events outside of the control of the provider will hinder my service, but, like my telephone service, I except a stable and reliable service where my uptime exceeds my downtown by no less than 99%. This includes reasonable ping times. | |
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 moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21 Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| It costs the same in the long run..... Look at this statement:
quote: Standing directly in the shadow of Fios deployment, Cablevision is competing rather cheaply at the moment, on last estimate spending $715 to pass and serve a home to Verizon's $1,800. Of course they have much more infrastructure already in place, and therefore can more slowly nudge fiber towards the customer.
Cable companies can take advantage of the situation and compete with FTTH because they are a lot younger and, in some areas, did deploy fiber. Now, they have to take it a bit further and then they can compete with FIOS and other FTTH services.
Of course, they could take a wait and see attitude (which some cable people claim the bells do) and wait to be passed by those same telcos. Either way, fiber looks like the future and both sides need to get working on it now or face the consequences. | |
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  UnderTater
@comcast.net | Cable Is Laughing at Verizon ...Meanwhile,Verizon spends BIG money rolling out fiber to potential customers. Cable wins in the end! Verizon can rest in peace after the likes of Comcast buries them! | |
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 |  |
 |  moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21 Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by UnderTater :
...Meanwhile,Verizon spends BIG money rolling out fiber to potential customers. Cable wins in the end! Verizon can rest in peace after the likes of Comcast buries them! Really? Tell me why cable in my area is crying because of all the FIOS installations going on.
Laugh all you want there cable boy but FIOS is giving you guys a run for the money and they have a lot more to burn than you do. | |
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 |  |   Cjaiceman Premium,MVM join:2004-10-12 Parker, CO
·Comcast Workplace
·Comcast
| Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon I think FiOS is going to be a major threat to the cable companies. They can deliver more video (at higher quality) to homes than cable can. They can also offer more speed on the Internet. I can only see a couple of downsides to fiber, one the ONT and battery backup needs a location in the home. Two is the company needs to run it to the home making the investment expensive. I think if the companies could lower the cost of deployment without sacrificing quality of the install there would be more fiber being run.
Personaly I think that Denver is going to be waiting A LONG TIME before we see fiber. Comcast is the fastest thing around. (I know, qwest is deploying fiber, but to a VERY LIMITED area). | |
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 |  |  |  moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21 Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon said by Cjaiceman :I can only see a couple of downsides to fiber, one the ONT and battery backup needs a location in the home. This is only a bad thing when it comes to phone service since most people don't have battery backups on their TVs and many don't have laptops.
said by Cjaiceman :Two is the company needs to run it to the home making the investment expensive. I think if the companies could lower the cost of deployment without sacrificing quality of the install there would be more fiber being run. This comes in time. When the fiber comes out in greater quantities, the price of the material will drop. Once more techs know how to do it, the process will speed up. | |
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 |  |  |  |  wev567
join:2006-02-25 Pittsburgh, PA
| Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon This comes in time. When the fiber comes out in greater quantities, the price of the material will drop. Once more techs know how to do it, the process will speed up. It aint the price of the fiber, it's the cost of labor and the amount of time needed to do the work. | |
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 |  |  |  |  ernieJohnstn
join:2005-02-27 Lilburn, GA
| I disagree on your second point. At the theoretical $30K per mile (about $6 per foot) to install fiber, almost all of it is the cost of opening and closing the hole (trench). The fiber is a small part of the cost.
What the telcos and the cable guys need to do is to agree to SHARE the cost of installing fiber. Each could lay their own cables in the trench. Now the cost could be lowered even more by allowing a third competitor to join them. After all, true competition didn't come to the cell phone industry until third competitors appeared. While they are at it, invite the power company to go divers with them, and bury it all.
Another way to lower cost is to install just one fiber to each premises and allow only the highest bandwidth provider access to and to be charged for it. While the companies involved could install this fiber, another alternative is for governments to install fiber and charge for its use along with the RoW (Rights-Of-Way). Or governments could just install the conduits in the ground and encourage the providers to install the fiber, greatly reducing the initial cost.
That's the way I see it. eJ | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   MadMANN Premium join:2005-08-19 | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon Isn't that sort of Communist? | |
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 |  |  |  moonpuppy
join:2000-08-21 Glen Burnie, MD
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon said by CableTool :said by moonpuppy :Laugh all you want there cable boy but FIOS is giving you guys a run for the money and they have a lot more to burn than you do. HAHAHAHA!! Thats not what the shareholders are saying. Shareholders are full of crap. Most are day trader wannabees who want Microsoft profits in 24 hours. Take a dip of 1 point and they all panic. | |
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 |  |  |  |   Subaru 1-3-2-4 Premium join:2001-05-31 Greenwich, CT clubs:  | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon lol So true | |
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 |  |  |  |   LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06 Felton, DE | ""Shareholders are full of crap. Most are day trader wannabees who want Microsoft profits in 24 hours. Take a dip of 1 point and they all panic. ""
Lol.... that doesn't change the facts now, does it? | |
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 |  |   LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06 Felton, DE | How are they crying? You saw someone actually cry over it? you must work for them then huh? SHILL!! | |
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 |   XBL2009 ------
join:2001-01-03 Chicago, IL
·AT&T Midwest
| said by UnderTater :
...Meanwhile,Verizon spends BIG money rolling out fiber to potential customers. Cable wins in the end! Verizon can rest in peace after the likes of Comcast buries them! I'd rather have Fios. -- Look who's talking. You haven't even peeled potatoes for the Military..........REPLY: Neither have Dick Cheney or Karl Rove !!! | |
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 |  RadioDoc 58ef2c0 Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
| And where is the money to extend cable FTTH going to come from, eh cablefanboi? Playing catch-up does not increase revenues.
Verizon will be done and reaping the benefits of a state of the art network. Your Comcast systems will be at least 10 years behind and spending $Billions to do what they should have done in the 1990s. -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 |  |  |   JamesPC
join:2005-10-12 Orange, CA | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon So you think it would have been better to buy fiber cable in the mid 90's......I dont think so! | |
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 |  |  |  |  RadioDoc 58ef2c0 Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11 | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon Why not? Or don't you think at all? -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06 Felton, DE | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon Why do you resort to insults and name calling? Shows a sign of a weak argument or lack of debating skills. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  RadioDoc 58ef2c0 Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11 | Re: Cable Is Laughing at Verizon Why are you trying to change the subject instead of addressing the questions? Do you work for Karl Rove? -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 |  Kearnstd Elf Wizard Premium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | the difference is verizon needs FiOS more then cable needs FTTH because Coax by nature has more room for growth then the anciant copper pair POTs lines. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 |  Kearnstd Elf Wizard Premium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ
| share holders and investors also dont have the smarts to have future vision. they live life quarter by quarter and dont see that a big investment and maybe some loss in the current can ready them for huge profits in the future. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 |  jmullagh
join:2002-03-30 Sayville, NY
| Strikes me odd at what the arguments is here! I have Verizon Fios... 20/5 service and love it! Moreover, I had DSL for almost 7 years with NO outages! Cable is a share medium which means when all the schools kids come home at about 3 PM... cable slows to a screeching halt while my DSL/Fios remains the same because it is NOT a shared medium within the outside plant environment!!! Cablevision not only has a ton of plant issues, they also seem to be having some executive issues as well. If I were the cable industry right now, I would not be laughing, I would be examining how to deploy fiber to the prem and make each customers line THEIRS and NOT a shared medium. I for one would not want to be running bank and stock trade issues over a shared medium that goes through many different homes before it gets to the fiber node. Sure its encrypted however, so was many web sites that were compromised! | |
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  batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Look at FIOS then dicide Verizon's FIOS is not a blockbuster hit. Only 15% that have had it available for a year or more sign up and that is in areas where TV can be provided with FIOS.
If Broadband Reports readers and posters would get out in the real world they will find fiber to the premise is a big HUH among the great unwashed. | |
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  calvoiper
join:2003-03-31 Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| Fiber may be the answer, but must it go all the way? Fiber is clearly the leader in capacity today, but what about a hybrid technology which uses Fiber to the Pole (FTTPol?) and then dispenses with the expensive "drop" to the home by using 802.11g Wi-Fi or something similar--perhaps a regulated band that would avoid interference concerns?
With just a bit of current carrying cable included with the fiber, you could centralize the power source for the wireless APs to greater or lesser degrees, avoiding the "millions of batteries" problems mentioned elsewhere.
calvoiper -- VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
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 |   Persona Premium join:2004-07-07 Gravenhurst, ON | Re: Fiber may be the answer, but must it go all the way? Even to the node would be a start. | |
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 |  pcnetworx1
join:2005-09-21 Bethel Park, PA | Cracks me up how somebody ALWAYS can be seeing a wireless solution be an answer to any problem.
It's good to see different ideas, but still gives me the chuckles. | |
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  JamesPC
join:2005-10-12 Orange, CA
| DSL sucks! DSL SUCKS! I had that shit through SBC and after restarting my router every couple times a day, I went to road runner. That was a great decision, I have had it for 5 years now and I have only had two different IP address. ATT now, always over sales on there weak network. | |
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  dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| ...and yet, I have Comcast HFC going across my front yard.
That's right, Comcast Fiber. Wouldn't be too much of a task for Comcast to hit me with some insane fiber(that would obliterate FiOS), same goes for my neighbors.
Seeing as Verizon has a ways to go before actually being a threat to Comcast's customer base(which is growing daily, 10mil currently), it's not an issue!
Also, there are many areas that will never be serviced by Verizon... crying, wishing, peeing on one's self remedies nothing! I don't want Verizon, never have! I'd love for Muni or a Utopia-esk, or the likes of SureWest to come here... but not Verizon.
YMMV. -- Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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 |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: ...and yet, said by dadkins :That's right, Comcast Fiber. Wouldn't be too much of a task for Comcast to hit me with some insane fiber(that would obliterate FiOS), same goes for my neighbors. How would this fiber be connected in your home? | |
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 |  |   dadkins Can you do Blu? Premium,MVM join:2003-09-26 Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: ...and yet, The way fiber is connected anywhere else I would imagine... the point I was making is, Comcast has ALOT of fiber already laid! Wouldn't take an act of Congress(literally) to connect up the houses in this neighborhood.  -- Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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 |  |  |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: ...and yet, said by dadkins :The way fiber is connected anywhere else I would imagine... the point I was making is, Comcast has ALOT of fiber already laid! Wouldn't take an act of Congress(literally) to connect up the houses in this neighborhood. An act of Congress no, big bucks yes. That is the most expensive part of fiber, into the home. It requires a battery back up and a multiplexer in each house. Verizon is the only one doing it on a grand scale and so far it is not a blockbuster hit. | |
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  sbrook Premium,Mod join:2001-12-14 H0H 0H0
·Rogers Hi-Speed
Host: Rogers Bell Canada
| There won't be any competition If cable co's offer fibre to the home and telcos offer fibre to the home, and the telcos offer video and cable offers phone, what's the difference between them? As soon as they both lay fibre then convergence will happen and the telcos will swallow cable or cable will swallow telco and for those complaining about lack of competition now ... well, there won't be any competition then! | |
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  MadMANN Premium join:2005-08-19 | Imagine this. . . Imagine if everyone got their way and there were, say, 6 broadband providers that all privided the "triple play" all competing for your business in one town. Can you imagine the aerial drop disaster at each house? The sky would be black!! | |
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 |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs: | Re: Imagine this. . . Gee it's too bad we don't have one common carrier for the whole country. Has that ever been tried? | |
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 |  |   MadMANN Premium join:2005-08-19
·Comcast
| Re: Imagine this. . . said by batterup :Gee it's too bad we don't have one common carrier for the whole country. Has that ever been tried? Yeah, it was called Bell Telephone. | |
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 |  |  |   CableTool Poorly Representing MYSELF. Premium join:2004-11-12 | Re: Imagine this. . . WIN! | |
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 |  |  |  patcat88
join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY
| said by MadMANN :said by batterup :Gee it's too bad we don't have one common carrier for the whole country. Has that ever been tried? Yeah, it was called Bell Telephone. And it almost worked, it innovated so much compared to the ILECs today. It spent alot more on capitol improvments and cared about quality, they didnt put no guaretee of anything in excahnge for ur money in the fine print. | |
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 |  |  |  |   MadMANN Premium join:2005-08-19 | Re: Imagine this. . . I also seem to remember long distance being $0.25/ minute. In the '80s!! | |
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  ftthz If love can kill hate can also save
join:2005-10-17 | fiber is the future ... | |
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 majortom1981
join:2004-08-26 Lindenhurst, NY
| Cabevision Why can't people understand its not the medium that is the problem.
THe bigger problem is the amount of people on each node and the bandwidth of each node.
There are many ways to fix these problems without deploying new fiber.
Like docsis 3.0,sperating out the nodes more,ip tv, switched networks
Even though people bash them I think cablevision is doing a good job of competing even they are one of the smaller cablecompanies. | |
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 |   FIB3RTECH
@charter.com
| Re: Cabevision The bottom line is cable will have to split nodes and go a little deeper with the fiber. They will not have to go all the way to the house with it. Coax has plenty of bandwidth to handle future demands. They could take the same approach that ATT has, but with a major advantage using coax rather than twisted pair. | |
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 |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Retraction-Suckers. said by CableTool :"CableLabs in turn issued the following statement: "The report shows that no major investment is needed for cable to compete with FTTP networks." » WSJ Misread Leaked CableLabs Report Tool of the cable, you do know that no one cares except a few gamers that read Broadband Reports and the special interests that Astor Turf here. The smart money that invests knows more then you or I ever will. | |
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 |  |   CableTool Poorly Representing MYSELF. Premium join:2004-11-12
| Re: Retraction-Suckers. Yeah but Im not arguing with smart anything.  I found it humerous that so many can get on board with an inaccurate statement while those that actually work with the product are stating that the report isnt refelcting the case.
There is a good chance you will not see any posters from this news item in the retracted one.  -- *´*) ¸.´¸.*') ¸.*. (¸.´ (¸.' Technicians -Unplugged | |
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  insomniac84
join:2002-01-03 Schererville, IN | First to fiber wins Whatever company goes fiber first, will win. It's probably not as cost effective to run fiber in a an area that already has it. | |
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 |  Chainzz Aka Snippy
join:2004-07-26 Amherstburg, ON
| Re: First to fiber wins If cable companies would consider more node splits and move the nodes closer to the home say 200 homes passed per node. Most cable outages are due to power loss...with less actives in the field eg(trunk amps and line extenders) cable companies would have a better uptime.
although they can currently compete with the telcos going to ftth as coax can provide jsut as much bandwidth. yes coax has to be maintained more, but if there is a fiber break, cut, the time to repair would be considerably longer and may take more than 1 technician to fix...if there is a coax break, 1 tech and within minutes can be fixed. Its going to come down to Customer service, pricing, uptime and when distaster strikes, time to repair.
PS...CABLE COMPANIES WERE FIRST TO FIBRE | |
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 |  |   insomniac84
join:2002-01-03 Schererville, IN
| Re: First to fiber wins said by Chainzz :PS...CABLE COMPANIES WERE FIRST TO FIBRE I'm talking fiber to the home. Controlling that network means if anyone wants to use it, you get paid. The company that installs the fiber could get out of the isp business all together and just charge for using their lines. They would have all the power. | |
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  0984oieut90p43w7tt8u
@cox.net | ....... only time my cable goes out is when it rains real heavy only other time is the random power outage | |
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