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Verizon to Cable: Bring On The Mbps
Ready to raise speeds whenever necessary
Verizon says they're ready to bump the speeds offered via their FiOS FTTH service whenever the cable industry is ready. "The speed we offer is based on competition from the cable sector," says Michael McKeehan, Verizon’s director of Internet and technology policy. "If they offer 6Mbps, we go a bit better. We don’t see the need to ramp up the speeds just yet." It's an unfamiliar position for the telco, which has traditionally been forced to compete on price as cable speeds edged upward. As we touched on briefly yesterday, it's going to be interesting to see if price competition is actually a thing of the past.
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Loker
Premium Member
join:2004-07-11
Fargo, ND

1 recommendation

Loker

Premium Member

When it is available over more of your footprint.....

Great...come back when you have covered a much larger portion of your foot print.

wdoa
join:2001-10-16
Spencer, MA

wdoa

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

..bingo... I don't think Verizon has plans to roll out FIOS in anything but the most populated areas. Here in Central Massachusetts Verizon has limited FIOS to areas within 30 miles or so of Boston. I'm 10 miles west or Worcester, so I don't think the odds of seeing FIOS in these parts in the next decade are so are very high.
arck1969
join:2006-11-27
Apple Valley, CA

arck1969

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

FIOS is in rural areas in California. If Banning, CA has FIOS then you really in the middle of nowhere...
Pixie74
join:2006-09-10
Glen Allen, AL

Pixie74

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

Ha! Banning, CA. has over 23,000 people in 2000 I do NOT think that is "rural" or "the middle of nowhere". Try living in Winfield, AL. this is from city-data.com Population (year 2000): 4,540. Estimated population in July 2005: 4,673 (+2.9% change)

So yeah get a "town" with a population less than 10,000 that has FIOS and I will take that as rural, until then Verizon is still just cherry picking the rich highly populated areas.
Cyber2lz
join:2001-11-15
Odessa, FL

Cyber2lz

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

I live in Odessa, Florida on a dead end road at the edge of a lake. We have had FIOS for going on two years. Hardly the bustling metropolis that is Banning, CA !!!
So all the hype about V* cherry picking dense/new/high income neighborhoods is Bravo Sierra.
Just a thought,
madrhino
join:2004-07-03

1 recommendation

madrhino

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

said by Cyber2lz:

I live in Odessa, Florida on a dead end road at the edge of a lake. We have had FIOS for going on two years. Hardly the bustling metropolis that is Banning, CA !!!
So all the hype about V* cherry picking dense/new/high income neighborhoods is Bravo Sierra.
Just a thought,
Let me guess.A ramshackle trailer in the middle of a mosquito,snake and gator infested swamp with no local politicians or influential neighbors for miles.The kind of God forsaken hellhole that only exists in WWII jungle prison movies.
Did I mention no influential neighbors?

intercede007
join:2002-10-20
Englewood, CO

intercede007

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

said by madrhino:

Let me guess.A ramshackle trailer in the middle of a mosquito,snake and gator infested swamp with no local politicians or influential neighbors for miles.The kind of God forsaken hellhole that only exists in WWII jungle prison movies.
Actually, a metropolitan area within roughly 20 miles of more than 600,000 people (Tampa and St. Petersburg).
madrhino
join:2004-07-03

1 edit

madrhino

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

Gee.I wonder if any retired Verizon executives live anywhere near there.
Fausttt
join:2006-08-07
Norfolk, VA

Fausttt

Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

oh yeah. It costs billions to roll out a whole new infrastructure. How dare verizon try to cut their costs by rolling out the higher income locations and big cities first then spread from there. Its no in my location yet but damned if im complaining. it has been out all of around 3 years. OMG how dare they dont have it in bumf--- wherever. How come i cant have a fiber line straight to my trailer!?!

Loker
Premium Member
join:2004-07-11
Fargo, ND

Loker

Premium Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

said by Fausttt:

oh yeah. It costs billions to roll out a whole new infrastructure. How dare verizon try to cut their costs by rolling out the higher income locations and big cities first then spread from there. Its no in my location yet but damned if im complaining. it has been out all of around 3 years. OMG how dare they dont have it in bumf--- wherever. How come i cant have a fiber line straight to my trailer!?!
they can go ahead and cherry pick I don't care.....just do not make challenges you can only back up in 1% of your entire footprint.....
migafre
join:2003-06-19
East Elmhurst, NY

migafre to Fausttt

Member

to Fausttt
That's just BS man, I live in Queens, NY and the only areas I've seen dug up for FIOS is in Manhattan. Don't tell me Queens isn't dense enough at 30000 per square mile. It kills me to hear that some hole in Florida has FIOS and not my area. It doesn't fit your argument that infrastructure is rolled out in big cities and high income locations.
Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Ahrenl to Pixie74

Member

to Pixie74
If Verizon were building out FIOS in the poorest state in the nation, to the least populated towns therein, I would be worried. Thank god you're not getting FIOS, or none of us would.. because they'd go out of business.

Btw, rich and most populated don't go hand in hand, it's usually one or the other. Rich people buy more land, and pay to keep low incoming housing out.. so there can't be as many people.
atowncrazy
join:2001-11-17
Carrollton, TX

atowncrazy to Pixie74

Member

to Pixie74
FiOS is deployed to where my parents live in Murphy Texas. Thay have less then 4000K people in the town. They also have other smaller surrounding towns as well. I would consider that rural.

DHRacer
Tech Monkey
join:2000-10-10
Lake Arrowhead, CA

1 recommendation

DHRacer to Pixie74

Member

to Pixie74
If VZ was cherry-picking rich highly-populated areas, Banning, CA would have LOST to Redlands, CA.

Banning is a huge growth market right now as people ditch the urban sprawl (give it 10 years and they'll be right back where they started), but Banning has had FIOS since before VZ started putting FIOS in Redlands.

And even then, only a few people in Redlands can actually get FIOS. I'd say 3 people I know on this forum from Redlands have it (I'm not in that list), while I believe FIOS in Banning has more subscribers than Redlands.

Banning, in comparison, is "rural" to Redlands, which is suburban, at most.

Just my 2 cents.

RideRed
Vista needs a popup blocker for Vista
Premium Member
join:2005-06-18
USA

RideRed to Pixie74

Premium Member

to Pixie74
I have FiOS and I'm 7 miles from the nearest grocery store and nearly 12 miles from the closest CO.

Verizon isn't cherry picking anything.

Loker
Premium Member
join:2004-07-11
Fargo, ND

Loker

Premium Member

Re: When it is available over more of your footprint.....

again I never said they were cherry picking in this post (although I do think they are doing a couple of rural areas just so they can say "look we aren't cherry picking) I said that they should not be challenging cable until they have covered a much larger portion of their network....

n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY

n2jtx to arck1969

Member

to arck1969
Any sign of it in Morgan Hill, CA? My firm used to have an office there and the DSL was great. We first opened the office when it was GTE but it quickly switched over to Verizon. I miss the place...
revuney
join:2003-03-22
Somerville, MA

revuney to wdoa

Member

to wdoa
It seems like it's random in it's targeting of areas...
Cambridge and Somerville have yet to get a roll out, and they are right next to Boston. Yet oddly enough, Lynn (WTF) and Saugus both have it... Not that I'm complaining.. I have it, and I love it.
Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Ahrenl to wdoa

Member

to wdoa
Actually, FIOS is installed and working in towns right next to Worcester, like Westboro, which is 40+ miles from Boston. You still probably won't see FIOS until 2010, but a decade is absurd. Unless you live west of Springfield, you'll be brought to the 20th century soon enough. I'm sure the faster speeds won't improve your fact finding ability though..
bloodx
join:2002-08-25
North Myrtle Beach, SC

bloodx to wdoa

Member

to wdoa
I'm in bloodx, SC, pop 9000.

tc1uscg
join:2005-03-09
Gulfport, MS

1 edit

tc1uscg to Loker

Member

to Loker
You are so right. Thats like saying "we have the most powerfull network" (in the one square block we offer it). Just like cell phone coverage.. Bet you won't see them around the Detroit market anytime soon. With 4 cable companies and AT&T in the area, they won't come near it. Hey Verizon, what are you afraid of, if you have such a badass attitude, bring it on, right here in the metro detroit. Be nice to see you get put in your place...

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville

Premium Member

Why wait?

If we're lit, let's get crunk now!

Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium Member
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL

Maxo

Premium Member

Re: Why wait?

said by JTRockville:

If we're lit, let's get crunk now!
I think their attitude is, if we don't have to crank it up, why bother?

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville

Premium Member

Re: Why wait?

So we're all still essentially dependent on cable companies if we want higher speeds? I don't like that dependence one bit, even if it's indirect!

C'MON VERIZON. DON'T HIDE IN THE SHADOWS OF CABLE COMPANIES!

BRING THE LIGHT
WE'LL GRAB IT

Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium Member
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL

Maxo

Premium Member

Re: Why wait?

said by JTRockville:

So we're all still essentially dependent on cable companies if we want higher speeds? I don't like that dependence one bit, even if it's indirect!

C'MON VERIZON. DON'T HIDE IN THE SHADOWS OF CABLE COMPANIES!

BRING THE LIGHT
WE'LL GRAB IT
Unfortunately it's nothing new. Telcos where screaming a while ago about how they could barely offer 1.5M for $50/month and be profitable. Now I can get 5.0M for about $60/month. As competitions forces providers to pony up, we get more for less. Of course, every consumer wants more for less and most any company wants to give you less for more.
fiberguy2
My views are my own.
Premium Member
join:2005-05-20

fiberguy2 to JTRockville

Premium Member

to JTRockville
But will you pay for it?

... and also, I thought Verizon was going to come in, save the day, and operate their system consumer friendly giving the people what they need.

This is just evidence that Verizon is out for themselves.. and if they could kill off cable with their better-late-than-never service, they go back to being what phone does best... rape the consumer.

There you have it. "We'll raise our speeds only when we have to"...

Ahhh... what a great day to see all you phone fan-bois (nice to get it in return, huh?) finally have to eat their own silly notions.

Want more light? Buy a 100 watt bulb.

JTRockville
Data Ho
Premium Member
join:2002-01-28
Rockville, MD

JTRockville

Premium Member

Re: Why wait?

Personally? As far as my budget goes... what I'm willing to pay? Let's just say: a lot. I'm paying $450 now. My 1.5/1.5 connection is worth every penny. But speed isn't the only thing I look for in a connection.

btw, unlike you, I've never felt raped by the phone company. As long as I've dealt with Verizon, and C&P before the change, and Bell of PA before that (I think that's what they were called when I lived there), prices have always been fair, and their product rock-solid.

Oh, and as far as the return goes? When have I ever served that term? Perhaps you're confused?

N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
Premium Member
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs

N3OGH to JTRockville

Premium Member

to JTRockville
BROADBAND SMACKDOWN!!

DaveDude
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey

1 edit

DaveDude

Member

Its not going to be one for one

What going to happen is that one will raise speeds, then the other copies, then 6-12months goes by, then another rate increase. Its not going to get 100M overnight. Even Verizon knows thats a losing game..

rtyutdh
@optonline.net

rtyutdh

Anon

Re: Its not going to be one for one

said by DaveDude:

ts not going to get 100M overnight.
Technically, Verizon's GPON can't reach 100Mbps per customer unless they decrease the number of users sharing bandwidth (currently 32 customers) or upgrade their network to WDM-PON which will cost an additional thousands of dollars per customer. Additionally, I think they have almost hit the ceiling with the 50Mbps plan.
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

patcat88

Member

Re: Its not going to be one for one

said by rtyutdh :

said by DaveDude:

ts not going to get 100M overnight.
Technically, Verizon's GPON can't reach 100Mbps per customer unless they decrease the number of users sharing bandwidth (currently 32 customers) or upgrade their network to WDM-PON which will cost an additional thousands of dollars per customer. Additionally, I think they have almost hit the ceiling with the 50Mbps plan.
Verizon can always oversubscribe like cable companies do, but Verizon has a long way to go until it reaches the ratios of cable companies (40mbitsps/200 customers=20kbitps per customer verse 622/32=19mbitps per customer, long way to go before VZ drops that low).
majortom1029
join:2006-10-19
Medford, NY

majortom1029

Member

Yeah right

Cablevision is already testing 50/50 wich can be bought up to 100/100 if they want.

I do not see an equivalent package from verizon.

•••••••••••••••••••
raIDERspeed
join:2002-07-26
Soledad, CA

raIDERspeed

Member

AT&T U-verse

what about AT&T U-verse? NOT!

RadioDoc

join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL

RadioDoc

Re: AT&T U-verse

What about it? AT&T is not Verizon.
cptmiles2
Premium Member
join:2004-04-22
Swayzee, IN

cptmiles2

Premium Member

What Sites

Please don't put me in the "How much do they really need" category, but I have access to a 30M connection via my FTTP provider (not Verizon) and I can't even find a site to prove that I am getting close to that speed. So I will say it. What can I really do with that much download capabilities as a residential customer without doing anything illegal?

•••••
proletarian2
join:2007-01-08
00000

proletarian2

Member

Get the (price)point.

Verizon (with the exception of the areas that offer the upgraded speeds) sell two speed tiers at two pricepoints.

One priced generally below cable for 5 meg for $39 and a $49 package with 15meg.

If they upgrade the speeds unnecessarily, they'll shoot themselves in the foot by cutting out revenue from most of the 15meg user.

ie, there are very few people who are going to pay $49 for a 20 meg package when they can get 10 or $39??
cbrain (banned)
join:2000-05-21
Silver Spring, MD

cbrain (banned)

Member

I've been hearing that for a year now ...

without any increase in speed. Cable now offers a much higher download. I also see Verizon selectively raises the speed for some. I love my FiOS but view promises, ads and press releases from both industries with skepticism.
whsftbldad
join:2007-02-07
Lakewood, CA

whsftbldad

Member

FiOSLarge and small markets

In speaking with a Verizon field tech, who reported this after a meeting, Verizon is holding off the large scale roll out of FiOS. This is explained as they want to use fiber to replace bad copper. They are only going to put FiOS in areas with problem CO's (Central Office), or old, problem backbone cabling in certain areas. This will reduce the time their techs spend on repeat trouble calls to areas with old copper. I am in the Long Beach/Lakewood CA area. I am a comm tech for another company and do work for Verizon and at&t residential and business. I want FiOS, but my area is not labeled "bad" yet, but 2 1/2 miles south there a couple of people that have it. I currently have Road Runner 8 down and 768 up verified.

Quiglag
God is Love
Premium Member
join:2004-09-19
Ontario, CA

Quiglag

Premium Member

Re: FiOSLarge and small markets

This makes sense. I think all of the cities in my area that have FiOS, were are all ex-GTG, and as far as I can remember the lines have never been upgraded until now; while both the cable, and power lines were both upgraded. Verizon was getting a bad rep in our area for poor phone service, and DSL. Not any more.

dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium Member
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ

dvd536

Premium Member

Fios

How about symmetrical speeds? that would be the death knell to cable.
raye
Premium Member
join:2000-08-14
Orange, CA

raye

Premium Member

It helps having one of the largest IP backbones in the world

One of the crown jewels (the biggest jewel IMHO) from the MCI aquisition was the MCI/UUNET IP backbone. Along with Sprint's IP backbone, it is one of the largest in the world; with OC-192 (and some OC-768 in some places) pipes the standard.

The cable companies have to buy their access for the most part; they have the local infrastrucuture but do not have their own global connections. Exception might be AOL's ATDN IP backbone but I am unsure if that is owned/operated by Time Warner Cable. I think not since TWC's/Roadrunner's routing tables tend to favor Level3.

As a result Verizon will be able to up speeds more quickly than the Cable cos, but if they will be able to match and exceed cable as their subscriber numbers apparoch cable remains to be seen.

RideRed
Vista needs a popup blocker for Vista
Premium Member
join:2005-06-18
USA

RideRed

Premium Member

Then finish them off !

I'd love to have more speed
Methadras
join:2004-05-26
Spring Valley, CA

Methadras

Member

i'm stunned...

that verizon hasn't been able to really penetrate the southern california market, like orange county and san diego counties... there is definiately a great need for this type of competitive nature to push cox and time warner into a different phase of their services... I would welcome FTTH or FIOS, but i fear that i'm not going to see it anytime soon if verizon is going to drag their feet mostly in the east coast...

•••

Jwobot
join:2002-08-14
Sterling Heights, MI

Jwobot

Member

Cell

this cell phone company sucks.
caco
Premium Member
join:2005-03-10
Whittier, AK

caco

Premium Member

Verizon just blinked.

Looks like Verizon is like that American kid in that Cisco commercial that blinks in video conference stare down with kid from Asia. Asia in this case being Comcast. Instead of going for the jugular it is shaking its tale like a gecko before it eats its prey, giving ample warning to get out of the way. Verizon says it has the network but says it will only unleash it full potential if cable companies up the bar. IMO the just took a step back.

•••
bohn
join:2006-05-30
Scarborough, ON

bohn

Member

Canada went in the other direction

It's nice to see competition in America. Here in Canada we've gone in the other direction. Slower speeds, absurd caps, speed throttling, double billing for busting 20 or 30 gigabytes a month, no newsgroups and email and sharply higher prices.
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

new ads

In NY Metro, there are already commercials aimed at competition between Cablevision and Verizon (ground zero for telco vs cableco competition). Verizon has ads for fios telling you when you buy all that high-def tv and computer equipment, your throwing it away when you hook up to cable..vision..
Cablevision's response?
Mailers stating that FIOS is missing channels (What News 12?, NY1, Hah! Keep em) Cablemodem entry level speed is still slower... 15/2 or 15/5, with 30/5 as boost.. they also proclaim themselves the Fiber experts... Hmm, really? Cablevision is also targeting the triple play package at FIOS customers.. $29.95 x 3 ? Anywho... Cablevision doesn't charge extra for hi-def equipment.. fios does, woo..

In the broadband wars Verizon has 10/2, 20/5, and 50/5 at low, medium and high prices to match. Cablevision is entry level and boost $10+ for the 30/5..

If Verizon wants to put that out there, Why not boost the entry level speed up from 10/2 to 15/5, move 20/5 to 30/5, and make 50mbit symmetric... at current prices?

So, raise the speeds already and SHUT UP!!
The 10 megabits is already OOOLD and the upstream weak & piddly-- your still trying to make your dsl customers not feel antsy and shift to cable company while you keep delaying Ny Metro Fiber Deployments... Huh?

•••

mikedz4
join:2003-04-14
Weirton, WV

mikedz4

Member

verizon is cherry picking most definitely!!!

Verizon come back when you cover ALL OF WEST VIRGINIA WITH FIOS. Then you can talk about not Cherry Picking with your FIOS, Only Then, got it????

PrinzII
join:2003-04-16
Gilbert, AZ

PrinzII

Member

I have read most of these posts and.....

As for cherry picking the most populated areas, I am calling BS. If that was the case, why are large cities such as Chicago not getting FIOS? The closest I have heard FIOS coming to Chicago was Fort Wayne, IN and that is over 3 hrs away.

Let's face it. AT&T's Project Lightspeed hasn't been implemented yet and there are people in the Chicago area who are clamoring for competition to companies like Comcast.
borathram
join:2006-12-26
Beaumont, CA

borathram

Member

Banning

Hey! I live in Beaumont, which is very close to Banning (2miles). It is not the rulalest (sic) of places in CA. I have been spreading the massage to my friends and neighbors abt FIOS and they love it.
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