 
pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |  Duh...
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | Re: There is no "free lunch" It never ceases to amaze me how we get soaked in taxes at all levels of government, and politicians of all persuasions still manage to find stupid things on which to spend our money.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
| | | bmn
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Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus | Re: There is no "free lunch" Like little jaunts across the ocean with our military that have destabilized an entire region ?
I don't know, wifi seems like a far less problematic issue in light of that.
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Prove it... | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
 ·Comcast
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by bmn  :Like little jaunts across the ocean with our military that have destabilized an entire region ? The war costs us $100 billion a year out of a $3 trillion budget. That includes all the farm subsidies and other pork needed to pass a funding package.
Besides, local governments are not as rich as the federal government and cannot extort the kind of tax revenues from citizens that the feds can. You would think such restrictions would provide local politicians an incentive to go easy on the spending.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
| | | | | bmn
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Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by pnh102 :The war costs us $100 billion a year out of a $3 trillion budget. So, $100 billion is nothing because its only a small percentage of the whole budget ? Sorry, but $100 billion is still $100 billion, regardless of the size of the budgest and that's $100 billion that could be spent on things domestically, like coastal restoration along America's coasts, especially in SE Louisisana, etc.
That includes all the farm subsidies and other pork needed to pass a funding package. Farm subsidies are another one... Bridges to nowhere in Alaska is another... Museums so crazy, weird stuff in home towns... There are lots, but they are far less visible than a pointless war.
Besides, local governments are not as rich as the federal government and cannot extort the kind of tax revenues from citizens that the feds can. You would think such restrictions would provide local politicians an incentive to go easy on the spending. You have to remember though, these WIFI networks in localities aren't being built just as giveaways to the public. Public agencies are using them for data backhaul to city hall because its far cheaper and definitely faster than relying on cell providers.
I recently overheard something about a project that will allow paramedics to send admissions information via the WIFI networks to hospitals instead of having to call it all in, reducing the time on the radio. Building inspectors can file from sites now, reducing processing time. There are multiple uses beyond just a free giveaway that will make government more efficient and responsive.
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Prove it... | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: There is no "free lunch" said by bmn : Public agencies are using them for data backhaul to city hall because its far cheaper and definitely faster than relying on cell providers. That is a load of hooey. We all know from firsthand experience that Wifi is unreliable and is more prone to failure in mission critical situations. How on earth did these agencies save peoples' lives prior to using wifi? The older systems are solid technology that is designed to stay up and running most of the time. Any public safety agency that wants to use Wifi for this purpose needs to have its head examined.
What you are stating is simply a manufactured reason for setting up taxpayer-provided Wifi.
said by bmn :I recently overheard something about a project that will allow paramedics to send admissions information via the WIFI networks to hospitals instead of having to call it all in, reducing the time on the radio. That is a scary prospect. Someone turns on a microwave or uses a 2.4Ghz cordless phone and patients die because the Wifi doesn't work.
said by bmn :Building inspectors can file from sites now, reducing processing time. So now we have to buy them even more expensive equipment to do the job that they should be doing just fine without it in the first place. That doesn't sound like progress to me.
said by bmn :There are multiple uses beyond just a free giveaway that will make government more efficient and responsive. Government as an institution has existed on this planet for at least 6000 to 10000 years. It has never been, nor will it ever be, efficient and responsive. But fear not, when the next great toy comes along, the government will spout any number of reasons for us to pay for it.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
| | | | | | | bmn
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Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by pnh102 :What you are stating is simply a manufactured reason for setting up taxpayer-provided Wifi. And one could reasonably state that your stance is the typically anti-progress stance of conservatives because, oh dear, it costs money...
That is a scary prospect. Someone turns on a microwave or uses a 2.4Ghz cordless phone and patients die because the Wifi doesn't work.
You clearly don't know much about wifi... Microwaves, due to shielding, should not emit radiation into the spectrum detrimental to the network. And the technologies built into newer phones work around wifi fairly well.
FUD.
So now we have to buy them even more expensive equipment to do the job that they should be doing just fine without it in the first place. That doesn't sound like progress to me.
Right, so instead of them being able to do more inspections more quickly without the long back end processing time where paper notes have to be deciphered and processed, we just keep the slow system. Typical conservative reaction. Complain about government inefficiency and take no steps to fix it. Status quo.
Government as an institution has existed on this planet for at least 6000 to 10000 years. It has been, nor will it ever be, efficient and responsive. Do you have proof of this or is that a statement you and like minded people made to reinforce your beliefs ?
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by bmn :because, oh dear, it costs money... So we should spend tax money on things we don't need for no good reason at all? Weren't you just telling me the war was costing too much?
said by bmn :You clearly don't know much about wifi... You clearly don't know much about healthcare. This is not an industry where great "leaps of faith" are made simply because of a "way cool now" technology. There are already ample ways for EMTs to communicate with hospitals that do not endanger the lives of patients. There is simply no need for a new technology that does not work as well.
There still are interference issues with Wifi. This is an indisputable, irrefutable fact. Any hospital or doctor that allows this technology to interfere with patient care and cost lives is going to be in a serious heap of trouble.
said by bmn :Typical conservative reaction. Complain about government inefficiency and take no steps to fix it. Status quo. We took your approach with public schooling in this country and we continue to throw more money at that year after year. I hear we have the best public schools on earth now... Oh wait a sec.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
| | | | | | | | | bmn
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Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by pnh102 :So we should spend tax money on things we don't need for no good reason at all? Weren't you just telling me the war was costing too much? If you ignore the reasons and dismiss them offhandedly as vendor propaganda, you can come to that conclusion that there are no good reasons. I've presents the facts and the uses, whereas you've not disproven, just dismissed.
You clearly don't know much about healthcare. Actually, I probably know more about healthcare IT than you do considering I worked in it for several years...
This is not an industry where great "leaps of faith" are made simply because of a "way cool now" technology. There are already ample ways for EMTs to communicate with hospitals that do not endanger the lives of patients. There is simply no need for a new technology that does not work as well.
There still are interference issues with Wifi. This is an indisputable, irrefutable fact. Any hospital or doctor that allows this technology to interfere with patient care and cost lives is going to be in a serious heap of trouble.
Did anyone say it was being deployed yet ? I merely stated that there is an ongoing project to create such a system. Issues such as interference and packet loss can easily be addressed.
Unfortunately, the naysayers, such as your self, always come before the real research gets done... Seriously, if people with an attitude such as yours always won, we'd still have polio.
Typical conservative reaction. Complain about government inefficiency and take no steps to fix it. Status quo. We took your approach with public schooling in this country and we continue to throw more money at that year after year. I hear we have the best public schools on earth now... Oh wait a sec.
After all, it is all the fault of the government and the teachers solely... Wrong.
Sorry, but technology in education, when used properly actually works to the advantage of the students. Several school districts in my area have shown that to be the case. You just sit a child down and say do this or do that. You have to introduce it as a tool not an end all and be all.
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| | | | | | | | | | Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA | Re: There is no "free lunch" Many of these mesh networks are multiband and include the 4.9 Mhz licensed Public Safety band. There is much less interference on the 4.9 Mhz band than on WiFi. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: There is no "free lunch" said by Sammer :Many of these mesh networks are multiband and include the 4.9 Mhz licensed Public Safety band. There is much less interference on the 4.9 Mhz band than on WiFi. <sarcasm>
Yes but that's not as cool as taxpayer-provided Wifi!
</sarcasm>
So who wants to the be the first person to die in the ambulance because of interference issues with Wifi?
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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jgkolt
Premium
join:2004-02-21
Lakewood, OH
clubs: | what they need to do They needs to make the coverage better, make if you pay one city it goes the next, and then it is a done deal. Make it like a national cell carrier and they we will get on board.
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www.LakeSemaJ.com | |
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jayjay111
@comcast.net
| Control of you I feel strongly that the Internet empowers us with free speech. To me, free speech means free from government censorship and control. To have city, state or federal governments controlling the Internet starts a 'risky slippery slope.'
NPR did a show on this and I called in against it, at the end of the show. The bureaucrat woman who is/was advocating setting up Philadelphia, PA was on the show. She used the word 'community' which to me is indeed very scary. That word was and is still used used to justify the oppression of hundreds of millions of people around the world. Take China for example, where in its more communist (community) days roughly a billion people were oppressed, denied free speech, denied what we in the western world consider basic human rights.
I don't mean to say that we are facing a communist revolution with municipal Internet access but I do feel strongly that the Internet needs to remain as free as possible from government control. It won't stop with this, I'm sure.
Here is an example of 'sliding the slope': the bureaucrats or politicians could make a stink about security and start requiring people to get a license to access the network. Suddenly we live in a country where Internet access is restricted by the authorities. It gives them the ability to censor what we see and hear. Only positive information could be allowed. Internet censorship to limit public access is a real and present reality for hundreds of millions of people around the world.
Yes I do think this is possible here. We are not better than anyone else in the world, just because we are Americans. Neo-conservatives or socialist liberals both have interests to limit liberty and free speech. Give them the power, and they may use it.
Keep the Internet free from state control, please. Know the risks. Know history. | |
| | krayzie bone
join:2006-09-03
Marietta, GA | Re: Control of you great post, couldn't agree with you anymore. So far, the Internet is the only medium that has not been corrupted or manipulated (yet) by any nation or government. Nobody owns the internet, and that's the beauty of it. | |
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John Galt
Forward, March
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp | said by jayjay111 :
Keep the Internet free from state control, please. Know the risks. Know history.
Your alarmist position is curious.
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jayjay111
@comcast.net
| Re: Control of you Is it alarmist to be skeptical of authority? Isn't this how our constitution was written so as to limit the powers of authority through the 'checks and balances' system?
Look at human history. The crimes against humanity were primarily caused by unrestrained authority. Aren't less-than-honest politicians a common thing? Why trust them? For free (not) Internet access? That's silly. Aren't power, publicity and grandstanding politicians eager to control the Internet, at least on some degree? If not today then how about the future? Just because it isn't a threat today, does that discount the unforeseen future?
Yes, it's true, governments all across the U.S. have vast powers. It is the new American way. I presume you'd love a 'free lunch' and never have to worry about Internet access by letting someone else pay for it (and control it). Meanwhile you hand over your freedoms, seemingly blind, ignorant or indifferent to the threat to this freedom we have. It is a freedom many take for granted because they've never known otherwise.
The price of freedom is diligence. If being diligent is in your eyes alarmist, then yes I'm that. | |
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Citywide Wi-Fi: Boon or Bust?
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There is no "free lunch"