 quetwoThat VoIP GuyPremium join:2004-09-04 East Lansing, MI | Ok, we get it already I know you are excited about the number, but every article doesn't have to tell us again and again that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers. Some companies serve more rural areas, and therefore have more debt. | |
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 |  BassistguyAlrighty ThenPremium join:2001-07-14 Ballwin, MO | Re: Ok, we get it already said by quetwo:I know you are excited about the number, but every article doesn't have to tell us again and again that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers. But doing so is helpful for people like me, who had no clue that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers.  | |
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 |  | | said by quetwo:I know you are excited about the number, but every article doesn't have to tell us again and again that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers. Some companies serve more rural areas, and therefore have more debt. Nor does every Charter article need to contain "though the CEO seems to do ok" either. -- "Don't steal. The government hates competition." | |
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 |  |  Host: Road Runner PC gaming GAMES PC gaming Tech
2 edits | Re: Ok, we get it already Nor does every Charter article need to contain "though the CEO seems to do ok" either. A quick look shows me I've used that phrase twice for Charter, including this report. The 20%/8% ratio metric has been used more frequently, but I find it pertinent and interesting.
I will, however, deliver beatings to the interns to do a better job in using less redundant metrics to highlight Charter's dysfunction. | |
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 |  |  |  RadioDoc58ef2c0Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11 | Re: Ok, we get it already Maybe next time you could use logarithms for the ratio. -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 |  |  | | said by BillRoland:said by quetwo:I know you are excited about the number, but every article doesn't have to tell us again and again that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers. Some companies serve more rural areas, and therefore have more debt. Nor does every Charter article need to contain "though the CEO seems to do ok" either. Why not. if everyone else is going down with the ship what makes upper management immune? Maybe some new fresh younger high up management with new ideas. Compensation linked to real improvement. | |
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 |  en102Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA | said by quetwo:I know you are excited about the number, but every article doesn't have to tell us again and again that Charter's industry debt-load is 20% with only 8% of the customers. Some companies serve more rural areas, and therefore have more debt. Just because they server more rural customers does not give them the excuse to have a higher debt:customer ratio. Having more rural customers isn't a bad thing... you 'could' charge higher rates, as there's less (or no) competition. | |
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 |  pkust join:2001-08-09 Houston, TX | said by quetwo:Some companies serve more rural areas, and therefore have more debt. The predicate does not necessitate the conclusion.
Regardless of the composition of the customer base, a healthy enterprise can only sustain so much debt; if it cannot generate revenues sufficient to service this debt, the enterprise will fail.
Charter's debt load, no matter the reason it was incurred, is optimistically described as "crushing". As of their most recent 10Q filing, the company has an increasingly negative net worth, with intangible assets ("goodwill") nearly double their tangible assets.
As was the case with DSL vendors such as Northpoint and Rhythms nearly a decade ago, Charter has a financial situation that is untenable: it's operating income does not come close to covering the interest payments on the debt load. To survive without a reorganization, Charter would have to immediately more than double it's operating income--a financial target that is nowhere close to realistic.
The question confronting Charter customers is what will happen during a bankruptcy proceeding. The existing assets are income-producing; strip the debt load off the company and its core financials are sound. However, companies cannot simply abandon their debt obligations (and the current climate on Wall Street is likely to make this even more difficult). Charter may well be forced into liquidation proceedings, and the assets sold off at fire-sale prices.
That Charter's customer base is more rural than urban has no bearing on the company's exceedingly grim financial reality. Charter is over-leveraged, and the de-leveraging which needs to happen will not be a painless process--not for the company, and likely not for the customers as well.
Such is the significance of a company carrying 20% of the industry's debt while servicing 8% of the industry's customers. -- Cordially,
Peter Nayland Kust pkust@tekmedia.com TEKMedia Communications, Inc. www.tekmedia.com | |
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 CorydonCultivant son jardinPremium join:2008-02-18 Denver, CO | By comparison... Charter's market cap is $45.34 million. Which means that they owe about 463x what the market thinks they are worth.
Total revenue in 2007 was about $6 billion, with net income (the "bottom line") a loss of $1.6 billion.
Not good news. -- "2 Strangers + 1 20 minute ceremony + $50 + 10 shots of tequila = Holy Matrimony and 1st Class Protections Under the Law
now thats crazy!" | |
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 |  | | Re: By comparison... said by Corydon:Charter's market cap is $45.34 million. Which means that they owe about 463x what the market thinks they are worth. Total revenue in 2007 was about $6 billion, with net income (the "bottom line") a loss of $1.6 billion. Not good news. I believe most of the loss was because of interest payments on the loans.
Basically paul allen went nuts when starting out with charter and bought up whatever markets possible. They overpaid by a lot for many markets. When you pay thousands of dollars per subscriber it takes a while to make back your investment.
Not sure where they will go from here. | |
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 |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | Sure it is.
For the bankruptcy lawyers..... | |
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 |  |  Sammer join:2005-12-22 Canonsburg, PA | Re: By comparison... Can you say pre-packaged chapter 11 bankruptcy? In this economy it's not like Charter's creditors have a choice. | |
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 |  KearnstdElf WizardPremium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | however i take it the cable company cant be forclosed on. i mean besides the banks wouldnt want to take on running a cable company. that said the franchise authorities in charter areas had better start shopping out to Comcast, and TWC. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 Emiya join:2006-03-30 Southington, OH | I can see what's coming... And in another week they'll be strutting up to Capitol Hill with their tin cups held out looking for a handout bailout. | |
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 |  zed260Premium join:2007-09-30 Cleveland, TN kudos:1 | Re: I can see what's coming... and id bet they wont get one
because paul allen has controlling stake in charter he will probably be asked why he wont bail them out (paul allen has enough to pay of most of charters debt)
if they do get one it will be an uproar i bet | |
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·WOW Internet and..
| Re: I can see what's coming... And the UAW doesnt have enough money to give to the BIG 3 to help them?
Since the Auto Industry- the Big 3, received money its only fair to Charter to get money.
The big 3 didnt need that money. The rest of the automakers are doing fine. But then again they're not stupid and paying for Grandpa to go to the casino and blow his "retirement" every two weeks hoping to make it big. | |
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 |  |  |  RadioDoc58ef2c0Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11 | Re: I can see what's coming... The 'rest' were already subsidized by their respective governments.
One cable outfit going under would almost zero economic effect compared to the US auto industry ceasing operations. -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 |  |  |  |  | | Re: I can see what's coming... It wouldn't hit us that much. Ohio and MI have already seen the affects and it repeats itself all the time. It gets worse before better.
But you see the Foreign companies doing great. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  RadioDoc58ef2c0Premium,ExMod 2000-03 join:2000-05-11 | Re: I can see what's coming... Toyota and Nissan would argue with your "great". They're both down about 20%. Honda is down over 9%. Toyota posted it's first loss ever, and that's over 70 years of operation.
»www.nytimes.com/2008/12/25/busin···ota.html -- Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
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 | | go to Hell already I wish charter would die and go to the depths of hell | |
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 |  bboe join:2004-02-03 Monterey Park, CA | Re: go to Hell already I agree, been having way too many problems with them for the last few months. Hope this is the end and my area get a new cable provider. | |
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 |  |  | | Re: go to Hell already Yes, no kidding they need to go already. | |
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 |  |  |  DarkLogixPremium join:2008-10-23 Baytown, TX kudos:3 | Re: go to Hell already Yes I agree, so how fast can they go there? | |
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 |  |  |  | | said by jchambers28:I wish charter would die and go to the depths of hell I hope you get aids, since we are being so mature about this.
said by centsofhumor:Yes, no kidding they need to go already. I hope they stay in WI where you and I are. Can't find anything better. My 16MB is rock solid. | |
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 |  |  | | Yah you want a new provider now, but when someone else takes over and raises your rates you'll be back on here bitching because your CATV went up $5 and Internet is then capped at 250gigs per month. | |
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 |  |  |  | | Re: go to Hell already We'll always find something to bitch about, don't worry. | |
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 |  |  |  bboe join:2004-02-03 Monterey Park, CA Reviews:
·Charter
| said by hottboiinnc:Yah you want a new provider now, but when someone else takes over and raises your rates you'll be back on here bitching because your CATV went up $5 and Internet is then capped at 250gigs per month. Anything is better then packet loss and having your download speed at half of what you paid for, if you are lucky. Sometime there is no download speed to even speak of at all. Funny you should bring up download caps, which ISP are you talking about? That assuming that ISP takes this area, which they don't have a market in. Lucky me. | |
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·Insight Communic..
| Re: go to Hell already Even if another Cable Operator takes over you will still have the same issues unless they have the capital to invest in the infrastructure providing your services to you at the moment. It's not "Charter" that causes the packet loss. It's the lines and equipment your signal goes through. If say Time Warner or Comcast buys it they will use the same equipment with little or no upgrades and will likely jack the prices and put in caps.
I've been there and seen it happen! In my home town I saw the cable company change hands 3 times and the service sucked as always because no one wanted to put money in the system to upgrade it. They just wanted to charge more. | |
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 |  KearnstdElf WizardPremium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | well you dont have to worry about comcast getting any charter areas if they go under. the FCC as pretty much said comcast cant go past 29% market share. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 |  |  fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium join:2005-05-20 kudos:3 | Re: go to Hell already said by Kearnstd:well you dont have to worry about comcast getting any charter areas if they go under. the FCC as pretty much said comcast cant go past 29% market share. Don't count on that ... The FCC isn't with in their rights to "regulate" business affairs to that level. Martin THINKS he has the ability to do so, however, its never been solidified. Besides, you really think Comcast is going to sit back and accept a 29% system cap while the likes of AT&T and Verizon are allowed to merge freely? The court systems have barely seen this yet.. | |
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 |  pkust join:2001-08-09 Houston, TX | said by jchambers28:I wish charter would die and go to the depths of hell They are not my favorite cable company (thankfully, they are not my current cable company), but if charter collapses, what happens to the customers? -- Cordially,
Peter Nayland Kust pkust@tekmedia.com TEKMedia Communications, Inc. www.tekmedia.com | |
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 | | FIOS is the answer..... Just get rid of Charter now in Northeastern Connecticut and call up the Verizon folks and start deploying the fiber for FIOS. Problem solved.
Obama= Bailouts we can believe in 2009. What a lying crook. | |
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 zed260Premium join:2007-09-30 Cleveland, TN kudos:1 Reviews:
·Charter
| in my area in my area of cleveland i bet comcast is 99 percent likely to be one to buy the cleveland area
i base this off the fact that comcast is avible in chattnooga not far from here and i think it would probably be vary cost savings to merge the two plants | |
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 | | Please sell my territory I would like to have a decent cable company | |
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 |  VarlikWithout Honor You Will Never Be FreePremium join:2002-01-06 Anderson, SC 1 edit | Re: Please sell my territory said by rid0617:I would like to have a decent cable company So would most of us in upstate SC. I just hope that someone decent buys my market out and not some podunk cable operation. But I'd settle for at least having another option for HSI since At&t says that I'm ineligible. -- "Sir SIR! We don't use DHCP servers. We only use IBM & Microsoft servers." From there my call to tech support went steadily downhill.
--Don't bother telling us that we're too loud. Cause there ain't no way that we'll ever turn down. | |
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 |  |  zed260Premium join:2007-09-30 Cleveland, TN kudos:1 1 edit | Re: Please sell my territory i think everyone would love a decent cable company not just charter custermers
though charter been better then most other companys | |
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