  rlt2562 The Wizard of Speed and Time Premium join:2002-12-23 Haughton, LA
·AT&T Southeast
·AT&T Southeast
| BS "...with regulatory proceedings, and other network and servicing requirements," BellSouth informs.
I understand now, this is why my brother has been waiting for over THREE YEARS in his middle-class, well-established neighborhood for DSL service. -- You'll get nothing and like it!! | |
|
 |   Alpine Premium join:2000-01-11 Atlanta, GA
| Re: BS Yep...
While I know how amazingly expensive it is to comply with all the regulatory junk that burdens the telco industry, this really is just a price hike in regulation's clothing.
I'm a fan of -most- deregulation, because I think it helps everyone (including consumers) in the long run. But the telcos are going to shoot themselves in their collective foot if they do this. It's deceptive and they won't be able to use the "cheaper for consumers" argument against regulation if they continue to charge even after regulations are relaxed.
Doh...
Adam | |
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 |  |   en102 Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA | Re: BS These 'unfees' are nothing more than a slush fund for to pay for the CEO's golden parachute when he/she bails. | |
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 |  Sammer
join:2005-12-22 Pittsburgh, PA | IMHO these fees are costs of doing business and not including them in the advertised price is false and misleading. It seems the one regulation we really need on telcos is truth in advertising. | |
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 |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs: | It is very expensive to supply access the the NSA for every circuit. | |
|
 bmn ? ? ? Premium,ExMod 2003-06 join:2001-03-15 hiatus
·Packet8
·Cox HSI
| Wait... This is on top of the existing $2 and something "Regulatory Cost Recovery fee" (or whatever its called) or is this the same fee being rehashed again ? -- "Extremes to the right and left of any political dispute are always wrong." Dwight Eisenhower | |
|
 |   phathead296 Got Slack?
join:2001-11-09 Charleston, SC
·AT&T Southeast
| Re: Wait... Yes. Pretty soon the ads will read:
6.0 Extreme DSL for only $9.95 per month!!!*
*plus regulatory cost recovery fees of $50.97 per month
Just tell me what the price is with all the fees, taxes, and any other charge by any other name. I hate it when I get one price quoted to me and pay an entirely different price when the bill arrives. Cell phones, electric service, and POTS are also terrible at this. | |
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 |  |   Shack
join:2002-01-17 Bloomington, IN | Re: Wait... That should be the law, it is a bit of deceptive advertising | |
|
 |  |  fiberguy My views are my own. Premium join:2005-05-20
edit: August 24th, @02:26PM
| You do get to know the price. It's called "Total Amount Due" and is on the bottom of your bill.
If they are all doing this, electric, phone, cell, etc., don't you think there is a reason for that?
The government requires, so that people on the other side of the isle bitching that they feel decieved that the taxes aren't broken out, that everything must be broken out.
Now, let's look at the other side of things. Some fees or taxes may be higher or lower or non-existent in your neigboring area from yours. It's impossible to advertise a price as "the price" when your neigbor may have to pay a dollor or two more higher or lower than you.
Besides, the price is exactly what they advetised. If they say your DSL is $14.95, then the DSL is $14.95. They aren't selling you taxes and all the fees.. those are often collected and passed on.
So, in your desire to have thi put up front, how do you propose that they accomplish this task for you?
Seems no one likes the way it's advertised now with out the fees, which is the law, by the way, nor do people like having to deal with disclaimers as they want it "straight forward".. so exactly what would make EVERYONE happy... the reality answer is that not everyone is going to be happy all of the time. You can't please all the people all the time and everyone wants it to be their way. Welcome to dealing with the public. | |
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 |  |  |   GlennAllen
join:2002-11-17 Richmond, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Wait... Speaking only for myself, I'd like to see only the actual govt. (fed/state/local) taxes and fees separated out from the "total cost" and not the telco's "taxes, fees, and surcharges", which are, in fact, part of their cost of doing business. I'd be somewhat happier with that; at least, I'd tend to not think so much that my telco is just ripping me off for a few extra dollars every month. | |
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 |  |  |  broadbander
join:2005-07-21 Brooklyn, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
| Fiberguy, the issue here isn't that "fees should be included in the initial estimate." The issue is that the telcos have recently been excepted from a particular fee (which should logically drop the price by said fee), but are continuing to charge for that fee under a different name. | |
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 |  |  |  xsiddalx
join:2005-03-11 Chicago, IL
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
| The original article is incorrect.... DSL providers do not pay into the universal service fund any more than you or I do when we purchase telephone service. (maybe oversimplicated, but true)
Most of the fees in the telco industry are junk fees (cable companies aren't exempt with their "franchise fees").
"Regulatory compliance" "Universal service" "account maintenance"
Why not add on: "IRS tax filing fees" "local gross receipts tax" - varies "state income taxes" - varies by state "sales tax differential" "lobbying fees"
bah...it's all bogus.
"pass through" type fees are not taxes, however, most of us are too addicted to our internet and are establishing "what the market will bear". Since we have contracts, the providers have to pass through as much as possible via "fees" because that is what we agreed to when we signed on. We pay the same "12.99" or, whatever rate, and are locked in with the contingency for them to add fees.
Until a class action suit is filed, what recourse do we have other than suck it up until the contract expires or refuse payment and have credit report issues.
Next we might expect to see our food prices at the grocer have an "advertising fee" and "fuel surcharge" added...
Welcome to the deregulatory model of communications 
It is up to the market to hash this out (meaning our walking with our dollars)
Since you mention the law though, fees are not taxes (check your bill, taxes are applied to those alleged taxes). A good lawsuit or ousting of some of our sold out politicians might more effective than a class action law suit, but frankly, we won't bother (at least in the US). | |
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 |  |   cableties Premium join:2005-01-27 Levittown, PA | you need a smaller 4pt font...  | |
|
  jipper
join:2001-01-04 Stanton, MI | Has anyone noticed.... Companies such as AT&T, Verizon, and Qwest have all started referring to DSL as HSI. I find it intresting and wonder if they are doing this to position it as not a data service but a different kind of service to charge another fee? Any thoughts? | |
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 |   china crisis
join:2003-05-28
| Re: Has anyone noticed.... said by jipper :Companies such as AT&T, Verizon, and Qwest have all started referring to DSL as HSI. Just another one of the Telco's lies. | |
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 |   pb5k more cowbell Premium join:2005-11-16 Tempe, AZ
·Verizon Online DSL
| I'm not sure that it makes any difference. DSL is unregulated whether they call it DSL or HSI, so they can tack on fees whenever they want regardless. Maybe they think "HSI" is a better marketing term. -- "When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.'" -- Theodore Roosevelt | |
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 |  |   TK Junk Mail Go ahead, make my day Premium join:2002-03-03 Margate City, NJ clubs:
·Comcast
| Re: Has anyone noticed.... said by pb5k :I'm not sure that it makes any difference. DSL is unregulated whether they call it DSL or HSI, so they can tack on fees whenever they want regardless. Maybe they think "HSI" is a better marketing term. They certainly are legally safe in doing what they are doing. But it is misleading, and I prefer doing business with straightforward companies whenever possible and take that into account when choosing a service. -- -- Join Red Room Forum BLOG tkjunkmail.blogspot.com My Web Page | |
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 |  |  |   pb5k more cowbell Premium join:2005-11-16 Tempe, AZ
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Has anyone noticed.... Very true. I don't like it either, but this is one of those "it's legal, but definitely not honest" situations. Not a lot that the individual can do - if you're fortunate there may be a competitor in the area with comparable service, so you could switch I suppose...though many dsl users are on contracts and would have to pay a termination fee. -- "When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.'" -- Theodore Roosevelt | |
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 |  |  |  broadbander
join:2005-07-21 Brooklyn, NY
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by TK Junk Mail :said by pb5k :I'm not sure that it makes any difference. DSL is unregulated whether they call it DSL or HSI, so they can tack on fees whenever they want regardless. Maybe they think "HSI" is a better marketing term. They certainly are legally safe in doing what they are doing. But it is misleading, and I prefer doing business with straightforward companies whenever possible and take that into account when choosing a service. Yes, it is indeed legal, but it is also the perfect evidence to show Americans that telecommunications is not dictated by the free market/competition like most industries.
When a fee is waived and "competitors'" prices do not go down accordingly, what is evident? | |
|
 |  Kearnstd Elf Wizard
join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ
| trouble is the competition just follows suit and invents their own new fees as well. Telecom is not an honest industry and is full of "WeaselSharks"(aka sneaky bastards who enter a feeding frenzy at the smell of cash). -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 |  fiberguy My views are my own. Premium join:2005-05-20
| said by jipper :Companies such as AT&T, Verizon, and Qwest have all started referring to DSL as HSI. I find it intresting and wonder if they are doing this to position it as not a data service but a different kind of service to charge another fee? Any thoughts? Qwest? Really? I can only speak of Qwest since I am in their territory. But every comercial, advertisement, and bill I get from them still says DSL.
Even if they call it HSI, (High speed internet) isn't it? It IS high speed internet. I think more people look for high speed internet and not necessarily "DSL".. maybe it's just a smart marketing move. Believe it or not, not everyone out there understands broadband like the visitors of sites like this do. As people what DSL is and they will stare back with a blank look. Many people that have DSL or cable modem service are pretty much saturdated by now. The next group of people are the slow adopters and you need to speak their language...
Many of these people are on dial up still. To them, it's SLOW INTERNET... So, to call the service HIGH SPEED INTERNET will grab these people's attention better than DSL will.
Positiion it as a data service? That was already done by the supreme court about a year ago. | |
|
 |  bcunningh
join:2005-04-01 Seattle, WA | I think it is interesting that nearly every Qwest commercial I see is pitching phone service labeled as "Digital Voice" I've not been able to figure out if this is some sort of VoIP service or just their new name for POTS. | |
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 |   werwerasdfsadf
@sbc.com | Because High Speed Internet will often not be delivered over DSL. FIOS certainly isn't DSL and Lightspeed isn't DSL in some places. | |
|
  technick Premium join:2000-12-16 Loganville, GA
edit: August 24th, @10:12AM
| This Is Bull!!! It would be a wonderful thing if a group of customers stood up and refused to pay these junk fees and filed a class action lawsuit against the telco. I know I am dreaming, but still it would be a wonderful thing. Best thing anybody with alternatives can do, dump the telco all together.
TO HELL WITH BELLSOUTH!!!
"Our greatest glory consists not in never falling, but in rising everytime we fall." - Confucius
Bellsouth Free Since 10/05 - To Hell With Bellsouth Advocatus Diaboli
Streamfire.net | |
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  Rob In Deo speramus Premium join:2001-08-25 Kendall, FL | Wrong Title. BellSouth didn't join Verizon in nothing, Verizon joined BellSouth in the Bogus 'Fees'. BellSouth has had the 2.97 "regulatory fee" for at least 1.5 years now. But, man my connection has been solid, so if it's because of that 2.97, then OK with me! | |
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 |   pnh102 Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty Premium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Fees are False Advertising said by Rob :But, man my connection has been solid, so if it's because of that 2.97, then OK with me! Then why not include the cost of this fee in the advertised price?
These extra fees are inexcusable. If an ISP isn't making profit by advertising their service at $29.99 a month, then they should simply raise the advertised price and not include a fee. -- Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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 |
 |   tsu
join:2001-08-17 Wheeling, IL | Re: unfee? fake-fee = un-fee. Hidden charges are often somewhat legitimate. | |
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 |  |   pnh102 Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty Premium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: unfee? said by tsu :fake-fee = un-fee. Hidden charges are often somewhat legitimate. I disagree. There is never any justification for a hidden charge. If a company wants to add fees, they should either increase the price or state up front in the advertised price that said price includes all fees.
When we go shopping for anything else, we see the listed price and we pay sales tax on it at checkout. Internet service should be no different. -- Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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 |  |  |   tsu
join:2001-08-17 Wheeling, IL | Re: unfee? Oh, I agree. Full disclosure should be absolutely manditory. | |
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 |  |  |   ff1324 Where did the time go? Premium join:2002-08-24 On Four Day | Would "money grab" be a better term? | |
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 |   N3OGH They both suck, we're so screwed Premium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs | Just like 7-Up is the UN-Cola!
Never had it, never will! | |
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 |  Sammer
join:2005-12-22 Pittsburgh, PA | BBR is right, "Bogus Fee" rings true. Unfee = Bogus Fee | |
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  rudnicke Premium join:2004-10-23 Rantoul, IL clubs: | Trust All these articles I see about the telco's. You just cant trust them anymore. | |
|
 BF69
join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| They better remove it Pretty damn simple if they don't remove the $2.97 then I'll just dump them and they can lose the $37.95 a month they get for what they charge for internet too. Now if they are that stupid to lose me as a custmer for $2.97 so be it. For evey year I am not a customer it would take 12 years of "recovery fees" to add up to that ammount. Doesn't seem logical to risk losing customers. Of course we are talking about telcos. | |
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 |   IhatemyISP MM3 Corbski Premium join:2003-01-27 Goose Creek, SC
·Comcast
| Re: They better remove it said by BF69 :Pretty damn simple if they don't remove the $2.97 then I'll just dump them and they can lose the $37.95 a month they get for what they charge for internet too. Now if they are that stupid to lose me as a custmer for $2.97 so be it. For evey year I am not a customer it would take 12 years of "recovery fees" to add up to that ammount. Doesn't seem logical to risk losing customers. Of course we are talking about telcos. Honestly, $37.95 a month is pocket change. They don't care about you, or the majority of the people that actually do care about this. We're in the minority. Most of their customer base doesn't know about this, and will just continue paying it. -- Torrentflux - ircd.removed.us - #dslr It's ok, I'm taking it back... | |
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 |  |  BF69
join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| Re: They better remove it said by IhatemyISP : Honestly, $37.95 a month is pocket change. They don't care about you, or the majority of the people that actually do care about this. We're in the minority. Most of their customer base doesn't know about this, and will just continue paying it. Less me put it this was. If BS loses just 8% of their customers over this then it will take ALL of the rest of their customers $2.97 fees to make up that lost revenue. So in the end what is the point? Not to mention some of those 8% are being charge for using features like the security suite.
Oh and if I go to Charter then I'll dump my BellSouth phone service and just use my cell/and or use VoIP. So there is more revenues lost.
Fact is it would only take less than a 5% loss for Bellsouth to lose money on this deal so why bother? | |
|
  timcuth Braves Fan Premium join:2000-09-18 Pelham, AL clubs:
·AT&T Southeast
| I can see three cjoices....
1) We can continue paying these absurd fees.
2) We can change providers, if we have a choice. Many people do not have a choice.
3) We can stop service and drop off the internet. It is becoming a PITA, anyway. Viruses, trojans, rootkits, DOS attacks, advertising bots, etc - its all getting to be more trouble than its worth.
Tim -- The shortest sentence is, "I am". The longest is, "I do". ~ Project Hope ~ | |
|
  Dan Professor Lava Hot Premium join:2002-12-17 {runtime_%#}
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| KARL! I figured it out! The government is not paying the bells to illegally spy on the citizens, so the bells are charging the customers to spy on them!
Quote:
"...as well as costs associated with monitoring..." Hmmm? -- My name is Dan.
You want more.
I get it.
| |
|
 |  See 7 replies to this post |
|
  smell_test
@verizon.net
| doesn't pass, well, they will slowly erode the dsl subscriber gains back to competitors, since there is no real difference between brand A and brand B dsl service, why not screw BellSouth and Verizon and use this against them again as a REASON to CHURN back to the competiton?
I would, but then again, I don't have, need or want dsl.. I do fine with my "high" megabit rate... People flip kittens over a few pennies at the gas pump, well, this will erode some subscribers, but as much as people have few alternatives, RBOCS turned the screws to clecs so much, that they can't even compete with RBOC dsl prices!
It's like having and entreprenuer trying to sell people on hydrogen fuel right beside the gas stations, when the only affordable vehicle, is that little toy model for $40. REAL hydrogen vehicles are a couple more decades (and wars) away! | |
|
  Servimaster Premium join:2005-04-16 Grass Valley, CA
| FUSF i thought it was going away looking @ my most recent AT&T DSL bill this is what it says
UNIVERSAL SVC FEE Effective 8/1/06, the Federal Universal Service Fee increased. This fee supports telecommunication needs of low-income households, consumers living in high cost areas, schools, libraries and rural hospitals. Your current bill reflects the change. For more information, please contact an AT&T Service Representative at 1-800-310-2355. Thank you for choosing AT&T California.
2-05 FUSF Pass-Through Fee 1 1.52 Service Date: 07/01/06 - 08/02/06 2-06 FUSF Pass-Through Fee 1 1.52 Service Date: 08/03/06 - 09/02/06 | |
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 |  hottboiinnc Kyle
join:2003-10-15 Toledo, OH | Re: FUSF Doesn't also AT&T charge you a "Data Transport Charge" for their "supplier" who is actually a AT&T Advanced Services? | |
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 |   Servimaster Premium join:2005-04-16 Grass Valley, CA | Not that I could find. | |
|
 TheOtherPete
join:2001-06-28 Boyds, MD
| Speakeasy claims no foul If you read my exchange with Speakeasy here: »End of Reg Fee = Higher Reg Compliance Fee???
You will see that they are claiming that they are just passing through increased government fees and are not profiting from this increase.
I don't see how that could be the case if Verizon already admitted that its basically a backdoor service price increase. | |
|
 |   Fatal Vector
join:2005-11-26 edit: August 24th, @02:34PM
| Re: Speakeasy claims no foul You see? I TOLD you so. Business 101 strikes again.
Once one pulls a ripoff and gets away with it, the others WILL follow like lemmings.
A glaring example of why prices will NEVER go down, ever. | |
|
 |  Windogg
join:2002-07-24 Cambridge, MA
| That is one reason why I dropped Speakeasy apart from the awful service. These bogus fees added 9% to my bill. I have never regretted my switch to LBDSL.net for DSL. The price I am quoted is the bottom line price. Not one penny is added as a fee, surcharge, or tax. | |
|
  KrK Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy Premium join:2000-01-17 Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| AT&T Still charges USF fee According to my brand new at&t bill in my hand....
"The FUSF pass through fees charged to some customers has been reduced".
In looking over my bill, it appears I have been charged $1.93 for this month, which is indeed reduced from the past.
They are still calling it the "FUSF Pass-Through Fee" on the DSL portion of my bill.
When was the fee eliminated? Sounds like it shouldn't be there at all. -- "Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) | |
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 |   batterup I Can Not Tell A Lie. Premium join:2003-02-06 Netcong, NJ clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: AT&T Still charges USF fee said by KrK :When was the fee eliminated? Sounds like it shouldn't be there at all. It was most likely eliminated during your billing cycle. | |
|
 patcat88
join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY | Fuel adjustment I am waiting for a Fuel and Energy fee on each bill "a quarterly recalculated non-governement fee to relief energy costs". | |
|
 |   Fatal Vector
join:2005-11-26 | Re: Fuel adjustment
SHHH!!!
Dont give them ideas! | |
|
  TOPDAWG Premium join:2005-04-27 Midland, ON
·TekSavvy Solutions..
| It's BS but no worries I always ask when I get something what will my total bill be. Most of the time they say it will be around this and I say around? You them to give you a number and they will then give you a number.
However you have to work it out of them most of the time. | |
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