  MrMoodyFree range slavePremium
join:2002-09-03
Smithfield, NC | Lie? What, *AAs lie? No way! | |
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 | Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
1 edit | Re: Lie? I know, what a surprise.
no reason to believe any number that comes out of that propaganda mill.
the sad part is that congress won't even notice this "correction" or have any impact on their policy making - the only money numbers they pay attention to are the ones going into their campaign coffers. | |
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| | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Re: Lie? What I find to be funny is the fact that they:
"A 2005 study funded by the MPAA claimed that 44% of the film industry's domestic losses came from college piracy."
I think my 6 year old rottweiler could have figured out that their facts were wrong.
Take 44% of the total losses the industry alleges they had in the time period allegedly studied. Isn't it a bit of a stretch to think that college students have that much money to begin with??? ... and! ... that they used to, before internet file sharing, spend that much money, collectively, on movies?
I don't know about the MPAA, but if you want to know where I'd be first to guess that an amount equal to 44% of the losses they say they had went to nightclubs, bars, liquor stores or other party events FIRST, before I'd say it went to movies... OR, simply to the day to day expenses of just being in college and living away from home.
The MPAA needs to stop their assumptions and stop thinking that everyone spends all their free/disposable income on their industry in the first place.
I'm all about keeping things legal with in reason, but if they are going to wage their war, they need to be honest about it. The more they become dishonest, the more I will actually support the other side who says trading movies and music harms no one. (because in that case, it's crooks dealing with crooks) | |
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| | |  Rogue WolfAte Your Homework, And Framed The Dog
join:2003-08-12
Troy, NY | Re: Lie? I think your Rottie should run for public office, because there's a whole crowd of politicians who don't seem to be keeping up (or are even bothering to try).
Can I donate some biscuits to the campaign? 
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I have learned to ignore such naysayers, when... quelling... them... hm?... was out of the question. | |
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| | | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Re: Lie? said by Rogue Wolf:Can I donate some biscuits to the campaign? She'd love to hear that.. she has some great drive behind her... UNTIL you throw a biscuit at her... at that point, she loses focus on the things that matter.. in fact, this one would, if you broke in, bit you in the butt and drag you away from the cheap silver and show you the good stuff!
She can be bought. | |
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| | |  DUD!!! | |
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 ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
kudos:4 | Oops.... What's a mere 30% amongst friends? | |
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| MrMoodyFree range slavePremium
join:2002-09-03
Smithfield, NC | Re: Oops.... 44% is 293% more than 15%. Of course you know there are three kinds of lies ...
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The public is a poor business manager. | |
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| | MPAA Just following a long tradition of exaggeration and bullying. Selfishness and greed are also included in the script.
No wonder politics has openly adopted the 'Hollywood' way of portraying the 'truth'. | |
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 gatorkramKaBOOM BabyPremium
join:2002-07-22
Winterville, NC
kudos:2
 ·Suddenlink
| ROFL... In three more years, they will realize they were ass backwards on this whole internet sharing thing, and claim they are glad they started it, and came up with the idea.
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Give me bandwidth or give me death!
»/testhistory/661871/4f240 | |
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| SalesGODGot Money? Will Sell
join:2001-04-11
Tinley Park, IL | Re: ROFL... Al Gore invented the internet.  | |
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| | alalperPremium
join:2000-08-20
Philadelphia, PA
1 edit | Re: ROFL... said by SalesGOD:Al Gore invented the internet. I have it on good authority (mine) that he stole the idea from me. | |
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 DogfatherPremium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Shocking That the MPAA racketeers would lie.
Blackmail, bribery, extortion sure, but lie? Never.
Meanwhile we see financial numbers come in from outfits like ABC/Universal reflecting nearly 50% margins. Time for them to stop whining about piracy and STFU. Oh and give the writers their .04 a DVD too so we can get this reality crap off TV. | |
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 SlickEnWPremium
join:2003-01-21
Seattle, WA
1 edit | Lies Most college kiddies are into the indie scene for a couple of years THEN they go back to pirating. Silly rabbits. | |
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|  NyQuil Kid8f The Nyquil Kid
join:2001-01-06
Brick, NJ | Re: Lies Most college kiddies are complete morons, so I'm not exactly crying tears for them....
[8F] The NyQuil Kid | |
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 gaforcesUnited We Stand, Divided We Fall
join:2002-04-07
Santa Cruz, CA
3 edits | MPAA learning from the US govt I expect the MPAA and RIAA to fold and new kinder, gentler organizations to rise from the ashes 
They have to avoid repercussions somehow, what better way.
Look at the book sellers, they had a harder time with pirates from the beginning, their files are smaller and easier to pirate.
So they embraced the web and started subscriptions services, offered free web library sections, didn't get greedy and charged less for web sales to reflect the cost savings of not having to bind books.
They sold a TON on amazon, they did volume sales, and made money.
Instead of DRM, most of them tried to make their material compatible on many different formats, and they include these different formats in every distribution, and without restrictions!~
»www.baen.com/
Eric Flint was right on target with his stance on piracy;
»www.baen.com/library/home.htm
--
‘Do ye, quieting in your bosoms your strong hearts,
Who of many good things have had your fill even to surfeit,
With what is moderate nourish your mighty desire; for neither will
We yield, nor shall you have all else as you wish.’
Solon | |
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|  KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: MPAA learning from the US govt said by gaforces:I expect the MPAA and RIAA to fold and new kinder, gentler organizations to rise from the ashes They are pushing for the formation of a new Uber Government Agency with supreme powers. It's called the Depart ment of Intellectual Property Protection and Enforcement, or DIPPE for short.
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) | |
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|  RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | said by gaforces:I expect the MPAA and RIAA to fold and new kinder, gentler organizations to rise from the ashes They have to avoid repercussions somehow, what better way. Look at the book sellers, they had a harder time with pirates from the beginning, their files are smaller and easier to pirate. So they embraced the web and started subscriptions services, offered free web library sections, didn't get greedy and charged less for web sales to reflect the cost savings of not having to bind books. They sold a TON on amazon, they did volume sales, and made money. Instead of DRM, most of them tried to make their material compatible on many different formats, and they include these different formats in every distribution, and without restrictions!~ » www.baen.com/Eric Flint was right on target with his stance on piracy; » www.baen.com/library/home.htm Once other thing that Baen has done. Many of their Series Hardbacks come with a free CD with all the prior books on it in all the formats that are in the Baen Online Library. In addition, the CD has printed on it PERMISSION to dupe AND DISTRIBUTE the CD. When I go on a trip, my Baen issued books go along in the form of those CDs (recycled electrons edition) not the "Dead Trees" edition.
As Eric states, the Online and CD editions leads to the purchase of the printed copies since the latter are easier to read.
For those who claim that getting movies via File Sharing (ie: So Called Piracy), robs the Studio of payment for the DVD Copy, I will point out a bigger set of "Pirates" who also do not pay the Studios for all the people viewing the movies via the DVD - Blockbuster, Netflix, and your neighborhood Public Library. | |
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 swhx7Premium
join:2006-07-23
Elbonia
·RoadRunner Cable
| How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers 1. Start with the number they give - in this case, "$6.1 billion to piracy worldwide, with most of the losses overseas", and 15% of the US part attributed to college students. So let's say, $6.1B x 0.4 x 0.15 = $366M.
2. Discount for likely counting of all p2p as "piracy". Let's say 10% of traffic the **AA counts is actually indie bands, Linux distros, other authorized content. $366M x 0.9 = $329M.
3. Estimate how many would have bought the same content in legal versions if they couldn't get it online. Maybe a third? $329M x 0.33 = $109M.
4. How many of those would have paid full retail, versus used copies, rentals or matinees? Say, a third full price, 2/3 at bargains averaging 50% (none of the used-copy revenue would go to the cartel companies). ($109M x .33) + (($109M x .67) x .5) = ($109 x 0.67) = $73M.
And all this is hypothetical. It's not something that can be counted on an income statement; the effect is the same as if potential customers had decided not to buy because they read books instead, or because of sunspots or any other reason.
Should higher education funding be held up because one industry speculates that it may be losing $72M by non-purchases by college students? | |
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|  scrummie02BentleyPremium
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers your math is false.. You know and I know that more then 10 percent make up p2p traffic...come one don't be naive. | |
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| | | | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers He counted 90% of the p2p traffic as pirated **AA content. From step2: $366M X 90% = $329M.
said by swhx72 :
Discount for likely counting of all p2p as "piracy". Let's say 10% of traffic the **AA counts is actually indie bands, Linux distros, other authorized content. $366M x 0.9 = $329M. | |
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| | | scrummie02BentleyPremium
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers whoops...I stand corrected..
I see now...good show. | |
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|  NOVA_GuyObamaCare Kills AmericansPremium
join:2002-03-05 | One more step... Then multiply that $72M by the number of people on the planet who actually care about some whiney punk *AA executive who did nothing to earn the money in the first place:
$72M * 0 = $0
This is as close to a mathematical proof to me that shows the RIAA and MPAA are worthless organizations.
This kind of reminds me of one of those Mastercard commercials.
Amount of money claimed to be lost to piracy: $366M.
Number of people hassled and hindered by useless *AA attorneys: thousands.
Number of *AA executives who add value to the economy: 0.
Value of having organizations that screw artists and attack the public because of psychotic paranoid fantasies: worthless.
--
Some terrorists don't wear rags on their head, go without showers for weeks, and smell like camel crap. Instead they live in America and support Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama for president. | |
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| | | | Re: One more step... said by NOVA_Guy:Then multiply that $72M by the number of people on the planet who actually care about some whiney punk *AA executive who did nothing to earn the money in the first place:
$72M * 0 = $0
This is as close to a mathematical proof to me that shows the RIAA and MPAA are worthless organizations.
This kind of reminds me of one of those Mastercard commercials.
Amount of money claimed to be lost to piracy: $366M.
Number of people hassled and hindered by useless *AA attorneys: thousands.
Number of *AA executives who add value to the economy: 0.
Value of having organizations that screw artists and attack the public because of psychotic paranoid fantasies: worthless.
Ding! Ding! Ding! this sums up the matter nicely. | |
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| | | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers Ah, but it's even better (worse?) than that.
(The following figures come from »arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20···761.html )
Apparently, of that $6.1 billion, $2.4 billion is "hard piracy" (guy on the corner selling copied DVDs for $5 each). Then there's $1.4 billion that the MPAA "loses" to illegal copying (making a backup copy of a legitimate DVD you bought). This leaves $2.3 billion lost via Internet downloading.
Now, plug $2.3 billion into your steps instead of $6.1 billion and we come up with $27.5 million.
The other interesting thing that this shows is that 60% of their "losses to piracy" figures are pretty much just made up numbers to evoke sympathy for the industry. Sympathy in government circles, of course, not with consumers. They don't care about us at all. Our wallets, yes. Us, no.
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-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar. Shooting For A Cause
Jason's Toolbox | PCQandA.com | |
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|  BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by swhx7:3. Estimate how many would have bought the same content in legal versions if they couldn't get it online. Maybe a third? $329M x 0.33 = $109M. 4. How many of those would have paid full retail, versus used copies, rentals or matinees? Say, a third full price, 2/3 at bargains averaging 50% (none of the used-copy revenue would go to the cartel companies). ($109M x .33) + (($109M x .67) x .5) = ($109 x 0.67) = $73M. Just because someone "Wouldn't have bought it anyways" doesn't make it ok. That's like saying it's ok to shoplift that CD or DVD from wal-mart because "I wasn't going to pay for it anyways." If you don't want to pay then do without. that's how life works. At least 90% of people in this country would consider themselves Christians and the Bible CLEARLY says "Thou shall not steal" I don't recall it making exceptions. I'm not quite sure why someone who actually believes in a supreme being that has the power to smite them down like we would a bug would screw around with God's rules. | |
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| | | | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers said by BF69:said by swhx7:3. Estimate how many would have bought the same content in legal versions if they couldn't get it online. Maybe a third? $329M x 0.33 = $109M. 4. How many of those would have paid full retail, versus used copies, rentals or matinees? Say, a third full price, 2/3 at bargains averaging 50% (none of the used-copy revenue would go to the cartel companies). ($109M x .33) + (($109M x .67) x .5) = ($109 x 0.67) = $73M. Just because someone "Wouldn't have bought it anyways" doesn't make it ok. That's like saying it's ok to shoplift that CD or DVD from wal-mart because "I wasn't going to pay for it anyways." If you don't want to pay then do without. that's how life works. At least 90% of people in this country would consider themselves Christians and the Bible CLEARLY says "Thou shall not steal" I don't recall it making exceptions. I'm not quite sure why someone who actually believes in a supreme being that has the power to smite them down like we would a bug would screw around with God's rules. differnce being when shoplifting your acually depriving somebody of acual property. when download a new copy of a dvd that i own that's all scratched up i'm not hurting anybody. | |
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| | swhx7Premium
join:2006-07-23
Elbonia Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| I'm not saying "piracy is OK". I'm saying "MPAA/RIAA 'losses' numbers are bogus". The economic effect is small compared to what the propaganda claims.
The merits of copyright infringement is a different topic. But if we're going to talk about "stealing", is the thief the one who disregards an artificial monopoly, or the one who robs the public domain by creating a monopoly?
Well maybe there should be a balance. We could start by following the U.S. Constitution, which allows "exclusive rights" only for "authors" and "inventors", not for exploitive middle-men like record companies. | |
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| |  JammerMan79Premium,VIP
join:2004-05-13
Prince George, BC
kudos:10 | He's not saying it's good or bad. He's saying that a loss of a sale should only be calculated on the people that would have actually bought it in the first place... If the person wouldn't have bought it anyways then there's no lost revenue.
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I may work for, but do not necessarily represent the views and beliefs of TELUS Communications. | |
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| | | RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers said by JammerMan79:He's not saying it's good or bad. He's saying that a loss of a sale should only be calculated on the people that would have actually bought it in the first place... If the person wouldn't have bought it anyways then there's no lost revenue. You also have to add those who only want to watch/listen to it and not own a physical copy and thus go to Blockbuster, Netfix, or their local Library and get the physical copy for a limited period of time. If I miss a movie in the theaters, I will often rent the movie to try it out before buying the DVD for my "can [re]watch it anytime" collection. Using Bittorent just bypasses the DVD Rental for my do-I-want-it try-out. | |
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| | | | JammerMan79Premium,VIP
join:2004-05-13
Prince George, BC
kudos:10 | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers agreed, I do the same thing. Download a movie and then purchase it used at the rental store for $10.00
If I didn't check it out first I would not be buying it at all. I have around 2000 dvd's (I hate to think of how much I've spent over the last 10 yrs)
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I may work for, but do not necessarily represent the views and beliefs of TELUS Communications. | |
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| | | | | | The local library is a good point. My wife and I have seen many movies from our local library's DVD collection. Should the MPAA count these as lost sales? Of course not. Just because I borrowed a movie doesn't mean that I would have purchased the DVD had the movie not been on the library's shelves. | |
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| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | i cant trust a group who says piracy is so evil and that downloading is bad. then they themselves go and do something far worse then IP violations by "pirates" and violate a the GNU software license.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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| | | | Re: How to interpret MPAA / RIAA "piracy" numbers You misunderstand. It's only bad when other people do it. When they do it, it's perfectly fine because they're the music/film industry and are therefore entitled to whatever they want. | |
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 PersonaPremium
join:2004-07-07
Gravenhurst, ON | What's Up? Why bother even coming clean on this? I mean what's the motivation here?
Feeling guilty?...Lol
Still high off yet another record year at the box office?... | |
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| | Who cares if the numbers were mistated.... As long as there is one person pirating, then it is a serious issue. 
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!
Could type that with a straight face for long. | |
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lesopp
join:2001-06-27
Land O Lakes, FL | Another Perspective Didn't these associations send people to congress to testify about piracy? I seem to remember they did. If they cited their figures from this study then wouldn't that constitute perjury? | |
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| KrKHeavy Artillery For The Little GuyPremium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| Re: Another Perspective Apparently it's not perjury if they are merely "Mistaken" about the truth ("Oooops! Our bad!") vs intentionally lying about the truth. In fact they did lie, but claim it was all just an innocent mistake. Kinda like the Saddam/Nuclear Weapons deal...
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) | |
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1 edit | Application Jason Levine
We are sorry Mr. Levine, but your application for the position of Statistician at the **AA has been declined. You failed to sprinkle the proper amount of fairy dust on the employment test. Your addiction to reality, is frankly, troublesome. You should get help before seeking employment with a bunch of misguided, self-serving, bullies in the future. Good luck.
B.S. Leach
SubHuman Resources
**AA
Edit: sorry swhx7, just couldn't make a good letter out of that name. | |
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Asmodeus
join:2004-05-26
Spring Valley, CA | what is more important... is considering that if the MPAA screwed this little bit of statistical meandering up, then what is to say that a review of whether or not some of their lawsuits or legal actions are also or should come into question. | |
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 TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY | You don't suppose the reason for the loss....., is from the Turds they are turning out for movies?
No wait I understand They think if the movies are turds no body will pirate them......smart
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Eat pork chops for Allah! | |
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|  dadkinsCan you do Blu?Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
kudos:18 | Re: You don't suppose the reason for the loss....., Yeah, that aint got nothin to do with it.
Bombing at the box office(if they don't just go straight to DVD) and there is no one wanting to buy the POS... the hell you say!
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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 RankDT
join:2000-11-08
Minden, LA | Who Cares? Do any of you people actually go to the movies or buy DVD's? If the whole industry failed I'd never miss them, | |
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