dslreports logo
 story category
Comcast Home Hotspots Raise Home Network Congestion Concerns

In June of last year Comcast announced that the company was launching a new, Fon-like effort that involved new router firmware that turns your gateway into a publicly-accessible hotspot. More specifically, updated routers would now offer two signals: one being yours, and the other being a "xfinitywifi" SSID signal providing free Wi-Fi to other Comcast users in your general area. The update has been slowly deployed on a market-by-market basis.

Click for full size
Fortunately, users can disable this functionality if they don't want to share their bandwidth with strangers, but Comcast says this functionality is enabled by default. The public usage also thankfully doesn't count against your Comcast usage cap (if you have one in your market), and Comcast will push more bandwidth your direction to compensate for additional strain on your line.

Still, Mari Silbey over at Light Reading raises concerns about how much bandwidth passers by are consuming when they use Comcast customer routers. Historically Comcast has told me that the router will adjust on the fly to manage the load, and Comcast's Charlie Dougles tells Silbey that users being elbowed out from their own routers is not something they're seeing:

quote:
Charlie Douglas, executive director of corporate communications at Comcast, confirmed that home hotspots could experience network congestion from guest users simply because of the way that WiFi works. "If you were at a baseball stadium, and it was empty, and the WiFi was on, and you were there by yourself, you would have an amazing experience," Douglas elaborated. But, he continued, if the stadium filled up, your online experience would slow down.

Douglas, however, was quick to point out that Comcast hasn't received reports of performance problems on home hotspots because of added traffic from guest users. "It's not something we're seeing," he said. He also thinks problems are unlikely in the future because of WiFi's limited range. A guest user would need to park and stay parked near someone's home hotspot in order to take advantage of it.


As noted above, users can chose to opt out of the functionality entirely. Comcast states that less than 1% have chosen to do so thus far, though judging from the confusion and surprise in some markets when this feature is turned on, that may not mean much. It's worth noting that some users in our forums have reported having a difficult time actually opting out.

Footing the power bill for passers by has also been a concern with the Comcast's router update. connection-bonding outfit Speedify issued a report earlier this year that found Comcast's sharing routers would cost users around $23 per year in additional power costs. Comcast protested the numbers and sent Speedify another router to test, only to have the results actually show greater power consumption.

Comcast users in enabled markets: what have your experiences been with the functionality?
view:
topics flat nest 
bigballer
join:2014-09-25

bigballer

Member

my understanding is

what if people set up phony "xfinity wifi" ssids and fooled people and stole some sensitive information?
athornfam2
join:2013-09-25
York, PA

athornfam2

Member

Re: my understanding is

If people are smart enough which most aren't to technology. They will find that when they jump on to the xfinity wifi that you will not have access to the internet until you sign into your account which is something that is automatically redirected for you when you get on your browser.

dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium Member
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4

dvd536

Premium Member

Re: my understanding is

dont you get an hour of access without logging in?

xfinity
@68.50.75.x

xfinity to athornfam2

Anon

to athornfam2

oh yeah, it's bulletproof...

Sure, it's really hard to fake the Xfinity captive gateway.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup to bigballer

Premium Member

to bigballer
said by bigballer:

what if people set up phony "xfinity wifi" ssids and fooled people and stole some sensitive information?

Public Wi Fi is a hackers dream. Enjoy.

dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium Member
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4

dvd536

Premium Member

Re: my understanding is

easy. just turn the power on the radio down so people outside cant get a strong enough signal to connect.

Rob
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL
kudos:2
·Xfinity

Rob to batterup

Premium Member

to batterup
said by batterup:

said by bigballer:

what if people set up phony "xfinity wifi" ssids and fooled people and stole some sensitive information?

Public Wi Fi is a hackers dream. Enjoy.

The xfinity wifi are not necessarily public wifi as from what I have seen, I have to log in using my Comcast username everytime. So there is (I assume) some tracking on the 'activity' one does on the wifi network.

kkkkkkkkkkk
@12.109.156.x

kkkkkkkkkkk

Anon

Re: my understanding is

Not hard to setup a captive portal that anyone that connects to your internet sees before being allowed full internet access (actually an option in pfsense, then just copy the default xfinity login page. Instead of sending info to Comcast, the fields dump to you, now you have their login info. Most users use the same pw for many things, so if you watch your traffic and see which bank they access and try the same pw, guess what? Now you can get to their banking, etch etc...

Rob
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL
kudos:2
·Xfinity

Rob

Premium Member

Re: my understanding is

said by kkkkkkkkkkk :

Not hard to setup a captive portal that anyone that connects to your internet sees before being allowed full internet access (actually an option in pfsense, then just copy the default xfinity login page. Instead of sending info to Comcast, the fields dump to you, now you have their login info. Most users use the same pw for many things, so if you watch your traffic and see which bank they access and try the same pw, guess what? Now you can get to their banking, etch etc...

I meant that if hackers wanted wanted to use a public wifi for their illegal activity and be 'anonymous', it wouldn't necessarily work since they have to use theirs (or someone else's) comcast login.

cork1958
Cork
Premium Member
join:2000-02-26

cork1958 to Rob

Premium Member

to Rob
said by Rob:

The xfinity wifi are not necessarily public wifi as from what I have seen, I have to log in using my Comcast username everytime

Not public wifi right now, at least. To me though, this is just creating another opening for some one to break into, so why take the chance?

I've helped SEVERAL people disable this garbage already. Lucky for me, if that's what you want to call it, I have Charter cable any my own router/modem, which I would also have if I were on Comcast.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop to bigballer

Member

to bigballer
We setup a Meraki AP with a bunch of popular SSIDs. in a 24 hour period I saw over 1000 devices connect to SSID of "xfinity wifi" as they drove by.
TheWiseGuy
Dog And Butterfly
MVM
join:2002-07-04
East Stroudsburg, PA
kudos:3

TheWiseGuy to bigballer

MVM

to bigballer
said by bigballer:

what if people set up phony "xfinity wifi" ssids and fooled people and stole some sensitive information?

Public Wi-Fi by its nature is unencrypted. That means even if someone does not set up an "Evil Twin" they can sniff everything you do, this is just how unencrypted Wi-Fi works. Don't use public Wi-Fi of any type for sensitive information unless you are using an encrypted website or VPN etc.

As to the fact that you are helping your cable company, which IMO is true, the trade off is, if you use public Wi-Fi you get access in more places.

Silver_2000
Premium Member
join:2005-12-12
Carrollton, TX

Silver_2000

Premium Member

Business users have no ability to turn this off

Call to comcast and waiting on hold is required - which is arrogant on Comcast. They will do what they want with your network congestion and your power usage.

newview
Ex .. Ex .. Exactly
Premium Member
join:2001-10-01
Parsonsburg, MD
kudos:1

newview

Premium Member

Double Dip

Subscribers paying a rental fee and increased electric costs for a modem that allows Comcast to provide a public WiFi connection is the height of arrogance.
ke4pym
Premium Member
join:2004-07-24
Charlotte, NC

ke4pym

Premium Member

Re: Double Dip

Seems to me that this is an easy issue to fix. Buy your own non-WiFi enabled cable modem.

newview
Ex .. Ex .. Exactly
Premium Member
join:2001-10-01
Parsonsburg, MD
kudos:1

newview

Premium Member

Re: Double Dip

said by ke4pym:

Seems to me that this is an easy issue to fix. Buy your own non-WiFi enabled cable modem.

Yeah ... for you, me and any other halfway knowledgeable tech head, THAT is the solution. But for the vast majority of people subscribing to Comcast, they are being given the modem that is setup to share WiFi BY DEFAULT, and in the vast majority of cases without the knowledge or permission of the subscriber, who is then paying a rental fee for the "privilege" of sharing Comcast's public WiFi.

Comcast should be required to publish notification of this public WiFi sharing on each and every bill of every subscriber who has this enabled, with clear & concise instructions for disabling it.

We'll see how much that 1% opt-out increases once subscribers are given the knowledge and tools to do so.

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop

Member

Re: Double Dip

"But for the vast majority of people subscribing to Comcast,"

Who cares? These are the people who cause these types of problems in the first place.

caster
@198.41.85.x

caster to newview

Anon

to newview
also even with your own comcast can make it hard to get rid of the rent fee.

Also if you have cable phone it's even harder to get out useing there box.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

BiggA to newview

Premium Member

to newview
Well, if they're that stupid then they deserve... whatever nonexistent negative effects come about because of xfinitywifi.

I'm sure there are plenty of articles on Google and videos on YouTube about how to disable it.

aaronwt
Premium Member
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA

aaronwt

Premium Member

How the heck is it costing $23 extra dollars a year?

The router and WiFi is already on. A router barely uses any power. The router alone shouldn't cost $23 a year in electricity let alone using guest WiFi.

MovieLover76
join:2009-09-11
kudos:1

MovieLover76

Member

Re: How the heck is it costing $23 extra dollars a year?

agreed, a router uses so little power I think this has got to be out of whack.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

BiggA to aaronwt

Premium Member

to aaronwt
Exactly. it makes no sense that adding an SSID broadcast and another VLAN on the DOCSIS side would magically cause the power consumption to go up.

Xioden
Premium Member
join:2008-06-10
Monticello, NY
kudos:1

Xioden to aaronwt

Premium Member

to aaronwt
At the national average rate of $0.1092 per kw/h, it would be 210kw/h a year, or a 41w increase in power usage per hour.

Now there are some places in the US that are more than triple that, a 10w an hour increase in extra power usage isn't out of the realm of possibility depending how they're doing it, and that would hit that $23 extra a year figure.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

BiggA

Premium Member

Re: How the heck is it costing $23 extra dollars a year?

That's ridiculous. Adding an SSID and a VLAN adds NOTHING to the power consumption. Sure, if it's heavily used, I guess it will use a teeny, tiny, bit more power to transmit more data, but come on, we're talking pennies.

Cthen
Premium Member
join:2004-08-01
Detroit, MI

Cthen

Premium Member

So....

This doesn't count as against someones cap. The cap is in place to regulate congestion. So if Comcast has a congestion problem, doesn't adding on public WiFi only add to that problem more?

Doesn't really make much sense to me.
Kuro
join:2014-10-01

Kuro

Member

Re: So....

You believed that?

»Cable Industry Finally Admits Caps Not About Congestion
talz13
join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH

talz13 to Cthen

Member

to Cthen
If it doesn't count against the cap, then can you just sign in to the guest wifi portion of your network and stream to your heart's content?
older dog
Premium Member
join:2005-06-09

older dog

Premium Member

Re: So....

It does not count against the cap of the person whose router you are using to access net.

But since you must sign in to your Comcast account to use the wifi it counts against your own cap.
talz13
join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH

talz13

Member

Re: So....

So you suggest that they form some kind of neighbor pact, where each will use the others router as an uncapped connection?
older dog
Premium Member
join:2005-06-09

older dog

Premium Member

Re: So....

To use the wifi you must sign in to your Comcast account which gives Comcast the ability to add up your total data usage.

The only way you could get around your cap is if Comcast choose to not count all or part of the wifi portion for the time being.
talz13
join:2006-03-15
Avon, OH

talz13

Member

Re: So....

Gotcha, so no free lunch!
Kuro
join:2014-10-01

Kuro to older dog

Member

to older dog
Could also buy business class but that comes with its own set of problems.

MovieLover76
join:2009-09-11
kudos:1
·Optimum Online

MovieLover76

Member

eh,cable-vision does the same thing

my cablevision smart router does the same thing, broadcasts optimumwifi SSID and I really couldn't care less. I don't see how the few users in my area could use so much bandwidth that I would notice the difference.
To really be able to use it at any distance they would have to choose the 2.4ghz network which I rarely use all my stuff is on 5Ghz.

I have no problem with sharing, I think more public wifi hotspots are better for users in general I know I hop on optimumwifi from time to time while out and about.

It's not a one way affair, I get benefit from the optimumwifi hotspot network too and therefore the bigger it is the more use I will get out of it.

LookFreeWifi
@50.153.165.x

LookFreeWifi

Anon

Re: eh,cable-vision does the same thing

So I decided to log in and test out the free Comcast Hotspot. With results like this I doubt this would impact the home owners experiance.

Signal Streighth: Fair





Silver_2000
Premium Member
join:2005-12-12
Carrollton, TX

Silver_2000

Premium Member

Not free

Its not free - either you are a subscriber or must sign up for an account to get a few min of access.

If you are in an Appt or Shared office space and 10 of your neighbors have Comcast this creates 10 more wifi networks to further congest the already congested and error filled 2.4 ghz band

Comcast is using your power and your real estate at zero cost and the net is revenue generation for them. Since after a few minutes free the hotspot is pay per use.

••••

battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000

battleop

Member

How to identify a marketing monkey...

Look for phrases like "amazing experience" when talking about a WiFi connection.

Zenit
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA
kudos:6
·T-Mobile US
·Xfinity

Zenit

Premium Member

Get a plain EMTA or Modem

That is the solution. If you are a voice customer try to get a plain EMTA - Comcast should still have a few in inventory, probably the Arris 722g 4x4.

Or buy your own modem/router combo and be done with it.

On my last trip to the Comcast office I counted no more than 5 people returning gateway's due to how they "sucked" within 15 minutes.

I could barely stand my first EMTA/Gateway (SMC unit) for 2 weeks...let alone months. The Dory was a pile of junk.

»na.smc.com/products/resi ··· mcd3gnv/

Never use that gateway, it had a signal range of 5 inches.

neill6705
join:2014-08-09

neill6705

Member

Re: Get a plain EMTA or Modem

Yeah, I don't really understand the complaining either. If I had a cable provider, I would've been using a Motorola Surfboard from the start (unless I could find a DOCSIS 3.1 HWIC for my Cisco 1841).

Time
Premium Member
join:2003-07-05
Irvine, CA

Time

Premium Member

Solution

I'd probably use a cable modem with no WiFi capabilities, or if it was mandated that you needed such, I'd purchase my own WiFI device and place the Comcast device in any one of the cheap miniature faraday cages available on eBay or Amazon. I don't care about the $23, but I have no intention of sharing due to security concerns.

•••

Acuity
join:2002-06-22
Londonderry, NH

Acuity

Member

So basically what they're doing..

What they're doing is charging you a rental fee on their router so they can give out your internet access to other people. Yes, I'd turn it off too.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

BiggA

Premium Member

This will backfire

Some people in apartments won't get cable internet because they can use xfinitywifi. This is not a hypothetical, a friend of mine is using xfinitywifi instead of actually getting cable. He logs in with his old Comcast email, which is tied to his parents' Comcast account.


How about ..