 | | Last mile is great... ..but backhaul seems to be the unaddressed problem. | |
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 | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 | Re: Last mile is great... Not in major cities. Remember that CenLink has a couple different backbone networks that work just fine...
1) Qwest
2) Savvis
3) Lightcore (legacy CenturyTel) | |
|
| | | | Re: Last mile is great... Not backbone, backhaul. CL has a bunch of remote COs with DSLAMS that seem to be connected with T1s. That means the max speed they can offer subscribers is 1.5Mbps. Replace those T1s with DS3s and they could offer faster speeds, in many cases without changing the DSLAM. Note that the DS3s don't have to be fiber. Coax or microwave would work just fine... | |
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| | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
 ·Verizon Online DSL
 ·RoadRunner Cable
·Comcast
| Re: Last mile is great... That's why I said "in cities". I guarantee that anything getting VDSL will be backhauled via OCn or gigabit Ethernet. CenLink wouldn't use microwave or coax in areas like Denver because
1) They have no coax network to speak of here
2) Line of sight issues make microwave a bad choice for everything other than cellular backhaul, and sometimes even that doesn't work out
If you're talking about rural areas though, good luck. Wirelesss backhaul would work well there, but my guess is that many areas don't have subscribers clumped nearly enough around RTs to actually deliver VDSL to most of them. | |
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| | | |  tobyTroy Mcclure
join:2001-11-13
Seattle, WA
·OlyPen, Inc.
·CenturyLink
| Re: Last mile is great... said by iansltx:That's why I said "in cities". I guarantee that anything getting VDSL will be backhauled via OCn or gigabit Ethernet. CenLink wouldn't use microwave or coax in areas like Denver because
1) They have no coax network to speak of here
2) Line of sight issues make microwave a bad choice for everything other than cellular backhaul, and sometimes even that doesn't work out
If you're talking about rural areas though, good luck. Wirelesss backhaul would work well there, but my guess is that many areas don't have subscribers clumped nearly enough around RTs to actually deliver VDSL to most of them.
There are cities that have populations greater than 23,000 that can only get 1.5 Mbps DSL. | |
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| | | | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 | Re: Last mile is great... Not sure how your comment relates to my post. Mind explaining? | |
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| | | nonymousPremium
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ Reviews:
 ·Callcentric
| said by travelguy:Not backbone, backhaul. CL has a bunch of remote COs with DSLAMS that seem to be connected with T1s. That means the max speed they can offer subscribers is 1.5Mbps. Replace those T1s with DS3s and they could offer faster speeds, in many cases without changing the DSLAM. Note that the DS3s don't have to be fiber. Coax or microwave would work just fine...
Most remote COs do have decent connections. Not all of them if really remote but most COs in Qwest area are decently connected even if just by microwave or radio signal. Now remote dslams is a different story. | |
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| | | | | Need to upgrade remote DSLAMS with fiber is the only way to get those types of speeds | |
|
| | | Reviews:
·VOIPo
·wavebroadband
| CL just replaced the 8 bonded t-1's feeding our rural remote terminal on the Olympic Peninsula in Washington with a fiber run. I can now get 5mbps down there on my current adsl lines... Im told by a tech that I should expect VDSL to be available soon... | |
|
| | | | "3) Lightcore (legacy CenturyTel)"
I've got several Lightcore long haul circuits and I can't complain.
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I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. | |
|
| | | No issues here, but I am on the former Qwest Network. I currently have the 40/5mb, and I get 90%+ of my speed, with most tests in the 35mb range down, and about 4mb up.
I have two coworkers here who are also very happy with their service, as their speed is as advertised.
On the flipside, I wasn't too happy with the Embarq network they bought when I lived in Vegas - the network wasn't as fast or stable as the Qwest network here in Albuquerque. To be fair, I live about 1 mile from the CO, and in a new area of town, so I get a very good connection. | |
|
| NugzPremium
join:2012-03-16
Ogden, UT | The have been in talks with Infinera so the backbones is not a problem.
What they really need to focus on is placing more DSLAM's / RT in cities and rual areas.
This CO crap is sooo last decade it makes me want to puke....
Not everyone is going to be around a CO ... with that said . To be competitive they need to get to everyone like the cable companies can..
MORE RT's That's it really.... One placed for each neighborhood.. | |
|
Crusty
join:2008-11-11
Sanger, TX Reviews:
·CenturyLink
 ·Speed of Light B..
·Embarq Now Centu..
| LOL With all the issues I had with CenturyLink, they might be able to do this in one small test area but to roll it out in mass, yea right.
I'd be glad if CenturyLink just fixed the issues in my area. (paid for 10, lucky to get 1.5 for 13 months) | |
|
| | Sonic pushing telcos? Is Sonic Fusion pushing telcos to give their copper lines TLC.... I hope so! Until fiber is everywhere copper is one of the few options we have. I am a Fusion customer here but I wish they could get past the RTs... | |
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| iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 | Re: Sonic pushing telcos? Since Sonic.net only serves AT&T areas (and only parts of those, at that) I would say the answer is "no" | |
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| | | | Re: Sonic pushing telcos? Not parts of ATT serviced; but a very very small section compared to the entire footprint of AT&T. | |
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| | elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA | Sonic Fusion is limited to a few dozen central offices in California, mostly about the Bay Area, and within those, only customers not on remote terminals.
It is a remarkable demonstration of what "can" be done if an ISP is willing to do more of the heavy-lifting.
But I can't see how they would have any influence on AT&T. | |
|
| | | | | Re: Sonic pushing telcos? they're not. In actually they're depending on them and actually are spending MORE than they should. They should eliminate the DSL Fusion product and move to something that they won't be upgrading in the next 4 years. You can only do so much with DSL and that's been shown countless times over; but yet Indie CLECs still think it's smart to invest in DSL.
And ATT does NOT have to allow them access remote terminals which will hurt them if they don't skip Fusion DSL and move to something else.
Here is one company that skipped the whole last mile route. Went and put in a Mesh Network backed by a Fiber line and then the customers are using actual WISP equipment: »www.5gmesh.com/ and they are expanding like wild fire. Nothing to do with the telcos or alike. Sonic and others could do the same thing. Take the WISP approach and kill the last mile copper lines and maintenance. | |
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| | | | BlueC
join:2009-11-26
Minneapolis, MN | Re: Sonic pushing telcos? DSL is still worthwhile, as long as distances are reasonable and backhaul is sufficient. You'd be a fool to get rid of existing wireline assets in exchange for wireless. Sonic.net is doing the right thing.
Wireless is actually very useful as a middle-mile approach. There is robust equipment out there that can backhaul 1gbps+ capacity with minimal latency. A great alternative to spending $xxx,xxx for trenching fiber.
As far as last mile goes, wireless doesn't exactly allow you skip the last mile, you're just utilizing a different method. A method that is subject to a lot of factors to make it work properly.
The company you reference appears to be simply selling an unlicensed service (wi-fi). While they may use licensed for backhaul, eventually everything needs to be 2.4ghz in order for their customers to receive the service, unless they are providing licensed CPE. Their plagiarized image of Ubiquiti's AirRouter explains it well enough. I'll take a properly-managed DSL service over wireless any day of the week. | |
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| | | | elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA | said by 25139889:they're not. In actually they're depending on them and actually are spending MORE than they should. They should eliminate the DSL Fusion product and move to something that they won't be upgrading in the next 4 years. You can only do so much with DSL and that's been shown countless times over; but yet Indie CLECs still think it's smart to invest in DSL.
I disagree. Fusion shows that copper is viable. I'll take 10-40 Mbps copper from Sonic *today* over anyone's promise for Fiber down the road. I have 10Gb fiber ring just feet from my window - the loop has been there for a decade (recently upgraded), and yet, we have no access. Sonic found a way to be relevant and deliver a product that no one else is offering.
said by 25139889:Here is one company that skipped the whole last mile route. Went and put in a Mesh Network backed by a Fiber line and then the customers are using actual WISP equipment: »www.5gmesh.com/ and they are expanding like wild fire. Nothing to do with the telcos or alike. Sonic and others could do the same thing. Take the WISP approach and kill the last mile copper lines and maintenance.
Mesh never delivers much.
I'm all for Wisp efforts, but they are not equivalent to copper, fiber, coax.
Sonic is no longer offering their Wisp service. I wonder why? | |
|
| | | and by Telcos doing this; Sonic still won't be able to offer those speeds. They'd have to put in their own DSLAMS which is a waste. They should focus on FTTH and skip their DSL upgrades. | |
|
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO
kudos:2 Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·RoadRunner Cable
·Comcast
| I want this My current, $115/mo 50/15 Comcast connection is great and all, but I'd jump for 80/40 in a heartbeat if it was available here. Even if that 80/40 is before IP overhead (the 50/15 is after overhead), I'd be getting a really fast connection for only marginally more money than Comcast is charging me for my current one.
At this point, I have all the download speed I need (and then some), so the upload speeds over short distances of pair-bonded VDSL2 are what would make me switch to CenLink. Hence my lack of clamor for the 100/12 connection...I don't need that much download speed, and the upload speed on that service would be a downgrade from what I have now. | |
|
| | | Re: I want this The 40/20 would be a god sent if companies like AT&T would use these models for their U-verse. I currently have 12/1.5 for $54/month. | |
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| |  Steve BPremium
join:2004-08-02
Seattle, WA | Re: I want this said by freakout9903:The 40/20 would be a god sent if companies like AT&T would use these models for their U-verse. I currently have 12/1.5 for $54/month.
I have the 40/20 VDSL and its awesome. I'm literally a block away from the terminal. I pay 49.99 for two years as a promo. After which I might go back to cable. CL DSL prices are a joke. I looked at that pic and noticed they were charging 40.00 for 1.5. Are you kidding me? | |
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| | | Crusty
join:2008-11-11
Sanger, TX Reviews:
·CenturyLink
·Speed of Light B..
·Embarq Now Centu..
| Re: I want this said by Steve B: CL DSL prices are a joke. I looked at that pic and noticed they were charging 40.00 for 1.5. Are you kidding me?
Welcome to the world of CTL customers.  Especially those who live in smaller cities and CTL has for the most part, a monoply on services. | |
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| | | QLR
join:2009-06-23
Tallahassee, FL | Here, it is $50 for dry loop 1.5 DSL... It is $30 if I get Directv or $20 if I get unlimited phone. Yuck. That's why I'm paying Comcast $45 for 12M Internet. | |
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| | |  Oh_NoTrogglus normalus
join:2011-05-21
Chicago, IL | said by Steve B:said by freakout9903:The 40/20 would be a god sent if companies like AT&T would use these models for their U-verse. I currently have 12/1.5 for $54/month.
I have the 40/20 VDSL and its awesome. I'm literally a block away from the terminal. I pay 49.99 for two years as a promo. After which I might go back to cable. CL DSL prices are a joke. I looked at that pic and noticed they were charging 40.00 for 1.5. Are you kidding me? Bandwidth is the cheap part so they can offer 1.5 and 40 for the same price if they wanted to.
The physical lines, equipment, power are the expensive part.
From what you show with those prices is they need at least $40 a month to pay for everything physical + an included 30% markup for profit. | |
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| | | | Too bad We will never speeds like this from U-Verse. What ever happen to their new 80/5 Paired Bonded Business Internet Tier. Yet Another Vaporware offering from ATT. | |
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|  bTU
join:2009-04-22
Aurora, CO | Hell, for $75/mo the 40/20 would be more than enough for me. I just wonder if they have the same level of customer service as comcast. | |
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| etaadmin
join:2002-01-17
Dallas, TX
kudos:1 | If you wait a little Comcast might up that upstream speed a little bit. DOCSIS3.0 upstream bonding is just around the corner with at least 4 bonded channels.
For xDSL technologies it is an endless game of catching up to DOCSIS3.0 once they are within reach cablecos just raise the bar one more time... and you don't have to be 100 feet from that magical box. | |
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| | | | Re: I want this because if telcos really wanted to compete and wanted the people that consume the bandwidth they'd just upgrade and be done with it. But even the Indie CLECs don't even want them. | |
|
| | |
| | I'll give them credit here At least they are trying to improve their service, although many of my Centurylink locations are still on 1.5Mb/384 services, I'll give them credit. If they can get this rolled out across much of their footprint it would be amazing.
The problem I foresee is this being rolled out only in major cities such as Omaha, Denver, Phoenix, Salt Lake City, MSP, and Boise. | |
|
 chd176
join:2003-01-10
Winfield, AL
·CenturyLink
| Meh Even in cities where they have the backhaul upgraded many areas are oversold in bandwidth so they can't even deliver their current tiers much less anything higher. Also tons don't have the backhaul either and are stuck at 1.5/256 in legacy CenturyTel areas and 1.5/768 in Qwest areas.
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10,000/768 CenturyTel PPPoE DSL line (really 5,000/768  ) Now it's really 1500/256...again lol | |
|
| | Good Luck to them I know this company has problems, but I'm for any competition against the cable monopoly that exists in a lot of areas. | |
|
| | | Re: Good Luck to them Pathetic service isn't really competition. It's really just a nuisance and creates a false sense of competition on paper. | |
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| | Thanks I will take the 60/30 please : ) | |
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| etaadmin
join:2002-01-17
Dallas, TX
kudos:1 | Re: Thanks how close are you from that magical box? I'm sorry sir the fastest you can qualify for is 1.5/1.5 Mbps 
When we read these announcements we tend to forget that not all of us can get the fastest tiers. This is the disappointing aspect of xDSL technologies. Yeah 100/12 sounds great right? but probably more than 80% of their customers won't be able to achieve these speeds... down to earth again. | |
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| | | | Re: Thanks I don't live in Denver and don't really know how far I am from the box. | |
|
| | Yeah right CenturyLink took over Qwest's pathetic service where I live, and they only offer 1.5mbps/896kbps (at $30/month). I went with Comcast instead and get almost 20 times that speed for less than twice the price. Something tells me that CL is not serious about "competing" with cable in most markets, so I've written them off as a serious ISP. | |
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| | | Re: Yeah right pretty much with everyone here. i mean i get 25/5 but i can see their fiber and tell you the numbers on it. thats how close it is but they wont run fiber to house and charge me less for it | |
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| | competition at least. i just want 20 meg down and at least 2 meg up.
896 up is just too slow. | |
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| |
| | Promises, Promises I haven't had much luck getting the advertised speed from CenturyLink, or the old Qwest. My actual speeds were alway 60-70% of what they said I would get. At least with Comcast, I am getting all of what I expect. I won't be fooled by them again. | |
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| | | Re: Promises, Promises Yeah, you have to lop off at least 10-20 percent from the advertised amount. Even if you sync up well it still takes a hit. | |
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|
| | | Re: Wait, what? Given the standards for VDSL support either 55meg or 100meg per line it is odd that the top speed being offered is 112meg on a 2 line multilink | |
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| | | This sucks, the fastest CenturyLink speed available at my address is 12/.896... oh well, at least i have comcast!!!!!!!!!!  | |
|
 Simba7I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT | Competition here? Since Optimum is the only one offering over 10mbps speeds here, this would definitely spark my interests.
I currently use CL as a secondary ISP anyway. All I would have to do is swap boxes. | |
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| | Everyone should call into Centurylink Everyone should call into Centurylink and request bonded dsl. I want my 20/2 speeds! | |
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|  MSaukMSaukPremium
join:2002-01-17
Sandy, UT | Re: Everyone should call into Centurylink i live in utah and i am very happy with my speeds, 40/5. i pay 29.99 a month for six months but like usual i will just move to the two year deal of 49.
comcast charges over 100 for around those speeds. (50/15)
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801 Images | |
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Reviews:
·XMission
| Century Link to UTOPIA 1.5 mbit down 768k up was the fastest Century Link would offer to me because I didn't use their ISP. I paid $33 to Century Link and $40 to my ISP (XMission). Now I'm on UTOPIA 100/100 fiber and pay $45 to XMission. I paid the UTOPIA connection fee up front so $45 is my total monthly cost. Actual speeds through my 10/100 router are 92 mbit down and 80 mbit up. If I connect directly to the UTOPIA gateway hardware I get 95+ mbits down and up. The Century Link-XMission latency was 52-55 msec. The UTOPIA-Xmission latency is 1 msec. | |
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| MSaukMSaukPremium
join:2002-01-17
Sandy, UT | Re: Century Link to UTOPIA said by cwoldberg:1.5 mbit down 768k up was the fastest Century Link would offer to me because I didn't use their ISP. I paid $33 to Century Link and $40 to my ISP (XMission). Now I'm on UTOPIA 100/100 fiber and pay $45 to XMission. I paid the UTOPIA connection fee up front so $45 is my total monthly cost. Actual speeds through my 10/100 router are 92 mbit down and 80 mbit up. If I connect directly to the UTOPIA gateway hardware I get 95+ mbits down and up. The Century Link-XMission latency was 52-55 msec. The UTOPIA-Xmission latency is I do wish I lived in an area that was served by them. I would use UTOPIA without a doubt. But a choice between comcast and century link, I choose Century Link. Price is wayyyy lower and quality is about the same.
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801 Images | |
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| | | I understand Centerville in particular is going gang busters with utopia. Exceeding build out estimates and such. | |
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| | | | Re: Century Link to UTOPIA The UTOPIA take rate is about 30% in the neighborhood I'm in. I expect it will go even higher as more and more folks talk about how well it works and how cheap it is. | |
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| | | NugzPremium
join:2012-03-16
Ogden, UT | Re: Century Link to UTOPIA You guys just bearly got that installed in Centerville. Thank You! for a update, The people in Brigham are struggling to get speeds, but someone I know is on Connect for life isp and on Utopia and bearly gets 18Mb Down and 5.66Mb up and is suppose to be 20/20... I told her she needs to have someone come and take a look..
Cause Utopia's fiber should do 100/100 which as you said is around 90-95Mb. Thank you! | |
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Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
 ·Verizon FiOS
| 100? Yeah right.. The only way you're getting 100mbits out of DSL is if you live in the Central Office that's served with Fiber.. the only kind of dsl service proven at 1k - 5k feet from a CO is about 25 - 50 megabit theorized by Uverse.. they have 25 working now, but need line bonding to go further. vdsl2 spec is NOT copper pair bonding... | |
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demirPremium
join:2010-07-15
usa
2 edits | rly? Interesting. We've had the 40+ megabit available in our suburb for years.
Maybe someone can get more specific on exactly what 'most of their customers' came from. I'd like to see that most of the customers can't get faster speeds before actually believing it. | |
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|  TsumePremium
join:2004-02-23
Johnson City, TN | Re: rly? The vast majority of CenturyLink customers in Johnson City and surrounding area are sent flyers offering "up to 10mbps".
I have not met a single soul out here in Gray who has qualified for over 3mbps. I originally could only get 1.5mbps, which was so slow and unusable that I paid Comcast $631 to run a line to my home. They now offer 3mbps to my home, but that's still not good enough. And that is a recent "upgrade" since the beginning of this year. This is an ex-Embarq area, if that matters. They only offered 5mbps at an urban apartment area next to Full Sail University in Winter Park, FL when I lived there three years ago. Again, ex-Embarq.
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to whoever anonymously gave me premium membership... thanks! | |
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| | | | Re: rly? Is Gray a real city? I was on a business trip to Johnson City one time, and stayed in Kingsport... I remember always being confused when driving through Gray if it was its own place or not, and the town itself seemed to not be sure... some signs called it Gray and some called it Midway.
It was 10 years ago I was there, but I bet there isn't a central office in Gray, that you are serviced remotely out of Johnson City and that is why you don't have the faster speeds available.
Maybe it has grown in the past decade, IDK.
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DSLr Mafia Member
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| | | TsumePremium
join:2004-02-23
Johnson City, TN | Re: rly? Gray isn't a real city, it's considered a census designated place. Until the past 10 years or so, it was mostly farmland. Now it is mostly a suburb of Johnson City. Most/all of Gray can get DSL from what I've heard from the locals, just not very fast speeds. It is geographically large enough that there would have to be at least one CenturyLink remote in the Gray area, but most likely not a CO. My loop length was originally 17,000ft or thereabouts, barely enough to get their DSL. They recently re-did some phone lines in the area and ran the line that was two houses down and served from a different remote to my house, so now I qualify for 3mbps which is still slow but better than the previous 1.5mbps.
The area is suburban enough to have Comcast cable and the main Comcast building is practically in Gray. It is also suburban enough that Johnson City is close to annexing the rest of Gray. Gray consists mostly of the immediate area around the Boones Creek Rd exit (already annexed by Johnson City) and the Suncrest / Bobby Hicks Hwy exit (soon to be annexed). I live near the Boones Creek exit probably a mile or two from Johnson City limits, but in a more rural farmland part of Gray. That means I probably won't see anything better from CenturyLink any time soon.
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to whoever anonymously gave me premium membership... thanks! | |
|
 danawhitakerSpace...The Final FrontierPremium
join:2002-03-02
Urbandale, IA | ...meanwhile, in Urbandale... I still can't get an offer of anything better than 1.5mbit/896kbit. Every time they send me a flier in the mail offering me service I get somewhat excited, thinking that perhaps my neighborhood is finally seeing an upgrade. But alas...
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You're watching Sports Night on CSC so stick around... | |
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| | CenturyLink Fiber in Seattle? My neighbor reported that CenturyLink was installing fiber in the Seattle Wallingford neighborhood. He got the information from the crew installing the fiber. Hopefully they will be offering a full range of internet speeds and competitive prices in the near future. | |
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Wait, what?
