 
jinjimbob
Troy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13 | No surprise here Another item to tax to death. | |
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aztecnology
O Rly?
Premium
join:2003-02-12
Murrieta, CA | Re: No surprise here Thank You CA, I'll file this right behind pre-paying for recycling for CRT's...
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.:|:. YES on the recall .:|:. | |
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Phoenix2088
join:2002-12-04
Strongsville, OH
clubs: | Davis?? Hmmmm, this sounds like Gov. Davis trying to get some money to help aid the state he has failed  . | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
 ·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
 ·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| Opening Pandora's box In my opinion, VOIP is just like any other kind of internet packets. It's really no different from say, sending a file via the net, etc. It's just used as a transport for voice communications that is set up to resemble telephone service for ease of use.
It should *not* be taxed. It should *not* be treated as "long distance" and charged more.
...but therein lies the rub. States and the Federal Government love the taxes and fees and social programs they tack onto telephone service. They are worried that everyone will switch to VOIP and dump POTS and they will lose their cash cow...
.... So, their answer is to treat VOIP the same as POTS and preserve their cash cow.
They aren't the same... but one thing is. TAXES.
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) | |
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CanOpener4
join:2003-06-23
Brooklyn, NY
| Re: Opening Pandora's box said by KrK  :
In my opinion, VOIP is just like any other kind of internet packets. It's really no different from say, sending a file via the net, etc. It's just used as a transport for voice communications that is set up to resemble telephone service for ease of use.
Exactly! Taxing VoIP appears to be very fightable in court, does it not? The question is, will they? | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| Re: Opening Pandora's box said by CanOpener4 :
Exactly! Taxing VoIP appears to be very fightable in court, does it not? The question is, will they?
I think it's a court battle for now, but once States/Congress passes a law(s) treating VOIP as a service like telephone service the battle will be lost.
This will really impact businesses who use VOIP over their IP networks to cut costs methinks.
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"Regulatory capitalism is when companies invest in lawyers, lobbyists, and politicians, instead of plant, people, and customer service." - former FCC Chairman William Kennard (A real FCC Chairman, unlike the current Corporate Spokesperson in the job!) | |
| | | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| said by CanOpener4 :
Exactly! Taxing VoIP appears to be very fightable in court, does it not? The question is, will they?
Trouble is, it may be easier for them to "roll over" and just pay the taxes; they still may be a better price than the telcos. And being taxed adds instant legitimacy to VOIP services. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: Opening Pandora's box said by Whistle Dixie:
Do they know about Skype? www.skype.com
yawn. loaded with spyware and requires the other party to have the program as well. not as elegant as real voip. is there a skypeLITE yet?
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You can never be too rich, too thin or have too much Bandwidth | |
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| True government Tax it...it is the american (government) way. Simply put, if it can be taxed, it will be taxed. And if it can't, they will just change the laws so it can.
Can anyone name one thing you buy or own that isn't taxed?
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AMD XP2500+ @2300mhz/ Asus A7N8X Deluxe rev 1.04/ 2x 512Mb Kingston HyperX PC3500/ WD 120Gb on serial/ Gainward GF4 4600/ Enermax 465P-VE/Custom water cooler | |
| | youngmoore
join:2001-03-16
Marietta, GA | Re: True government my ISP isn't taxing me.
ym | |
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oliphant5
Got Identity?
Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | Re: True government Your ISP isn't but the state certainly is. Take a look at the taxes you pay for the line your xDSL runs on. | |
| | | nodis
join:2001-12-20
San Jose, CA
| actually, your isp probably is taxing you. in my case, i have dsl from earthlink and they collect $1 or so every month for the universal service fund (USF). this just started.
on the same copper pair that my earthlink dsl runs on, i have phone service from sbc, which, in turn, collects the usual slew of taxes on PSTN plus another USF levy. whee.
if vonage or other voip carriers start to collect taxes for using voip phone service on the dsl link, i will, effectively, be paying taxes/usf levies THREE times for service over a single copper pair.
i really hope the fcc steps in and rationalizes this mess. states and localities have to raise money somehow, as does the usf, but i'd really like to pay the fees only once. someone needs to figure out what layer of service (POTS, DSL, or IP service like VoIP running on the DSL link) will be taxed. | |
| | | | youngmoore
join:2001-03-16
Marietta, GA | Re: True government yup I heard about that. Its not required so I have no idea why they started doing that. The only time you see taxes on BB for DSL is with ILEC's for some reason.
ym | |
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CanOpener4
join:2003-06-23
Brooklyn, NY | Food, but candy, soda and other junk foods are. | |
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oliphant5
Got Identity?
Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | Re: True government In some states...in some others (like I think Oklahoma) all food in taxed. | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK | Re: True government In Oklahoma, everything is taxed. There's no SALES taxes on newspapers and periodicals, however. | |
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Camelot One
Premium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Sarasota, FL
clubs:
| Re: True government I am taxed on both my ISP and newspapers. (unless purchased from a machine, though I don't understand that one) In fact, I am taxed on the phone line, the DSL circuit, and the ISP charge. Food is taxed as well, though at a lower rate than normal sales tax.
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AMD XP2500+ @2300mhz/ Asus A7N8X Deluxe rev 1.04/ 2x 512Mb Kingston HyperX PC3500/ WD 120Gb on serial/ Gainward GF4 4600/ Enermax 465P-VE/Custom water cooler | |
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oliphant5
Got Identity?
Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA | The greed of government is never satisfied. | |
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oliphant5
Got Identity?
Premium
join:2003-05-24
Corona, CA
| I'm shocked California state cubicle leeches looking to regulate and tax yet another business out of existence? Say it isn't so. These out of state companies like Vonage should just flip them the bird. What's next, regulating VPN? What other packets shall we tax today? How about email? Dumbass Davis cronies running Cali into bankruptcy...sending business fleeing.
This is just another bunch of greedy politicos smelling another wallet to raid.
Please...just 7 more days...can't you whoring Sacramento fcks just take one of your many taxpayer funded vacations?!?
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-- Munis Killed the Telco Star -- Powered by Barry McKockenner Racing in association with Jack Mikkokov Motorsports | |
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pianotech
Pianotech
Premium
join:2002-12-30
New Castle, PA | Chalk another one up... ...for the People's Republic of California. Maybe they can try and chase EVERY business out of the state.
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Independent Composer & Pianist. | |
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
·Qwest.net
| Re: Chalk another one up... To all businesses being run out of California, Please come to Wyoming. No state income tax good roads. our data networks are growing. New Business would help speed this along. The communities here would put on knee pads to get you here. You don't have to worry about Governors like Gray-out Davis, we have run these kinds of creeps out years ago. 
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I love Irish Terriers, Low Brass, and the electric blue glow of an 866 mercury vapor rectifier tube at night.
[text was edited by author 2003-09-30 17:21:43] | |
| | | | raye
Premium
join:2000-08-14
Orange, CA |  Arnold for governor
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Cheetah9
join:2001-01-07
Bethel Park, PA
| Re: Arnold for governor Sorta wish I was still in Orange so I could vote!
I think you all are going to send a CLEAR message to the "good'ole Boys" there in CA and around the country when Arnold wins! But, I bet they won't listen.
I'm all for the recall concept! Only thing I can't quite grab is why Davis got re-elected to begin with.
I like and respect both Arnold AND his wife. I think they will BOTH be good for CA. And maybe you all will get the best of BOTH worlds - Rep and Dem. Maybe that's what's needed to get the Parties working together to do the will of the people, rather than fighting each other and doing dumb things like the new Car taxes, Drivers Licenses for illegals, and this proposed VOIP tax.
Go Arnold!
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If everything is under control your not going fast enough!! | |
| nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| this is a b*tch For once the FCC isn't doing anything to crush or stifle a new technology (and the competition it will provide) in it's infancy, but the states are gonna ruin it.
It's still competition, though.
If VOIP starts having to pay "universal access charge", shouldn't that be used to give people internet connections? | |
| pkust
join:2001-08-09
Houston, TX
| Naivete is no defense Straight from the VoicePulse web site:
"Our broadband phones use the latest technology to send your calls over the Internet to bring you the greatest features, save you money and still give you stable, reliable phone service!"
If these companies don't want to be treated like telephone companies, why do they keep presenting themselves as telephone companies? I have no great love for the Baby Bells, but anyone who sticks his chin out has no right to complain when he gets smacked in the face.
It's worth noting that nowhere on Verizon Wireless' web site do they claim to be any manner of telephone company--the language is "wireless communications". I do not believe this is coincidence.
Rightly or wrongly, telephone companies are subject to regulation by each state's PUC (or equivalent). Rightly or wrongly, "telephone service" is regulated by each state's PUC (or equivalent).
Corporate managers who are ignorant of the legal minefields surrounding their core business are either incompetent, naive, or (more likely) both.
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Cordially,
Peter Nayland Kust
pkust@smsysinc.com
Secure Mobile Systems, Inc.
www.smsysinc.com | |
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calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| A new way to justify regulation.... From the Voxilla article:
***Leutza believes that a typical consumer “can’t distinguish between the traditional Public Switched Telephone Network and these new networks that [are] IP technology driven.”***
What's next, Jack? You find a typical consumer that "can't distinguish between a cable modem and a DSL line, and you use that to leapfrog your jurisdiction from DSL to Cable? Many folks would say, with good reason, that there's a lot less difference between DSL and Cable than there is between VoIP and the PSTN.
This is a new, and very dangerous, step for regulation--even though something is clearly NOT regulated, bureaucrats now try to regulate it because it might look like (and therefore, compete with) their existing gravy train.
With logic like this, we will doubtless soon be regulating tire changers as horseshoers, mechanics as veterinarians and nailing license plates on horses' butts....
Calvoiper
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VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
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California to Regulate VoIP?
Greed the American Way