 
CrzyCrakr
Premium
join:2005-06-24
Edgewater, MD | What??? Comcast using unfair tactics? You don't say. 
I wouldn't put it past them but I think they could just be getting Comcrap's crappy service in them parts. | |
|
 | nshulga
join:2002-06-06
Morrisville, PA
1 edit | Re: What??? I don't think they have the competence to do that kind of thing. Most of the Comcast people I've dealt with are still looking for "any" key on their keyboards. | |
|
| | Wallslide
join:2001-12-28
Seattle, WA
| Re: What??? Reminds me of a nice little anecdote.
Just for the hell of it, I decided to use a dremel to take off all the letters on my keyboard. Well, inevitably my Comcast internet was having issues, and a technician had to be sent out. When he arrived, he had to use my computer, and had the worst time trying to figure out where the keys were. I eventually had to swap keyboards so that he could do his work, to which he said "Thank God, you were killing me there."
I don't think think you need quotes around "any", they are looking for every key on the keyboard. | |
|
| | | |
| | | 
insideoutwards
@comcast.net
| Re: What??? C'mon...think!
The Comcast network is optimized for VOIP and voice packets. With today's standards-based implementations there is no way that any provider is going to alter VOIP QoS or traffic based on BRAND.
Most likely, the latency is originating in the best-effort world of the Internet cloud - not the bandwidth-managed private networks that Comcast owns. | |
|
Vig
Thread-safe since 1997
Premium
join:2004-03-23
San Diego, CA | remeber the adage Never ascribe to malice what can be adequately explained by incompetence. | |
|
| 
chakey
Premium
join:2004-06-14
Gladstone, NJ
clubs: | Re: remeber the adage Well said. That is true for any large corporation... | |
|
WaxPhoto
I AM SAM
Premium
join:2004-04-08
Roanoke, IN
| Latency & DNS Issues I use vonage over comcast here in Indiana... There is some horrid latency around here. Whether thats artificially introduced by comcast... I don't know. What I do know is that when I stream internet radio, the latency gets noticeably worse.
Conspiracy? Perhaps. But maybe its just Comcastic! 
--
To see what is in front of one's nose needs a constant struggle. -George Orwell | |
|
| 
N3OGH
Bear patrol must be working like a charm
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs | Re: Latency & DNS Issues More like ComCRAPtic... | |
|
| | gpancner
join:2001-09-27
Nine Mile Falls, WA | Re: Latency & DNS Issues And you could do better? | |
|
| | |
N3OGH
Bear patrol must be working like a charm
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs | Re: Latency & DNS Issues Well, my job isn't to be the "largest internet service provider in America".
I would like to see a corporate executive at Comcast come out and do my job. I doubt they would hang around too long.... | |
|
| 
Maarvin
Premium
join:2005-04-11
Denver, CO | I must be doing something wrong. Both Comcast and Vonage work almost flawlessly for me! | |
|
| |
WaxPhoto
I AM SAM
Premium
join:2004-04-08
Roanoke, IN | Re: Latency & DNS Issues Good for you.
Unfortunately half a continent away, things are different. | |
|
calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA
| Is BBR blacklisted, too? With the exceptionally slow response I'm getting on this site today (as compared with the rest of the 'Net), I'm wondering if Comcast is trashing BBR loads as well....
calvoiper
--
VoIP--the death knell of remaining voice monopolies! | |
|
|
| 
kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
 ·T-Mobile US
| Re: This is why we should support a 2 tier internet! said by PhoenixDown  :Because companies like Vonage should have to pay to be placed on an oversold network. But now, really, would a 2 tier net mean that vonage and voip calls go through okay and non-voip or premium users get to suffer yet more lag? Exactly this is why WE SHOULD NOT SUPPORT ANY TIERING EVER. | |
|
| bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| Tiering would actually probably ease their network lag overall. There's probably a lot of latency irrelevent data moving across the network that if bumped down in priority would free up some resources. Though Comcast is a poorly designed network. Poorly designed networks can't be easily fixed. | |
|
| | |
| 
DaveNJ
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey | I support QOS, not 2 tier. If i am sending traffic, it should be handled the best way possible. VOIP should have a higher priorty. They need to sell QOS not 2 tier. But wait a minute, that what the consumer would want anyway...... | |
|
| | bogey780
join:2004-03-19
Here
| Re: This is why we should support a 2 tier internet! But the trouble you get is the same that happened with the DSL CLECs. Bell isn't going to drop the money down to do the upgrades knowing other companies will just take advantage of thsoe upgrades without having contributed anything. Hence the "use our pipes for free" quotes. | |
|
| | | |
jose3030
Premium
join:1999-08-17
Manassas, VA
| I can attest to this I was one of the affected.
My uploads. Downloads. Arent affected. They are 8mb/768, ALWAYS. Yet, my phone calls would cut out, have problems.
It got so bad, I cancelled Vonage and ordered Sunrocket.
I wouldnt buy Comcast's VoIP offering since they're pulling this... | |
|
| 
GOLFnSUN
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·Comcast
1 edit | Re: I can attest to this said by jose3030 :I was one of the affected. My uploads. Downloads. Arent affected. They are 8mb/768, ALWAYS. Yet, my phone calls would cut out, have problems. It got so bad, I cancelled Vonage and ordered Sunrocket. I wouldnt buy Comcast's VoIP offering since they're pulling this... And your proof Comcast is doing anything?
Much more likely Vonage is the cause as their service quality is below par( »/gbu ) all over the US.
--
--
Join Red Room Forum
BLOG tkjunkmail.blogspot.com
My Web Page | |
|
| | 
longstreet
join:2004-11-14
Plano, TX | Re: I can attest to this Comcast is overselling the nodes.
I had the same problem, had a tech out twice (who of course found nothing wrong on my end) I demanded a fix and in a week they upgraded the node on their end to handle 20% more . . .problem solved. | |
|
| | | 
imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI
·WOW Internet and C..
| Re: I can attest to this said by longstreet :Comcast is overselling the nodes. Every ISP oversells their bandwidth.
You demanding anything and it getting fixed is purely coincidental. It was probably already in the works but they didn't get the equipment or have the window set for the repair until after your appointment. | |
|
| | | |
longstreet
join:2004-11-14
Plano, TX
1 edit | Re: I can attest to this Actually, the entire apartment complex called the same day, WE demanded a fix, spoke to an engineer, he set it all up after my call | |
|
| | | | |
imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI
1 edit | Re: I can attest to this That's all fine and dandy, except he doesn't have the authority to set any kind of headend repair fix. All he did was tell you what you wanted to hear and they fixed it when the engineers could fix it. | |
|
| | | | | | |
| | | | | | | 
KeepOnRockin
Music Lover Forever
Premium
join:2002-11-08
Beaverton, OR
2 edits | Re: I can attest to this I think it is a bunch of FUD.
I doubt Comcast is intentionally blocking its competitor. It's probably is just a few isolated people having problems (as compared to the total amount of people using Vonage with Comcast's ISP).
| |
|
| | | | | | | | |
| | | | | | | | | |
| | | | | |
kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
·T-Mobile US
| Re: I can attest to this said by imrf :That's all fine and dandy, except he doesn't have the authority to set any kind of headend repair fix. All he did was tell you what you wanted to hear and they fixed it when the engineers could fix it. Why would be it's impossible? There's *always* some extra 'juice' somewhere, exactly for cases like this. Maybe he simply raised the bandwidth limit on their port, that's it. | |
|
| | | | | | |
imrf
Premium
join:2002-06-06
Utica, MI | Re: I can attest to this It's possibly that is was a capacity issue, I'm not denying that.
But that response was to his post before he edited it and changed tech supervisor to engineer. Tech supervisors don't have the authority to do any kind of changes like that. | |
|
| | | | | | | |
longstreet
join:2004-11-14
Plano, TX
2 edits | Re: I can attest to this My edit was for spelling.
The line tech and the engineer for our area I see weekly.
The line tech is seen more often, as usually it's a subscriber problem, the engineer is seen somewhat less.
This is a description, not a prescription, . . people don't always follow policy.
The manner in which we were fixed was prompt and courteous, you need to make alot of noise though when the tech shows up to get anything done.
The phone people won't do anything. You gotta get someone in the flesh and then demand.
You can cuss out the phone folks, they'll just apologize and say they are very sorry. I don't even have to call the 1-800-comcast anymore, I have the engineer's cell.
Thank god somebody has an idea of what customer service really is, not just some pimply dude 9 states away that's a policy monkey. | |
|
| | | | |
longstreet
join:2004-11-14
Plano, TX
2 edits | Funny how the line techs (sent after the original 2 calls) don't do much but test your lines, on the second time a line tech was kind enough (after much pressuring) to give us an engineers number. So he brings the kitchen sink, we luck out.
I don't think it went through the regular repair channels. Perhaps engineers aren't *supposed* to talk to subscribers, but we were handled differently. It's a nice change compared to Qworst. | |
|
| | | | | | |
| | | 
MrChupacabra
Premium
join:2003-03-26
Florida
·Bright House
| said by longstreet :Comcast is overselling the nodes. I had the same problem, had a tech out twice (who of course found nothing wrong on my end) I demanded a fix and in a week they upgraded the node on their end to handle 20% more . . .problem solved. I really doubt there was any bandwidth increase made just because of your demand or complaint. Some bad field equipment may have been replaced or a miss configured head end may have been fixed.
I've already gone into it about the number game that every ISP has to play. You can hunt that down if its that big of an issue.
Don't you just love residential services?
--
Any intelligent fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction. --Albert Einstein | |
|
| |
jose3030
Premium
join:1999-08-17
Manassas, VA | My proof is that everything ELSE is fine.
Always has been.
I had Vonage for about 2-3 yrs now, and NOW is when its starting to crap out?
Very interestingly, no problems w/ Sunrocket at all. | |
|
| Scott_
join:2002-04-01
New Baltimore, MI
| said by jose3030 :I was one of the affected. My uploads. Downloads. Arent affected. They are 8mb/768, ALWAYS. Yet, my phone calls would cut out, have problems. It got so bad, I cancelled Vonage and ordered Sunrocket. I wouldnt buy Comcast's VoIP offering since they're pulling this... Are you still having the problem with Sunrocket? If you are not experiencing any problems then how is that Comcast's fault. | |
|
| |
jose3030
Premium
join:1999-08-17
Manassas, VA | Re: I can attest to this No problems w/ Sunrocket at all. | |
|
| Scott_
join:2002-04-01
New Baltimore, MI | I have used Vonage for 2 1/2 years and have no issues with Vonage. I switched to Comcast's CDV only to have everthing on
one bill. | |
|
LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06
Felton, DE
| Any chance it might be........... Hmm...a Vonage problem?? Why is right away the ISP? I have Vonage and Comcast and it works great. Of course I don't use my network through it though, crappy linksys, but that's another thread.
I can imagine a tech call to Vonage:
A:"High this is Vonage, can I help you?"
B: "Yes, I'm having issues where my calls are cutting out, and some people can't hear me."
A: "Hmmm, that sounds like it would be an issue with your
ISP. Have them check your connection."
Lol, everyone automatically goes for the ISP.
--
Fighting on the Internet is like winning the Special Olympics. Win or lose, your still Retarted! | |
|
|
See 6 replies to this post |
|
YChicagoVoIP
join:2004-12-19 | it's definitely Comcast I have Comcast and it's definitely them. I can't get my Vonage, Stanaphone, or Voipstunt to stay registered. I'm on my 3rd router, 2nd Vonage phone adapter, etc. and it hasn't helped. | |
|
|
LeftOfSanity
join:2005-11-06
Felton, DE
| Re: it's definitely Comcast How can you say definitely? That is your proof? That 3 Voip providers are having problems? ITS VOIP! Could be numerous reasons. Why don't I have these problems? Mine works great.
--
Fighting on the Internet is like winning the Special Olympics. Win or lose, your still Retarted! | |
|
| | YChicagoVoIP
join:2004-12-19
| Re: it's definitely Comcast Why would every provider I use have problems? Would they all have started at the same time?
I'm not talking about the Vonage voice quality issue. I'm talking about losing registration on other boxes -- and SIP registration is not a bandwidth-intensive task. | |
|
| | | 
phattieg
join:2001-04-29
Winter Park, FL
·Verizon Wireless B..
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | Re: it's definitely Comcast I had Vonage for 3 years (key word had). Worked great, but customer service sucked. I am on Comcast, never had jitter, not much echo (hardly any ever). It's not Comcast, but you know, thats what you get for relying on technology that goes thru 20 hops to get to it's destination. I have my own Asterisk VoIP server, I know how this stuff works enough not to get all mad if I have call issues. Have Vonage re-provision your device to a new port. Then you know that the "standard blocks" you think might be in place won't get blocked. uLaw is the codec they use for calls (G.711u) which is 64kbps per channel. It's not the ISP's fault if you have to terminate a call outside their network. | |
|
G_Poobah
join:2004-01-17
Schenectady, NY
| Congestion and Latency : Not the same thing First rule: You can run at 95% load, and still not experience any excess latency. Latency only becomes an issue what you are at 100% load, and you are dropping packets.
Second rule: You can experience latency with no congestion. If your router is messed up, if your layer 1 connection is fubar, you can experience latency. Even if you are using the 64 byte ping, you can get latency due to hardware problems, poor router or a host of other issues.
Third rule : QOS helps with congestion. QOS does NOT HELP with latency. Period. Read up on internet 2 for a REAL WORLD example of a long term, major project that relied on QOS. Bottom line is : They dropped QOS, and added more bandwidth, because that was the correct technical solution.
Final rule : If comcast can get away with it, comcast will do it. The Ellacoya switch box that comcast is testing, SPECIFICALLY ALLOWS you to manually add latency to traffic. If you pull up the management interface to configure it, you can deny, throttle or delay a protocol. Comcast has much to gain, and little to lose by doing this. Past history of corporate misdeeds are good predictors of future misdeeds. However, proving it is much harder to do. To test it, the correct test would be to do a VoIP strictly within your node, to see if latency occurs. Then try the exact same call over an SSL link, which is not subject to throttling/etc of the ellacoya box. If it works over SSL, and doesn't work without SSL, then there's a damn good argument that comcast is deliberately treating the protocols differently. If it sucks over SSL too, then there's a damn good argument it's not comcast.
--
Flabby? pastey-skinned? riddled with phlebitis? Then you've got a good Republican body! So compare your lives to mine, and then kill yourself. | |
|
|
See 11 replies to this post |
|
|
aliasrlz
Premium
join:2000-09-01
the world
| I don't have Vonage.... and have had issues since their stupid upgrades!
I have been saying all along ....their infrastructure is screwed up now.....connectivity has gone to all hell, and speeds as well , off and on  | |
|
|
See 6 replies to this post |
|
|
| fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20 | Re: vonage.. Yea... you think? So it's Comcast's fault? You think it's the crappy 3rd party service called Vonage that may be the source?
You want a real phone line, buy one. You ge twhat you pay for. | |
|
|
jose3030
Premium
join:1999-08-17
Manassas, VA | I dont think Fax is officially supported on Vonage.
Also, turn down the speed on your fax, to the 9600bps setting if at all possible, try it again son. | |
|
| | |
| | |
jose3030
Premium
join:1999-08-17
Manassas, VA | I meant Using the regular line, not the dedicated "fax line" that they sell for 9.95. | |
|
ib50MbSoon
Formerly TwoKDialup
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Coloma, MI | For whatever it's worth... Sunrocket over Comcast is working fine here in SW Michigan. | |
|
hollada
join:2001-12-30
Franklin, MI
| SE Michigan Sunrocket not working well With the gizmo in line between modem and router I can only get .8 - 1.5 mbps with the gizmo removed I get 6-8 mbps. With gizmo hanging off router I get constant call drops and "can't hear ya's". Even with gizmo in line I get occaisional drops and other lousy performance. I don't think any of these VOIP co's have their firmware/QOS working yet.
my 2 cents. | |
|
| cableguy619
join:2003-06-24
Chula Vista, CA
| Re: SE Michigan Sunrocket not working well Not a Comcast resident or employee but honestly Vonage in my experience is shotty... It is a bandwidth hog for what ever reason it wants all the bandwidth you have...
As for Sunrocket I think they have their stuff together. I have yet to hear of any major issues with them and see alot of my friends very happy with them over vonage..
You have to remember Comcast network is set up for their producst and services. They do not have to adapt to outside vendors. The vendors need to be the ones to get a little more info on how their producst are effected from system to system.... | |
|
| |
itguy35
@mo.chart
| Re: SE Michigan Sunrocket not working well Funny. I used to be a Sunrocket customer until the first large outage several months ago. After the problem was "fixed" my SR service went to crap. I switched to Vonage, ported my number and never looked back. Vonage has been flawless for me here in MO and is far better than my Sunrocket service ever was. I also read a couple weeks ago that SR was again experiencing growing pains. I'm a Charter Business customer in the STL market. | |
|
caddyroger
Buy American
Premium
join:2001-06-11
clubs: | Vonage and comcast doing good I had vonage for about a year now no dropped calls and no down time. I'm not have been affected yet. | |
|
Kizaki
join:2000-05-19
Fort Myers, FL
| Tested Vonage over an encrypted tunnel I tried Vonage on my neighbor's Comcast connection and it was running like crap. To see if Comcast was throttling Vonage, I connected to my server in New York using OpenVPN. I routed Vonage though the tunnel and it ran perfectly, without a flaw. With results like this, I assume Comcast is doing something to Vonage's traffic. | |
|
|
See 10 replies to this post |
|
xlimitx
join:2001-12-31
Wilkes Barre, PA
·ProLog
1 edit | Sounds like a CMTS issue to me. I'll bet you that it's Comcast issue indirectly. You'll probably find a common denominator with Vonage customers that are having problems between Adelphia, Comcast, Cox and whoever else. From personal experience running certain versions of OS on certain types of CMTSs causes unexpected bugs like dropping UGS flows and other types of problems for VoIP customers.
So, I'm not really pointing fingers, just pointing a large thumb at everyone. See if you can get the VoIP provider and ISP on the same trouble call. If the ISP or VoIP provider won't accomodate, I'd go with someone else that is willing to help you.
Peace. | |
|
jjsk8r85
join:2005-02-17
Belleville, MI | vonage + comcast i've been experiencing a few problems within the last few months using vonage over comcast, and i've figured out that it's michigan's comcast routers that are dropping packets, and causing LOTS and LOTS of jitter along the route. | |
|
IguesstheyLoveme
@208.17.x.x
| Never I have had vonage over a year with Comcast. Never an issue. Must be area specific network issues, because I have never had ANY issue with Comcast TV or CHSI, and I'm in Delaware. Everything works great for me.
And I even have the bandwidth saver feature on the vonage website all the way up. | |
|
tekausa
Premium
join:2003-10-29
Flint, MI
|  I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory
»hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/a···75A1.pdf
2. Just imagine the tort liability issue alone, example: a 911 emergency call garbled by an internet provider intentionally resulting in loss of life.
3. Comcast COO Steve Burke said they won't do it, not just because it's against regs, but also because its a bad business decision.
»www.multichannel.com/article/CA5···+Stories
Comcast Corp. chief operating officer Steve Burke said last Friday [3/11/2005] that the cable company does not and will not block competing voice-over-Internet protocol providers from serving Comcast cable-modem customers.
"We are not [blocking], nor would we block. I think that would be a terrible business decision", Burke told reporters at a National Cable & Telecommunications Association headquarters.
According to a published report, Vonage Holdings Corp., a leading non-facilities-based VoIP provider with more than 500,000 customers, is complaining that a cable company [unnamed] is blocking access.
--
Theo | |
|
| 
CableTool
Poorly Representing MYSELF.
Premium
join:2004-11-12
| Re: I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory Exactly. So Comcast is going to risk its business, lawsuits up the wazoo and Steve Burkes own word to wreak a little havoc for Voip users?
Voip users that pay you for your service? Voip users that even if they are not using Comcasts phone they are still paying for the bandwidth it travels on. They get your money no matter who you use...
--
*´*)
¸.•´¸.•*') ¸.•*.
(¸.•´ (¸.•'
Technicians -Unplugged | |
|
| | HoorahUSMC
join:2006-03-03
Monmouth Junction, NJ
| Re: I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory One small quote comes to mind here.
"I did not have sexual relations with that woman."
Risk? Multi Millions of dollars in their bank (If not Billions, I'm not sure). In business, the only true regulators are the consumers. And c'mon, if you think that the average consumer can tell the difference between truth and lies, you got to be crazy. And if you think that Comcast doesn't care about the VoIP industry, then you ABSOLUTELY must be crazy.
Think business. When you are big, the only next step is to get bigger. Better?? that happens ONLY when you are the biggest and have nothing but free time and money to spend. Of COURSE they are going to try and monopolize. What large company DOESN'T?
The problem here, is NOT that it's survival of the best service available, rather it's a classic case of "If i can't be better than you by my own merit, then I'll simply try my hardest to bring you down to my level".
I'm a Comcast customer. I have it in my house. And honestly, I hate it. They raise prices on a whim, QUALITY sux on a regular (I'm a gamer, and when you get disco'd when in the middle of a BIG TIME MMO raid, the cuss words REALLY come out), their customer service sux and to top it off, they have the nerve to "prioritize" THEIR traffic and MAKE you pay more for it?? I don't want to pay more! I pay enough as it is.
And I GAURANTEE that if Comcast customer's had a choice to switch to another Cable service (Like RoadRunner), they would loose customer's by the tens of thousands in just one day alone.
They were jerks 10 yrs ago when I left for the Marine Corps, and they are jerks now that I'm back home.
-that's MY two cents. Period. | |
|
| | |
CableTool
Poorly Representing MYSELF.
Premium
join:2004-11-12
| Re: I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory I agree big companies... ANY companies strive to get bigger and make more money. Having people leave your service because they cant use Vonage isnt one way.
Getting caught by the federal govt for manipulating traffic also isnt the way to do it.
have the NERVE to PRIORITIZE THEIR TRAFFIC.. on THEIR network? Why not?
When were they held to prioritize anyone elses?
--
*´*)
¸.•´¸.•*') ¸.•*.
(¸.•´ (¸.•'
Technicians -Unplugged | |
|
| | | |
|
Thisisfunny
@comcast.net
| I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory
This is funny to read you guys rant and rave over this issue. One side is blaming Comcast, the other is blaming Vonage.
The issue at hand is this simply. You are using a 3rd party device or service over an existing service providers connection. That service provider is going to check their end for any supported issues. If any issues are not seen, then they are going to say it's the 3rd parties device or service that is at fault. You next go to the 3rd parties device or service for support and they say everything is fine on their end. Then they blame the service provider for the issue.
The infinite loop of blame starts.
The service provider ensures that all traffic can go in and out of their network properly. Since a High Speed provider is going to make sure that Web traffic (HTTP, FTP, POP3, and SMTP) is flowing properly. Any other traffic really is not their concern (3rd party VOIP, P2P, VPN, online gaming, and so on).
What is really the issue at hand is this, you are using a residential service with no guarantees for connectivity or up time, read your TOS (terms of service). Your using a service (Vonage) that depends on the other service providers connection (cable/dsl) for connection. Read Vonage TOS. Your depending on both facilities to work the way their suppossed to, why, "It's all about the benjamins." You people want cheap money services, and the rule of thumb is... You pay for what you get. You pay $25/mo for phone, do you really think they are making that much money per sub? Prolly not!
Having equipment to handle the amount of people connecting to their service connection takes capital and positive cash flow. If Vonage is making $5-10 per sub I'd be surprised. Granted their prices have dropped in the years since they started offering phone service, but that's a mute point.
Really folks in a nutshell, the responsibility falls to the consumer in this arena. You want everything for less, well when you get a product or service for less, you get less quality, less performance, less everything, have you noticed that car prices have gone down, or that utility bill has gotten less. True these are products that consume resources, but they haven't made it cheaper to get those have they. So why should anything else get cheaper. It's about the butts in the seats idealogy.
Later - these are my thoughts not yours. | |
|
| |
Just_Some_Guy
@pacbell.n
| Re: I don't buy this VOIP conspiracy theory While I'll admit I'm no expert I think these are note worthy points:
tekausa:
1. The FCC has said it's against their regs to block or otherwise mess with VOIP. They fined one ISP $15K for doing it about a year ago.
Would the legislation have been made and fines issued if there wasn't a problem with the issue?
Thisisfunny:
Any other traffic really is not their concern (3rd party VOIP, P2P, VPN, online gaming, and so on).
I disagree, ISP's seem very interested in both VOIP & P2P.
This is from one of my previous posts:
There are a number of QoS related techniques that if properly implemented could, and do, prove beneficial to comsumers. Such as proxies an routing. Giving preference to latency sensitive applications like VOIP service and games isn't a bad thing. They don't necessarily use a tremendous amount of bandwidth. And are you really going to notice +/- 50ms while browsing or using p2p? No.
HOWEVER, many ISP given the opporotunity leverage QoS technology AGAINST the consumer.
EXAMPLE 1:
I was recently asked to investigate setting up VOIP between a corporate office in Nevada & Mexico. TELMEX the monopolistic ISP/Phone Co. in Mexico began blocking VOIP. So I began looking into ways around this. Turns out, in many cases they were blocking the SIP servers of the providers like Vonage. I thought, okay, I can deal with that...most all our calls were between the two local areas and, with the proper setup, a VOIP service provider isn't necessary. But, additionally, I began wondering what the likelyhood that TELMEX would intentionally introduce latency to VOIP traffic, as VOIP is extremely sensitive to latency. Later, TELMEX offers it's own VOIP service, at an absurd rate. While many residents down there are now reporting that there VOIP service is "back on", they have also added that the QoS is much degraded...Hmmm. Google "TELMEX" for more info on that issue.
EXAMPLE 2:
About 30 min ago I was reading this: »www.theregister.com/2006/02/23/i···ge2.html
Being interested in traffic shaping, routing, and QoS issues, I began reading about Sandvine traffic management equipment:
"By far the most important aspect of Stateful Policy Management is that the process is completely subscriber friendly. Featuring no delay time for any subscribers and no decreases in the number of downloads or download performance for P2P users, Stateful Policy Management manages P2P completely transparently; subscribers have no indication of what is happening they are only aware of the improved network performance. Their choice is not limited, their performance is enhanced, and all of the pitfalls of having a subscriber-negative P2P policy are avoided all while the service provider banks tangible savings. Stateful Policy Management accomplishes the seemingly disparate goals of reducing P2P costs while improving the subscriber experience. The Verdict By intelligently inspecting traffic, service providers gain an understanding of what kinds of traffic are traveling on their networks. Once P2P traffic has been identified, it can be redirected along the least-cost path of the network and managed at the session level, decreasing both upstream and downstream bandwidth consumption, transit costs, and most importantly, subscriber frustration. Stateful Policy Management is the only solution examined that transparently reduces costs while at the same time maximizing the subscriber experience."
So, without the users knowledge they suggest meddling with the application layer.
Envision this senario:
You fire up your p2p app. and start to download Slackware. The ISP see's this and notices that another p2p user on their network already has Slackware in their p2p share and redirects you to them, all without your knowledge.
"Least cost" to them is not crossing their network boundry. But, you on the otherhand are most concerned with maximising the use of your allocated bandwith. The server you WOULD have been accessing may have had an upload cap of 1.5 Mbps, instead, you get the guy down the steet with an upload cap of 128 Kbps...All without your knowledge.
PDF:
»www.sandvine.com/general/getfile···ILEID=16
Or:
»72.14.207.104/search?q=cache:91t···lnk&cd=1
Thisisfunny:
That service provider is going to check their end for any supported issues. If any issues are not seen, then they are going to say it's the 3rd parties device or service that is at fault.
Is your average tier1 tech support aware of the configuration settings of any tranparent network application proxies on the network? Is it in the flowchart?
It's worth noting that I'm not of the opinion that Comcast is at fault here. Obviously ISP are frequently blamed for thing which are not within there control.
However I do believe that suspicion by consumers is warranted in these cases.  | |
|
|
|
|
Comcast Mishandling Vonage Traffic?
·
·
·
