  kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
1 edit | WHat's new here? Halliburton did it, others did it and the Administration was smiling and paid the bill. It's cronism at its best, nothing new, just a higher level, that's all. Now these crooks have a safe money flow from the budget, they switched to the next target group: the servicemen. | |
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 |   dvd536 as Mr. Pink as they come Premium join:2001-04-27 Phoenix, AZ | Re: WHat's new here? We're above the law. "We're the telephone company". | |
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 |  |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY | Re: WHat's new here? And on top of that, we have our friends in right places. | |
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 |  |   kapil The Kapil
join:2000-04-26 Chicago, IL
| I don't think it's the fact that they are the phone company...I think it's because they are a phone company in the U.S. where unchecked capitalism has grown into unending greed. Nothing is done for the good of society, country, man...it's all about profits for the stakeholders. You reap what you sow....and we've been sowing these seeds for a LONG while. | |
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 |  |  |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| Re: WHat's new here? I agree.
How about this?
1. AT&T lowers the price from this outrageous ripoff level to normal level - ie reseller price - and 2. makes a deal with Pentagon, perhaps serving this for a flat fee, so 3. soldiers can use the service for free. | |
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 |   53059959 Temp banned from BBR more then anyone
join:2002-10-02 PwnZone | I double hate halliburton. they have their own IP block! only 1337 companies get to have that. | |
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 |  |   kapil The Kapil
join:2000-04-26 Chicago, IL | Re: WHat's new here? Lots of companies have their own "IP block" ...just depends on how big. | |
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 |   BIGMIKE Premium join:2002-06-07 Westminster, CA | Support the troops IMPEACH BUSH. | |
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 |  |  voyager6868
join:2003-01-29 Lynnwood, WA | Re: WHat's new here? Funny how all you Americans voted for Bush and now you're FINALLY realizing your mistake. The rest of the world knew this a long, long time ago. | |
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 |  |  |   LinuxJunkie
join:2005-01-19 Cyberspace | Re: WHat's new here? Yeah, no other country in the history of the world has ever regretted voting a particular person into office. I mean, just ask the Germans. (that was sarcasm in case you couldn't pick up on it) | |
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 |  |  |  hottboiinnc ME
join:2003-10-15 Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| not all Americans voted for bush...it was just the stupid ones that did. IE- Ohioans that were promised everything but the damn White House moving here--and we still haven't seen anything we were promised--AGAIN!
DOWN WITH BUSH IN WITH HILLARY! | |
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 |  |  |  ackman
join:2000-10-04 Acworth, GA | I voted for the other guy...I'm not sure how this idiot won a second term. | |
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 |   natter
join:2000-12-18 Littleton, CO | but...hillary can fix it! | |
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  gatorkram Spelling and Grammer impared Premium join:2002-07-22 Winterville, NC clubs: | Sad You'd think something like this would be donated to the troops, and used as a really nice tax write off, and good PR. Oh well. -- Give me bandwidth or give me death! | |
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  Kamaz
join:2006-01-26 Elizabethtown, PA | Fuzzy Feeling It gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside knowing AT&T really supports our troops. They really know how to treat our soldiers after they sacrifice their blood and lives. God bless AT&T and the USA! | |
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 |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| Re: Fuzzy Feeling said by Kamaz :It gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside knowing AT&T really supports our troops. They really know how to treat our soldiers after they sacrifice their blood and lives for the steady income of oil companies. God bless AT&T, the oil industry, Halliburton and the USA! Fixed for you.  | |
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 |  |   AnonymousPerson
@optonline.net
| Re: Fuzzy Feeling "It gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling inside knowing AT&T really supports our troops. They really know how to treat our soldiers after they sacrifice their blood and lives. God bless AT&T!"
Now it is fixed.  | |
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  ropeguru Premium join:2001-01-25 Bridgeport, WV clubs:
·VOIPo
| All that will happen... Is that the Feds will re-nogotiate and AT&T will drop the price for them with the stipulation that they allow the AT&T/Bellsouth merger go through. Once that goes through they will jsut raise all the LD rates for the general consumer to cover the losses from the federal deal. -- FWD#: 223611 | |
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  kapil The Kapil
join:2000-04-26 Chicago, IL | Poor ATT ...they can't seem to help but stuff their feet in their mouth.
Does this company, either pre or post merger, EVER get any good press? You'd think they'd do a few good deeds by accident. | |
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  cdru Go Colts Premium,MVM join:2003-05-14 Fort Wayne, IN
| $.21 a minute? Honestly, for what they are getting I think that sounds fairly cheap. Yeah it's not $.025 a minute that you might get with the latest ultra-cheap VoIP. But how much is an international call from here to Iraq?
Domestic Long Distance with AT&T could be $.10/minute. I think that the fact that the soldiers are in the middle of a desert, fighting a war, and don't exactly have the same telcom infrastructure makes things a little different.
Yeah it would be nice for them to donate the calls home. But they are a business, not a charity. The blocking of competing providers though is a little wrong. -- "What gives them the right to come in and do this?" she said. - Lady complaining that she was getting FIOS in her backyard. | |
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 |   marigolds Gainfully employed, finally Premium,MVM join:2002-05-13 Saint Louis, MO
1 edit | Re: $.21 a minute? The article points out that the wholesale rate is $0.01 per minute for international calls from Iraq to here. The soldiers have to use payphones in the PBXs which are calling card blocked; so AT&T gets to charge them the long-distance pay phone rate and they can only use AT&T phone cards on the phones. | |
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 |  |  |  shashinka
join:2000-09-16 West Boylston, MA
| Re: $.21 a minute? The PX and BXs (post and base exchanges) work under AAFES (Army Air Force Exchange Service) and under the Marines/Navy there is MWR (Morale Welfare Recreation). Companies have to get contracts to provide services thru them. When I was in Japan on base there was Burger King, Popeyes Chicken, AT&T and some others. I worked for an independent ISP that was competing against AT&T. We provided better service at cheaper prices! Unfortunately they kicked us off base because of this exclusive contract. Then the on-base people would have to pay a per minute charge to call off base (on base wasn't metered, it was unlimited local ). This was an unfair advantage of course. The problem is that these companies want these exclusive rights because if they're going to pay to start operations they need to be guaranteed they will profit, otherwise they probably wouldn't come. Its unfortunate. Luckily we could use all sorts of calling cards, call back services. Another thing is off-base they had DSL and Cable but on base they didn't again because of contracts. Not sure if its changed. The cable company only had TV and the phone lines could not by military rule be used for DSL at that time. A lot of red tape but this isn't a country its a premise of the U.S. Govt. too many laws. | |
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 |  |  |  King75 King Of All And Nothing Premium join:2004-07-31 Stevensville, MD clubs:
| Maybe they should be able to charge whatever they want if one they weren't the only provider, two they didn't block calling cards, and three there wasn't a war going on. I will never buy anything AT&T again. Riping off people is what American companies do best but they are awarded a government contract for our uniformed men and women overseas they had better do it for a FAIR price. I know many people in the army and they refuse to ask for a dime from anyone, but it just kills me when they are being ripped off and these people are making millions. Goodbye AT&T you join the ranks of the American Red Cross in organizations that have treated our American hero's like shit. I hope you can sleep at night, but just remember it is a luxury provided by the United States Military. | |
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 |   marigolds Gainfully employed, finally Premium,MVM join:2002-05-13 Saint Louis, MO
| It sounds like AT&T has exclusive control over that, not the PBX's. So it is AT&T's decision on whether or not calling cards and toll free access is blocked. I think that is the crux of the issue, AT&T has created an environment in which they can gouge. -- ISCABBS - the oldest and largest BBS on the Internet telnet://whip.isca.uiowa.edu Professional Geographer Geographic Information Science researcher | |
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 |  |   G_Poobah
join:2004-01-17 Schenectady, NY
| Re: $.21 a minute? "AT&T has created an environment in which they can gouge."
This is perfect proof of why net neutrality is required. AT&T has every intention of gouging the users in the US for using the internet. All the corporate apologists wanted proof that AT&T would screw the consumer, this is proof right here. AT&T gouges because that's what MEGACORPS DO. It's what their nature is. It's capitalistic greed in all it's glory. The only cure is democracy, which AT&T is actively working to subvert through lobbyist and other fascist maneuverings. -- Flabby? pastey-skinned? riddled with phlebitis? Then you've got a good Republican body! So compare your lives to mine, and then kill yourself. | |
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 |  dweeb
join:2002-06-23 Ferndale, MI
| .21 a minute is actually pretty damn good to call half way around the world. If you go to ATT website, its .79 per minute to call Iraq from the US. Plus nobody has said anything about the equipment ATT has invested to bring phone service to the troops. They aren't the salvation army. | |
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 |  |   wcweaver Premium join:2002-02-22 Fort Myers, FL clubs: | Re: $.21 a minute? Do you work for AT&T? | |
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 |  |  King75 King Of All And Nothing Premium join:2004-07-31 Stevensville, MD clubs:
| There is a big difference between calling Iraq from the US and calling the US from Iraq from a military base. I don't give a damn about what they have invested because they are just going to use that equipment to offer service to the Iraqi public at an even more gouged price. They really know how to screw the military and the public. | |
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 |  |  |  ackman
join:2000-10-04 Acworth, GA
| Re: $.21 a minute? said by King75 :There is a big difference between calling Iraq from the US and calling the US from Iraq from a military base. I don't give a damn about what they have invested because they are just going to use that equipment to offer service to the Iraqi public at an even more gouged price. They really know how to screw the military and the public. By my witness, I think G.W. Bush and friends are the ones who REALLY know how to screw the military and the public. | |
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 |   mdlthomas
join:2000-04-24 Clarksville, TN | well put. Those on the "I hate RBOC's" bandwgon might not like it . of course..it is easy to hate 'The Man' when you are living in your mammas basement.  -- mdlt | |
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 |  |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| Re: $.21 a minute? said by mdlthomas :well put. Those on the "I hate RBOC's" bandwgon might not like it . of course..it is easy to hate 'The Man' when you are living in your mammas basement. Or perhaps it's just you who need to travel outside of Nashville a little bit? BBR has far less kiddie posters than other sites and I have yet to see your comments on posts from people with relatives serving in Iraq. | |
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 |  |  |   mdlthomas
join:2000-04-24 Clarksville, TN
| Re: $.21 a minute? Actually, I am quite well traveled. As the son of an Airline pilot, I have probably seen places you have only read about in books. Now we all know that NYC is the center of the universe...just ask any new yorker! But us 'simple' folks do actually get out once and a while. 
As to your 'Family In Iraq' crack, another poor assumption. I have one of the largest 'familes' of Iraq vets next to my house..they are called the 101st, stationed in Clarksville TN. I am all too aware of what is happening from REAL people over there...not just getting Spin reports from Fox News or my Jr. Senator from New York.
But that really isn't the point here, it is the fact that a lot of people on this forum are a bunch of crybabies when it comes to an RBOC. Like they have been personally wronged, and have some childish vendetta against 'The Man'. Why don't you try focusing your anger against the government, and the jackass elected officials.
The fact of the matter is- phone calls overseas cost money, and .21/min is a good deal. If they CHOOSE to use Skype, Yahoo Voice, etc, they can. But there is nothing more unpatriotic then demanding that a company who built an infastructure to provide services to our troops be open to all the freeloaders..you included. -- mdlt | |
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  Catwoman Premium join:2003-06-11 Normal, IL
2 edits | My son is in Iraq At Christmas I sent him a ATT calling card with 700 minutes on it, costing I think around 50 dollars. Well come to find out that it's not 700 minutes, it was really only about 75 minutes. (I can't remember the exact time but it was not very long)
He spends most of his extra money on calling cards. Also over there an ATM charge is 8 dollars.
The military does offer what they call "morale calls" for free, but you have to wait in line for a long time and they don't give you very much time. It's better than nothing.
Thank God for the internet though, because we can talk on Yahoo for free. I was really impressed with that. I can view his webcam and see him also.
When he is on missions though he cannot use internet and military phones so he uses the calling card. He usually tries to call me every night so I am not worried about him, so it ends up costing quite a bit of money. | |
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 |  King75 King Of All And Nothing Premium join:2004-07-31 Stevensville, MD clubs:
| My cousin and her husband are both in Iraq right now so I know a little of what you are going through and I just have this to say.
Thank him for his selfless service to his country from all of us at DSL Reports and that I personally thank god everyday a man or woman puts on that uniform. Your son is exactly what this country needs. And to quote from the television show "The West Wing." America doesn't need martyrs they need hero's. "A hero would gladly die for their country but would much rather live for it." Your son is that hero. | |
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 |  |   Catwoman Premium join:2003-06-11 Normal, IL | Re: My son is in Iraq Thank You King, you touched my heart. I will be praying for your family. | |
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  pnh102 Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty Premium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD | Saddam Loves AT&T All the Anti-War people should support AT&T here because they are making it harder for the troops to do their jobs. -- Rove / Rumsfeld 2008! | |
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 |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
1 edit | Re: Saddam Loves AT&T said by pnh102 :All the Anti-War people should support AT&T here because they are making it harder for the troops to do their jobs. All GOP-lickers should praise ATT because they are the absolute capitalistic dream company: they even rape our own soldiers in the combat zone! WOW! And also our GOP-led administration is more than happily assisting them! | |
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 |  |  alalper Premium join:2000-08-20 Philadelphia, PA
1 edit | Re: Saddam Loves AT&T said by kamm :All GOP-lickers should praise ATT because they are the absolute capitalistic dream company: they even rape our own soldiers in the combat zone! WOW! And also our GOP-led administration is more than happily assisting them! You sir must be a total a$$, since your comment is totally assinine. | |
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 |  |  |  |
 |  |  |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| Re: Saddam Loves AT&T said by alalper :said by kamm :All GOP-lickers should praise ATT because they are the absolute capitalistic dream company: they even rape our own soldiers in the combat zone! WOW! And also our GOP-led administration is more than happily assisting them! You sir must be a total a$$, since your comment is totally assinine. Just like the original poster's - 'cause mine was simply paraphrasing his iditotic comment.
Oh and mine is also jut as asinine (notaa bene it's one 's') as our current adminitration and its bloodthirsty members. | |
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 |  wev567
join:2006-02-25 Pittsburgh, PA
| said by pnh102 :All the Anti-War people should support AT&T here because they are making it harder for the troops to do their jobs. So the AT&T, a mega-national conglomerate, is one of the "Anti-War people"? Go tell that to their Republican board of directors. This "war" is just an excuse to make themand their cronies rich thru no-bid contracts. Remember KBR? Want to make things easy for the troops? How about body armour? Or just bring them home. Their "job" was to free Iraq from terrorists and find WMDs, or so we were told. It seems they are dying in the middle of someone else's civil war, and we don't even get cheap oil out of it.
ITMFA | |
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  viperpa33s Why Me? Premium join:2002-12-20 Bradenton, FL
·Bright House
| Shame on at&t No one is asking for at&t to donate time and money but they can sell the services at cost or maybe 1 or 2 cents above cost. Also it be good PR for at&t and the right thing to do. Our troops already have a hard enough time being away from home and family. Charging 21 cents for call when it only costs them a penny, blocking other calls or charging excess fees is really sticking it to the troops who put there life on the line.
We'll here from at&t that doing this is good for the consumer. | |
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 |   willawake Premium join:2004-05-01 greece
| Re: Shame on at&t its shocking. what else could improve a soldier's morale than calls back to his gf, family, friends. it should be cheap and convenient. -- »www.yachtmati.com Megayacht Photos. »www.badcaps.net/forum - Badcaps Motherboard Repair Forums | |
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  Transmaster Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20 Cheyenne, WY
·Qwest.net
| I am Hating of you gee whiz I communicate all of the time with friends in that part of the world using Messenger and Skype, it is routine communications. But I suppose it is easier to blame it on Bush and Bellybutton, (the spell check changed Heliburton to bellybutton so I just left it that way:) )et al. -- Low voltage Tech's are wimps, Real tech's use 45 pound filament transformers, plate voltages no less then 2400 volts with at least 10 amp's lighting 8877 triodes...BPL I'm coming to get you. | |
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  lonnyb lurking no longer Premium join:2004-01-25 Elizabethtown, KY clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Skypeout rate To call an ordinary phone in Iraq costs about 35 cents a minute using Skype. »www.skype.com/products/skypeout/···tes.html To countries with well established infrastructure like Western Europe the rate is about 2 cents per minute but not to places like Iraq. | |
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 |  CplEstesUSMC
join:2005-02-16 Douglasville, GA
·AT&T Southeast
| Re: Skypeout rate yes but from Iraq to the US is 2.3 cents/minute. I know becuase I just wrapped up my second tour. We just brought our laptops with us and when we could, hooked them up to an internet cafe. Bought some weird headsets from the Iraqs and used Skype. Skype is the S*** AT&T does blow and I honestly thank you for your support. | |
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 |  |   lonnyb lurking no longer Premium join:2004-01-25 Elizabethtown, KY clubs: | Re: Skypeout rate Wow, 2.3 cents a minute FROM Iraq is pretty good!! (By-the-way, I am praying for our troops!!!!!) | |
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  richardpor Fur it up
join:2003-04-19 Portland, OR
| Oh Please 21 cents a minute is not bad especially calling from half way around the world. As for blocking competing calling card 800 numbers, why not. I think it is reasonable especially if 800 numbers is in the states and the competing number either dose not pay ATT for the network or do not accept call outside the US. For all intensive purpose it may be the completion that is blocking the calls. Most third party card companies are small operations.
I guess it kind of gland one has so much time to make phone calls. I say this sarcastically. I was in the Navy forward deployed out of Yokosuka Japan from 1984 to 1988. I was out 45 days at a time. I was lucky to make two phone calls a year and it cost me more than .21 a minute. We wrote letters to keep in touch. You remember letters. My father was in Viet Nam. He made only one call during his whole deployment.  | |
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 |  See 8 replies to this post |
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  Tomek Premium join:2002-01-30 Brooklyn, NY
·Packet8
| Iraq I've been in Iraq and Kuwait. So far only AT&T offers "phone centers" which simply are satellite connected phones to the states. Phone cards are really overpriced. By using this system, I pay more to US from Iraq, than from US to Poland. The best alternative is using DSN phones, which allow free connection to military base anywhere in the world. From there you just request a transfer/switch to a local or 800 number (for phone cards). The problem is that DSN phones are often hard to find or unavailable. Quality is also not best, but still much better in terms of price than ATT.
I'm not sure about internet. The unsecured network I think is provided by Turkish provider, supervised by Navy. I think it depends on base and individual contract. But speeds weren't that bad. Even unclassified network run at least twice 56k speeds (during congestion) and up to 1.5. -- Semper Fi | |
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 |   Catwoman Premium join:2003-06-11 Normal, IL
| Re: Iraq That what I was talking about with the "morale call", they are free. I sometimes have and operator from a base in the US put it through and they say they have a morale call from Iraq. The quality sucks because the feedback is really bad. Also they time you on the phone so you can't talk long. I could be wrong about it being DSN maybe that's a different kind, but I know he told me that he tries to connect to a US base and call.
I was really surprised at the quality of the internet, yahoo is able to keep up really good.
I have to say I am really impressed with the military at least trying to help families so much. They have a group called the Family Readiness Group. They keep me up to date on everything going on. I get emails from his LT. every month too. I know things are much better for soldiers today than they have been, but I can tell you all that this experience has changed who I am. This has to be one of the hardest experiences of my life.
I am so proud of my son and every soldier in the military, I would do anything I could to help any one of them. | |
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  FiL Premium join:2005-08-16 Silver Spring, MD
| a shame a damn shame, u can dodge bullets and mortars, but when it comes to calling home, your fubar...
ATT, the G-Dubya's....ughhhhhm... Devil's Apprentice...
hey Richard, bet you never tried calling your house after shrapnel took off both your ears only to have the call disco. cuz you used a competitors callin card!
Gotcha!!! | |
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 |   pnh102 Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty Premium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| Re: a shame said by FiL :a damn shame, u can dodge bullets and mortars, but when it comes to calling home, your fubar... I guess having to put up with AT&T's anti-American behavior is easier than putting up with people calling our troops baby-killers, accusing them of mass rapes, massacres and the "razing of villages in a fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan?" -- Rove / Rumsfeld 2008! | |
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  cousintim
join:2004-10-10 Dallas, TX | Something in the Middle? One or 2 cents/minute seems low and 21 cents/min seems high. For comparison, an AT&T call from the U.K back to U.S is 17.5 cents/minute using a Sam's Club AT&T prepaid card. Maybe 10 to 15 cents/minute would be reasonable as an Iraq military rate. | |
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  ylen131
join:2000-02-09 Canoga Park, CA
| welcome to business at&t is responsible only to person and that's its shareholders. They are in business to make money period. charging .21 a minute is cheap. They easily can charge over $1.00 and if troops have a problem with them then they can petition us gov to pay for the phone calls or they can just skip calling international | |
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  commodog Premium join:2000-02-03 Oxnard, CA
1 edit | AT&T Beat forces into Bosnia way back when.. AT&T Contractors with portable Sat trailers had set up pay phone booths in Bosnia before we got there so troops could call home. While back then it was $1.25 to $1.50 a minute, it's worth it to be able to call your family after seeing some of the stuff we saw.
There is a contract in place to provide this service as soon as orders are finalized to send in the troops. | |
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 mmoon
join:2005-12-03 Marietta, GA | You think this is bad? Wait until AT&T finishes it's reconstruction. It will be worse than before deregulation. They will try for internet control also. Wait for it...wait...hold on... | |
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 |  HawkI911
join:2002-04-08 San Antonio, TX | Re: You think this is bad? I think walmart oughta throw their hat in the ring just to be a thorn in the side of AT&T. | |
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 pantrw
join:2006-01-22 Mexico
| Shouldn´t be there in the first place i truly don´t understand why the hell your sons, parents, friends, etc... are risking their lives out there, WHAT´S THE GREATER GOOD?? if it´s all about oil (and not anti terrorism, as it was supposed to be) then WTF are they doing there, don´t get me wrong, i respect them greatly, i just dont get the fact that they´re out there fighting someone else´s civil war (supposedly), AND getting abused by a Freakin´ phone company (not to mention all the other BASIC services they have to pay for), to me, it´s not logicall
P.S: F#%K those people, why do big companies have to be such GREEDY bastards -- Life is too beautiful to waste it by being stupid | |
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 |   kamm
join:2001-02-14 Brooklyn, NY | Re: Shouldn´t be there in the first place Pretty much these are the questions most of them ask inside everyday... | |
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 |  |   SND2005 Premium join:2001-09-15 Im Over Here
·CWLab
| Re: Shouldn´t be there in the first place Why? Because "they" choose to do so! Becasue there are some in the United States who can see beyond their own backyard and want to help others. Some people actually like to help those who cannot help themselves.
The milatary oath for people who have not seen it.... I, _________, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God. -- It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it. | |
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 |  |  |  pantrw
join:2006-01-22 Mexico
| Re: Shouldn´t be there in the first place ************************ I, _________, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God. ****************** NOTE: SO HELP ME GOD ALSO NOTE: the Constitution of the United States so what, you´re gonna tell me that they must die and risk their lives to make oil cheaper for you? I bet GOD does not want people killing each other about some materialist interest, also, what effect do other people´s thoughts HAVE AGAINST THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION, take Mexico´s example, we dont go fight wars just to make the dollar heavier, on the other hand, if another country needs our help, we provide, OH, and a little hint there, next time you want to quote any document, or person, etc... at least take the time to understand qhat you´re quoting -- Life is too beautiful to waste it by being stupid | |
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 |  |  |  |   Jigsaw Stardust We Are Premium join:2000-10-21 Cleveland, OH
·Cox HSI
| Re: Shouldn´t be there in the first place The New God Of our Country. | |
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