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 JRKyWoops join:2002-04-13 Colorado Springs, CO 1 edit | Two options Well you always announce bad news on Friday. I suspect recall (which there are rumors a silent recall already began) or free bumpers (which shouldn't require a freakin press conference). -- Josh "JRKy" Kennedy
"Irish I had another drink" | |
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 |  ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT kudos:4 Reviews:
·VOIPo
| Re: Two options said by JRKy:Well you always announce bad news on Friday. I suspect recall (which there are rumors a silent recall already began) or free bumpers (which shouldn't require a freakin press conference). I doubt a recall, but the free bumpers I think will be the solution. And when does Apple ever NOT do anything with an "event"? -- "So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org | |
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 |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
| Re: Two options Apple doesn't want the image of its masterpiece phone to be a phone that can't exist outside of a shell for fear of not working like a phone.
Apparently there's a coating they could put on the antenna band around the phone which would stop the issues people are having with the signal drop. If this can be applied to phones easily, then a recall could be viable. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 |  |  |  | | Re: Two options I say whatever. My iPhone 4 works just fine. Worked fine without the bumper and works fine with the bumper... -- .:|:. Go Wheatley or Go Home! | |
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 |  |  AlcoholPremium join:2003-05-26 Climax, MI kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| said by ptrowski:said by JRKy:Well you always announce bad news on Friday. I suspect recall (which there are rumors a silent recall already began) or free bumpers (which shouldn't require a freakin press conference). I doubt a recall, but the free bumpers I think will be the solution. And when does Apple ever NOT do anything with an "event"? They won't give away free bumpers because they haven't admitted the problem yet.
I hope they finally admit the antenna issue is a flaw in their design. That's all most people want. -- I found the key to success but somebody changed the lock. | |
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 |  |  |  Morac join:2001-08-30 Riverside, NJ kudos:1 Reviews:
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: Two options said by Alcohol:I hope they finally admit the antenna issue is a flaw in their design. That's all most people want. If Apple admits a design flaw without making amends then they basically will have to cede all the pending class action law suits against them. They won't do that. My guess is that they'll hand out free bumpers which likely only cost about 50 cents to make.
They'll take maybe a million dollars loss, plus the millions more that they'll "lose" from the $29 markup on the bumpers, but the alternative for Apple is a lot worse.
--
The Comcast Disney Avatar has been retired. | |
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 RobIn Deo speramus, God Bless the USAPremium join:2001-08-25 Kendall, FL kudos:2 | I feel bad for the engineer.. I feel bad for the engineer who designed the new iPhone. I can only imagine that prior to the launch of the iPhone 4, this engineer was receiving kudos and even talks about promotions and bonuses.
Now, I'd be surprised if they even allowed him into the building  -- CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us | |
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 |  | | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. It's not just the engineer . . . the entire engineering staff who worked on the RF, plus the testing crew who was supposed to certify the unit worked as a whole.
That's the biggest SNAFU, IMO . . . how did it ever make it past the pre-manufacturing testing phase? | |
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 |  |  | | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. Don't forget the people that made the testers keep the phones in 3gs lookalike cases! | |
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 |  |  |  | | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. Think. Apple's packaging clearly states : Designed in California. More time surfing and biking than engineering...
Look! It's 2pm, let's...go...surfin! | |
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 |  |  |  |  vpokoPremium join:2003-07-03 Boston, MA | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. Funny coming from a guy who's posting on a messageboard in the middle of the workday. | |
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 |  | | I feel more sorry for the morons in the QA department that should have caught this before it was even released into mass production.
Sure the engineer is somewhat at fault, but the people that tested it and gave it's approval to move forward are the ones truly at fault here. | |
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 |  |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. I don't feel sorry for any of them.
Anyone with remotely ANY RF experience knows touching an antenna changes it's electrical properties and effects performance.
The people in QA should have tested the unit in the case it would be released in. ESPECIALLY since the antenna and case design had changed.
The problem here lies within the culture of the organization. Apple's continued success and meteoric rise to tech stardom has brought about the same hubris that brought us Windows ME.
If Apple (meaning Steve) is smart, they will replace each phone (they won't). Afterwards, a company wide "stand down" would be in order to review everything and anything either on the drawing board or in production.
If they screwed something this simple up, no doubt other products in the pipeline have issues.
Apple's most valuable asset is their brand. They've all ready done considerable damage with this debacle. They need to make the uber effort to fix it NOW. -- Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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 |  |  |  | | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. said by N3OGH:I don't feel sorry for any of them. Anyone with remotely ANY RF experience knows touching an antenna changes it's electrical properties and effects performance. The people in QA should have tested the unit in the case it would be released in. ESPECIALLY since the antenna and case design had changed. The problem here lies within the culture of the organization. Apple's continued success and meteoric rise to tech stardom has brought about the same hubris that brought us Windows ME. If Apple (meaning Steve) is smart, they will replace each phone (they won't). Afterwards, a company wide "stand down" would be in order to review everything and anything either on the drawing board or in production. If they screwed something this simple up, no doubt other products in the pipeline have issues. Apple's most valuable asset is their brand. They've all ready done considerable damage with this debacle. They need to make the uber effort to fix it NOW. They damaged it from Day 1 when they first released the iPhone without the most basic of features like copy/paste, multitasking and calling their own user base criminals. Yet the mindless slaves customers keep purchasing their stuff. | |
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 |  |  |  |  | | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. said by k1ll3rdr4g0n:said by N3OGH:I don't feel sorry for any of them. Anyone with remotely ANY RF experience knows touching an antenna changes it's electrical properties and effects performance. The people in QA should have tested the unit in the case it would be released in. ESPECIALLY since the antenna and case design had changed. The problem here lies within the culture of the organization. Apple's continued success and meteoric rise to tech stardom has brought about the same hubris that brought us Windows ME. If Apple (meaning Steve) is smart, they will replace each phone (they won't). Afterwards, a company wide "stand down" would be in order to review everything and anything either on the drawing board or in production. If they screwed something this simple up, no doubt other products in the pipeline have issues. Apple's most valuable asset is their brand. They've all ready done considerable damage with this debacle. They need to make the uber effort to fix it NOW. They damaged it from Day 1 when they first released the iPhone without the most basic of features like copy/paste, multitasking and calling their own user base criminals. Yet the mindless slaves customers keep purchasing their stuff. I have a Motorola Droid that supposedly has had "copy and paste" since day 1, but it isn't OS-wide. I can't copy text from an e-mail message within the GMail app, for example. Yet no one seems to criticize Google for their horrible implementation.
Apple may have less features in their products, but what is there is implemented *very* well. -- Toyota - Moving Forward, even when you really want to stop. | |
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 |  |  | | said by Skippy25:I feel more sorry for the morons in the QA department that should have caught this before it was even released into mass production. Sure the engineer is somewhat at fault, but the people that tested it and gave it's approval to move forward are the ones truly at fault here. I suspect the QA or other testers probably found the issue and there was an executive decision to push forward.
Sometimes politics/markerting overrides technical decisions. | |
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 |  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | said by Skippy25:I feel more sorry for the morons in the QA department that should have caught this before it was even released into mass production. Sure the engineer is somewhat at fault, but the people that tested it and gave it's approval to move forward are the ones truly at fault here. In all fairness to the testers, they may very well have raised the issue during testing. But were then overridden by Steve Jobs and his arrogance towards Apple customers with his attitude of "just hold it differently". Jobs & the Marketing Dept with their different concerns may just have pushed aside findings by the testers. -- Are you happy with your rep in Washington, DC? | |
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 |  morboComplete Your Transaction join:2002-01-22 00000 | I'm certain it's more complicated that just "the engineer". Hopefully someone leaks emails or documents similar to the O ring concerns NASA had back before Challenger. | |
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 |  |  banditws6Shrinking Time and DistancePremium join:2001-08-18 Frisco, TX Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. said by morbo:I'm certain it's more complicated that just "the engineer". Hopefully someone leaks emails or documents similar to the O ring concerns NASA had back before Challenger. Some information is starting to come out now, although it is unverified at present.
Bloomberg: Apple Engineer Told Jobs IPhone Antenna Might Cut Calls »www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-1···law.html -- "I'll follow the law until it's just stupid." -Ted Nugent | |
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 |  |  |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | Quoted from the article.
"A carrier partner also raised concerns about the antenna before the devices June 24 release, according to another person familiar with the situation."
I'm gonna venture a guess that was AT&T.
Even if not. If both the RF engineers and the service provider (whom I'm guessing knows a little something about cell phone antennas ) tells you there's going to be issues, you're probably going to have issues.
Nope, just make it lickable and the masses will buy it.
This is what happens when function takes a back seat to form... -- Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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 |  |  |  |  jtudorXm 60's On 6 FreakPremium,MVM join:2002-12-07 Morganton, NC | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. Design by Committee!
That always works so well! | |
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 |  ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT kudos:4 Reviews:
·VOIPo
| said by Rob:I feel bad for the engineer who designed the new iPhone. I can only imagine that prior to the launch of the iPhone 4, this engineer was receiving kudos and even talks about promotions and bonuses. Now, I'd be surprised if they even allowed him into the building That's why on their site they have 3 Antenna Engineers jobs open.  -- "So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org | |
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 |  | | There will have been a ton of pressure from higher up to meet deadlines, budgetary restrictions, etc.
I'll bet those people were forced moreso to bow to those pressures than just poor design/QA. | |
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 |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
| I believe the last time an Apple iPhone engineer received kudos, he was drunk at a German bar in Southern California and subsequently lost his iPhone 4.
If only Apple hadn't required their engineers to use cases to hide the phone prototypes from the public, they would probably have noticed this defect. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 |  |  ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT kudos:4 Reviews:
·VOIPo
| Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. said by tiger72:If only Apple hadn't required their engineers to use cases to hide the phone prototypes from the public, they would probably have noticed this defect. Very good point! -- "So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org | |
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 |  |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 1 edit | But hiding the new product was of utmost importance to them.
Look at all the effort that went into the lawsuit surrounding the loss of the prototype. The search warrant, investigation, etc.
It was more important to keep the product secret so as to enhance the WOW! factor than to make a good product.
No doubt Apple has made some revolutionary products over the years, and they will most likely continue to do so for years to come. And while this issue with the iPhone 4 in the grand scheme of things is rather small potatoes, it is indicative of organizational deficiencies at the company.
When the leadership is more interested in making it pretty, and pushing it out the door fast, the result is this sort of error.
Kind of reminds me of the Apple ///. A product rushed through development, into production, and on to desks. Ultimately into failure..
As Steve Wozniack said "the primary reason for the Apple III's failure was that the system was designed by Apple's marketing department".
Someone posted earlier about engineering decisions being vetoed at the executive level. I think that's exactly what happened here.
Guess even Steve Jobs lays an egg every now and again.... -- Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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 |  |  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. said by N3OGH:Guess even Steve Jobs lays an egg every now and again.... Jobs is a monomaniacal control freak. As they say in the "Monk" TV series, that can be both a blessing & a curse.
The blessing part is that he has the ability to energize an entire organization with his vision of what a product should be and single-mindedly drive them to deliver on his vision.
The curse part is that he runs right over ANYONE who stands in his way, even if that person has brought up legitimate concerns over the product he has envisioned.
Unfortunately for Apple in the long run, his refusal to listen to others is starting to sully Apple's reputation for quality. Apple has a rep for GREAT design, but is now getting a rep for lackluster engineering and quality control. -- Are you happy with your rep in Washington, DC? | |
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 |  |  |  |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | Re: I feel bad for the engineer.. Pretty much.
Do as I say.
Why?
Because I say so....
Sooner or later, it leads to failure.
The first rule of project mayhem Apple is do not ask questions. -- Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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 |  |  | | said by tiger72:I believe the last time an Apple iPhone engineer received kudos, he was drunk at a German bar in Southern California and subsequently lost his iPhone 4. You must mean Northern California... | |
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 |  KearnstdElf WizardPremium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | even if an Engineer stated there was a problem, the case and looks designer might have gotten the "Jobs Override Lever" pulled to keep the casing design as is. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 |  AlcoholPremium join:2003-05-26 Climax, MI kudos:3 Reviews:
·Comcast
| said by Rob:I feel bad for the engineer who designed the new iPhone. I can only imagine that prior to the launch of the iPhone 4, this engineer was receiving kudos and even talks about promotions and bonuses. Now, I'd be surprised if they even allowed him into the building The antenna engineer already told Apple that this might happen. They ignored him because they have to launch a new iphone every year and they couldn't delay the release. -- I found the key to success but somebody changed the lock. | |
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 |  KearnstdElf WizardPremium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | I am almost amazed the Engineer was not "Let go under creative differences" for disagreeing with Steve over the phone being released without changes. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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approval from: bionicRod 
| Hmmmm. Pie "...just really good and uses lots of convincing pie graphs." Apple pie charts. | |
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 | | Silent Recall? According to the Register (via Morning Links) Apple may be performing a silent recall...
»www.theregister.co.uk/2010/07/15···for_bad/
quote: Today's rumeur du jour concerning Apple's ongoing antennagate fiasco: Cupertino has secretly fixed the Jobsian handset's Death Grip defect, and is now quietly collecting the bad phones and replacing them with good ones.
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 |  bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Re: Silent Recall? Actually.. Gizmodo was the first to report (but it appears it may be related to proximity sensor too...) They have a live updated page for users to share experiences.. here:
»gizmodo.com/5587029/iphone-4-sil···true&s=i | |
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 1 edit | Iphone issues I don't think they will recall. It will most likely be more of Steve Jobs bad mouthing Apple customers with his belligerent attitude and horrific treatment. Of course Apple needed the week to come up with a good lie to cover up the issue with the phone. -- Certs: CCNA, GPEN, GCIH, GCFW, GSEC, GCIA, GCFA | |
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 Duramax08A Challenger AppearsPremium join:2008-08-03 San Antonio, TX | a confrence just to tell you how to hold the phone?  | |
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 |  | | Re: a confrence More like to sell existing customers the all new iAntenna. | |
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 |  |  Stumbles join:2002-12-17 Port Saint Lucie, FL | Re: a confrence More like to sell existing customers the all new iAntenna I-tenna.
That's better. | |
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 |  |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 | Re: a confrence Only $49.99!
Don't forget to purchase an ATT Microcell to go with it! | |
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 |  KearnstdElf WizardPremium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | dont forget the iDuct tape for the outer edges!
only 79.99 per roll. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 | | Preview of the friday press conference: Steve Jobs

Apple users
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 |  | | Re: Preview of the friday press conference: HA! If I had a million dollars for every time I said this exact same thing, AND POSTED that SAME VIDEO from 1984, I'd have at LEAST 20 million dollars...LOL!
Wow, that just made my day! 
Hopefully we will see Apple finally clean up it's act before its too late, and address some of the issues(including those NOT related to the i-devices) that are constantly posted on their own official forums(BEFORE THEY DELETE THEM).
I'd really like to see some real "quality" work come out of Apple for a change, even if it took ALL of the wind out of the i-devices HYPE. | |
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 |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | LOL.
I didn't know they had iPhones in 1984.
Funny post, and that's from a guy who's primary desktop is a Mac Mini.... -- Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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 newviewEx .. Ex .. ExactlyPremium join:2001-10-01 Parsonsburg, MD kudos:1 | Report Card This whole fiasco is a perfect example of the failure of form over function engineering.
Apple gets an "F". | |
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 cacoPremium join:2005-03-10 Whittier, AK | My guess in exact order 1-Announce how many Iphones4 they have sold up to date 2- Say majority of folks who have purchased the phone have absolutely no problem with antenna issue 3- Say a tiny fraction of users have reported problems with phone that we have confirmed to be accurate 4-Offer free bumpers to those that would like one and offer a 20.00 itunes gift card for inconvenience 5- Those who would like can return phone for full refund, the restocking fee will be waived and ATT will not charge an etf if you decide to cancel your cell service. 6- Line up to the left if you would like to kiss Job's ring -- Politicians and diapers have one thing in common. They should both be changed regularly, and for the same reason. | |
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 |  miniduPremium join:2002-09-28 Cheboygan, MI | Re: My guess in exact order said by caco:1-Announce how many Iphones4 they have sold up to date 2- Say majority of folks who have purchased the phone have absolutely no problem with antenna issue 3- Say a tiny fraction of users have reported problems with phone that we have confirmed to be accurate 4-Offer free bumpers to those that would like one and offer a 20.00 itunes gift card for inconvenience 5- Those who would like can return phone for full refund, the restocking fee will be waived and ATT will not charge an etf if you decide to cancel your cell service. 6- Line up to the left if you would like to kiss Job's ring 7- You can pick up your empty wallet at the door, thanks for the donation | |
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 | | Apple will not "appease" anoying customers Apple's internal memo specifically said not to "appease" the damn annoying customers by giving them bumpers for free.
I think the press conference will be a giant middle iFinger followed by an F-U statement from his holiness himself. | |
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 | | iPhone 4 I'm on my way to buy one now. (along with 1000s of other people) | |
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 tcopePremium join:2003-05-07 Sandy, UT kudos:1 1 edit | Apple Recall We already know that there will be a recall.
Apple calls it the iPhone 5... and it will cost customers $200.
Now to the funny part... Apply consumers _will_ buy it!
Edit: I don't see Apple being able to "fix" this with a bumper (free or otherwise). It makes them look even worse. You need to add some rubber to the outside of your $200 phone to fix a defect? Not that Apple consumers won't blindly buy Apple products (research shows they will... especially if it's a neon color) but media would have a field day with that. | |
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 Reviews:
·voip.ms
| Press conference Given how badly Jobs has been performing in the face of this fiasco it would really surprise me to see him actually doing the press conference.
To abuse an analogy, the sharks are in the water and they smell blood. Steve seems to think that thrashing about in the water while bleeding from a few tiny paper cuts is a smart idea. -psst- Steve, all you're doing is is making the sharks hungrier
The farther Steve Jobs stays away from the mike on Friday, the less likely he is to get a case of althele's lung 
NefCanuck | |
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 |  tcopePremium join:2003-05-07 Sandy, UT kudos:1 | Re: Press conference said by NefCanuck:Given how badly Jobs has been performing in the face of this fiasco it would really surprise me to see him actually doing the press conference. Because Jobs has always had a lack of self confidence? | |
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·voip.ms
| Re: Press conference said by tcope:said by NefCanuck:Given how badly Jobs has been performing in the face of this fiasco it would really surprise me to see him actually doing the press conference. Because Jobs has always had a lack of self confidence? I'm just looking at the way Jobs has reacted to this and it reminds me of the saying:
"Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt"
NefCanuck | |
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 |  |  |  tcopePremium join:2003-05-07 Sandy, UT kudos:1 | Re: Press conference said by NefCanuck:" Better to be silent and thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt" To late for that. He's already said there is no problem... then basically pointed the finger at AT&T's poor service. Neither of which were true and neither of which made any sense. He _would_ have been better off keeping his mouth shut... but it's _Steve Jobs_. | |
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 cacoPremium join:2005-03-10 Whittier, AK | Just gets worse. »www.boygeniusreport.com/2010/07/···-issues/
Man this is turning into a PR disaster. News conference tomorrow is going to be interesting to say the least. -- Politicians and diapers have one thing in common. They should both be changed regularly, and for the same reason. | |
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 MRCUR join:2007-03-09 Columbia, PA | My iOS 4.1 experience... FWIW, I've had great luck with iOS 4.1 on my iPhone 4. While I do think the new bars look pretty weird, they are much easier to see (which is what Apple was going for). I also find the bars to be more accurate overall. Where I used to get -90 dB signal and have five bars, I'm not getting a much more reasonable (IMO) three bars.
Here's what's interesting - Apple upgraded the baseband with 4.1, and I've been getting much improved signal (both raw and Apple graded) in many areas. Where I used to get around -90 dB in my room (iPhone sitting flat on a desk without being touched), I'm not getting around -75 dB. The only change is iOS 4.1... Can anyone else running 4.1 confirm this? | |
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 |  | | Re: My iOS 4.1 experience... Where did you get 4.1 from? iTunes is not providing it that I see. | |
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 2 edits | Discounted bumpers but not free... My guess is Apple will not give away anything. I think they will offer a discount. If they cost $30, Apple will sell them to you at a "one-time-only" price of $10. Just a guess. | |
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 | | Problem is solved HTC Evo+Sprint=Problem solved. | |
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 |  CheesePremium join:2003-10-26 Naples, FL kudos:1 | Re: Problem is solved said by nnaarrnn:HTC Evo+Sprint=Problem solved. The evo looks hot!  | |
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 vrettePremium join:2000-07-22 Lombard, IL | The guy I sold my used Apple Bumper on eBay... ...to for more than I paid for it (yes, people are paying over $29 just to get them NOW) is not going to be happy if the solution is free bumpers... as will anyone who already bought a bumper. Have fun sorting that out Apple. -- Chairman of the Bored... | |
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