  baineschile2600 ways to livePremium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Yet more evidence... That servicing country/rural areas is not profitable for broadband and TV. Too much wiring, for too few consumers. | |
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 ·WOW Internet and..
| Re: Yet more evidence... I wouldn't count all of their areas country or rural by far. St. Louis by far is not country or even rural. Charter got too big too fast and the only way they are the size they are is by picking up areas from other companies they didn't want.
But yet TWC services LOTS of rural areas in Ohio and i don't see them having any problems. Charter just has issues with spending too much money and not making anything. | |
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| | | | Re: Yet more evidence... said by hottboiinnc: Charter just has issues with spending too much money and not making anything. Charter makes over 1 BILLION a year. The issue is the debt load, which Chapter 11 is helping them with. They make plenty of money. | |
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| | |  morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000 | Re: Yet more evidence... said by nordoI :
Charter makes over 1 BILLION a year. The issue is the debt load, which Chapter 11 is helping them with. They make plenty of money.
if they are making plenty of money then they would be able to service their debt. hottboiinnc is right: they got too big, too fast. buying too many cable plants for too much money.
of course, bankruptcy will help them! | |
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| | | | | | Re: Yet more evidence... You are right, they paid too much for the systems they bought. That along with the shady upper management team they had really killed them.
I think Neil and the current team can turn it around, but they have a lot of work ahead of them to do so. | |
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| | | | | | said by morbo:said by nordoI :
Charter makes over 1 BILLION a year. The issue is the debt load, which Chapter 11 is helping them with. They make plenty of money.
if they are making plenty of money then they would be able to service their debt. hottboiinnc is right: they got too big, too fast. buying too many cable plants for too much money. of course, bankruptcy will help them! You just repeated what he said. lol
Charter does make plenty. They just have the debt load. After Chap11 I can see them coming out a lot better. | |
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| | | | | morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000 | Re: Yet more evidence... said by r0gerr :said by morbo:said by nordoI :
Charter makes over 1 BILLION a year. The issue is the debt load, which Chapter 11 is helping them with. They make plenty of money.
if they are making plenty of money then they would be able to service their debt. hottboiinnc is right: they got too big, too fast. buying too many cable plants for too much money. of course, bankruptcy will help them! You just repeated what he said. lol Charter does make plenty. They just have the debt load. After Chap11 I can see them coming out a lot better. my point is that anyone can make money if you wipe out their outstanding debt. even someone with 100k in credit card loans and a million dollar mortgage with an average job can "make" money if you simply erase their debt. it's more important to look at what got them into that situation and avoid it in the future. | |
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| | | It is proof that a company saddled with mountains of debt, poor management and poor customer service is a company that isn't long for this world. That was the problem that Charter has. It has nothing to due with them serving rural areas because they service some lucrative suburban/rural areas that, if they had decent management, would make them a very profitable company.
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"This is a bus. You know how big a bus is?" | |
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| |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
kudos:1
 ·T-Mobile US
| Re: Yet more evidence... said by NetAdmin1:It is proof that a company saddled with mountains of debt, poor management and poor customer service is a company that isn't long for this world. That was the problem that Charter has. And high prices. Their high prices may be alright in the boonies, but in the cities it served (like St. Louis, and parts of DFW) ATT and Verizon are a much, much better deal.
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"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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| me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | 1. One word: wireless. 2. just put internet then, or DSL may cost less. If done correctly rural areas can be profitable if they were not there would be no WISPs. | |
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| | | | Re: Yet more evidence... very true!. | |
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| | | me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Re: Yet more evidence... Yup, you only have so much wire, but repeaters can be used(to an extent) to boost the ranger of wireless. It makes it easier to serve rural areas, it can put out the same speeds as DSL and cable verizon is even working on(or so I hear) 60m wireless. With a 5gb cap you can not do much, but when they get it out they most likely will up the cap. | |
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| | | | | | Re: Yet more evidence... VZ maybe working on it but ATT already has Wireless in AK. it makes more sense. | |
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| | | | | me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Re: Yet more evidence... What kinda speed? | |
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join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Re: Yet more evidence... Thank you hottboiinnc. | |
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| | | |  BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by me1212:Yup, you only have so much wire, but repeaters can be used(to an extent) to boost the ranger of wireless. It makes it easier to serve rural areas, it can put out the same speeds as DSL and cable verizon is even working on(or so I hear) 60m wireless. With a 5gb cap you can not do much, but when they get it out they most likely will up the cap. yeah to what 10 GB maybe 15 GB? Cap or not cap, how do you justify Verzion charging $256 per GB overage? | |
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| | | | | me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Re: Yet more evidence... I cannot justify the $256(I too say "WTF?".) A 100gb-250gb or even no cap look more likely, looking at their other internet services(DSL/FiOS). Anyway I know how to get verizon with no cap now, and I plan too in a few months. Mobile+no cap= win. | |
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| | | | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Yet more evidence... said by me1212:I cannot justify the $256(I too say "WTF?".) A 100gb-250gb or even no cap look more likely, looking at their other internet services(DSL/FiOS). Anyway I know how to get verizon with no cap now, and I plan too in a few months. Mobile+no cap= win. don't expect that no cap to last too long. Once again I stated actual verizon service not a reseller. In my area you can only get verizon for 3G, that's it. And sorry there is no "cap free" option. | |
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| | | | | | | me1212
join:2008-11-20
Pleasant Hill, MO | Re: Yet more evidence... Ok yeah the reseller is the only way for the no cap, but if they can resell the 60m well I would like that. If you can get sprint you can use it. Yes they will take sprint if you can't ger verizon. | |
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·WOW Internet and..
| if you use a reseller of the EVDO service via VZ there is NO cap at all. That has been talked and talked about on here before.
Also a reseller of VZW service offers Unlimited national calling over the VZW wireless voice network for $85 month to month- a lot less than what VZW charges. | |
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| | | | | | | | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Yet more evidence... said by hottboiinnc:if you use a reseller of the EVDO service via VZ there is NO cap at all. That has been talked and talked about on here before. Also a reseller of VZW service offers Unlimited national calling over the VZW wireless voice network for $85 month to month- a lot less than what VZW charges. which part of "that does not exist in my area" is hard to comprehend? | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: Yet more evidence... if you have VZW then the reseller is in your area. What part of "don't you get it" don't you understand. | |
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| BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by baineschile:That servicing country/rural areas is not profitable for broadband and TV. Too much wiring, for too few consumers. That's not why Charter is $20 billion in debt. Try getting some facts first. | |
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| | baineschile2600 ways to livePremium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Re: Yet more evidence... That may not be the sole reason, but it would be silly to discount it completely. | |
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|  h7
@charter.com | said by baineschile:That servicing country/rural areas is not profitable for broadband and TV. Too much wiring, for too few consumers. Perhaps you'd be happy then to move to Washington DC to live just like any or all of the other lemmings that link that way... | |
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| | Where's the Board of Directors? They must be ok with the company direction or they would toss the CEO and charter a new path  | |
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| zed260Premium
join:2007-09-30
Cleveland, TN
kudos:1 | Re: Where's the Board of Directors? all voting share is controlled by paul allan he is the one who has to vote to aprrovel the voluntary chapter 11 bankruptcy | |
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| | Mismanagement They need to discount their rates to get their service sold in my area. It's about $75 a month for 20 meg service in my market. That's a lot higher than $15 DSL from AT&T - and most folks don't know the difference. I do, of course, but I'm the kinda guy who hangs out on DSLR.
Charter is a terribly mismanaged company in nearly every single way. | |
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·WOW Internet and..
| Re: Mismanagement no way in hell is any company going to sell 20meg internet connection for $15- except maybe Windstream. Also i bet Charter has more customers than what you think in your area. Especially those people that can't DSL due to ATT will NOT extend to those areas, and will never see anything except cable for a very long time. | |
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2 edits | Re: Mismanagement said by hottboiinnc:no way in hell is any company going to sell 20meg internet connection for $15- except maybe Windstream. Also i bet Charter has more customers than what you think in your area. Especially those people that can't DSL due to ATT will NOT extend to those areas, and will never see anything except cable for a very long time. Sorry, I should have been more specific. I don't think they need to be at $15 to be competitive. Just be competitive with AT&T's top tiers... around $50. Normal people just aren't willing to pay $75-100 a month for Internet access.
They also have a major advertising problem down here... I'm a techie, and I didn't know they'd finally come to town this fall until a few weeks ago. AT&T spent a lot of money upgrading their system for uverse and whatnot... their DSL reach is also much longer now. A lot more people are served in my community with DSL than with cable Internet... I understand that probably isn't the case in most places. | |
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·WOW Internet and..
| Re: Mismanagement U-Verse isnt as big as they claim. It's available here. One VARD may only service 100-200 customers within a certain feet range. The only thing they did was shorten the copper distance. And ATT may have top tiers now with the U-Verse product but what happens if Comcast takes over your town from Charter or TWC? Or someone else that can compete. U-Verse will nothing when Comcast starts at 16/1 on basic tiers now for $44 per month. DSL can NOT compete against cable in anyway- especially if it comes from ATT. | |
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| BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by gopnick:They need to discount their rates to get their service sold in my area. It's about $75 a month for 20 meg service in my market. That's a lot higher than $15 DSL from AT&T - and most folks don't know the difference. I do, of course, but I'm the kinda guy who hangs out on DSLR. Charter is a terribly mismanaged company in nearly every single way. $15 DSL is 768 kbps Charter 20 Mbps is 27X faster for only 5X the cost. hell my upload is nearly 3X faster than the download on the $15 DSL. | |
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| | Are Telephone companies more stable than Cable? I just signed up with Frontier (in Rochester, NY) and made sure to check out their financials beforehand after hearing about Charter (which is not available in my area). Frontier seems really stable and they're still paying their $1 dividend every year. I'm seriously thinking of buying their stock as it amounts to a 20% return annually with the dividend! For some reason or another, it seems the telephone companies seem more stable (financially) than the cable companies. | |
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| | | Re: Are Telephone companies more stable than Cable? depends on your cable company. Comcast seems to be a rock. TWC is having some problems right now but they're also a rock and know what they're doing. Charter just got too big too fast and spent money that they didn't have. | |
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| | | Re: TPC - Perhaps being there from the 'beginning', a 'history' with the politicians, and having their heavily subsidized infrastructure in place.
OTOH, Charter does have poor customer relations and high prices. | |
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| | h7
@charter.com | Re: Are Telephone companies more stable than Cable? said by Al Bell :
Re: TPC - Perhaps being there from the 'beginning', a 'history' with the politicians, and having their heavily subsidized infrastructure in place.
OTOH, Charter does have poor customer relations and high prices.
Very good point about the telcos and also about Charter. It's most definitely easier for the telephone companies to survive because the gov't has been feeding TC pockets for at least as long as the industry has existed. Of course, most always cable connections are technically faster and more reliable also (if they are done right)... Truth is for me even if Charter is having major problems, which they are, I hope they make it through it all and survive and get better because I too would like to see faster and more reliable speeds in my area (as well as more affordable prices) from them.  | |
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| | | This is due to the large amount of profits that POTS lines have versus VOIP.
They are only stable because they bleed the customer of all their money for lines that were put down 100 years ago. | |
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Lazlow
join:2006-08-07
Saint Louis, MO | Docsis 3? I wonder how much equipment they bought in that last quarter in preparation of doing the D3 change over. They would have know well in advance that the bankruptcy was coming (or likely to come). Since the quarter was going to look bad anyway, why not buy all the D3 stuff they could, thereby making this year look markedly better. I know they replaced a lot of the older lines here in St Louis(started seeing it in November). | |
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| | Charter and telcos Charter is big, and bloated, full of overpaid execs, and bad Indian customer service. I had service issues with them for 6 months - speeds going downhill every other week. I had to switch back to ATT, not that I wanted, but at least I am getting (very close) to advertised speed. Customer service is not that much greater, but then I don't have to call them as much.
It would be a good thing if they would let Charter go into bankruptcy and it be even better if they would break it up, in smaller, digestible chunks...Well, the way the economy goes these days, they will get some money from the bail out (what better time to declare bankruptcy) and they will continue with the well known crappy service. | |
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| h7
@charter.com | Re: Charter and telcos said by Mechano:Charter is big, and bloated, full of overpaid execs, and bad Indian customer service. I had service issues with them for 6 months - speeds going downhill every other week. I had to switch back to ATT, not that I wanted, but at least I am getting (very close) to advertised speed. Customer service is not that much greater, but then I don't have to call them as much. It would be a good thing if they would let Charter go into bankruptcy and it be even better if they would break it up, in smaller, digestible chunks...Well, the way the economy goes these days, they will get some money from the bail out (what better time to declare bankruptcy) and they will continue with the well known crappy service. Mechano join:2004-05-30 Antarctica Yeah well when you live in Antarctica what can you do? Call a penguin when it doesn't work out? Heh and yeah I know you don't really. :P | |
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| | | | Re: Charter and telcos Yeah...and my name is Kowalsky, and I am now in Madagascar. What is your name squirt ? are you even 13 ? | |
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| | | h7
@charter.com | Re: Charter and telcos said by Mechano:Yeah...and my name is Kowalsky, and I am now in Madagascar. What is your name squirt ? are you even 13 ? Only by about x3. At least I can take a joke "Squirt". Which is what it was so Re:Lax. :P
h#7 | |
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| | | | I hear you on the customer and tech support. I was completely surprised to learn Frontier's was domestic - including their tech support which is actually about 3 miles from where I live in Rochester! You don't see that too much anymore! | |
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 bencPremium
join:2007-06-17
Glen Carbon, IL
·Charter
| Would This Mean Charter Could Cease Operation? I Hope Not. Given the title, one might think that I'm a Charter fanboi. I'm not.
I do use their "Business" service, and while I have a slight gripe with the price, it's otherwise has been quite good to me. No restrictions, caps, or anything. And I get a static IP too. Even Customer Service doesn't seem bad. However, that's probably due to the fact that I use the "Business" service.
Anyway, I hope they won't cease operation because at my apartment, it's the only way to get broadband at a somewhat affordable price.
I'm too far out for DSL, so I can't use DSL-Extreme. T1 is very expensive, and I don't even know if I can get it since I have an apartment. There is such a thing as uncapped 3G, but latency is higher and last I heard that costs like $170/mo. so that's less speed for more money.
I couldn't stand the thought of using Satellite. FAP issues aside, latency is atrocious, and pricing is too high for what you get.
Even if I could get T1 at my apartment, I'm not going to enjoy paying $400+ when before it was $120. That's a lot of money for 50% more upload, although it'd be rock solid...
If another company buys the plant, then I dread to think who that company would be, and there's no way to tell if the other company's pricing would be comparable. | |
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| | | Re: Would This Mean Charter Could Cease Operation? I Hope Not. you get can get EVDO Rev. A 3G on the VZW network for the same price fully uncapped-fully unlimited. You just need to do business with the resellers. Anad where do you get 3G at $170per month. Don't you watch TV and see the Sprint ads? | |
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| | bencPremium
join:2007-06-17
Glen Carbon, IL Reviews:
·Charter
| Re: Would This Mean Charter Could Cease Operation? I Hope Not. said by hottboiinnc:you get can get EVDO Rev. A 3G on the VZW network for the same price fully uncapped-fully unlimited. You just need to do business with the resellers. Anad where do you get 3G at $170per month. Don't you watch TV and see the Sprint ads? The $170 price? I saw it in a post on this site. However, it was awhile ago.
The $60 prices in those ads you speak of come with a 5GB cap, which would limit what I'd want to do by a lot. Basically it'd mean limited YouTube, and forget about Hulu or Netflix.
As for resellers that you mentioned, that's something that I don't know a whole lot about. It sounds interesting.
$60 for no cap or a very high cap might actually be reasonable. $60 for 5GB is not. | |
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| | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by hottboiinnc:you get can get EVDO Rev. A 3G on the VZW network for the same price fully uncapped-fully unlimited. You just need to do business with the resellers. Anad where do you get 3G at $170per month. Don't you watch TV and see the Sprint ads? these resellers are going to be out of business before too long. Verizon has caps because they don't want their network congested. If these resellers have customers using 23X 50X or 100X or more bandwidth EACH how long before Verizon puts the breaks on that? Also 170? that's a joke. Charter's 60 mbps uncapped tier is $120. Which frankly isn't worth that much. | |
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| | | | | Re: Would This Mean Charter Could Cease Operation? I Hope Not. What kind of caps does Verizon have? I just switched to them from Charter a couple weeks ago partially because of the shady way Charter is starting to impose caps. I never saw anything about caps here at DSLR or their own website.
I have the 7.1/768 plan.
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The Firefox alternative.
»www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/ | |
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| | | | | And you know how the resellers are going to close how? I call bull shit and you don't know anything regarding that.. | |
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